Match Thread: Ireland v Wales [2.30pm 29/08/15 Aviva Stadium] Guinness Series

Ceadog

Wales kicked 41 times, Ireland 33. Wales scored 1try off a 10 man maul, Ireland scored a great team try finished off by The Awesome Power Of Henderson, and had two more held up.

But yeah Gatty, Ireland played no rugby and never threatened the Welsh defence. Whatever you say mate.

leakyboots

Funny 'ol game really. Wales looked more battle-hardened than us, primary concern for me was our forwards as a unit were bested, scrum and breakdown in particular - Tipuric owned us there. Hoping it's just rustiness, if England do the same next week it's a bit of a concern. Complain all you like about how the breakdown is reffed but teams have to adapt, we were thick in that regard, disappointing.

Backs showed virtually no creativity.... kick-kick-kick and Sexton's trademark wraparound... I hope to God this talk of keeping our powder dry is true, hopefully this was planned. I don't know what it is with Wales but I'm always uneasy playing them, wouldn't fancy meeting them in a semi final.

1 - McGrath - difficult day at the office in the scrum (their new 3 looked to be a monster), did some good grunt work carrying in the loose. We really need Healy fit and firing though if we're hoping to beat the top sides. Will turn 26 during the World Cup so hoping he raises his game even further, like him as a player.

2 - Strauss - intriguing battle with him and Cronin, I think he might edge it because of throwing (one or two askew today, was that down to him?) but maybe horses for courses if we need Cronin to inject some pace in the last 20. Has impressed me in these warmups, wasn't stellar today though. Ankle injury needs monitoring according to Schmidt.

3 - White - I won't profess to know much about propping, he didn't get a pasting. The dropoff from Ross is a bit of a worry, him, Sexton and Murray are our cotton wool players.

4 - Henderson - fine outing. Really putting his hand up, I'd be happy to see him or Toner there. I know some people here said we missed Toner in the lineout (POM did a stellar job disrupting and didn't Jordi get a steal towards the end?) but this animal offered some brute force that we haven't seen since Ferris. I don't know would Toner have been as effective today to be honest. Either way, this guy is a real weapon.

5 - POC - Not a great day at the office, when POC is carrying you know we're in trouble. Bit of a farce of a send off but that's neither here nor there.

6 - POM - thought he had a good game, did a lot of grunt carries, was a threat on their throw all day at 2 and correct me if I'm wrong was the only (or one of a paltry few) to get a turnover on the deck. Murray Kinsella had him as one of the few who played well.

7 - Probably the player who'll be most disappointed with his performance. Thoroughly outclassed, not sure he's a 7 but will travel regardless. Think we missed a trick not giving Henry the gametime and having him on the bench. edit: Did have a lineout steal towards the end, good work on that

8 - Heaslip - showed well towards the end of the game but I thought was quiet when we were under the cosh in the first half. Engine and workrate is phenomenal.

9 - Murray - passing was crisp but showed little else. Humdrum performance, will hopefully up his game a notch v England.

10 - Sexton - poor game for me, couple of good kicks which nearly put Earls in, some nice touchfinders but a good few botched ones too. A poster on another forum is claiming he's suffering from the same concussion demons as Fogarty/Jackman - whatever about that, a lot of our hopes rest on his form as the dropoff is quite stark. Will be watching him closely v England, we need him on song.

11 - Earls - tidy match - was called on to do more defensive work than his back 3 compatriots and did it well, North was quiet - hit a lot of rucks (nearly more than Murphy I'd wager) and tackled like a demon, especially in the second half. Bit of a shaky start with a knock on in contact (Heaslip and Rob Kearney had similar), I'd put another one down to a bad blind pass from Murray and was turned over - which I don't think is on him as he had support and had gone into the long position and placed well... there was a ruck inspector (Murray?) who watched Wales drive over which annoyed me no end, was surprised noone else commented on it. Put Rob Kearney through for one of our few half breaks with a great pass. Probably could have gone foraging more in attack like Dave Kearney did though, so a bit of the inverse of the first Wales game where he did well offensively.

12 - Henshaw - Reminded me of D'Arcy in his post-stepping years, hard as nails and hitting everything. The collision in the tackle on Faletau was colossal. One of the few stemming the tide

13 - Fitzgerald - once again I'm left wondering what is it that he brings to the table that many seem to think he's nailed on boarding the plane. Backline did not get moving at all, tackled well to be fair but that's about all I can remember of his contribution. Between today's showing and the poor game v Scotland, I don't know how people can claim on form someone like Earls is behind him for centre backup or Zebo for the wing. JS said injury shouldn't trouble him for longer than 3-7 days which is good news for his chances. Personally I wouldn't have him travelling at all.

