Homelessness on the rise

Slydice

RTE are after putting up an article:
Nearly 7,000 people in Ireland are homeless
http://www.rte.ie/news/2016/1230/841830-homeless/

It looks like the total homeless they have worked out is the Adults figure added to the Family Homeless dependents so that's 4436 + 2549 = 6985

They go straight out and don't use the term 'dependents'. They say 'children'

The number of children without a home and living in hotels or B&Bs in November stood at 2,549, up from 2,470 the previous month.

That shows the over 1000 more homeless children 'having rights breached' above the number from that government report by Dr Geoffrey Shannon (Special Rapporteur on Child Protection) since the September 2015 numbers it was working from.

Slydice wrote: »

He's working from figures from September last year. In the charts posted here, it shows the number of Dependents (e.g. Children) have risen by 1000 since then.

Children placed in emergency accommodation 'having rights breached'
http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/children-placed-in-emergency-accommodation-having-rights-breached-764758.html

Homeless children who are placed in emergency accommodation are having their rights breached, according to a new report.

Slydice wrote: »

The report (182 pages) is here:
http://www.dcya.gov.ie/documents/publications/201611189thReportoftheSpecialRapporteuronChildProtection.pdf
An unacceptable 1,500 children are living in emergency homeless accommodation in 2015
The reference used for that number is from September 2015:
Nearly 1,500 Children Made Homeless in Ireland
23rd September 2015
http://www.barnardos.ie/riseup/children-made-homeless/

Slydice

The December figures have been released:
http://www.housing.gov.ie/sites/default/files/publications/files/homeless_report_-_december_2016.pdf

Homelessness on the rise. I've updated the two charts based on the totals they give.

Homelessness (Adults)


Family Homelessness


The latest report repeats:

The root cause of increased homelessness is the supply shortage across the housing sector, which in turn is a result of the recent economic collapse and the associated damage to the construction sector. Accordingly the long-term solution to the current homeless issue is to increase the supply of homes.

Samuel T. Cogley

Electric Sheep wrote: »

Neither do the small time landlords. Professional landlord companies properly vet tenants before letting - credit reports, proof of employment, references. They care about the condition of the investment, rather than letting it go to rack and ruin in the interest of money in their pocket this month.

Credit report means sod all. It means they've never stiffed the bank is about it.

Proof of employment is easily sought and routinely requested by this Gombeen who let's his apartment out under market value, is an active director in the OMC and maintains it to the very highest standard, okay the bathroom could do with redoing if I'm honest.

Clancy Quay is a prime example of what's going to happen if left purely to large companies. I've nothing against Clancy Quay, I just don't want it to be the only option.

rossmores

A report today says nearly 2/3 of the homeless live in Dublin and probably ¾ of these shelters are now on the north city It seems politicians have used the north inner city as a dumping ground for our biggest social problem its the new Grange Gorman.
despatching such a large section of disadvantaged, mental health issues and drug addicts in one area is going to bring more problems  including antisocial and increased littering
It cited a recent increase to a new home in Drumcondra

rossmores

I would like to add when you get near one of these shelters the litter increases, loitering sometime drinking alcohol and the odd human defecation (would like to rub peter's nose in it when i here him on the radio) some of these people need specialist care in a place away from the urban centers they are not able to take care of them selves any suggestion that the greedy unprofessional gouging LLs could provide a solution by aggressively making them house homeless is insane

Slydice

They seem to have forgot to put a link on their main site again but the January figures are available:
http://www.housing.gov.ie/sites/default/files/publications/files/homeless_report_-_january_2017.pdf

Some Homelessness [Homelessness (Adults)] is on the rise. The overall total has stopped rising (by 0.31 of 1%) from the numbers for Family Homelessness moving down (see table below). I've updated the two charts based on the totals they give.

Homelessness (Adults)


Family Homelessness


The Family Homelessness figures are moving downwards. The Homelessness (Adults) figures are moving upwards.
|Dec|Jan|Diff
Non-Family Adults|4643|4760|+117
Family Adults|1627|1581|-46
Family Dependents (e.g. children)|2505|2407|-98
That's -27. The total number was 4643+1627+2505 = 8775

27/8775 = 0.31 of 1%

The latest report repeats:

The root cause of increased homelessness is the supply shortage across the housing sector, which in turn is a result of the recent economic collapse and the associated damage to the construction sector. Accordingly the long-term solution to the current homeless issue is to increase the supply of homes.

