Budget 2017

LegallyAbroad

MeatTwoVeg wrote: »

Let's be honest, anyone on the dole for over 5 years has no intention of working. There's plenty of jobs out there for those who want them.

SW should be a safety net, not a lifestyle choice.

What's the plan, so? Give them no money? Enough to make their life miserable?

eeguy

nhunter100 wrote: »

During the height of the boom there was 120k on SW: job seekers/ long term illness etc about 4% was the official figure. There is now according to the CSO 257k on the live register excluding all those on schemes. How many job vacancies throughout the state do you think there is?

In the height of the boom when we had to import people from Asia and Eastern Europe to fill vacancies?

There are thousands on the dole who have no intention of working.

Plenty of OAP's who are filling the year between retirement and pension, plenty of mothers or fathers who'd rather claim than work and pay for childcare, plenty of people with medical issues who are unable to work and many many people who haven't done a days work in their lives.

Idbatterim

FG during the boom was calling for more spending, it would have been the same results just with different idiots in charge.

this is true, after FF stumbled on the jackpot. Who wouldnt want to have been governing during that time. Shouting stop would have done nothing for them and if in hindsight as transpired said "we shouted stop" it wouldnt have one them a single vote.

If the lifestyle is so great why are you working?

the lifestyle is far to close to many people breaking their balls. Even if it was the same living standard, many would choose to work, as they couldnt mentally take a life of doing nothing. Many others have no problem with this....

This is a typical Irish question, why not just stay at home then! No other country pays out welfare like we do!

Grayson

Swanner wrote: »

Well done you.. :rolleyes:



Yes I do. They get free money all year. If that's not enough for them they always have the option to find a job and earn it instead.



I work extremely hard to make sure it's not but then i suppose that's the difference between those of us who choose to work and those of use who don't.

I apply for up to 20 jobs a week. I go to at least one interview a week. I apply for jobs not just where I live but all around the country. I've even applied for jobs abroad. I'm not choosing to be on social welfare. I'm certainly not choosing to have to borrow money from family and friends to be able to pay bills and rent. So why don't you just feck off with your holier than thou attitude.

nhunter100

JustTheOne wrote:

Why do we need half a million foreign workers to work in the service industry etc if we have all these Irish people looking for work?

A warehouse company in Kildare claimed they couldn't find local people to work for them so where forced to recruit outside Ireland. Yet a Kildare newspaper investigated and could find no evidence of advertising job vacancies in said company either locally or nationally. Make of it what you will.

Cina

I can't believe they're increasing the bloody dole again, getting it right back to the old levels. We already have one of the most scandalously high dole payments in the developed world, is it really necessary?

Walter H Price

kazamo wrote: »

An extra fiver a week !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.......omg that's like an extra three cent per hour they spend in bed.
That's way too generous, or perhaps when we look at the actual monetary increase rather than a percentage, we get a little more perspective.

Perhaps your 2% was a greater monetary value

Its the principle of the thing why are people on the dole getting increases and bonuses restored , what have they done to earn that . maybe link int to community work or charitable work , but why just give it to them for literally nothing.

Its one thing if a person in genially out of work for a few moths a year etc but there should be a reducing scale in terms of benefits the longer you are unemployed and the bonus should be tied to something either courses , voluntary or community work or the number of interviews you attend something tangible.

nhunter100

Iang87 wrote:

You genuinely think that everyone on SW wants a job. You're being ridiculous. So many make a choice to be on it because you can get everything that goes with it. Rent allowance, free house, heating bonus half the year and a horse in your garden

Did I say everyone? Just say only half of the 257k (excluding those on courses) on SW are actively seeking work is there 128k vacancies in the job market?

eeguy

nhunter100 wrote: »

If the lifestyle is so great why are you working?

Because then who'd pay the taxes to pay the dole? :rolleyes:

Moo Moo Land

Cina wrote: »

I can't believe they're increasing the bloody dole again, getting it right back to the old levels. We already have one of the most scandalously high dole payments in the developed world, is it really necessary?