14 - D. Kearney - am a fierce critic of his but had a very good outing today, him, Henderson, Henshaw and POM our best players. Caught the ball well and went looking for work in attack, tidied up some scrappy ball. Given how open the back three selection it's hard to know which way it will go but he put his hand up today.

15 - R. Kearney - solid outing. People will naturally gravitate towards his fielding (but forget it's a basic requirement for a fullback and he spilled three) but he looked eager in attack which I think he hasn't done in recent years, ran a good bit of ball. Ran away from one tackle on Roberts (I think) which annoyed me, doesn't have much in the way of competition so place is secure. Form is good which is encouraging.

Subs - game was very broken up and scrappy, especially after Earls' injury so don't really have much to say on them. Cronin did well in the loose, Killer was a bit meh (think he gave away a brainless penalty too), Reddan was so-so, ditto Felix/Ryan. To be honest I thought Wales were worth the win - good result in terms of keeping expectations closer to ground and a proper test-level encounter. Roll on the Orcs.

Tox56

.ak wrote: »

Gatland's post hand comments for a chuckle...

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/international/warren-gatland-ireland-s-narrow-approach-was-easy-to-deal-with-1.2333853#utm_sguid=117404,ccf7bfd8-b733-deb1-4874-171ca9f7987d

It just gives me more respect for how Schmidt approaches his off field obligations. We are lucky to have him representing us

Tox56

leakyboots wrote: »

11 - Earls - tidy match - was called on to do more defensive work than his back 3 compatriots and did it well, North was quiet - hit a lot of rucks (nearly more than Murphy I'd wager) and tackled like a demon, especially in the second half. Bit of a shaky start with a knock on in contact (Heaslip and Rob Kearney had similar), I'd put another one down to a bad blind pass from Murray and was turned over - which I don't think is on him as he had support and had gone into the long position and placed well... there was a ruck inspector (Murray?) who watched Wales drive over which annoyed me no end, was surprised noone else commented on it. Put Rob Kearney through for one of our few half breaks with a great pass. Probably could have gone foraging more in attack like Dave Kearney did though, so a bit of the inverse of the first Wales game where he did well offensively.


13 - Fitzgerald - once again I'm left wondering what is it that he brings to the table that many seem to think he's nailed on boarding the plane. Backline did not get moving at all, tackled well to be fair but that's about all I can remember of his contribution. Between today's showing and the poor game v Scotland, I don't know how people can claim on form someone like Earls is behind him for centre backup or Zebo for the wing. JS said injury shouldn't trouble him for longer than 3-7 days which is good news for his chances. Personally I wouldn't have him travelling at all.

I'm not going to claim to be completely impartial on this because I am a massive fan of what Fitzgerald brings to the table, but the difference in how you assess these two performances is pretty telling. They were both solid defensive performances with not much done offensively but Earls had a 'tidy game' whereas it is unfathomable that Fitz could even travel. Personally I would say Fitz had a solid game that was not at all dissimilar to what we saw from our current first choice 13 throughout the six nations

twinytwo

Tox56 wrote: »

It just gives me more respect for how Schmidt approaches his off field obligations. We are lucky to have him representing us

Gatty is a very very bitter man, he still has... even after all these years a massive chip on his shoulder from the IRFU telling him to take a hike.

It borders on pathetic really.

leakyboots

Tox56 wrote: »

I'm not going to claim to be completely impartial on this because I am a massive fan of what Fitzgerald brings to the table, but the difference in how you assess these two performances is pretty telling. They were both solid defensive performances with not much done offensively but Earls had a 'tidy game' whereas it is unfathomable that Fitz could even travel. Personally I would say Fitz had a solid game that was not at all dissimilar to what we saw from our current first choice 13 throughout the six nations

I just think Earls had a better game than him, put RK away with a sweet pass and answered defensive questions with tackles and rucking. You can argue he was a better-executed-crossfield-kick away from a try which Fitz got in his breadbasket last week. Fitz tackled well (made 9 missed 1 I think), yes, but did little else in attack. If it's a shootout between the two on their recent performances, Earls wins for me, in better form.

