Philip Cairns' Murder finally confirmed?

Means Of Escape

Zero DNA link between Cooke and Cairns

Too little too late

Kamili

Means Of Escape wrote: »

Zero DNA link between Cooke and Cairns

Too little too late

surprise surprise...

http://www.rte.ie/news/2016/0804/806905-cairns-disappearance-cooke/

CUCINA

I remember back in the day, maybe early 80's, when there was a lot interest by the media (mainly Sunday World?) anticipating what Emmon Cookie was going to say live on radio where he was going to answer allegations being made about him. I used to live just down the road from where he lived and my friend and I at the time were quite interested in what he might say.
So I actually recorded what he said and I still have the cassette in the attic...must resurrect it and refresh my memory of it.
"Captain" Cooke we knew was eccentric but there was very little choice of music on the radio in those days so he was a prominent figure back then, I suppose...

Kamili

CUCINA wrote: »

I remember back in the day, maybe early 80's, when there was a lot interest by the media (mainly Sunday World?) anticipating what Emmon Cookie was going to say live on radio where he was going to answer allegations being made about him. I used to live just down the road from where he lived and my friend and I at the time were quite interested in what he might say.
So I actually recorded what he said and I still have the cassette in the attic...must resurrect it and refresh my memory of it.
"Captain" Cooke we knew was eccentric but there was very little choice of music on the radio in those days so he was a prominent figure back then, I suppose...

I think a few have already linked this in their posts in the thread previously

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EQL8A8rEdg0&ab_channel=ParnellMooney

Means Of Escape

Smokescreen and wild goose chase
Easy to pin this on a guy who has popped his clogs
It is clear that the people who came forward presented fanciful recollections and may themselves have had a bone to pick with Cooke .
There is no doubt that Cooke was a bad apple and didn't serve enough time .
His name was taken and carried as fact surrounding the Cairns case .
Hopefully the trawling through his files might bring forward names associated with his deviant activities and in turn they could be pulled in for questioning .
Someone knows the full story and I'll warrant they are still in the land of the living .

Strumms

Kamili wrote: »

surprise surprise...

http://www.rte.ie/news/2016/0804/806905-cairns-disappearance-cooke/

I guess it's very much back to square one. Does anyone know if the Gardai started digging anywhere as they had planned ?

Going Forward

Kamili wrote: »

surprise surprise...

http://www.rte.ie/news/2016/0804/806905-cairns-disappearance-cooke/

But there are DNA samples, samples which are testable going by that report.

I hadn't been aware that there were samples on it till now actually.

And there had been speculation that the 30 year gap had affected them.

Or that the bag had picked up samples over the years that had nothing to do with the case.

Kamili

Going Forward wrote: »

But there are DNA samples, samples which are testable going by that report.
.

Samples which have already been tested. There were three on it, and not one points to Cooke.

Going Forward

Kamili wrote: »

Samples which have already been tested. There were three on it, and not one points to Cooke.

Were the contents ever tested?

Kamili

Going Forward wrote: »

Were the contents ever tested?

I don't think so. Wonder if they were ever fingerprinted either...

Fleawuss

It's still wait and see. The RTE report also says that Cooke claimed he knew Philip. Taking that at face value ( given the well documented weirdness of Cookes thinking a dubious enough proposition) it has to be established how Cooke knew such a quiet religious boy without his family apparently knowing anything about it.

Kamili

Cooke was asked on his deathbed (while dying from cancer and in a lot of pain, and on medication) if he knew Philip. He said yes, then later denied it. So I'm not sure what to believe!

Going Forward

Kamili wrote: »

Cooke was asked on his deathbed (while dying from cancer and in a lot of pain, and on medication) if he knew Philip. He said yes, then later denied it. So I'm not sure what to believe!

If he'd been asked if he knew the Pope they'd have gotten the same answer.

So why the foock didn't they just ask him if he'd killed the chap?????

Kamili

They did and he wouldn't admit to it. Nor to where Philips body is.

