Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Where would you like to see next LUAS line/extension?

Options
13567

Comments

  • Options
    #62
    hytrogen
    Registered Users Posts: 952 ✭✭✭hytrogen


    Have to agree with the off street luas ideas, far more quicker on the green line once it gets past charlemont outbound. Begs the question would an overhead line along the canals benefit those going from the 'core to grand canal dock / docklands as the canals seem chocka daily, even the pedestrians & cyclists are in their droves.


  • Options
    #63
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Del.Monte wrote: »
    The Green Luas line should continue via the old Harcourt Street alignment and then run parallel to the DART into Bray.

    Unessecary really Bray is already served by the high frequency 145 aswell as the dart as you mentioned. Do we really need the dart and the luas to run parallel to each other.


  • Options
    #64
    Banjoxed
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,844 ✭✭✭Banjoxed


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    Del.Monte wrote: »
    The Green Luas line should continue via the old Harcourt Street alignment and then run parallel to the DART into Bray.

    Unessecary really Bray is already served by the high frequency 145 aswell as the dart as you mentioned. Do we really need the dart and the luas to run parallel to each other.

    How unessecary is a connection from North Wicklow to Sandyford and Dundrum?


  • Options
    #65
    monument
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,073 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    Banjoxed wrote: »
    How unessecary is a connection from North Wicklow to Sandyford and Dundrum?

    If they really wanted to they could find a route to Shankhill and have that as an interchange station for Luas / Dart / Commuter / Intercity.


  • Options
    #66
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 11,614 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    monument wrote: »
    If they really wanted to they could find a route to Shankhill and have that as an interchange station for Luas / Dart / Commuter / Intercity.

    That makes the most sense. Can't see it happening though.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #67
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Banjoxed wrote: »
    How unessecary is a connection from North Wicklow to Sandyford and Dundrum?

    Dart to Dun Laoghaire 75 to Dundrum. 84/a to Cherrywood and Luas. Just because they aren't direct dosent mean they aren't there. A frequent enough bus from Bray to Dundrum wouldn't be a bad idea but its not a link that warrants spending millions when there are already good rail and bus links in place.

    Anywhere that is served by the n11, dart line or the luas green line is fine for public transport it dosent need anymore money spent on public transport. It's fine money should spent elsewhere and that's coming from somewhere that lives in one of the places mentioned


  • Options
    #68
    Chivito550
    Registered Users Posts: 7,695 ✭✭✭Chivito550


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    Dart to Dun Laoghaire 75 to Dundrum. 84/a to Cherrywood and Luas. Just because they aren't direct dosent mean they aren't there. A frequent enough bus from Bray to Dundrum wouldn't be a bad idea but its not a link that warrants spending millions when there are already good rail and bus links in place.

    Anywhere that is served by the n11, dart line or the luas green line is fine for public transport it dosent need anymore money spent on public transport. It's fine money should spent elsewhere and that's coming from somewhere that lives in one of the places mentioned

    The 75 is an appalling route. Infrequent and takes a slow scenic route through crap roads.


  • Options
    #69
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,603 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    Chivito550 wrote: »
    The 75 is an appalling route. Infrequent and takes a slow scenic route through crap roads.

    This has to be one of the dafter comments I've read.

    The 75 is every 30 mins off-peak and higher frequency at peak.

    Like any orbital route it takes a route that maximises loadings all along the route. Looking at the loadings it does that very well.

    It isn't primarily aimed at passengers going from one end of the route to the other, rather those making journeys along the route. Orbital routes don't really work otherwise.

    As such it serves major traffic generators all along the route and serves major housing developments too, the source of much of its customers.

    The basic route design is good.

    There is a long term plan to add another east-west route which would allow some straightening out of the 75 by removing the loop around Ballinteer - but this could not be removed otherwise as it gets strong loadings from that area.


  • Options
    #70
    Chivito550
    Registered Users Posts: 7,695 ✭✭✭Chivito550


    lxflyer wrote: »
    This has to be one of the dafter comments I've read.

    The 75 is every 30 mins off-peak and higher frequency at peak.

    Like any orbital route it takes a route that maximises loadings all along the route. Looking at the loadings it does that very well.

    It isn't primarily aimed at passengers going from one end of the route to the other, rather those making journeys along the route. Orbital routes don't really work otherwise.