Yeah and Labour aren't even in government.

nhunter100

Iang87 wrote:

You genuinely think that everyone on SW wants a job. You're being ridiculous. So many make a choice to be on it because you can get everything that goes with it. Rent allowance, free house, heating bonus half the year and a horse in your garden

No one gets a free house this is the most stupid ignorant nonsense I see repeated in this country. Ring the local council and ask their rent policy.

JustTheOne

nhunter100 wrote: »

No one gets a free house this is the most stupid ignorant nonsense I see repeated in this country. Ring the local council and ask their rent policy.

What 40 a week rent ?

And if you don't pay are you gonna get evicted?

Don't be so naive. The arrears owed to councils from non payment is millions.

Imagine they try to evict them.

The uproar from the left and the paper headlines.

My name is URL

MeatTwoVeg wrote: »

Let's be honest, anyone on the dole for over 5 years has no intention of working. There's plenty of jobs out there for those who want them.

SW should be a safety net, not a lifestyle choice.

Some people people are just unemployable for whatever reason.

What's your alternative exactly?... force companies to employ people that they don't want to employ?

If someone has been unemployed for 5+ years then I'd wager that there's more at play than just an unwillingness to work. I mean what kind of life is it? I can't imagine anyone opting for it unless they had some sort of depression or whatever.

And besides, aren't there now very strict measures in place which ensure that claimants attend meetings and engage with officials in order to help them find work?

I'm sure you'll probably come back with some anecdotal story about a guy you know who drives a new car every year and is living the life of Brian on the dole, but it's bullcrap.

The Bishop Basher

Kal El wrote: »

Im going to be that guy to say you lost this argument, sorry sunshine

I think you're giving an internet debate a little more credence then it deserves.. There is no or right or wrong and there are rarely winners or losers. Just lots of people giving their opinion and responding to the opinions of others.

But hey, if you want to pretend to be some kind of adjudicator and declare winners based on your own personal views then knock yourself out. Whatever works for you...

Oh and Sunshine ?? Really ?

I sincerely hope you don't address people with that term in "real life" :eek:

It's about as cringy as cringy gets.. Even on boards..

nhunter100

eeguy wrote:

There are thousands on the dole who have no intention of working.

You painting everyone on SW with the same brush?

Cina

I think it's an ignorant stance to take to say that anyone on the dole could get a job if they actually tried - clearly that's not the case at all, unless maybe you're in Dublin and you get lucky, so berating those on the dole is a bit of a sh*tty thing to do.

However, our dole is far too high. It's nearly back to boom levels now, we were the 2nd wealthiest country in the world in terms of GDP back then or something nuts, and even then the €204+ seemed ludicrous. We just shouldn't be paying money like that, and it is quite true that people can live pretty comfortably on that amount of money, arguably very comfortably in some areas, therefore some are less likely to try get off it.

it's just typical of our government to go and give everyone a bit more money year on year cause things are looking up again instead of fixing the real issues.

mickdw

MeatTwoVeg wrote: »

Let's be honest, anyone on the dole for over 5 years has no intention of working. There's plenty of jobs out there for those who want them.

SW should be a safety net, not a lifestyle choice.

Agree 100%.
I also believe that short term increased payments should be available for those who lose their job reducing to base rate over maybe 4 months or so.
Every long termer on the dole should be put on a work scheme. No free money. So young person getting around 100 dole should work 11 hours at minimum wage rate, hours worked increasing with amount of welfare payment.

LegallyAbroad

mickdw wrote: »

Agree 100%.
I also believe that short term increased payments should be available for those who lose their job reducing to base rate over maybe 4 months or so.
Every long termer on the dole should be put on a work scheme. No free money. So young person getting around 100 dole should work 11 hours at minimum wage rate, hours worked increasing with amount of welfare payment.

What if they refuse to work?

ghostdancer

JustTheOne wrote: »

Why do we need half a million foreign workers to work in the service industry etc if we have all these Irish people looking for work?

we don't need them. if they all left tomorrow then loads of irish people who are on the dole would take their place.

you sound like you don't want any foreigners in the country "taking our jobs"

Iang87

nhunter100 wrote: »

No one gets a free house this is the most stupid ignorant nonsense I see repeated in this country. Ring the local council and ask their rent policy.