Read through the thread, its all there.

evolving_doors

Just because you don't find a person's DNA on an item doesn't mean that they didn't come into contact with the victim.
If you handled a schoolbag for a few minutes then it was left for a few decades what is the likelyhood of obtaining your DNA?..
Would the lack of DNA evidence automatically role Cooke out?
I dunno, but the deathbed ' confession ' thing is abit shakey, Cooke didn't willingly ask to confess beforehand did he? It was based on what someone else had claimed that made the Gardai go and interview him, no?

The_Valeyard

Very true, but the news is disappointing, but hopefully, some day we will get an answer to this horrible crime.

Going Forward

Gebgbegb wrote: »

Just because you don't find a person's DNA on an item doesn't mean that they didn't come into contact with the victim.
If you handled a schoolbag for a few minutes then it was left for a few decades what is the likelyhood of obtaining your DNA?..
Would the lack of DNA evidence automatically role Cooke out?
I dunno, but the deathbed ' confession ' thing is abit shakey, Cooke didn't willingly ask to confess beforehand did he? It was based on what someone else had claimed that made the Gardai go and interview him, no?

The only encouraging feature is that there is DNA of some quality on the bag.

But it could be anyone's.

I've never heard of the bag's contents being checked for anything, DNA or fingerprints.

Were Cookes fingerprints ever checked against the books it contained?

Not by the sound of things.

I don't think they were putting too much effort into pinning it on him.....

murpho999

Kamili wrote: »

Cooke was asked on his deathbed (while dying from cancer and in a lot of pain, and on medication) if he knew Philip. He said yes, then later denied it. So I'm not sure what to believe!

How do you know this? Were you there?

Smondie

They haven't ruled out Cooke yet according to the independent today.

Paedophile Eamon Cooke has not been ruled out as a suspect in the disappearance of Philip Cairns despite his DNA not being found on the teenager's schoolbag.

http://m.independent.ie/irish-news/news/eamon-cooke-not-ruled-out-as-suspect-despite-no-dna-link-to-philip-34940430.html

Kamili

murpho999 wrote: »

How do you know this? Were you there?

It was all over the media

https://cathyfox.wordpress.com/2016/06/20/philip-cairns-murdered-by-eamon-cook-sunday-times-article-19-jun-2016/

Detectives at Rathfarnham station arranged to visit Cooke as he lay on his
death bed. The former DJ, who was heavily medicated, is said to have given
“yes” and “no” answers when asked about Philip Cairns. He is thought to
have admitted that he knew the schoolboy, but volunteered nothing further.
He was offered the chance to speak to a solicitor or priest but declined.
He died on June 6, aged 79. The father of 11 was later buried alongside the
first of three wives, Lena.

http://www.broadsheet.ie/tag/eamon-cooke/

Eamon Cooke died in a hospice on June 4, 2016. It is stated that Gardai interviewed him in the hospice on at least two occasions before his death.

It appears that these interviews took place after the May statement. It is not explained why Cooke – who was under palliative care at the time of the interviews, which took place shortly before his death – was not interviewed before, if the information in the May statement had – as indicated above – been communicated in some form to Gardai in 2011.

It was originally stated that Cooke corroborated or confirmed ‘some aspects’ of the statement but had not disclosed the location of Philip’s body.

It was subsequently stated that Cooke had denied killing Philip. It was however stated that he admitted knowing Philip.

However in another report – by UTV – Alice Cairns is specifically quoted as saying that Cooke admitted knowing Philip in one interview, but denied it in another.

Nonetheless gardai – as reported by RTE yesterday – continue to contend that Cooke knew Philip

They qualified this however by saying ‘in the sense of inviting children to visit his radio station’.

Means Of Escape

Kamili wrote: »

It was all over the media

https://cathyfox.wordpress.com/2016/06/20/philip-cairns-murdered-by-eamon-cook-sunday-times-article-19-jun-2016/





http://www.broadsheet.ie/tag/eamon-cooke/

He was probably on morphine and not very lucid hence the yes/no answer option
What he said wouldn't have a leg to stand on in court as a result .
He probably knew him through another deviant who more than likely murdered Cairns.
Again there is no doubt that he knew of him

Kamili

Oh definitely, but knowing and killing are two different things.

Means Of Escape

Kamili wrote: »

Oh definitely, but knowing and killing are two different things.