Either way the call between Earls/Zebo/Jones/Dave K/Trimble/Fitz will be the main talking point I suspect come Monday night/Tuesday.

awec

I'm not on the Fitz hype train either. Though I am not a card carrying member of the Earls hype club either.

aimee1

leakyboots wrote: »

Funny 'ol game really. Wales looked more battle-hardened than us, primary concern for me was our forwards as a unit were bested, scrum and breakdown in particular - Tipuric owned us there. Hoping it's just rustiness, if England do the same next week it's a bit of a concern. Complain all you like about how the breakdown is reffed but teams have to adapt, we were thick in that regard, disappointing.

Backs showed virtually no creativity.... kick-kick-kick and Sexton's trademark wraparound... I hope to God this talk of keeping our powder dry is true, hopefully this was planned. I don't know what it is with Wales but I'm always uneasy playing them, wouldn't fancy meeting them in a semi final.

1 - McGrath - difficult day at the office in the scrum (their new 3 looked to be a monster), did some good grunt work carrying in the loose. We really need Healy fit and firing though if we're hoping to beat the top sides. Will turn 26 during the World Cup so hoping he raises his game even further, like him as a player.

2 - Strauss - intriguing battle with him and Cronin, I think he might edge it because of throwing (one or two askew today, was that down to him?) but maybe horses for courses if we need Cronin to inject some pace in the last 20. Has impressed me in these warmups, wasn't stellar today though. Ankle injury needs monitoring according to Schmidt.

3 - White - I won't profess to know much about propping, he didn't get a pasting. The dropoff from Ross is a bit of a worry, him, Sexton and Murray are our cotton wool players.

4 - Henderson - fine outing. Really putting his hand up, I'd be happy to see him or Toner there. I know some people here said we missed Toner in the lineout (POM did a stellar job disrupting and didn't Jordi get a steal towards the end?) but this animal offered some brute force that we haven't seen since Ferris. I don't know would Toner have been as effective today to be honest. Either way, this guy is a real weapon.

5 - POC - Not a great day at the office, when POC is carrying you know we're in trouble. Bit of a farce of a send off but that's neither here nor there.

6 - POM - thought he had a good game, did a lot of grunt carries, was a threat on their throw all day at 2 and correct me if I'm wrong was the only (or one of a paltry few) to get a turnover on the deck. Murray Kinsella had him as one of the few who played well.

7 - Probably the player who'll be most disappointed with his performance. Thoroughly outclassed, not sure he's a 7 but will travel regardless. Think we missed a trick not giving Henry the gametime and having him on the bench. edit: Did have a lineout steal towards the end, good work on that

8 - Heaslip - showed well towards the end of the game but I thought was quiet when we were under the cosh in the first half. Engine and workrate is phenomenal.

9 - Murray - passing was crisp but showed little else. Humdrum performance, will hopefully up his game a notch v England.

10 - Sexton - poor game for me, couple of good kicks which nearly put Earls in, some nice touchfinders but a good few botched ones too. A poster on another forum is claiming he's suffering from the same concussion demons as Fogarty/Jackman - whatever about that, a lot of our hopes rest on his form as the dropoff is quite stark. Will be watching him closely v England, we need him on song.

11 - Earls - tidy match - was called on to do more defensive work than his back 3 compatriots and did it well, North was quiet - hit a lot of rucks (nearly more than Murphy I'd wager) and tackled like a demon, especially in the second half. Bit of a shaky start with a knock on in contact (Heaslip and Rob Kearney had similar), I'd put another one down to a bad blind pass from Murray and was turned over - which I don't think is on him as he had support and had gone into the long position and placed well... there was a ruck inspector (Murray?) who watched Wales drive over which annoyed me no end, was surprised noone else commented on it. Put Rob Kearney through for one of our few half breaks with a great pass. Probably could have gone foraging more in attack like Dave Kearney did though, so a bit of the inverse of the first Wales game where he did well offensively.

12 - Henshaw - Reminded me of D'Arcy in his post-stepping years, hard as nails and hitting everything. The collision in the tackle on Faletau was colossal. One of the few stemming the tide

13 - Fitzgerald - once again I'm left wondering what is it that he brings to the table that many seem to think he's nailed on boarding the plane. Backline did not get moving at all, tackled well to be fair but that's about all I can remember of his contribution. Between today's showing and the poor game v Scotland, I don't know how people can claim on form someone like Earls is behind him for centre backup or Zebo for the wing. JS said injury shouldn't trouble him for longer than 3-7 days which is good news for his chances. Personally I wouldn't have him travelling at all.

