NBA Playoffs 2016

ButtersSuki

Just watching the postgame OKC Thunder press conference. Pop is in vintage sarcasm mode!

Lots of questions on Duncan and Manu. Would hate to see both retire.

astonaidan

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Sacramento didn't! :pac:

Can't flipping sleep so I've come back to this

I do think taking 50 shots is a dick move.It's not like he shot 50 every game? Not every single game, sure.....I can't remember the exact stats but Kobe has something like 5 of the top 8 (maybe it's 4 of 7, not sure, need sleep.....) "most gunning" (I'm too tired to even structure a sentence correctly now it seems) games in NBA history.

Melo? Yup, he blew it for himself, but he also took down Thibs and that Bulls team when he made that call. Contrast what he did for money with David West leaving millions on the table for a chance to compete with San An - it didn't work out for him but at least he tried. Melo preferred to be a big fish in small pond.

Curry V Lillard though? Seriously? How is that even a question? Curry is playing once in a generation basketball this year and last. Lillard is a very, very good player right now and has upside too, but he's not on Curry's level. And I know that's technically NOT what you said, you said he'd be 99% as effective as Curry in that Warriors team. I disagree. As good as Lillard is, he doesn't have the passing ability (1st and second/hockey assist) Curry has, nor does he have the range, nor does he have the ability to run the offence like Curry does etc. They'd prob win 65+, maybe even tip 70 games with Lillard instead of Curry, but they don't win 73, and they don't win the games they won as comfortably as they did with that adjustment.

I'd place both Chris Paul and Westbrook ahead of Lillard right now too btw.

Exactly that isnt what I said. I think Lillard is on a far weaker team and put on GSW, hed be in the running for MVP
Id also have Paul and Westbrook ahead of him but I see Lillard as a more similar player to Curry, hes also 3 years younger.
Like I said I like Curry and rate him high, hes a very relateable superstar, dont know anyone that doesnt like him in the way people didnt like Kobe, Shaq, MJ or LBJ. I see him as a Steve Nash type star

ButtersSuki

astonaidan wrote: »

Exactly that isnt what I said. I think Lillard is on a far weaker team and put on GSW, hed be in the running for MVP
Id also have Paul and Westbrook ahead of him but I see Lillard as a more similar player to Curry, hes also 3 years younger.
Like I said I like Curry and rate him high, hes a very relateable superstar, dont know anyone that doesnt like him in the way people didnt like Kobe, Shaq, MJ or LBJ. I see him as a Steve Nash type star

Sorry if I misinterpreted. Wasn't doing so deliberately.

I see where you're going but not sure I agree - yet. That may change as he evolves though.

Technically he's not as pure a shooter as Curry, I'm talking pure technique and biomechanics.

Though he (Lillard) has great handles, Curry is better.

Curry is hands down a better passer on the 1st or 2nd assist. His passing repetiore is far more than the flashy assist too - I don't think I've seen a better one handed passer off his weak hand, certainly none with such a complete game.

Curry right now is also a smarter player IMO. The way he creates mismatches and where he creates them from (he has redefined where a high post screen is set) is game changing.

What Lillard did with a (relatively) poor this year deserves enormous credit.

That said, the question with Lillard for me is how good would he be on a better team? Some players look very good playing on bad teams. If he was sharing the ball more with better players would his game be where it is? Curry for all his amazing play has never been labelled a "gunner" as he passes so well and plays a team game. There's a bit of the gunner in Lillard. Whether that's out of necessity due to a lack of a supporting cast or whether he's greedy is as yet undefined IMO.

Paully D

ButtersSuki wrote: »

All over in OKC. Hard to believe San An are done. Kinda sad

LeBron closer to another ring with that.

ButtersSuki

Paully D wrote: »

LeBron closer to another ring with that.

The only way he wins a ring this year is if someone goes down injured.

NufcNavan

Another strategic point this series exposed on the part of the Spurs.

There's a reason Pop all of a sudden went from "pace and space" (which everyone else tried copying) back to old school post up and mid-range basketball. They lacked playmakers. Parker and Manu were old and Danny Green can't put the ball on the floor and he was in a season long shooting funk.

A lot of people were saying Pop caught everyone off guard this year. That he zigged when everyone else zagged when he all of a sudden shifted strategies this year. A lot of that probably came out of necessity as Pop knew his team wasn't going to be able to play like it did in 2013 or 2014.

OKC was well equipped to handle a team like that, with a big physical frontline and long armed defenders. They just collapsed on Leonard/Aldridge from 15 feet and in and forced the other Spurs to put the ball on the floor.

astonaidan

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Sorry if I misinterpreted. Wasn't doing so deliberately.