Slydice

Total Homelessness is on the rise.

My understanding of the numbers was wrong. Total Adults includes family adults (based on how broadsheet do their analysis URL="http://www.broadsheet.ie/2017/02/21/a-record-7167-people/"]here[/URL).

The table should have been:
|Dec|Jan|Diff
Adults|4643|4760|+117
Family Dependents (e.g. children)|2505|2407|-98

That's +19.

Sorry for giving wrong information

Slydice

The February figures have been released:
http://www.housing.gov.ie/sites/default/files/publications/files/homeless_report_-_february_2017.pdf

Homelessness on the rise. I've updated the two charts based on the totals they give.

Homelessness (Adults)


Family Homelessness


The latest report repeats:

The root cause of increased homelessness is the supply shortage across the housing sector, which in turn is a result of the recent economic collapse and the associated damage to the construction sector. Accordingly the long-term solution to the current homeless issue is to increase the supply of homes.

Arcade_Tryer

Nice graphs but it's obvious very few people care about homelessness. In fact, I think most would argue that it's part and parcel of a modern, Capitalist economy. The lack of action by Government, combined with the extent to which charities are relied upon to provide services to the poor in Ireland, pretty much shows the level of thought most people give to homelessness, myself included.

Doctor Nick

I rarely thought about homelessness until I became homeless after losing my job. It's totally demoralising. I'll never forget the first night I slept in emergency accommodation. Sleeping with shoes under my pillow after somebody advised me to do so otherwise they'd have been robbed. Looking at people injecting heroin into their necks. Sleeping with one eye open in case you were attacked by one of the five other men I shared a room with.

The first word uttered by the staff in the homeless services was "well you'll be losing that allowance". A horrible experience I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy. Thankfully those days are behind me and I have my own place now and am back working.

trobbin

There's certainly a problem in Dublin with homelessness, but I'd question if it's as bad as other cities around the world. The figures look terrible when counting the percentage increase, but there's a bigger problem. Government policy.

See, there's a thing going on in Dublin. Loads of people out there who do nothing with themselves only claim social welfare and have kids. Well them same people want a house, and that's fair enough. But if you don't go on the homeless list you're bottom of the list. Go on the homeless list, become a statistic and get the government (tax payer) to put you up in a hotel, until a suitable house becomes available. Joke!

I have a cousin. She's a leech. She's been on rent allowance for over 10years! NO JOKE. She's got two kids, she drives a nice car (better than many hard workers I know) she goes on holidays and drinks regularly. In fact, she's got a very good life. She's got a guy too, he lives there, but doesn't. She would've been on the homeless list years ago if it had of been the thing back then.

Real homeless people need real help. You'll find them on the street, not on the latest statistic posted on the news, to highlight an agenda.

Mrs OBumble

Arcade_Tryer wrote: »

Nice graphs but it's obvious very few people care about homelessness. In fact, I think most would argue that it's part and parcel of a modern, Capitalist economy. The lack of action by Government, combined with the extent to which charities are relied upon to provide services to the poor in Ireland, pretty much shows the level of thought most people give to homelessness, myself included.

Rubbish.

Most of those charities receive huge amounts of funding from the government for the services they're providing. Every single council provides some social housing, the large ones significant amounts. There are several not-for-profit companies that each run thousands of using to social housing nationwide (government funded again), and any number of smaller ones providing lower numbers.

Yes, there is under funding of mental health services, including addiction services. And people with mental health issues make up a proportion of the homeless.

And yes, there are issues with location X supply: we have houses, but they're in the wrong place, or a tied up with Fair Deal issues, or boarded up because the councils cannot afford to fix them up, or not allowed to be lived in any more because they're bedsits which don't meet middle-class sensibilities. And there are others which are being removed from the rental market because landlords are being deterred from renting out due to ridiculous tenants rights - ironically such rights have been strengthened because politicians want to be seen to care about tenants, and because they aren't smart enough to consider the unintended consequences of their policies.

But neither of these mean that "no one cares".

More like there are no simple solutions to this complex set of problems.

Wheeliebin30

Homeslessness is the biggest scam for people to get bumped up the list.

Country is ruined with people thinking they deserve a nice house for 40 euro a month.

Anyway, Sweden has 32,000 homeless people. If your homeless in Ireland you're looked after better than most other countries.