14 - D. Kearney - am a fierce critic of his but had a very good outing today, him, Henderson, Henshaw and POM our best players. Caught the ball well and went looking for work in attack, tidied up some scrappy ball. Given how open the back three selection it's hard to know which way it will go but he put his hand up today.

15 - R. Kearney - solid outing. People will naturally gravitate towards his fielding (but forget it's a basic requirement for a fullback and he spilled three) but he looked eager in attack which I think he hasn't done in recent years, ran a good bit of ball. Ran away from one tackle on Roberts (I think) which annoyed me, doesn't have much in the way of competition so place is secure. Form is good which is encouraging.

Subs - game was very broken up and scrappy, especially after Earls' injury so don't really have much to say on them. Cronin did well in the loose, Killer was a bit meh (think he gave away a brainless penalty too), Reddan was so-so, ditto Felix/Ryan. To be honest I thought Wales were worth the win - good result in terms of keeping expectations closer to ground and a proper test-level encounter. Roll on the Orcs.

regarding fitz .....
our attacking play is seriously compromised by having 3 separate teams with 3 separate 9-10-12-13 selections with little time to develop any sort of understanding. Wales have had the team [more or less] that played today prepping for today for the last month or so using behind closed doors games. You seem to be blaming fitz for this when our half backs had very poor games. Saying that they did do some nice loop arounds which would have yielded more on another day

Its also amazing how highly critical you are of R Kearney. One of the spills was a result of a tackle which dislodged the ball as he turned on landing. The other was a result of competition in the air for the ball.

Kearney x2 were the best of our backs. Henderson, Heaslip, POM our best forwards [in that order]

twinytwo

Ceadog wrote: »

Wales kicked 41 times, Ireland 33. Wales scored 1try off a 10 man maul, Ireland scored a great team try finished off by The Awesome Power Of Henderson, and had two more held up.

But yeah Gatty, Ireland played no rugby and never threatened the Welsh defence. Whatever you say mate.

Plus we have healy,best,ross,sob (to start)payne and potentially bowe and trimble to come back in

Luck was with him today, it i was gatty id be very worried. i reckon they will lose to england and aus in the wc and i wouldnt be surprised if figi did a number on them again

TOMP

What is the point of the game against England next week, except to possibly pick up more injuries? Surely we know what the players can do at this stage.

twinytwo

wittycynic wrote: »

The only thing I'd disagree with him on is that Wales, by comparison, play a lot of rugby. They have one approach (BOSH!!) and it has worked well for them as they've had the right personnel to execute it (ie big men like Roberts, Cuthbert, and North). They are limited in that respect.

But he was on the ball about Ireland. We were very poor at building chances and completely lacking creativity.

And yet we were a hairs breath away from scoring 4 other tries. If 1/2p wasnt deadly from the tee, wales wouldnt be up to much.

sydthebeat

Lydiate is a rucking machine....

Syd out.

total former

Joe (on RTE) name checked Dave Kearney as having a great game, also Murphy, Henderson and Tadhg Furlong. Last one was a surprise tbh.

The Lost Sheep

TOMP wrote: »

What is the point of the game against England next week, except to possibly pick up more injuries? Surely we know what the players can do at this stage.

We need another run out ahead of actual cup games. A lot of guys have been fighting for squad places so far but now we can concentrate on the group games.

leakyboots

total former wrote: »

Joe (on RTE) name checked Dave Kearney as having a great game, also Murphy, Henderson and Tadhg Furlong. Last one was a surprise tbh.

Murphy? Jaysis. Poor fella got a lesson today

awec

TOMP wrote: »

What is the point of the game against England next week, except to possibly pick up more injuries? Surely we know what the players can do at this stage.

The actual squad needs a warm up to play with each other.

awec

total former wrote: »

Joe (on RTE) name checked Dave Kearney as having a great game, also Murphy, Henderson and Tadhg Furlong. Last one was a surprise tbh.

Murphy? Joe must be trolling us.

leakyboots

aimee1 wrote: »

regarding fitz .....
our attacking play is seriously compromised by having 3 separate teams with 3 separate 9-10-12-13 selections with little time to develop any sort of understanding. Wales have had the team [more or less] that played today prepping for today for the last month or so using behind closed doors games. You seem to be blaming fitz for this when our half backs had very poor games. Saying that they did do some nice loop arounds which would have yielded more on another day

Its also amazing how highly critical you are of R Kearney. One of the spills was a result of a tackle which dislodged the ball as he turned on landing. The other was a result of competition in the air for the ball.