    As such it serves major traffic generators all along the route and serves major housing developments too, the source of much of its customers.

    The basic route design is good.

    There is a long term plan to add another east-west route which would allow some straightening out of the 75 by removing the loop around Ballinteer - but this could not be removed otherwise as it gets strong loadings from that area.

    I'm referring to the previous comment that DART/75 combo is a perfectly good alternative to a LUAS from bray to dundrum. No it isn't. I live near Dundrum, and took public transport out to Bray once and it took 90 minutes. It's 15/20 minutes in a car. A LUAS would be about 40-45 minutes at a guess which is far more attractive.


  • Options
    #71
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,603 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    Chivito550 wrote: »
    I'm referring to the previous comment that DART/75 combo is a perfectly good alternative to a LUAS from bray to dundrum. No it isn't. I live near Dundrum, and took public transport out to Bray once and it took 90 minutes. It's 15/20 minutes in a car. A LUAS would be about 40-45 minutes at a guess which is far more attractive.

    Well the 75/145 combo will do Dundrum-Bray in about 45-50 minutes. Of course going via DL will take longer.

    I've done that trip plenty of times.

    How it could take 90 is beyond me - you must have just missed a 75 or weren't using the RTPI/Journey planner to plan your journey.

    Of course a direct LUAS would be preferable.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #72
    Chivito550
    Registered Users Posts: 7,695 ✭✭✭Chivito550


    lxflyer wrote: »
    Well the 75/145 combo will do Dundrum-Bray in about 45-50 minutes. Of course going via DL will take longer.

    I've done that trip plenty of times.

    How it could take 90 is beyond me - you must have just missed a 75 or weren't using the RTPI/Journey planner to plan your journey.

    Of course a direct LUAS would be preferable.

    Pointless getting bogged down in details. We both know that infrequent bus services which are slow are not a viable option to getting people out of cars. Maybe I missed one, maybe the RTPI didn't work properly. Does it matter? A good transport system like the LUAS you don't even need to think about these things. I never looked at a timetable much when I lived in Melbourne. Just walked out of my house and caught the next tram. If I have to look at a RTPI and I see 25 minutes til the next bus, that is 25 minutes to my journey time. Just because I can hang around in my house doesn't change that fact.


  • Options
    #73
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,603 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    Chivito550 wrote: »
    Pointless getting bogged down in details. We both know that infrequent bus services which are slow are not a viable option to getting people out of cars. Maybe I missed one, maybe the RTPI didn't work properly. Does it matter? A good transport system like the LUAS you don't even need to think about these things. I never looked at a timetable much when I lived in Melbourne. Just walked out of my house and caught the next tram. If I have to look at a RTPI and I see 25 minutes til the next bus, that is 25 minutes to my journey time. Just because I can hang around in my house doesn't change that fact.

    The problem is that with orbital journeys, no two individual trips are going to be the same - hence many people will use their cars in preference to using public transport, as it's quite possible that one single public transport trip is not going to be sufficient to complete the journey.

    Most will require at least one connection or a walk. How many people will choose that option over driving directly?

    Radial routes to/from the city centre are far more suited to public transport than orbital ones - hence you have the issues that you complain of.


  • Options
    #74
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    I think a direct bus from bray to dundrum is a good idea buto bray doesn't need a luas line to it it has the dart and frequent buses. It would be an unessecary waste of money which could spent improving public transport in other areas of the city


  • Options
    #75
    Del.Monte
    Registered Users Posts: 12,363 ✭✭✭✭Del.Monte


    Reading through this thread there comes across two distinct patterns of posting - by those who use the existing services and by those who have a map and a packer of coloured markers. :rolleyes:

    ****



  • Options
    #76
    monument
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,073 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    Del.Monte wrote: »
    Reading through this thread there comes across two distinct patterns of posting - by those who use the existing services and by those who have a map and a packer of coloured markers. :rolleyes:

    If you want to challenge people's points please do, but if you want to post snarky comments, don't bother posting.

    - moderator


  • Options
    #77
    Banjoxed
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,844 ✭✭✭Banjoxed


    Del.Monte wrote: »
    Reading through this thread there comes across two distinct patterns of posting - by those who use the existing services and by those who have a map and a packer of coloured markers. :rolleyes:

    Do you really think Bray connecting to Sandyford and Dundrum is an exercise in crayonism when detailed design work has been done already?


