Budget 2017

Mr. FoggPatches

What other innovative ideas will the innovative noonan cone up with for the budget?

frozenfrozen

10 cent per litre on petrol

Cee-Jay-Cee

None as he's incapable of an original idea, just the same old ****e, year after year.

SEPT 23 1989

Whatever the Reichstag allows him to do

the evasion_kid

Probably a tax on e-juice...since they're losing a lot of their revenue stream

matchthis

Protestor tax and 50c in the swear jar if anyone says Denis O'Brien. Ought to save a few million

The flying mouse

In 1696, England implemented a window tax, taxing houses based on the number of windows they had. That led to many houses having very few windows in order to avoid paying the tax. Eventually this became a health problem and ultimately led to the tax’s repeal in 1851.


Bring back the window tax :D It be a right pain...

Ted111

10% on cones
15% on 99s

Arcade_Tryer

A privilege tax on white males between the ages of 18 and 40?

_Kaiser_

Diesel is apparently to go up (which will affect commuters and pretty much everything), there'll be money/grants for first-time buyers (not many houses for them to buy in places they might actually want to though), and FF want more money for pensioners (no doubt targeting the Grey Vote for when they pull the plug on the current Government).

They might introduce their sugar tax as well. Their broadcast tax (pay the TV license fee even if you legitimately don't have a TV) is still lurking around too.

Oh and there'll be a token reduction in the USC which they hope you'll focus on to hide the fact they've taken just as much/more off you.

In other words, same old really!

Grandeeod

Protect the vintners. Increase the money train on the legalised drug pushing that is cigartette smoking. Tweak the taxes. Protect the rich. Screw the middleclass. Placate the social welfare class.

Maybe something new like a fat tax via fizzy drinks and takeaway foods, Who knows. That's pretty much it.

beach_walker

What'll that bring a pack to?

A few taxes under the guise of protecting lard-arses, one on the smokers and something on off-licence booze to "protect the public from themselves". Pints a-go-go in the Dail bar after the budget though! Big session!

lawlolawl

They'll move the furniture around a bit with small income tax reductions but cancel them out with tax hikes on other things and the only people who will really have any net benefit will be the pensioners because they are a handy vote to get for a couple of terms if you throw a few pound at them.

foggy_lad

The cheeky bassturds selling fags outside the shop in ballyfermot and many other places will probably be the first to put their prices up

bob50

I would think they will jack up motor tax hasnt been done for few years Also Petrol & Diesel

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suicide_circus

The grey vote, the fiscal space and the old reliables - Michael Noonan delivers his budget for 2017 this afternoon following exhaustive petitioning by a multitude of ministers, mandarins, marxists and madmen.

The scope of the USC is set to shrink as social welfare payments expand.

More nurses and gardai are on the cards. Funding for social housing and halting sites. Tax relief for first time buyers, the self employed and home carers as farmers and fishermen also get a look in.

Only the good news stories have been leaked so far...

lawlolawl

suicide_circus wrote: »

More nurses and gardai are on the cards.

The owners of Coppers rub their hands together in anticipation.......

Zascar

[url]Http://www.thejournal.ie/squeezed-middle-analysis-3009557-oct2016/?utm_source=shortlink[/url] - the first comment says it all:

The reason they’re a squeezed middle is because:
- they earn too much to be entitled to any welfare support
- they don’t earn enough to be able to use tax avoidance mechanisms
If they are sick they have to pay in full to see the doctor and pay in full for any medication they may need.
If they have to go to the dentist again they have to pay in full.
If they wish to do a college course to up-skill they have to pay in full.
If they are renting they have to cover the cost of rent in full themselves.
They need to pay their mortgages in full or risk losing their family homes.
If they need to heat their home the need to pay in full.
If they wish to use public transport they have to pay in full.
If they have school age children they have to pay in full for uniforms, books and the voluntary contribution.
The tax the squeezed middle pay, pays the above for those who never intend to work. It facilitates a certain lifestyle for them. Two foreign holidays a year, driving a newer car than the person that works hard and gives up to half their income in tax.
How about some fairness. How about giving something real back to those that kept this country afloat. Those who took pay cuts along with increased taxes. Those who are still working but still struggling.
A substantial tax/USC cut or widening of tax bands might just help the squeezed middle get back on their feet.

lawlolawl

Nah, looks like it will be more of the same. The pensioners get the biggest boost followed by people with children.

