Lions 2017 [MOD WARNING IN OP]

irishbucsfan

Is that David Nucifora behind the bar?

irishbucsfan

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Is that David Nucifora behind the bar?

Careful now, you might trigger awec.

swiwi_

Webbs wrote: »

Is this ironic New Zealand humour??

It's deadpan Swiss humour.

irishbucsfan

Its didpin Swess humah bru

nagdefy

Quick question..

Has there ever been an Irish player who declined to play with the Lions after selection?

For any reason, including politically when the Lions were named 'The British Lions'.

errlloyd

nagdefy wrote: »

Quick question..

Has there ever been an Irish player who declined to play with the Lions after selection?

For any reason, including politically when the Lions were named 'The British Lions'.

Clive Woodward claimed that D'Arcy was selected for the final test in 2005 and refused to play saying he was too tired. The suggestion was that D'Arcy was somewhat resentful of being in the midweek squad on that **** show of a tour.

D'Arcy has vehemently denied it ever since. If you are asking the question because you have vaguely heard a story of an Irishman refusing to play, that was probably it.

nagdefy

errlloyd wrote: »

Clive Woodward claimed that D'Arcy was selected for the final test in 2005 and refused to play saying he was too tired. The suggestion was that D'Arcy was somewhat resentful of being in the midweek squad on that **** show of a tour.

D'Arcy has vehemently denied it ever since. If you are asking the question because you have vaguely heard a story of an Irishman refusing to play, that was probably it.

No it wasn't any story i heard. I was possibly thinking more on the political level in earlier Lions tours that some fella felt uncomfortable with playing for the 'British Lions'. The same way some Ulster players like Trevor Ringland felt uncomfortable with Amhrán na Bhfiann pre 1995 and the introduction of Ireland's Call. Which is very understandable. As often mentioned Irish Rugby is a sport which brought all people on the island together from all regions regardless of politics, class or creed.

The Rape of Lucretia

Webbs wrote: »

Is this ironic New Zealand humour??

No, but it is fair comment on the disfiguring wound cut open across world rugby. It is only right to mock such nonsense. Already a terrible blight on the Irish game, but the same syndrome shown in the pick of 'British and Irish' Lions.

irishman86

bilston wrote: »

I think the Lions selection makes clear the weakest part of the Ireland squad. The back three. The irony being that given Earls, Zebo and Trimble will probably now tour USA and Japan it will limit the chances to give the likes of Sweetman, Byrne and Stockdale a shot.

You left out the weakest of the lot Kearney, or is he still injured if so Ill quietly take my leave

Former Former

Webbs wrote: »

Is this ironic New Zealand humour??

No, irony is lost on the Kiwis when it comes to this issue.

The Rape of Lucretia

nagdefy wrote: »

Quick question..

Has there ever been an Irish player who declined to play with the Lions after selection?

For any reason, including politically when the Lions were named 'The British Lions'.

I cant remember a name, but I think people declining to travel on tours in the 50s or 60s due being unable to abandon work for the 4 months the tours took in those days with 25 games was not unheard of. Possibly indicated that or took themselves out of the reckoning before the squad itself was announced though.

b.gud

swiwi_ wrote: »

Payne, Te'o, ??
Stander
Faletau
??

Who am I missing?

Buer

b.gud wrote: »

Payne, Te'o, ??
Stander
Faletau
??

Who am I missing?

Vunipola brothers. One born in NZ, one born in Australia.

Shefwedfan

nagdefy wrote: »

No it wasn't any story i heard. I was possibly thinking more on the political level in earlier Lions tours that some fella felt uncomfortable with playing for the 'British Lions'. The same way some Ulster players like Trevor Ringland felt uncomfortable with Amhrán na Bhfiann pre 1995 and the introduction of Ireland's Call. Which is very understandable. As often mentioned Irish Rugby is a sport which brought all people on the island together from all regions regardless of politics, class or creed.

Hugo MacNeill didnt travel to South Africa in 81. It was Ireland and not Lions. Not sure if that is what you are thinking of

http://www.newstalk.com/Hugo-McNeill-on-his-1981-South-Africa-tour-boycott

English Lurker

I think there may have been players who turned down selection for some of the South Africa tours during apartheid but I can't remember nationality.


p.s. I've never seen the sense with including lads born in one place and brought up in another with those who switch national allegiance late in the day for professional reasons. Two different kettles of fish. Particularly as accusations about the former tend to be very much stones in glass houses for most countries.

Former Former

nagdefy wrote: »

No it wasn't any story i heard. I was possibly thinking more on the political level in earlier Lions tours that some fella felt uncomfortable with playing for the 'British Lions'. The same way some Ulster players like Trevor Ringland felt uncomfortable with Amhrán na Bhfiann pre 1995 and the introduction of Ireland's Call. Which is very understandable. As often mentioned Irish Rugby is a sport which brought all people on the island together from all regions regardless of politics, class or creed.

The answer is "no".