Graces7

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Homeslessness is the biggest scam for people to get bumped up the list.

Country is ruined with people thinking they deserve a nice house for 40 euro a month.

Anyway, Sweden has 32,000 homeless people. If your homeless in Ireland you're looked after better than most other countries.

??? where does that figure come from please? Not actual costs in reality and no "deserve" about it.
E40 a week is nearer. Or even E60 a week.

And you are 100 % right that we in Ireland are far better off than in any other country in the world. In the US folk are existing in ruins in their hundreds and try Greece.

Doctor Nick

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Homeslessness is the biggest scam for people to get bumped up the list.

Country is ruined with people thinking they deserve a nice house for 40 euro a month.

Anyway, Sweden has 32,000 homeless people. If your homeless in Ireland you're looked after better than most other countries.

Homelessness is a scam? So really when I lost my apartment and had to spend months surround by people injectng heroin and other drugs into places I didn't no exist. Also watching young folk kicking the bollocks out of each other on a regular basis. Having nowhere to bathe or brush my teeth. Spending day after day carrying everything I own with me. Have people look the other way when they see you coming. Same people who probably would have chatted to me a few months before I was deemed lesser than. Some scam.

Oh yes the big homeless scam, I must try it again it was so fun and I made a fortune :rolleyes:

Carlos Orange

Doctor Nick wrote: »

Homelessness is a scam?

I wouldn't call it a scam but when you read the government spend between €20,000 and €30,000 a year per homeless person I find it very strange.

pilly

psinno wrote:

I wouldn't call it a scam but when you read the government spend between €20 and €30 thousand a year per homeless person I find it very strange.

That's because they're spending the money on hotels rather than building houses.

Doctor Nick

Doctor Nick wrote: »

Homelessness is a scam? So really when I lost my apartment and had to spend months surround by people injectng heroin and other drugs into places I didn't no exist. Also watching young folk kicking the bollocks out of each other on a regular basis. Having nowhere to bathe or brush my teeth. Spending day after day carrying everything I own with me. Have people look the other way when they see you coming. Same people who probably would have chatted to me a few months before I was deemed lesser than. Some scam.

Oh yes the big homeless scam, I must try it again it was so fun and I made a fortune :rolleyes:

Homelessness is not a scam but the way the numbers are reported so make it sound worse imo. You were homeless by the sounds of it but someone living in a nice hotel is not really homeless. The figures should be rough sleepers and those in homeless shelters. They are the real homeless not thouse in hotels and other good accommodation just waiting to get and often turning down nice apartments being given to them for a fraction of the cost that they would actually cost to rent.

Also lack of housing is not the root cause of a decent proportion of thouse sleeping rough or in hostels (not saying it was your case). It's personal issues and addiction. How many of those people can't go home to their home becuse they have fallen out so badly with their parents or siblings so rather than be able to just go home they have to stay on the streets.

antoinolachtnai

There was a time when this was true, but we are really running out of housing in Dublin city. This is an irrefutable fact. We are just growing too fast as a city (population grew 4.8 percent since 2011) but we are not adding any new housing units. There are just not enough units available to meet the demand.

If someone is in temporary accommodation they are certainly homeless. I say this not just out of sympathy for these people but because these people so nor have a permanent situation, and they will have to be moved to other accommodation, temporary or otherwise, over time. Their accommodation is just not suitable for the long term for a load of reasons which are mainly economic.

Are there people abusing the system? I don't really know. But I do know for sure that there is a serious shortage of accommodation.

It is certainly true that homelessness effects the weakest people (people with addictions, mental illness and all the rest) the most. But whereas these people used to have some access to permanent accommodation, they now have almost none. A lot of the accommodation is still there, but it's been taken over by people who have a bit more money to spend and who are more acceptable as tenants.

Rodin

Plenty of accommodation outside Dublin. Move people there.

Those paying their own way have to live where their means allows.

Should be no different for any one else.

Doctor Nick

Vanessa Billions Strapless wrote: »

Homelessness is not a scam but the way the numbers are reported so make it sound worse imo. You were homeless by the sounds of it but someone living in a nice hotel is not really homeless. The figures should be rough sleepers and those in homeless shelters. They are the real homeless not thouse in hotels and other good accommodation just waiting to get and often turning down nice apartments being given to them for a fraction of the cost that they would actually cost to rent.Eta: people in emergency housing should definitely be included in the figures. They might stay on a different hostel 7nivhts pw.