Single childless fellas like myself will probably still be paying an effective 50% tax on incomes over a fairly modest cut off and I'll use **** all of the services these taxes pay for.

The number of childless singles is slowly increasing in Ireland but it is a section of society that gets absolutely rode with taxes and sees the least benefit.

E: oh, and if I ended up losing my home for whatever reason I'd be the very bottom of the housing list so I'd be homeless longer than anyone else in Irish society would

nullzero

lawlolawl wrote: »

The owners of Coppers rub their hands together in anticipation.......

The new Gardai and Nurses will be rubbing their coppers together out of necessity.

suicide_circus

lawlolawl wrote: »

Nah, looks like it will be more of the same. The pensioners get the biggest boost followed by people with children.

Single childless fellas like myself will probably still be paying an effective 50% tax on incomes over a fairly modest cut off and I'll use **** all of the services these taxes pay for.

The number of childless singles is slowly increasing in Ireland but it is a section of society that gets absolutely rode with taxes and sees the least benefit.

E: oh, and if I ended up losing my home for whatever reason I'd be the very bottom of the housing list so I'd be homeless longer than anyone else in Irish society would

In fairness, the government has to make childlessness unattractive or at least make having children more affordable, the population is aging rapidly and someone has to pay for our pensions

VinLieger

My God they have missed the mark so far to please the actual squeezed middle for combined income houses.

Also this new build rebate caps out the percentage increases when you get to 400k? First if all there's virtually nobody building houses and secondly any that are being built are nowhere near 400k

Vicxas

So this first time buyers grant is for only newly built houses.

That's a bit of a kick in the crotch.

lawred2

lawlolawl wrote: »

Nah, looks like it will be more of the same. The pensioners get the biggest boost followed by people with children.

Single childless fellas like myself will probably still be paying an effective 50% tax on incomes over a fairly modest cut off and I'll use **** all of the services these taxes pay for.

The number of childless singles is slowly increasing in Ireland but it is a section of society that gets absolutely rode with taxes and sees the least benefit.

E: oh, and if I ended up losing my home for whatever reason I'd be the very bottom of the housing list so I'd be homeless longer than anyone else in Irish society would

Yeah working families are making out like bandits...

lawred2

suicide_circus wrote: »

In fairness, the government has to make childlessness unattractive or at least make having children more affordable, the population is aging rapidly and someone has to pay for our pensions

Less of that planning for the future nonsense

lawlolawl

suicide_circus wrote: »

In fairness, the government has to make childlessness unattractive or at least make having children more affordable, the population is aging rapidly and someone has to pay for our pensions

We can just import young people from other countries to do this.

Let someone else pay to raise and educate them and we'll reap the benefits of this. It's what other first world nations do with Irish young people.

suicide_circus

lawlolawl wrote: »

We can just import young people from other countries to do this.

Let someone else pay to raise and educate them and we'll reap the benefits of this. It's what other first world nations do with Irish young people.

Which countries actively imported Irish young people to tackle their pension deficit?

lawlolawl

suicide_circus wrote: »

Which countries actively imported Irish young people to tackle their pension deficit?

It's obviously not specifically done for that reason because the money for pensions just comes out of the big pot of government money but the tax paid by Irish people working abroad is a net benefit for the country they move to because, as I said, they didn't pay to raise or educate them.