Yes I believe he knew of him or met him but I don't believe he killed him and the recollections of the person who came forward were incorrect either through malice or the passage of time .
The "link" with Cooke should have been revealed 25 years ago as the person HAD to have known the importance of the information
I don't buy the fear element that prevented the person coming forward as there were numerous avenues to make anonymous tips .
Far more progress would have been made given Cooke was alive .

The latest revelations regarding DNA link only reinforces that the people who came forward only gave the family false hope .

Annie Mc Carrick disappearance is a newer case as is Deirdre Jacobs and they remain unsolved and are likely to remain so like the Dollard case .
.

Means Of Escape

Whatever happened to Cookes jag?
Might be still in circulation being a rare car at the time .
Anyone know the reg?
Even if it was restored and owned by a collector hair fibres could still be found in the car in the most unusual places ie under the gear selector ,under wiring spare tyre in the boot etc .

The car is the key if it survives not in notebooks or files.

Kamili

I wonder if the jag is in the lock up..

Phillip was apparently seen getting into a red car though.

Pic of the Jag here

http://www.dxarchive.com/ireland_dublin_radio_dublin.html

WonkyMe

Have the others who worked at the station been interviewed about the children who apparently visited there? Who, what, where , when, frequent visitors, vibes, strange incidents etc.
Cooke appears to have been quite arrogant and it would seem strange if nobody noticed anything, if things were going on. On the other hand, might Cooke have surrounded himself with people of similar inclination, perhaps?

darkdubh

Was very sceptical about the Cooke connection from the off.How did Philip end up at the radio station,how did he know Cooke?That whole story of the witness fainting and coming to in the car sounded very iffy.As for Cooke supposedly verifying the story he was was probably heavily drugged and possibly suffering from dementia.

1968

Gareth O'Callaghan Facebook post yesterday. Linked a Cairns family friend and member of Dublin Sea Angling Club with the death of Philip.

[Link :

https://www.facebook.com/gareth.ocallaghan.1/photos/a.425043820976753.1073741829.305722736242196/656369004510899/?type=3&theater]

"I would like to thank an individual who contacted me two weeks ago with information in relation to the disappearance of Philip Cairns. This is the most significant information that I have received so far. For confidentiality purposes I will call the man Tom. We spoke at length that Friday evening, and again at length on two other occasions in the past two weeks. We remain in contact and he is very eager to be kept updated on progress. He understands why I am sharing some of what we have discussed here - as it is very important that you are aware of this if you have a genuine interest in this case being solved. I should advise here that it doesn't make for easy reading.

Tom told me that he believes he knows where Philip's body is buried. He has lived with this awful secret for many years and had been too terrified to come forward with the information and report it to the gardai. He was afraid that he would also disappear if it was ever suspected that he had told anyone what he understands happened to Philip.

Tom has given me the address of a house in the south Dublin area. He explained to me that he believes more than anything that Philip's body is buried there. The man who owned this house died of cancer in 2006. He was an eccentric who was into young boys. He was most likely the last person to see Philip Cairns alive. Tom explained to me that he lived in fear for years, even long after this man had died. Clearly this man was not operating alone. He told me it took him almost four years to go to a garda station and report what he knew. He felt that he was carrying such a huge secret, even though this man was dead, that he was certain his life was in danger if he opened his mouth. I could tangibly feel his fear as he explained the long years of silent terror that continue to haunt him to this day.
There have been many conspiracy theories and stories over the years. Some of them have led to land being excavated and checked, but none of them have yielded anything. I have read up widely on all of the history of this case, but clearly Tom's information is one of the strongest leads I have listened to. Both his story and his timeline are very strong. He was a gardener for this man for quite a few years and became suspicious both as a result of certain strange statements and bizarre misgivings the man would blurt out as he became older and more regretful, and also from items he came across while digging and loosening top soil in the back garden.

Tom is a healthy, fit man in his mid-60s. He swims a few times a week and looks after himself. He is a family man with a caring, empathic way about him. His memory is strong and his ability to recall very specific items and details leads me to believe that his information is not only genuine and credible, but extremely important and relevant.