  • Options
    #78
    Del.Monte
    Registered Users Posts: 12,363 ✭✭✭✭Del.Monte


    Banjoxed wrote: »
    Do you really think Bray connecting to Sandyford and Dundrum is an exercise in crayonism when detailed design work has been done already?

    I don't see why you're quoting me - this was my post: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=101131998&postcount=7
    I always thought that it was nonsense to terminate at the Bride's Glen.

    ****



  • Options
    #79
    Banjoxed
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,844 ✭✭✭Banjoxed


    Del.Monte wrote: »
    Banjoxed wrote: »
    Do you really think Bray connecting to Sandyford and Dundrum is an exercise in crayonism when detailed design work has been done already?

    I don't see why you're quoting me - this was my post: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=101131998&postcount=7
    I always thought that it was nonsense to terminate at the Bride's Glen.

    Apologies, you're right there, Del Monte. Finding the notion that the 75 route is of any use other than purely local cross connections absurd.


  • Options
    #80
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    The 75 is a decent enough bus on weekdays and saturdays but the lengthy diversion to serve Sandyford industrial estate is really stupid as it takes far too long. Although it's Sunday timetable is utter muck.

    It seems to get big loadings of teenagers on weekends and school holidays going to Dundrum SC coming from both termini so this is why I think there would be a market for a better Sunday service on this route.


  • Options
    #81
    Banjoxed
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,844 ✭✭✭Banjoxed


    In the meantime the 145 is crammed this morning, bus lovers.



  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #82
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Banjoxed wrote: »
    In the meantime the 145 is crammed this morning, bus lovers

    Bray also has the Dart it dosent need a luas. Urban public transport whether it be a train, tram or bus is always going to packed in the morning or evening peak fact not everyone is always going to a seat even the best public transport systems in the wored have to deal with overcrowding.


  • Options
    #83
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,458 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    The Dart needs to connect westward towards Dundrum and Sandyford. The extension from Brides Glen to Shankill or Bray would give this. Not sure of cost but it would be worth it - after DU and MN, plus the Clongriffin spur.

    We need networks in the Dublin area with lots of interconnections to allow fast travel from place to place with only one change to get people out of cars.


  • Options
    #84
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Sam Russell wrote: »
    The Dart needs to connect westward towards Dundrum and Sandyford. The extension from Brides Glen to Shankill or Bray would give this. Not sure of cost but it would be worth it - after DU and MN, plus the Clongriffin spur.

    We need networks in the Dublin area with lots of interconnections to allow fast travel from place to place with only one change to get people out of cars.

    It already does through the 75 bus. Look a Luas to Bray would be great for the purposes you mentioned but I think funding should priortised other projects MN being one and other places need luas extensions more. I think a new luas line or a green line spur to Rathfarnham would make sense or maybe a Luas line west to Blanch or Lucan.


  • Options
    #85
    Del.Monte
    Registered Users Posts: 12,363 ✭✭✭✭Del.Monte


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    It already does through the 75 bus. Look a Luas to Bray would be great for the purposes you mentioned but I think funding should priortised other projects MN being one and other places need luas extensions more. I think a new luas line or a green line spur to Rathfarnham would make sense or maybe a Luas line west to Blanch or Lucan.

    Nobody from Bray or points south of it is going to go changing and hanging about in Dun Laoghaire for a bus to get to Dundrum, Sandyford etc. as I said earlier it's easy to plan these things on paper but if you're a regular user you know what is and isn't going to work or be an attractive option.

    ****



  • Options
    #86
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Del.Monte wrote: »
    Nobody from Bray or points south of it is going to go changing and hanging about in Dun Laoghaire for a bus to get to Dundrum, Sandyford etc. as I said earlier it's easy to plan these things on paper but if you're a regular user you know what is and isn't going to work or be an attractive option.

    Look as I said earlier on the thread a direct bus from Bray to Dundrum would be a great idea it's just it's not a route that warrants spending millions on. There's also the 84/a which has half hour frequency Monday to Friday which will get you as far as cherrywood.

