Pro's and con's of Leaf

josip

nokia69 wrote: »

Battery swapping is not going to happen, its like Hydrogen fool cells, popular with people who don't know what they're talking about

Why do you so strongly believe that fuel cells don't have a place in the market?
Even Nissan, for many the EV market leader, is not prepared to dismiss them as completely as you do.
www.gizmag.com/nissan-biofuel-fuel-cell/43856

Fuel cells are inefficient and producing hydrogen is hugely inefficient, this extra energy consumption is far better off charging batteries which is very efficient.

Until battery tech reaches the point it can transport a HGV I can see a place for Hydrogen but if not created with Nuclear or 100% renewable then they might as well stick to diesel.

Water John

Aren't TCD making some breakthrough on Hydrogen fuel cell?

Water John

Water John wrote: »

Aren't TCD making some breakthrough on Hydrogen fuel cell?

Doesn't make much of a difference, the fuel still has to be produced and batteries are already vastly superior because fuel cells can't give the power without having a lithium battery in between anyway and currently no hydrogen pump exists yet that I know of capable of pumping more than 150 miles of range due to the massive pressures involved.

1.5 years will see 300 Km+ electric cars and I don't know why anyone would want to trade the same range for the sake of refuelling in 10 mins when they can charge 300 kms from home over night or over a couple of nights if needs be.

Fast charging is getting faster also.

Fuel cells also have a limited life. But 300 Km batteries will last a pretty long time. The Leaf will most likely have 90% capacity left after 160,000 kms and still be perfectly usable after 200,000 for the current Gen 24 Kwh, larger batteries will see far less cycling and should last much longer. Though the 30 Kwh Leaf battery life will remain unknown for some time yet.

Water John

Not disagreeing with you in general. The volatility of Hydrogen would be an issue for me. Just keeping looking at all options for the future of transport and energy.

Jolly Red Giant

Well - after procrastinating for more than a year - I finally went into a Nissan dealer earlier this week and took a short test drive in a Leaf.

I have to say that I was even more impressed than I thought it would be. There really is no competition when you compare it to driving an ICE.

I want to get one - the biggest problem now is to convince 'she who must be obeyed' that this is a good idea. I am meeting monumental resistance, but I am arranging to get the car for a 24 hour run to see if it will change opinions.

I have been browsing here for a year and if I can convince the all important person of the advantages of the Leaf then I am sure I will be back to ask lots of questions and look for advice from those who have the experience of driving these cars.

You need to make sure your Wife/Partner , etc, is willing to go along with charging on long trips, otherwise you risk rows.

The 30 Kwh would be the leaf to get because it's got about 30 kms more range and charges faster form the fast chargers, however if most of your driving is local and shorter trips then the 24 Kwh might be the most suitable option. The 6.6 Kw charger is very useful when plugged into standard public chargers.

cuculainn

Is the 30kwh only giving 30 km extra?
I know the 250 km quoted range is ideal conditions at a certain speed but if it's just 30 km extra that's a 130 to 140 km range for me....as opposed to 170 that the dealer was estimating......

cuculainn

cuculainn wrote: »

Is the 30kwh only giving 30 km extra?
I know the 250 km quoted range is ideal conditions at a certain speed but if it's just 30 km extra that's a 130 to 140 km range for me....as opposed to 170 that the dealer was estimating......

170-180 kms would be possible at 80-100 Kph-105 Kph.

The 24 Kwh has 21 Kwh usable and the 30 Kwh has 28.

So I drove 200 kms on the motorway -whatever was the slower driving through waterford and back to the Motorway, my average efficiency was 18.2 Kwh/100 kms if I remember correctly.

That's about 5.4 Kms/Kwh.

So that would give me 113 Kms until the car physically stops in the 24 Kwh and 151 kms in the 30 Kwh at the same efficiency. So that's 38 kms more.

Better than 113 , and also the 30 Kwh charges faster at the fast charger which is going to be useful.

So say at 110 kph be charging after 140 kms in the 30 Kwh or be pretty close to a charge point and after 100 kms in the 24 Kwh. So I guess that gives a real life of about 40 kms in the difference.

Obviously if you drive on national 100 Kph routes your efficiency will go up and you get more range. Or you can drive at 100 Kph on the motorway either. Either way 140 kms isn't bad at about 110 kph if you can replace 100 kms in 25-30 mins at the fast charger because an 80% fast charge is about 2 Kwh more than the 24 Kwh charged to 80%.

240 kms with a 25-30 min QC ? that's not bad really, especially if you rarely drive past 130-140 kms for your normal every day driving.

Villain

Reports in the Facebook group of EV Owners that Nissan have stopped offering PCP on Leafs! Anyone know if that's across all dealers?

I wouldn't be surprised as I have pointed out in the past PCP with EVs have extra risks and unknowns given how battery technology is moving and future values are uncertain although people like mad lad think I'm talking nonsense

Villain

Villain wrote: »

Reports in the Facebook group of EV Owners that Nissan have stopped offering PCP on Leafs! Anyone know if that's across all dealers?