We need to start pushing our society in that direction.

tea and coffee

lawlolawl wrote: »

We can just import young people from other countries to do this.

Let someone else pay to raise and educate them and we'll reap the benefits of this. le.

How's that working out for Germany then?

VinLieger

Jesus christ to apply for the child care grant you have to have your child in full time care...... are they oblivious to the facts of how the vast majority actually live today? The only people who have children in anywhere near full time care obviously can afford it already so are on well above 80k which is the newly announced cap and the rest use family and other options and its close to 50% care. The grant isnt gonna help anyone whose not already using full time care and can well afford it.

How are they not doing the obvious thing by simply making child care cheaper across the board by reducing the costs to the people running it?

tigger123

The grant for first time buyers is such f*ckin nonsense. Only applying to newly built homes? What's the point in that? So frustrated with the whole thing; rents in Dublin are crazy, which in turn makes it incredibly difficult to get a deposit together, which means you have to continue renting, which means it's really difficulty to get a deposit together, which means etc etc etc.

VinLieger

tigger123 wrote: »

The grant for first time buyers is such f*ckin nonsense. Only applying to newly built homes? What's the point in that? So frustrated with the whole thing; rents in Dublin are crazy, which in turn makes it incredibly difficult to get a deposit together, which means you have to continue renting, which means it's really difficulty to get a deposit together, which means etc etc etc.

Its an indirect builders grant lobbied for by the construction industry.

Why the fvck don't they just do something to reduce building costs which would help both builders and buyers????

Iseedeadpixels

lawlolawl wrote: »

Nah, looks like it will be more of the same. The pensioners get the biggest boost followed by people with children.

Single childless fellas like myself will probably still be paying an effective 50% tax on incomes over a fairly modest cut off and I'll use **** all of the services these taxes pay for.

The number of childless singles is slowly increasing in Ireland but it is a section of society that gets absolutely rode with taxes and sees the least benefit.

E: oh, and if I ended up losing my home for whatever reason I'd be the very bottom of the housing list so I'd be homeless longer than anyone else in Irish society would

Single fella with a child will pay the exact same as you trust me.

tigger123

VinLieger wrote: »

Its an indirect builders grant lobbied for by the construction industry.

Why the fvck don't they just try reduce costs which would help both builders and buyers????

Because the construction industry is more organised than first time buyers.

...And Justice

The only people that will benefit from the budget is the folks at the upper and lower ends of the spectrum, all the numpties in the middle that fund it all like me will benefit the least.

VinLieger

...And Justice wrote: »

The only people that will benefit from the budget is the folks at the upper and lower ends of the spectrum, all the numpties in the middle that fund it all like me will benefit the least.

Hilariously ironic consider they claim they are targeting the squeezed middle this time. They have missed that mark so hard with this one thanks to FF pandering to their lower earning base afraid SF will steal it and then all the lobby groups like the build industry.

Even the child care grant is bogus and completely illogical, cannot believe zappone screwed that up this badly

lawlolawl

tea and coffee wrote: »

How's that working out for Germany then?

Unskilled refugees don't fit into the category I'm referring to.

suicide_circus

Still can't quite believe the first time buyers rebate is restricted to new builds.

There is literally no political party representing middle income people and families now.

Harry Palmr

Fixed income

No car, don't drink or smoke and own house

I don't care!

suicide_circus

lawlolawl wrote: »

Unskilled refugees don't fit into the category I'm referring to.

He was referring to the millions of Turkish and other gastarbeiter and their offspring who have been coming since the 60s. They didn't really integrate, have generally remained low paid and have only slightly slowed Germany's population aging.

ThisRegard

suicide_circus wrote: »

Still can't quite believe the first time buyers rebate is restricted to new builds.

There is literally no political party representing middle income people and families now.

From what I can remember when it was around before it was also only for new builds, with the intention to try encourage builders to start building. But we all know where that money ends up.