Apologies here aswell. They must fork out approx 40 euro per week for their house, this of course assuming it meets what requirements they feel they need. A garden/ 3/4 bedrooms, nice area. We've seen all these things trashed out in the media in recent years. Once again i'm speaking for some and not all

nhunter100 wrote: »

Did I say everyone? Just say only half of the 257k (excluding those on courses) on SW are actively seeking work is there 128k vacancies in the job market?

Took you up wrong on this I apologise. I though you implied nobody wanted to be on SW

Cina

ghostdancer wrote: »

we don't need them. if they all left tomorrow then loads of irish people who are on the dole would take their place.

you sound like you don't want any foreigners in the country "taking our jobs"

uh, no.. you're the one who sounds like that.

kazamo

Walter H Price wrote: »

Its the principle of the thing why are people on the dole getting increases and bonuses restored , what have they done to earn that . maybe link int to community work or charitable work , but why just give it to them for literally nothing.

Its one thing if a person in genially out of work for a few moths a year etc but there should be a reducing scale in terms of benefits the longer you are unemployed and the bonus should be tied to something either courses , voluntary or community work or the number of interviews you attend something tangible.

I agree with that principle.
It should be related to the level of contributions made rather than the standard payment regardless of whether anything was paid.

Seems unfair that the minimum waged when made unemployed are given the same payment as those earning 80-100k for a number of years but are now jobless.

But it will never be reintroduced as it would cost more than the current system. So those unemployed on previous high salaries are subsidising those who never worked as they are being cheated out of the support they would have got in France, Netherlands or Germany.

MeatTwoVeg

Take money off the hard working who pulled the country out of recession. Give it to the pensioners and SW recipients who sat on their arse's for the last 8 years.

Welcome to politics, Irish style.

nhunter100

eeguy wrote:

Because then who'd pay the taxes to pay the dole?

What 2 million would leave the workforce for the dole? Most jobs pay more than the dole you know this right. Just curious at those who claim the dole is such a great lifestyle why are they working. I have friends who can't find work and are struggling to live even with the 5 extra they'll get, I know it wasn't a choice for them.

The Bishop Basher

nhunter100 wrote: »

If the lifestyle is so great why are you working?

I could tell you why I choose to work, although i imagine most could guess the reasons, but that has zero relevance to the point being made which is that a significant number of people choose not to work..

Why do they choose not to work ? Well you'd have to go ask them but i would hazard a guess that getting free money every week along with a decent Christmas bonus all for doing nothing more then turning up once a week to collect it may have something to do with it..

nhunter100

Cina wrote:

I can't believe they're increasing the bloody dole again, getting it right back to the old levels. We already have one of the most scandalously high dole payments in the developed world, is it really necessary?

One of the highest cost of living countries in the world too.

lawlolawl

If you are currently on the minimum wage you'd have to work 50 hours a week at the new "increased" rate to make the same amount extra that someone on the dole will be getting for doing **** all.

DeadlyByDesign

I was expecting so much more with the new childcare scheme. A €900 subsidy which equates to an €80 relief per month. Considering a lot of creches are charging upwards of 1k a month....absolute madness

Cina

nhunter100 wrote: »

One of the highest cost of living countries in the world too.

it's really not any more than most developed countries. Everyone rambles about how expensive Dublin is but most European capitals I've gone to, American/Canadian cities etc. are just as, if not substantially more expensive, and Dublin is comfortably the most expensive area in Ireland.

My friend moved to Exeter in the UK a while back with his girlfriend and was absolutely astonished at how high the cost of living is over there compared to here, especially when you consider their SW is a fraction of what ours is.

put simply, it's a bit of a myth that Ireland is this unaffordable place that requires mass amounts of money to survive in.

joeysoap

PARlance wrote: »

What exactly are you expecting when "Brexit happens"?
Ciggies are more or less the same price in the UK at present.

Brexit = UK exiting EU= duty free at Gatwick available to passengers travelling to the EU, including Ireland.

I picked Gatwick, with careful planning you can get return flights for €40 almost year round

At random

Price breakdown
Flights
Dublin to London Gatwick
Wed 16th Nov 12:50 - 14:20 FR 122
1 x Adult fare€ 19.99
London Gatwick to Dublin
Wed 16th Nov 17:45 - 19:10 FR 117
1 x Adult fare€ 19.99