Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread V

Zzippy

Deleted User wrote: »

He's been top drawer for Leinster to be honest, one of our best players this season overall but it's a big step up and one that Tommy O'Donnell has already made so it's an odd call.

He's no less of an unknown than McCloskey, both gotta swim in the deep end on their first rodeo.

As much as it's nice to see new names come through and there might be a short reprieve from the "conservative Joe" rhetoric, I'd much rather have SOB and Payne available.

Those mixed metaphors are awful. Like a duck out of water...

salmocab

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Gotta agree with you. He is an interesting prospect. But it would be a fastracking like no other, and one that doesnt seem necessary through injury or lack of experienced decent level alternatives. A lot of players had done less yet waited in the wings for literally years to get their chance. His performances for Leinster this year, and I have seen most or all of them, have been good. But no so outstandingly outstanding that they demand inclusion.

But he hasn't demanded selection, he's been playing extremely well and now with SOB injured and possibly with Joe thinking that the 6N is gone he's getting a look at in a tough game.
I don't think its any slur on TOD either who I suspect would be starting if we had beaten France.

Interested Observer

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Gotta agree with you. He is an interesting prospect. But it would be a fastracking like no other, and one that doesnt seem necessary through injury or lack of experienced decent level alternatives. A lot of players had done less yet waited in the wings for literally years to get their chance. His performances for Leinster this year, and I have seen most or all of them, have been good. But no so outstandingly outstanding that they demand inclusion.

As always there are plenty of factors that go into it. SOB is injured and Henry has been out for a while so the path has cleared a bit, POM is also injured and though they don't directly compete it gives scope in the backrow. TOD is a good player but again not so outstanding that he demands inclusion.

However long other players have or haven't waited is irrelevant, Schmidt has to pick a team for this weekend.

And he's been excellent for Leinster. Totally deserved to be in the squad.

Zzippy

Zzippy wrote: »

Those mixed metaphors are awful. Like a duck out of water...

What are you talking about?

Clearly you haven't heard about Aqua-Rodeo

salmocab

Deleted User wrote: »

What are you talking about?

Clearly you haven't heard about Aqua-Rodeo

good googling

Billysays no

calico77 wrote: »

lol dragged by who? He is very much his own man and some of these decisions are injury enforced.

You are totally correct. Every decision is injury enforced. It seems the only way to see our form players is through enforced injuries

Zzippy

Deleted User wrote: »

What are you talking about?

Clearly you haven't heard about Aqua-Rodeo

Excellent!

mfceiling

Eddie O'Sullivan with a classic metaphor recently whilst commentating on the radio.

"He's playing well today, he's got his heart in the oven but his head is in the fridge"

Seriously where did he pull that out of?

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

Billysays no wrote: »

Are we talking in a general sense about old people or about rugby players gone past their best before date? Would like clarification before responding!

Clarify for yourself what you meant by the new generation and then apply the opposite of that.

calico77

Billysays no wrote: »

You are totally correct. Every decision is injury enforced. It seems the only way to see our form players is through enforced injuries

Every? I said some.

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

calico77 wrote: »

VDF has performed every bit as impressively as McCloskey. We have more depth at backrow [tested by injuries to POM, SOB] so there is less of a clamour for VDF. He certainly hasnt looked out of place in the ERCC games he played in either.

In my humble less than expert opinion VDF and McCloskey have been the two standout Irish players this season. Nobody involved with the WC squad has had a great season domestically since, some have had one or two good performances, but VDF and McCloskey have performed to the same high level consistently. That's not to say they're world class but they are, for me, the two players I hoped to see at some point during this 6 Nations. Although I did expect it to be from the bench.

Billysays no wrote: »

You are totally correct. Every decision is injury enforced. It seems the only way to see our form players is through enforced injuries

Imagine that. Top coach only changes two time 6 Nations winning team when forced to by injury. Madness!

Billysays no

calico77 wrote: »

Every? I said some.

Apologies. You are once again correct. To tag Healy onto the Irish team in his current form is beyond believable. But once a player has once played for Ireland he will always play for Ireland. Form is irrelevant. So we do have to wait for joe to move on or our players to simply get injured. Its a shocking indictment of Irish management. Bottom line with McCloskey and jvdf I now want to watch Ireland again

Paul Smeenus

Does VdF know The System©?

Bearing in mind McCloskey was around the squad last 6N, VdF would have to be a very fast learner to get it so quickly.

Is TOD injured?

If not, then there's at least one non-injury enforced change....

calico77

Billysays no wrote: »

its a shocking indictment of Irish management. Bottom line with McCloskey and jvdf I now want to watch Ireland again

How is it shocking, Two titles on the bounce indicates the coach knows what he is doing. Changes are needed and will happen but you cant just throw a load of new lads in these days and expect results.

bilston

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

Does VdF know The System©?

Bearing in mind McCloskey was around the squad last 6N, VdF would have to be a very fast learner to get it so quickly.

McCloskey's first squad session was in June I think and then IIRC he wasn't even in the extends pre WC squad so he is pretty new to the set up as well.

I'd be really happy with that side. The bench will be interesting. Presumably Healy will be on it. Will Joe go for impact in Cronin or a bit more of a steady hand in Strauss. Dillane will likely debut from the bench. Will it be TOD or Ruddock on the pine? Surely Ruddock offers more options. Reddan is a cert for the 21 shirt. Assuming Zebo is No.23 and Earls will already be in the team do we really need Madigan's versatility? Will Jackson therefore get the nod at No.22?

Interested Observer

bilston wrote: »

McCloskey's first squad session was in June I think and then IIRC he wasn't even in the extends pre WC squad so he is pretty new to the set up as well.

He mightn't have been named in the squad but he was down in Carton house training this time last year.

The Lost Sheep

Zzippy wrote: »

TOD is more of a 6 to me in the way he plays, VDF more of a classic openside. Maybe Joe thinks it's a more balanced backrow with VDF. Don't worry though, he's only keeping the jersey warm til Jake Heenan is IQ, we'll have a true 7 turnover machine then...

I wouldn't agree with that about TOD. Isnt really like a 6. Just not destructive enough to be a 6.

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

Imagine that. Top coach only changes two time 6 Nations winning team when forced to by injury. Madness!

So we cant rotate players. It is madness.

Deleted User wrote: »

Is TOD injured?

If not, then there's at least one non-injury enforced change....

He isn't. He had illness but has recovered.

swiwi_

R Kearney; A Trimble, J Payne/S McCloskey, R Henshaw, K Earls; J Sexton, C Murray; J McGrath, R Best (capt), M Ross; D Toner, D Ryan; CJ Stander, J Van der Flier, J Heaslip.

R Strauss, C Healy, N White, U Dillane, R Ruddock, E Reddan, I Madigan, S Zebo.

It appears this is the team. It's a pity we'll never know how much of these changes were purely injury related. I feel Trimble needs a big game, he seems to have lost pace, and hasn't really offered anything on attack in the 2 games so far, but his defence has been good. I'm glad VdF has got the nod, he looks to me to have a higher ceiling than TOD. If VdF gets injured Ireland are in trouble, I really don't think any of Stander, Ruddock or Heaslip are adequate 7 cover. Madigan I despair, or rather I feel sorry for Jackson, I've nothing personal against Madigan.

At the end of the day, though, this is your team, not mine, I hope the guys do the business for you!

Zzippy

Continued here folks, closing this one now.