However...
A couple of days after first speaking with Tom, I contacted the gardai and discussed the information he had given to me with the senior garda who is heading up the investigation into Philip's disappearance. It turns out that Tom had met with the gardai on two separate occasions - in 2010 and 2011 - and made statements based on the same information I have shared here. (Obviously the information is more detailed than I can share here.) Tom heard nothing back from the gardai whatsoever in the years since then. No action whatsoever was taken to check out the location or the details that Tom had given. He also contacted the investigation team more recently in the hope that they might take his information seriously. He has heard nothing back from them either.
I spoke last night with a friend of mine who is a high-ranking police officer in the UK. He told me that if had received this information in relation to a property in the area that he polices, a forensic team with dogs and diggers would be in that garden at first light the following day and they wouldn't leave a stone unturned.

While I understand that the Eamon Cooke theory has taken up the full spotlight of this investigation in recent months, Tom's information strikes me as being far more urgent and relevant; while also considering that nothing substantial has been done in six years to investigate and possibly eliminate Tom's evidence.
The question needs to be asked today: why hasn't this information been taken seriously and this address been investigated? Is someone trying to hinder the investigation? Is someone powerful thinking it might be far more convenient just to pin the blame on a dead convict whose reputation is already in tatters? Is this deflection at the core of the cover-up that has prevailed now for thirty years?

The man who owned this property that Tom has identified was a member of Dublin Sea Angling Club, a fishing club that Philip and his father were also members of. The man was also a regular attendee at the prayer meetings that Philip attended on a weekly basis. He had become a close friend of Philip's dad over the years. The group were due to head away for the long October bank holiday weekend on a fishing trip to Kilcoole, in County Wicklow. Philip disappeared the day before the fishing club were due to travel. From information I have received confidentially, I understand that a number of paedophiles were also members of this fishing club. I would be interested in hearing from anyone who was familiar with Dublin Sea Angling Club in the 1980s.

On Sunday 17th November 2002, Philip's dad, Phil, did an interview with Jimmy Guerin in the Sunday Independent. Phil confirmed his belief, which he had maintained since Philip's disappearance sixteen years earlier, that a paedophile was responsible for his son's death. What worried him most, he said in the interview, "is the fate Philip suffered before his death".

A few days later, gardai publicly discounted the possibility that a paedophile may have been involved in Philip's disappearance and said they understood this to be the belief of Philip's father. This smacks of cover-up. Who were they trying to hide, and why?
It seems to me that for a father to be so conclusively adamant that a paedophile drove his son away from school that afternoon and killed him, he would either have had to know his son's abuser, or else his son would have to have told him about the abuse he was being subjected to. Or both. The net is tightening."

Going Forward

1968 wrote: »

Gareth O'Callaghan Facebook post yesterday. Linked a Cairns family friend and member of Dublin Sea Angling Club with the death of Philip.

[Link :

https://www.facebook.com/gareth.ocallaghan.1/photos/a.425043820976753.1073741829.305722736242196/656369004510899/?type=3&theater]

"I would like to thank an individual who contacted me two weeks ago with information in relation to the disappearance of Philip Cairns. This is the most significant information that I have received so far. For confidentiality purposes I will call the man Tom. We spoke at length that Friday evening, and again at length on two other occasions in the past two weeks. We remain in contact and he is very eager to be kept updated on progress. He understands why I am sharing some of what we have discussed here - as it is very important that you are aware of this if you have a genuine interest in this case being solved. I should advise here that it doesn't make for easy reading.

Tom told me that he believes he knows where Philip's body is buried. He has lived with this awful secret for many years and had been too terrified to come forward with the information and report it to the gardai. He was afraid that he would also disappear if it was ever suspected that he had told anyone what he understands happened to Philip.

Tom has given me the address of a house in the south Dublin area. He explained to me that he believes more than anything that Philip's body is buried there. The man who owned this house died of cancer in 2006. He was an eccentric who was into young boys. He was most likely the last person to see Philip Cairns alive. Tom explained to me that he lived in fear for years, even long after this man had died. Clearly this man was not operating alone. He told me it took him almost four years to go to a garda station and report what he knew. He felt that he was carrying such a huge secret, even though this man was dead, that he was certain his life was in danger if he opened his mouth. I could tangibly feel his fear as he explained the long years of silent terror that continue to haunt him to this day.
There have been many conspiracy theories and stories over the years. Some of them have led to land being excavated and checked, but none of them have yielded anything. I have read up widely on all of the history of this case, but clearly Tom's information is one of the strongest leads I have listened to. Both his story and his timeline are very strong. He was a gardener for this man for quite a few years and became suspicious both as a result of certain strange statements and bizarre misgivings the man would blurt out as he became older and more regretful, and also from items he came across while digging and loosening top soil in the back garden.