I see where you're going but not sure I agree - yet. That may change as he evolves though.

Technically he's not as pure a shooter as Curry, I'm talking pure technique and biomechanics.

Though he (Lillard) has great handles, Curry is better.

Curry is hands down a better passer on the 1st or 2nd assist. His passing repetiore is far more than the flashy assist too - I don't think I've seen a better one handed passer off his weak hand, certainly none with such a complete game.

Curry right now is also a smarter player IMO. The way he creates mismatches and where he creates them from (he has redefined where a high post screen is set) is game changing.

What Lillard did with a (relatively) poor this year deserves enormous credit.

That said, the question with Lillard for me is how good would he be on a better team? Some players look very good playing on bad teams. If he was sharing the ball more with better players would his game be where it is? Curry for all his amazing play has never been labelled a "gunner" as he passes so well and plays a team game. There's a bit of the gunner in Lillard. Whether that's out of necessity due to a lack of a supporting cast or whether he's greedy is as yet undefined IMO.

Thats funny, I think this year Curry has become more of a gunner. I probably see Lillard in the same light you saw Curry, soon it will be my turn

astonaidan

Random question, their was a guy who used to post on the forum a while back maybe a year or two, what was his name its been annoying me all day.

ButtersSuki

astonaidan wrote: »

Random question, their was a guy who used to post on the forum a while back maybe a year or two, what was his name its been annoying me all day.

There were a few.

DRD? Nuri Sahin?

ButtersSuki

astonaidan wrote: »

Thats funny, I think this year Curry has become more of a gunner. I probably see Lillard in the same light you saw Curry, soon it will be my turn

Really?

Kobe is/was a gunner.

Genuinely curious as to how you see Curry that way. Will you clarify that for me?

ButtersSuki

For those of you who'd be interested the latest BBall breakdown covering the refereeing of game 5 San An v OKC is excellent. On YouTube. In the phone do can't post the link but very easy to find.

astonaidan

ButtersSuki wrote: »

There were a few.

DRD? Nuri Sahin?

Ah I never noticed Nuri was gone, I think it was DRD, he go banned

ButtersSuki

astonaidan wrote: »

Ah I never noticed Nuri was gone, I think it was DRD, he go banned

Nuri got barred from boards completely. Miss Nuri on here, his knowledge and insights into the game were excellent.

DRD was trolling so much it was hard to take him seriously when he wasn't.

Disgraceful refereeing last night in the Raptors - Heat game, shameless. Not saying the Raptors would have won if they got fair calls but they never even had a chance.

Give the ball to Wade - Drive - Foul - repeat

astonaidan

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Nuri got barred from boards completely. Miss Nuri on here, his knowledge and insights into the game were excellent.

DRD was trolling so much it was hard to take him seriously when he wasn't.

Yeah DRD was definitely the guy I was thinking of

ButtersSuki

Deleted User wrote: »

Disgraceful refereeing last night in the Raptors - Heat game, shameless. Not saying the Raptors would have won if they got fair calls but they never even had a chance.

Give the ball to Wade - Drive - Foul - repeat

See games 3-6 of the 2006 Finals for more of the same. Plenty of phantom calls in that series. Dallas were robbed, not Sacramento Kings v Lakers robbed, but robbed.

astonaidan

ButtersSuki wrote: »

See games 3-6 of the 2006 Finals for more of the same. Plenty of phantom calls in that series. Dallas were robbed, not Sacramento Kings v Lakers robbed, but robbed.

Random Lakers dig, oh you :pac::pac:
But yeah D-Wade gets some seriously strange calls in games, which is funny cause Id never call him a flopper, think refs are more intimidated by him

ButtersSuki

astonaidan wrote: »

Random Lakers dig, oh you :pac::pac:

Ah come on now....even the most rabid Lakers fans admit that was a screw job....and not just one game, multiple game con job.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jNAOTwd-nEQ

There's so many articles and multiple documentaries about it INCL. allegations of match fixing by the referees at the request of the league.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/06/11/AR2008061100102.html

http://grantland.com/features/2002-western-conference-oral-history-los-angeles-lakers-sacramento-kings/

http://espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3436401

http://roundballdaily.com/2010/05/12/the-lost-champions-the-story-of-the-2002-sacramento-kings-and-the-fixed-western-conference-finals/

There's literally dozens of articles in respected journals about that series. It was a complete screwing of Sacramento. The most disgraceful and rigged officiating ever seen anywhere.............outside the Irish National League :pac:

ButtersSuki

La Queen Jane (not mine, but I like it) with a complete d!ck move comment about Curry's MVP.