Also lack of housing is not the root cause of a decent proportion of thouse sleeping rough or in hostels (not saying it was your case). It's personal issues and addiction. How many of those people can't go home to their home becuse they have fallen out so badly with their parents or siblings so rather than be able to just go home they have to stay on the streets.

Don't agree with that. I know many people who refuse homeless shelter because they had been attacked in them an found them unsafe. In order to get access to an emergency shelter bed you must ring the freephone number 3 times a day if you want to secure a bed. A lot of people refuse to do this as they are afraid of the people there.

Then consider those who do get accommodation, they get it for one night and the next day the game begins again. Ring this number here. Ring it 3 times between the hours if and we'll try get a bed. . Hope they'll answer and if lucky you get the same place as the night before but more often they don't. Yes they give that person a bed to sleep on but what good is a bed if you're frightened of those in the room with you. Others who just walk in. Hoping their property won't be stolen if the happen to doze off. Sheltered accommodation should not consider people in these circumstances as housed

Homeless in this country is not fit for purpose and needs radical overhaul

Arcade_Tryer

antoinolachtnai wrote: »

It is certainly true that homelessness effects the weakest people (people with addictions, mental illness and all the rest) the most.

Surely you mean sickest? People who suffer from mental illness and substance abuse are sick; not necessarily weak.

Graces7

Rodin wrote: »

Plenty of accommodation outside Dublin. Move people there.

Those paying their own way have to live where their means allows.

Should be no different for any one else.

I am outside Dubin and believe me there is not "plenty of accommodation" that anyone can access on eg RS. I had to move over 200 miles . And am in very poor and difficult accommodation even now. .

antoinolachtnai

Even if that were practical, and in many cases it isn't, it doesn't resolve the fundamental problem - Dublin's population continues to grow, the accommodation is all full, and we aren't really building new accommodation at any sort of scale.

Rodin

Graces7 wrote: »

I am outside Dubin and believe me there is not "plenty of accommodation" that anyone can access on eg RS. I had to move over 200 miles . And am in very poor and difficult accommodation even now. .

Over 200miles would take you out of the country from Dublin

Graces7

Rodin wrote: »

Over 200miles would take you out of the country from Dublin

The point was that moving to a more remote area does not mean there is more accommodation to be had, and there are many places over 200 miles from Dublin. Try West Cork...

Doctor Nick

Doctor Nick wrote: »

Don't agree with that. I know many people who refuse homeless shelter because they had been attacked in them an found them unsafe. In order to get access to an emergency shelter bed you must ring the freephone number 3 times a day if you want to secure a bed. A lot of people refuse to do this as they are afraid of the people there.

Then consider those who do get accommodation, they get it for one night and the next day the game begins again. Ring this number here. Ring it 3 times between the hours if and we'll try get a bed. . Hope they'll answer and if lucky you get the same place as the night before but more often they don't. Yes they give that person a bed to sleep on but what good is a bed if you're frightened of those in the room with you. Others who just walk in. Hoping their property won't be stolen if the happen to doze off. Sheltered accommodation should not consider people in these circumstances as housed

Homeless in this country is not fit for purpose and needs radical overhaul

In my post I said I would very much consider the above as fully homeless and in a very bad situation and they should be considered in the hard figures for homelessness they are 50/50 for being in the street every night.

A high proportion of the homeless figures are made up of people who will never spend a night on the street though and are living in hotels or other long term (but temporary) good, safe and comfortable accomidation while waiting to be housed by the government.

Rodin

Graces7 wrote: »

The point was that moving to a more remote area does not mean there is more accommodation to be had, and there are many places over 200 miles from Dublin. Try West Cork...

Only the most western parts of West Cork. Hardly 'many places'.

And daft has 57 properties to rent in West Cork. As I said, plenty of accommodation.

Graces7

Rodin wrote: »

Only the most western parts of West Cork. Hardly 'many places'.


And daft has 57 properties to rent in West Cork. As I said, plenty of accommodation.

Many more locations in remote areas ...

Jobs? Prices? Schools?

Rodin

Graces7 wrote: »

Many more locations in remote areas ...

Jobs? Prices? Schools?

Everywhere is cheaper than Dublin.
Revitalising rural areas with new people will give life to them, will necessitate services.
The money saved on hotel bills can be reinvested.