Kearney x2 were the best of our backs. Henderson, Heaslip, POM our best forwards [in that order]

Fair points, I was just pointing out Kearney did drop 3, it wasn't meant as a criticism, just a fact. His fielding is what it should be for a fullback is what I'm getting at. Him and his bro were the best of a stodgy backline today for sure, as I said, his form is good which is encouraging.

Buer

Tox56 wrote: »

I'm not going to claim to be completely impartial on this because I am a massive fan of what Fitzgerald brings to the table, but the difference in how you assess these two performances is pretty telling. They were both solid defensive performances with not much done offensively but Earls had a 'tidy game' whereas it is unfathomable that Fitz could even travel. Personally I would say Fitz had a solid game that was not at all dissimilar to what we saw from our current first choice 13 throughout the six nations

Absolutely. Earls had a great 20 minutes in defence in the second half. In the first half, he missed a one on one tackle on the wing and knocked on 3 times. Was not his best showing by a long stretch.

Fitzgerald was tidy in the first half and looked fairly comfortable, defending solidly against the Welsh partnership and putting one nice kick through but was anonymous in the second half.

Both should travel but far from certain that they will.

Tox56

awec wrote: »

Murphy? Joe must be trolling us.

I don't know why everyone is surprised at him name checking Murphy, outside the 'star' players he was one of few who had a decent game

smiley_face

Tox56 wrote: »

I don't know why everyone is surprised at him name checking Murphy, outside the 'star' players he was one of few who had a decent game

Just watched the highlights and noticed he robbed a lineout in the 2nd half that was much needed at 10-10.

awec

Tox56 wrote: »

I don't know why everyone is surprised at him name checking Murphy, outside the 'star' players he was one of few who had a decent game

Eh?

Jordi Murphy was completely anonymous. He had an awful game. He definitely isn't 7 cover.

Stheno

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

We need another run out ahead of actual cup games. A lot of guys have been fighting for squad places so far but now we can concentrate on the group games.

POC said he felt rusty out there today

Thought both Kearneys had a good game. Earls did well in defense too. Seemed to be a lot of careless errors

CoDy1

Just watching the highlights, that 'lost forward' call by the tmo on SOB was scandalous.

Sean Kinsella

wittycynic wrote: »

The only thing I'd disagree with him on is that Wales, by comparison, play a lot of rugby. They have one approach (BOSH!!) and it has worked well for them as they've had the right personnel to execute it (ie big men like Roberts, Cuthbert, and North). They are limited in that respect.

But he was on the ball about Ireland. We were very poor at building chances and completely lacking creativity.

Ain't that the truth, I'm sad to say.

total former

awec wrote: »

Eh?

Jordi Murphy was completely anonymous. He had an awful game. He definitely isn't 7 cover.

He's 6-7-8 cover.

Think "awful" is a bit harsh, he was quiet in attack but solid in defence and is becoming a good asset on the opponents' lineout.

Tox56

awec wrote: »

Eh?

Jordi Murphy was completely anonymous. He had an awful game. He definitely isn't 7 cover.

Awful is way too harsh, unless I missed something he didn't make any real mistakes, according to the stats only the locks made more tackles in the pack, and he made some pretty good efforts at disrupting the lineout when POM went off. He's not 7 cover but that's not going to be his role in the squad, he's a squad player to possibly bench and possibly provide cover at 8, a job he did as well as you could reasonably expect in the six nations

twinytwo

aimee1 wrote: »

Kearney x2 were the best of our backs. Henderson, Heaslip, POM our best forwards [in that order]

Ah here, you might as well call a spade a spade... while he was on the pitch POM was easily the best of the backrow.

twinytwo

twinytwo wrote: »

Ah here, you might as well call a spade a spade... while he was on the pitch POM was easily the best of the backrow.

Heaslip was, by a substantial margin, the best back row.

POM and Murphy had largely similar games.

Buer

That was the quietest I've seen POM in a while. Hit rucks but aside from one great penalty he wasn't anywhere close to slowing the Welsh ball. Wasn't prominent in tackling, carrying or lineout where he normally excels.

Conceded a couple of penalties too. He's a deserved cert for our team but today wasn't anything like his best.