StanleyOllie

lawlolawl wrote:

Nah, looks like it will be more of the same. The pensioners get the biggest boost followed by people with children.

lawlolawl wrote:

Single childless fellas like myself will probably still be paying an effective 50% tax on incomes over a fairly modest cut off and I'll use **** all of the services these taxes pay for.

Parents also pay 50% tax on income. Could you afford E1000 to get a child minded if you happened to have one. Its a huge expense and it cripples families. And thats only for one child.

techdiver

lawlolawl wrote: »

Nah, looks like it will be more of the same. The pensioners get the biggest boost followed by people with children.

Single childless fellas like myself will probably still be paying an effective 50% tax on incomes over a fairly modest cut off and I'll use **** all of the services these taxes pay for.

The number of childless singles is slowly increasing in Ireland but it is a section of society that gets absolutely rode with taxes and sees the least benefit.

E: oh, and if I ended up losing my home for whatever reason I'd be the very bottom of the housing list so I'd be homeless longer than anyone else in Irish society would

suicide_circus wrote: »

In fairness, the government has to make childlessness unattractive or at least make having children more affordable, the population is aging rapidly and someone has to pay for our pensions

Single income families are also screwed. With one parent staying at home, you cannot transfer all credits and cut offs, which means you are doubly penalised if you want to raise your own children.

Take 2 families with children.
Family 1 with one person working earning €80,000 per year is worse off than family 2 with both individuals working earning €33,000 each (combined €66,000).

Family 1 take home pay - €4,531
Family 2 take home pay - €4,546 (€2,273 x 2)

On the face of it, family 1 is "rich" according to our government and family 2 are the squeezed middle! Despite the fact that family 2 has a higher take home pay from a lower gross.

lawlolawl

StanleyOllie wrote: »

Parents also pay 50% tax on income. Could you afford E1000 to get a child minded if you happened to have one. Its a huge expense and it cripples families. And thats only for one child.

But they get some of that back in children's allowance, back to school allowance and possibly family income supplement depending on their circumstances.

pconn062

VinLieger wrote: »

Its an indirect builders grant lobbied for by the construction industry.

Why the fvck don't they just do something to reduce building costs which would help both builders and buyers????

+1

At least they have guaranteed an increase in building costs for for once off houses for first time buyers, this increase will just be absorbed into the price with only the builders benefiting.

Utah

Would I be right in saying that the FTB grant will only benefit people who bought new builds between July and today? After today the developers will start absorbing the grant into the price of the house?

Vicxas

The childcare grant is for families who make up to €48000 combined.


Jesus Christ.

VinLieger

Vicxas wrote: »

The childcare grant is for families who make up to €48000 combined.


Jesus Christ.

AND you have to have your child in full time care

tigger123

VinLieger wrote: »

AND you have to have your child in full time care

How could you both afford to work full time, earn a combined income of 48k, and have your children in childcare? Am I missing something?

seamus

suicide_circus wrote: »

The grey vote, the fiscal space and the old reliables

Their hands are pretty tied to stop them doing anything radical. They wouldn't get FF's backing.

Not that I think they would go for anything radical anyway.

They need to do something to try and keep a grip on inflation before it kicks off again.

Abolish the PAYE credit and raise the tax bands. Take a little more out of people's pockets rather than giving them extra spending power. Push it into funding public services.

Tax relief for FTBs again is stupid. I know the aim is to encourage more builds as opposed to helping FTBs, but the grant will be consumed by builders, the price of new builds will be beyond the affordability of the lower 50% of FTBs, who will put upward pressure on the second-hand market, whose owners will be eyeing up a new build, putting upward pressure on the price of new builds...

You can't put any money into one part of the housing market without affecting the whole thing.

Lovely Bloke

Don't give a bollix about the deckchair re-arranging, but having to listen to that absolute muldoon Noonan butcher the English language for an hour and a half with his "two seventeen" this and "two sixteen" that, he can fúck right off.