I wouldn't be surprised as I have pointed out in the past PCP with EVs have extra risks and unknowns given how battery technology is moving and future values are uncertain although people like mad lad think I'm talking nonsense

I don't think you talk nonsense all the time, just some of the time !

Hmmm, I never heard this, well they would be foolish to eliminate a way of paying for the Leaf because I don't think I would pay via regular finance or bank loan because I don't want to pay full price PM for something I've no intentions of keeping in the first place, however, there is still the option to pay over 5 years but then I'd be paying higher interest.

Jolly Red Giant

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't think you talk nonsense all the time, just some of the time !

Hmmm, I never heard this, well they would be foolish to eliminate a way of paying for the Leaf because I don't think I would pay via regular finance or bank loan because I don't want to pay full price PM for something I've no intentions of keeping in the first place, however, there is still the option to pay over 5 years but then I'd be paying higher interest.

I was offered PCP on Thursday.

Marcusm

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't think you talk nonsense all the time, just some of the time !

Hmmm, I never heard this, well they would be foolish to eliminate a way of paying for the Leaf because I don't think I would pay via regular finance or bank loan because I don't want to pay full price PM for something I've no intentions of keeping in the first place, however, there is still the option to pay over 5 years but then I'd be paying higher interest.

The PCP is financed by AIB; unless they can pass the RV risk back to the Nissan distributor, it is understandable that there will be a limit to how many PCP deals they will finance.

Soarer

Hey guys.

Would a 2014 Leaf with this arrangement have the 6.6kw charger?

KCross

I dont think its possible to tell from looking at the charge ports.

You have to look at the dash and by pressing one of the buttons to the right of the steering wheel, to cycle through the displays, it will show up two charging times (6.6 and 3.3). If it only shows 3.3 it, obviously, doesnt have the 6.6 charger.

I believe the only other way to know is to pop the bonnet and look at the charger itself.

Yes correct, find in themenu and it should give charge times for 6 and 3 kw if it only has 3.3 Kw it will only show charge time, ir estimate charge time.

oinkely

I concur with all the above, only one 'time to charge completion' with the standard charger.

As an aside, charged my 24kw on a standard charger near work today. Parked it at 10am at 30%, picked it up at 1.45 at 100%, balancing was not yet done, the timer was estimating another 40 minutes for that to finish.

Not too shabby, and the 6.6kw charger would be twice as fast.

Love this car ;-)

Water John

Not sure where this should go, but OH reports that chargers near County Hall in Cork were occupied by two cars that were fully charged. It seems to be a habit on that location.
Local staff seen to use them as their own.

KCross

Water John wrote: »

Not sure where this should go, but OH reports that chargers near County Hall in Cork were occupied by two cars that were fully charged. It seems to be a habit on that location.
Local staff seen to use them as their own.

Two things...
Just 100yds up the road is the Nissan garage and there is a free rapid charger there so she could use that instead. I've used it a few times and it was always free.

And maybe it would be worth putting a chargebump sticker on the hoggers cars. They might get the message and they might respond to being bumped.

Water John

Yes Kcross, she does usually uses that one. I think it was more at the annoyance of the manners/etiquette of those hogging those ones she was highlighting.

iseedeadpeople

having been driving a leaf now for couple of months and while i do love it i finally have a con.... Never trust the range meter. If it says 60km left knowck 20 off it too be safe

The range indicator is pretty accurate , what catches it out is sudden change in driving style or steep hills but it should balance out again.

It's better to learn how many kms per battery % you can get. But that too will change with a sudden change in driving style.

Word of caution, once the battery reaches about 18% drive as easy as you can because it can go from 12% to --- very quickly. Because not all battery cells are created equally there is some differences in the amount of capacity they have and the rate of current they can be discharged at so if you plant the foot the weaker cells will drain quicker but the BMS will intervene and knock those cells out of the equation so you're left with less capacity, so the trick is when the charge gets low from low battery warning, drive gentle and it will help you maximise the amount of charge you can pull from the battery.

BoatMad

iseedeadpeople wrote: »

having been driving a leaf now for couple of months and while i do love it i finally have a con.... Never trust the range meter. If it says 60km left knowck 20 off it too be safe

At 95kmph I discount the GOM , by about 10 km fit every motorway hill I know I will encounter

At 105kmph I increase the discount to 15

So on the m11 I have four major climbs and the GOM gets discounted by 40 km.

Works a treat.

josip

BoatMad wrote: »

At 95kmph I discount the GOM , by about 10 km fit every motorway hill I know I will encounter

At 105kmph I increase the discount to 15

So on the m11 I have four major climbs and the GOM gets discounted by 40 km.

Works a treat.

What are the major climbs on the M11?

BoatMad

josip wrote: »

What are the major climbs on the M11?

Heading south
Bray north to kilmac ( easy one I discount )
Greystones to Newtown
Coynes to Wicklow ( a bastard )
Run up to arklow north
Avoca river to gorey service area

BoatMad

josip wrote: »

What are the major climbs on the M11?