Such a jealous beeyatch. Curry doesn't get half the preferential treatment from refs he does, nor does he travel 5 times a game, nor does he commit 5+ offensive fouls with his left arm every game. LeJon is like school in summer: no class.

MrKingsley

As someone who has only properly started following basketball the last 4/5 years Id never even heard about that kings - Lakers scandal. Thanks for posting it Butters.

Certainly will change the way I look at Kobe or Shaq's legacies. Im living in france and only had access to french (bein sports) coverage of the NBA, which is excellent I find. But during Kobe's tour they never really mentioned his first 3 rings. I guess now I know why.

Also Butters would you have a link to that Lebron quote? I only saw one where he seemed quite gracious and said Curry undoubtedly derserved the MVP. The fact that he is a massive tool would mean that it wouldnt surprise me if it was purely for the cameras

ButtersSuki

MrKingsley wrote: »

As someone who has only properly started following basketball the last 4/5 years Id never even heard about that kings - Lakers scandal. Thanks for posting it Butters.

Certainly will change the way I look at Kobe or Shaq's legacies. Im living in france and only had access to french (bein sports) coverage of the NBA, which is excellent I find. But during Kobe's tour they never really mentioned his first 3 rings. I guess now I know why.

Also Butters would you have a link to that Lebron quote? I only saw one where he seemed quite gracious and said Curry undoubtedly derserved the MVP. The fact that he is a massive tool would mean that it wouldnt surprise me if it was purely for the cameras

No problem on the Kings story. I'm always amazed at how many people missed that.

It's part of the reason I don't have Kobe on the pedestal others do. One of those rings was heavily tainted. Another is the fact he was riding Shaq's coat tails on those first 3. He was not the leader or the main man on that team.

Comments:
LeJon's initial comments were complimentary, then being LeJon his soother fell out of his mouth and this came out:

But, after bringing up the subject of debate surrounding the award, LeBron questioned the interpretation of the award. It’s a question that the sports world has been bickering over for quite some time — Does the award go to the player most valuable to his team, or does it go to the league’s best player?

“But when you talk about most ‘valuable’ then you can have a different conversation, so, take nothing away from him, he’s definitely deserving of that award, for sure.”
…

“If you do it by a year-to-year basis, I think sometimes the word ‘valuable’ or best player of the year, you can have different results,” he said.

LeJon:
http://uproxx.com/dimemag/lebron-james-steph-curry-mvp-what-valuable-means/

Curry's response:
https://www.yahoo.com/news/steph-curry-comes-back-lebron-145231679.html

“I’ve gotten really good at ignoring people,” Curry said. “So that is the theme of the last two years.”

ButtersSuki

Really looking forward to the WCF.

No. 1 offense v No. 2, not often you get that. The over pts per game will be high on this.

4 guys capable of going for 40+ every night. Huge shootout potential.

Also between Draymond/Varajao and Adams/Kanter, real chance of some chippiness.

GS are undoubtedly deeper, so expect Russ and KD to play 50+ mins every game (bar a blow out).

OKC undoubtedly to get physical with Steph. That's crucial for me, that he stays healthy.

KD always plays well against GS. he's averaging 37PPG against them this year.

Best 4Q team in the league statistically? GS. Best in the Playoffs? GS.

OKC were 22nd in the league in the 4Q this year........:eek:

From memory, OKC have led in the 4th Q all games v GS this year - and ultimately lost. But the fact they were there or thereabouts is interesting.

Russ:
The one thing GS have problems with is very good PGs. Can you trust Russ though? Do you get triple double Russ, or 30shot Russ (screwing it up for KD en route)?

Another stat I read last night that I didn't know is that in NBA history for players taking 1500+ 3's, Russ is the 3rd worst shooter % wise ever. :eek:






I could talk about this one forever. I can't see GS losing bar injury, but it should be VERY close.

I just hope everyone stays healthy and it should be awesome.

It's the real Finals for me.

MrKingsley

Yeah i cant wait for this match up either. I hope westbrook plays like he has done for the season and doesnt revert to shooting thirty times and being more interested in being the star on the court as opposed to winning with the team.