    People are only going get out of the cars as parking there is a nightmare to go into town the majority of orbital journeys are made by people who own a car like schoolchildren, students and OAPs. Face it the majority of people use public to go into however de-centralised Dublin is getting.


  • Options
    #87
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Look Metro North is highly unlikely in the foreseable future and even beyond that I would cast serious doubts.

    Metro South hasn't even reached the crayons stage face it probably won't happen in as far away as next 100 years. Whats the point on a metro the runs parallel to the Luas anyway.

    The government should either just build MN or admit it's never gonna happen.

    The metro is planned to light rail which means a glorified luas anyway and not a proper underground heavy rail system.


  • Options
    #88
    strassenwo!f
    Registered Users Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭strassenwo!f


    With regard to the Bray and Shankill LUAS/DART issue, I'm not aware that a possible DART spur between Killiney and Cherrywood has ever been looked at.

    The two lines are only a couple of kilometres apart (as the crow flies) around there and it might be possible to achieve a DART link to Cherrywood there - broadly along the river valley, probably with elevated sections.

    The main point of doing this would be that Cherrywood is right beside both the N11 and the M50 and would thus be very suitable for a massive park-and-ride station for both the DART and the LUAS. The stations in Bray town centre, Shankill and Killiney are not really suitable for this purpose.

    By bringing the DART a bit inland at that point, Dublin could achieve a useful southside link between the two systems without heaping greater traffic on Bray or the other 'coastal' stations. If doable, there might be something like half the southbound trains out of the city going to Bray and Greystones, and the others going to Cherrywood.


  • Options
    #89
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    strassenwo!f wrote: »
    With regard to the Bray and Shankill LUAS/DART issue, I'm not aware that a possible DART spur between Killiney and Cherrywood has ever been looked at.

    The two lines are only a couple of kilometres apart (as the crow flies) around there and it might be possible to achieve a DART link to Cherrywood there - broadly along the river valley, probably with elevated sections.

    The main point of doing this would be that Cherrywood is right beside both the N11 and the M50 and would thus be very suitable for a massive park-and-ride station for both the DART and the LUAS. The stations in Bray town centre, Shankill and Killiney are not really suitable for this purpose.

    By bringing the DART a bit inland at that point, Dublin could achieve a useful southside link between the two systems without heaping greater traffic on Bray or the other 'coastal' stations. If doable, there might be something like half the southbound trains out of the city going to Bray and Greystones, and the others going to Cherrywood.

    To reinterate my point anywhere on the dart, n11 or luas on the southside dosen't need anymore public transport investment for the time being it is by far the best area in the country for public transport. If we had triple or quadruple dart line then certainly have a cherrywood spur it would completely fuuck up rail traffic and the level crossings will be down 75pc of the time.


  • Options
    #90
    strassenwo!f
    Registered Users Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭strassenwo!f


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    To reinterate my point anywhere on the dart, n11 or luas on the southside dosen't need anymore public transport investment for the time being it is by far the best area in the country for public transport. If we had triple or quadruple dart line then certainly have a cherrywood spur it would completely fuuck up rail traffic and the level crossings will be down 75pc of the time.

    I totally agree with your first point. Dublin has much bigger transport issues to deal with than linking the DART and LUAS in a part of the metropolitan area which is already very well served. The focus should definitely be on other areas before such niceties as DART/LUAS link-ups out in the sticks are given serious thought.

    However, with regard to your second point, I wasn't suggesting any three- or four-tracking. I would think 3 or 4 trains per hour to/from Bray and/or Greystones should be quite sufficient to serve the needs of those locations - it's not like the trains are usually full when they start or finish at those stations. The other 3-4 trains currently in the schedule could go to/from Cherrywood. At peak times this would be no more than there are now through the area with the level crossings.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #91
    Stephen15
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    strassenwo!f wrote: »
    However, with regard to your second point, I wasn't suggesting any three- or four-tracking. I would think 3 or 4 trains per hour to/from Bray and/or Greystones should be quite sufficient to serve the needs of those locations - it's not like the trains are usually full when they start or finish at those stations. The other 3-4 trains currently in the schedule could go to/from Cherrywood. At peak times this would be no more than there are now through the area with the level crossings.

    At peak times the services are full as far as Greystones. That would leave Greystones with hourly service which isint ideal.


Advertisement