I honestly can't remember the "British Lions" name being a bone of contention among anyone in the game.

sydthebeat

English Lurker wrote: »

I think there may have been players who turned down selection for some of the South Africa tours during apartheid but I can't remember nationality.


p.s. I've never seen the sense with including lads born in one place and brought up in another with those who switch national allegiance late in the day for professional reasons. Two different kettles of fish. Particularly as accusations about the former tend to be very much stones in glass houses for most countries.

there was john Taylor (welsh scrum half) who didnt make himself available for selection due to the apartheid

i cant think of any irish player who refused after selection.

(unless you count quinny as self sabotage !)

Winters

It's not a Lions story but another D'Arcy reference, I believe Darce turned down touring with Ireland under Gatland as it clashed with his Leaving Cert. Probably 1999 to Oz.

Edit, it was 1998 and South Africa.

So good Warren Gatland wanted to cap him in South Africa that summer. His Dad, John, a Mayo native who worked for the Bank of Ireland in Wexford, and the late Vinnie Murray, more mentor than coach or teacher, intervened. They presented options and allowed him to make up his own mind. He sat the Leaving Certificate instead of a June tour.

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/international/gordon-d-arcy-end-of-an-era-for-centre-of-golden-generation-1.2340428

Buer

It would have been insanity for D'Arcy to go on that tour. It was reckless by Gatland to even ask him. Regardless of asking him to tour and shelve his leaving cert, South Africa was no place for an 18 year old. That tour was absolute carnage with seasoned professionals getting the heads thumped off them. It ended the careers of several players and a couple more didn't see a green jersey for another few years, most notably Denis Hickie.

awec

Was that the tour with the ridiculous fighting during the match?

The Lost Sheep

awec wrote: »

Was that the tour with the ridiculous fighting during the match?

Yeah that was the year of the 'battle of pretoria'. Paddy Johns and Keith Wood both thumped Gary Teichmann and a load other incidents iirc

Buer

awec wrote: »

Was that the tour with the ridiculous fighting during the match?

Indeed. There were also 4 or 5 midweek games on that tour too where we were getting the heads digged off us.

7 games, 3 weeks, 36 players. It's no wonder several guys never played international rugby again. A couple of them probably had no appetite for it after that. There was punching, gouging, stamping and high tackles galore.

And that was just Paddy Johns.

In light of recent events, people forget just how hard VDW was. A right scrappy (nasty) little bugger when he wanted to be.

Clegg

Buer wrote: »

It would have been insanity for D'Arcy to go on that tour. It was reckless by Gatland to even ask him. Regardless of asking him to tour and shelve his leaving cert, South Africa was no place for an 18 year old. That tour was absolute carnage with seasoned professionals getting the heads thumped off them. It ended the careers of several players and a couple more didn't see a green jersey for another few years, most notably Denis Hickie.

I was only 6 at the time of that tour, but to this day my dad still goes on about "Stefan f'n Terblanche" doing poor Hickie again and again.

Buer

Clegg wrote: »

I was only 6 at the time of that tour, but to this day my dad still goes on about "Stefan f'n Terblanche" doing poor Hickie again and again.

He absolutely toasted him. Hickie was only a kid at the time and his defence was known to be ragged. Gatland made him the focal point of criticism though and Hickie didn't get to wear green again for 2 years which was an awful shame as the wingers we played in the meantime didn't have a fraction of the talent.

One of the SA backrow during that series was one young Rassie Erasmus, actually. Not found wanting.

CMOTDibbler

Clegg wrote: »

Gatland thinks the Lions superior goalkicking will give them an advantage over New Zealand. One of Farrell or Halfpenny to start then.

Should have brought Ferg.

All time kicking success percentages:

Jonny Sexton: 88.7%
Leigh Halfpenny: 87%
Owen Farrell: 84.2%

Ferg can stay at home :P

WesternZulu

Former Former wrote: »

The answer is "no".

I honestly can't remember the "British Lions" name being a bone of contention among anyone in the game.

Was it not Keith Wood who called for a name change to its current form; it must have been a bone of contention to some?

https://www.balls.ie/rugby/british-irish-lions-face-another-name-change-136150

errlloyd

Buer wrote: »

One of the SA backrow during that series was one young Rassie Erasmus, actually. Not found wanting.

According to an article I read Keith Wood actually punched Rassie in the face, but he was aiming for someone else.

CMOTDibbler

errlloyd wrote: »

According to an article I read Keith Wood actually punched Rassie in the face, but he was aiming for someone else.

He was more accurate with a ball in his hands.

Neil3030

WesternZulu wrote: »

Was it not Keith Wood who called for a name change to its current form; it must have been a bone of contention to some?

https://www.balls.ie/rugby/british-irish-lions-face-another-name-change-136150

However, it is understood that the favoured choice is 'The Lions'.

About time. How it has taken this long to take such an eminently sensible route is beyond me.

Clegg

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

All time kicking success percentages:

Jonny Sexton: 88.7%
Leigh Halfpenny: 87%
Owen Farrell: 84.2%

Ferg can stay at home :P

That's a really interesting stat actually.

There's a perception about Sexton as being unreliable with the boot. Probably coloured by that kick against NZ and the Championship decider against France a few years ago.