It should be a great series. Im going for a 4-2 GS barring injury

And to back to what lebron said........what a spa. 'To do it on a year to year basis'......... what like 2015 to 2016???

astonaidan

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Ah come on now....even the most rabid Lakers fans admit that was a screw job....and not just one game, multiple game con job.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jNAOTwd-nEQ

There's so many articles and multiple documentaries about it INCL. allegations of match fixing by the referees at the request of the league.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/06/11/AR2008061100102.html

http://grantland.com/features/2002-western-conference-oral-history-los-angeles-lakers-sacramento-kings/

http://espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3436401

http://roundballdaily.com/2010/05/12/the-lost-champions-the-story-of-the-2002-sacramento-kings-and-the-fixed-western-conference-finals/

There's literally dozens of articles in respected journals about that series. It was a complete screwing of Sacramento. The most disgraceful and rigged officiating ever seen anywhere.............outside the Irish National League :pac:

Oh stop I cant even watch Irish Basketball, their must be 20 uh guys thats not the rules moments in a game. Kinda like playing with the lads and your like dude you cant do that and they reply street rules :mad:
I wasnt arguing with you regards Lakeshow by the way, I wasnt complaining either :pac::pac::D

astonaidan

ButtersSuki wrote: »

No problem on the Kings story. I'm always amazed at how many people missed that.

It's part of the reason I don't have Kobe on the pedestal others do. One of those rings was heavily tainted. Another is the fact he was riding Shaq's coat tails on those first 3. He was not the leader or the main man on that team.

Comments:
LeJon's initial comments were complimentary, then being LeJon his soother fell out of his mouth and this came out:

But, after bringing up the subject of debate surrounding the award, LeBron questioned the interpretation of the award. It’s a question that the sports world has been bickering over for quite some time — Does the award go to the player most valuable to his team, or does it go to the league’s best player?

“But when you talk about most ‘valuable’ then you can have a different conversation, so, take nothing away from him, he’s definitely deserving of that award, for sure.”
…

“If you do it by a year-to-year basis, I think sometimes the word ‘valuable’ or best player of the year, you can have different results,” he said.

LeJon:
http://uproxx.com/dimemag/lebron-james-steph-curry-mvp-what-valuable-means/

Curry's response:
https://www.yahoo.com/news/steph-curry-comes-back-lebron-145231679.html

“I’ve gotten really good at ignoring people,” Curry said. “So that is the theme of the last two years.”

Just regarding the Kobe part, as Im sure youve noticed Im a massive fan of his, him and Shaq would have been the reason I started following basketball.

Would you feel the same about Lebrons legacy at Miami or do you feel D-Wade was riding his coattails, do you feel Pippen is overrated due to playing alongside Jordan.
Personally I dont think the Lakers win with just Shaq and not Kobe, Shaw was a monster and easily the most visible person in the NBA at the time due to his play but equally his personality. I think its easy to over look the value of Kobe when you see a monster like Shaq tbh.
I dont think Kobe is flawless, Im sure his chasing of Shaq out of LA is a massive regret, I know from a fans point of view it is.

astonaidan

Id like to see OKC win a championship, I just dont see them beating Cleveland. So for that reason, plus if OKC win Durant will not leave which would be just boring, Ill be cheering on GSW

Paully D

I never thought it would be possible, but LeBron is even more unbearable back in Cleveland than he was in Miami.

NufcNavan

Hopefully something big happens this summer that results in a mega star going to the East. The Eastern playoffs have been completely unwatchable for these last two years because none of these weak teams can even compete with Cleveland. I think Boston is the best hope right now for bringing some semblance of respect back to the East playoffs.

Lebron is about to go to his sixth straight Finals. He's an all-time great and everything, but his domination of this conference is starting to reach cartoon-ish levels.

ButtersSuki

NufcNavan wrote: »

Hopefully something big happens this summer that results in a mega star going to the East. The Eastern playoffs have been completely unwatchable for these last two years because none of these weak teams can even compete with Cleveland. I think Boston is the best hope right now for bringing some semblance of respect back to the East playoffs.

Lebron is about to go to his sixth straight Finals. He's an all-time great and everything, but his domination of this conference is starting to reach cartoon-ish levels.

Funny thing is, if he was a nicer person - and hadn't done The Decision BS - no one would mind half as much. And that's what he constantly forgets.

Paully D

NufcNavan wrote: »

Hopefully something big happens this summer that results in a mega star going to the East. The Eastern playoffs have been completely unwatchable for these last two years because none of these weak teams can even compete with Cleveland. I think Boston is the best hope right now for bringing some semblance of respect back to the East playoffs.

Lebron is about to go to his sixth straight Finals. He's an all-time great and everything, but his domination of this conference is starting to reach cartoon-ish levels.

Yeah, I was thinking earlier on that I really hope when all is said and done that his legacy is true to the fact he was virtually guaranteed a Finals spot almost every year of his 6 years playing fantasy NBA.

You think of the battles that other greats have had in the playoffs over the years. LeBron is basically automatically in a Finals every season.