Tom is a healthy, fit man in his mid-60s. He swims a few times a week and looks after himself. He is a family man with a caring, empathic way about him. His memory is strong and his ability to recall very specific items and details leads me to believe that his information is not only genuine and credible, but extremely important and relevant.

However...
A couple of days after first speaking with Tom, I contacted the gardai and discussed the information he had given to me with the senior garda who is heading up the investigation into Philip's disappearance. It turns out that Tom had met with the gardai on two separate occasions - in 2010 and 2011 - and made statements based on the same information I have shared here. (Obviously the information is more detailed than I can share here.) Tom heard nothing back from the gardai whatsoever in the years since then. No action whatsoever was taken to check out the location or the details that Tom had given. He also contacted the investigation team more recently in the hope that they might take his information seriously. He has heard nothing back from them either.
I spoke last night with a friend of mine who is a high-ranking police officer in the UK. He told me that if had received this information in relation to a property in the area that he polices, a forensic team with dogs and diggers would be in that garden at first light the following day and they wouldn't leave a stone unturned.

While I understand that the Eamon Cooke theory has taken up the full spotlight of this investigation in recent months, Tom's information strikes me as being far more urgent and relevant; while also considering that nothing substantial has been done in six years to investigate and possibly eliminate Tom's evidence.
The question needs to be asked today: why hasn't this information been taken seriously and this address been investigated? Is someone trying to hinder the investigation? Is someone powerful thinking it might be far more convenient just to pin the blame on a dead convict whose reputation is already in tatters? Is this deflection at the core of the cover-up that has prevailed now for thirty years?

The man who owned this property that Tom has identified was a member of Dublin Sea Angling Club, a fishing club that Philip and his father were also members of. The man was also a regular attendee at the prayer meetings that Philip attended on a weekly basis. He had become a close friend of Philip's dad over the years. The group were due to head away for the long October bank holiday weekend on a fishing trip to Kilcoole, in County Wicklow. Philip disappeared the day before the fishing club were due to travel. From information I have received confidentially, I understand that a number of paedophiles were also members of this fishing club. I would be interested in hearing from anyone who was familiar with Dublin Sea Angling Club in the 1980s.

On Sunday 17th November 2002, Philip's dad, Phil, did an interview with Jimmy Guerin in the Sunday Independent. Phil confirmed his belief, which he had maintained since Philip's disappearance sixteen years earlier, that a paedophile was responsible for his son's death. What worried him most, he said in the interview, "is the fate Philip suffered before his death".

A few days later, gardai publicly discounted the possibility that a paedophile may have been involved in Philip's disappearance and said they understood this to be the belief of Philip's father. This smacks of cover-up. Who were they trying to hide, and why?
It seems to me that for a father to be so conclusively adamant that a paedophile drove his son away from school that afternoon and killed him, he would either have had to know his son's abuser, or else his son would have to have told him about the abuse he was being subjected to. Or both. The net is tightening."

Seems plausible.

Looks like he's bringing it back to the born again christian/religion angle that was discussed earlier in the thread.

And here

http://touch.boards.ie/thread/2055930498

Stasi 2.0

Means Of Escape wrote: »

Whatever happened to Cookes jag?
Might be still in circulation being a rare car at the time .
Anyone know the reg?
Even if it was restored and owned by a collector hair fibres could still be found in the car in the most unusual places ie under the gear selector ,under wiring spare tyre in the boot etc .

The car is the key if it survives not in notebooks or files.

Believe it was a 1958 model so in al likelihood it has been long since been scrapped although he still had it as recently as 1989. Given its age it may have been resprayed and its possibly not the only vehicle Cooke owned -his obsession for hording old junk (in various states of repair and frequently of dubious origin) was pretty legendary and probably extended to cars. He did own an old ambulance at one point.