Heading south
Bray north to kilmac ( easy one I discount )
Greystones to Newtown
Coynes to Wicklow ( a bastard )
Run up to arklow north
Avoca river to gorey service area


This contrasts with the m4 m6 which is quite flat

who_ru

Hi Folks,

is this good value for a 2015 Leaf?

http://www.carsireland.ie/detail.php?ad_id=1526922&r=s.php%3Fm%5B%5D%3D61%26o%5B%5D%3D2167%26l%5B%5D%3Dp1%26g%3D0

peposhi

It is actually excellent value.

pwurple

who_ru wrote: »

Hi Folks,

is this good value for a 2015 Leaf?

http://www.carsireland.ie/detail.php?ad_id=1526922&r=s.php%3Fm%5B%5D%3D61%26o%5B%5D%3D2167%26l%5B%5D%3Dp1%26g%3D0

Looks way too good to be true. That model would have retailed at 30k 6 months ago.

What's wrong with it? Run a CARTELL report in case it's been crashed or has an insurance claim on it.

who_ru

pwurple wrote: »

Looks way too good to be true. That model would have retailed at 30k 6 months ago.

What's wrong with it? Run a CARTELL report in case it's been crashed or has an insurance claim on it.

I spoke to the dealership, told me they bought the car in the UK.

DrPhilG

Still looks suspect.

I bought in the UK, got a 1 year old Tekna for the equivalent of about €18,500 when the same car in Ireland was around €22k.

So a good saving, but not THAT good!

josip

Ask them for the UK reg before they bought it so that you can run a check on it on the UK site.
If they don't/won't give you the reg I'd walk away.

jsd1004

pwurple wrote: »

Looks way too good to be true. That model would have retailed at 30k 6 months ago.

What's wrong with it? Run a CARTELL report in case it's been crashed or has an insurance claim on it.

Its a UK import. They seem to be fetching 11k sterling in the uk. Looks like thats what the dealer bought it for.

imfml

Hi all,

I took the leap and have ordered my Leaf. Very excited!

I'd appricate any opinions on PCP vs HP.

The reason I ask is because my preference has always been to drive a car from new for 7 or 8 years. But with battery technology improving, I may consider trading in in 3 years.

Would be interesting to hear others thoughts.

Leasing is a wise choice for now, and always a good choice if you want lower monthly payments "and" intend to change in 2-3 years. Though PCP still offers the option to purchase or refinance at the end of the lease.

What Leaf spec did you go for , battery etc ?

imfml

Deleted User wrote: »

Leasing is a wise choice for now, and always a good choice if you want lower monthly payments "and" intend to change in 2-3 years. Though PCP still offers the option to purchase or refinance at the end of the lease.

What Leaf spec did you go for , battery etc ?

24KW SVE

Excellent, well done ! Same as mine and I love it. Getting into the car on a cold frosty morning fully warm and defogged and defrosted is a really great feature to have !

I love the LED lights too and haven't replaced a single bulb in nearly 44,000 kms and 1 year 7 months ! I replaced the parking lights and number plate bulbs to led, just get the best quality dimmest bulbs you can get, sme people have very bright led's in the reg and it's very bad for drivers behind.

imfml

Any tips for driving a Leaf in the snow? Or automatic or electric cars in general.

Proper winter tyres would be a good start. The difference can be the ability to get out to not being able to with Summer tyres. Proper winter tyres really are amazing.

Buying winter tyres this time of year will be expensive, ideally you install winter tyres for temps around 7 deg C and below.

Other than that the best thing to do is watch the regen, cars with stronger regen will cause more issues because it's unnatural to experience such braking when you lift off the throttle then when you feel the car sliding it's scary, it's like braking hard on ice and that's a no no so the trick is that if your Ev experiences strong regen when you lift off the throttle then don't lift off all the way the more you lift off the stronger the regen.

Not so bad in a Leaf but a lot worse in Ioniq.

The BMW I3 RWD is really scary in Snow with regen it's like pulling the handbrake lol

For the unaware it's actually quiet dangerous , so take it easy and slow down long before a junction , no need to go mad slow on the open road it's only a problem when you need to brake.

liamog

Deleted User wrote: »

Other than that the best thing to do is watch the regen, cars with stronger regen will cause more issues because it's unnatural to experience such braking when you lift off the throttle then when you feel the car sliding it's scary, it's like braking hard on ice and that's a no no so the trick is that if your Ev experiences strong regen when you lift off the throttle then don't lift off all the way the more you lift off the stronger the regen.

Not so bad in a Leaf but a lot worse in Ioniq.

The BMW I3 RWD is really scary in Snow with regen it's like pulling the handbrake lol

For the unaware it's actually quiet dangerous , so take it easy and slow down long before a junction , no need to go mad slow on the open road it's only a problem when you need to brake.

So basically, D mode on the eGolf/e-Up!, zero regen on the Ioniq, is there a zero regen mode on the Leaf or Zoe?

Sabre Man

You can use D mode on your Leaf if you have the choice between B and D.

liamog

liamog wrote: »

So basically, D mode on the eGolf/e-Up!, zero regen on the Ioniq, is there a zero regen mode on the Leaf or Zoe?

Yes, Use D because it provides less regen and use the brakes as normal but you might want to be a bit more cautious until you get to know how it behaves. Just keep the wheels from locking up.