Cars to be banned from key Dublin City Centre streets; priority to walking, buses etc

Calina

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Oh I know.

But realistically, buses are the only option for those not on DART, suburban rail, or Luas lines.

They are the mainstay of transport in many suburbs not serviced by the above, so every little helps!

THEN get the integrated scheme sorted (30 years hence I'd say sceptically lol).

So for now, getting the buses moving is a great thing. The same problems do not apply to DART, and to a lesser extent Luas.

Bus users need a break now.

I never came back to this.

I use buses daily. What I am terrified about is that at some point, there will be getting the buses moving, and then there will be yerrah sure it is grand. When you say 30 years and assume that's a hard call (which I'd tend to agree with), and when you put it in the context of the fiasco that is accommodation in Dublin, the logical answer seems to be to emigrate if you want an even remotely reliable transport system. I don't want to hear "we'll get the cars off the road and then it'll be grand". I want to hear integration. It takes years to plan these things never mind getting them started. We're looking at a situation of most of us being dead by the time the place gets an integrated transport system. This is putting the city in the zone of being a hundred to two hundred years behind other cities of a similar population. Fine, do something about the buses in the interim, but only in the context of more comprehensive light rail and integrated options. This crazy, let's put in a Luas line here, and then do nothing for nearly 20 years, well, yeah, the buses have turned out grand there alright.

BoatMad

Calina wrote: »

I never came back to this.

I use buses daily. What I am terrified about is that at some point, there will be getting the buses moving, and then there will be yerrah sure it is grand. When you say 30 years and assume that's a hard call (which I'd tend to agree with), and when you put it in the context of the fiasco that is accommodation in Dublin, the logical answer seems to be to emigrate if you want an even remotely reliable transport system. I don't want to hear "we'll get the cars off the road and then it'll be grand". I want to hear integration. It takes years to plan these things never mind getting them started. We're looking at a situation of most of us being dead by the time the place gets an integrated transport system. This is putting the city in the zone of being a hundred to two hundred years behind other cities of a similar population. Fine, do something about the buses in the interim, but only in the context of more comprehensive light rail and integrated options. This crazy, let's put in a Luas line here, and then do nothing for nearly 20 years, well, yeah, the buses have turned out grand there alright.

All about money and politics my friend, do you want more hospitals or more busses and LUAs etc . everyone is at the feeding trough. Dublin should be getting way more percentage of the available funding, but thats not going to happen in a rural oriented country

ezra_pound

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/oslo-set-to-ban-cars-from-city-centre-by-2019-1.2397666


Oslo set to ban cars from city centre by 2019

monument

Thinkingaboutit wrote: »

I suppose Dublin City Council seem hellbent on Detroit on the Liffey, but likely it'll be introduced in some nominal way, basically some more restrictions on cars, while the public transport system remains terrible.

Detroit on the Liffey? Detroit Has pritty much unrestricted car access. It's more like Amsterdam-lite on the Liffey (with trams for the most part swapped with buses).

The car restrictions are so that public transport keeps moving, is expanded on (Luas Cross City, and more buses), and also has scope to improve further.

The Liffey Cycle Route and other routes should also mean that cycling will become far more attractive to a larger percentage of the residents of Dublin City.

BoatMad wrote: »

All about money and politics my friend, do you want more hospitals or more busses and LUAs etc . everyone is at the feeding trough. Dublin should be getting way more percentage of the available funding, but thats not going to happen in a rural oriented country

More Luas routes could and can be funded partly by ring-fenced development levies.

Dyr

ezra_pound wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/oslo-set-to-ban-cars-from-city-centre-by-2019-1.2397666


Oslo set to ban cars from city centre by 2019

Do dublin bus operate in oslo?

You could level dublin city centre and it turn into nothing but footpath, bus lane and cycle lane and two things would still continue:

Dublin bus would still be a shambles

Cyclists would still believe they're pedestrians


Forgive me If I fail to see how bus lanes and cycle lanes alone are a viable transport solution for the city centre

ezra_pound

Bambi wrote: »

Do dublin bus operate in oslo?

You could level dublin city centre and it turn into nothing but footpath, bus lane and cycle lane and two things would still continue:

Dublin bus would still be a shambles

Cyclists would still believe they're pedestrians


Forgive me If I fail to see how bus lanes and cycle lanes alone are a viable transport solution for the city centre

What is your solution?


Transport infrastructure and service providers need improving and car access needs to be limited in the city centre. I think we're all in agreement on that.

ezra_pound

Bambi wrote: »

Do dublin bus operate in oslo?

You could level dublin city centre and it turn into nothing but footpath, bus lane and cycle lane and two things would still continue:

Dublin bus would still be a shambles

Cyclists would still believe they're pedestrians


Forgive me If I fail to see how bus lanes and cycle lanes alone are a viable transport solution for the city centre

Do you think Dublin bus may operate in Oslo? Is it a serious question?

Cyclists are pedestrians, as are motorists and naval officers and aircraft pilots.

Do cyclists in Amsterdam act less like pedestrians than they do in Dublin? No.

Is the phenomenon of cyclists thinking they're pedestrians a major evil that transport policy/social policy is trying to remedy? No.

So why bring it up?

Will this policy make transport in Ireland worse? No.

monument

Bambi wrote: »

Forgive me If I fail to see how bus lanes and cycle lanes alone are a viable transport solution for the city centre

There would not just be bus lanes and cycle lanes.

There would be bus lanes, bus/cycle only streets, bus/cycle/taxi only streets, bus/cycle/tram only streets, tram lanes, tramways, cycle lanes, cycle paths, footpaths, greenways, improved railway lines, and still tons of general traffic lanes and car parking (including large shopping centre car parks, large to small private car parks, and on-street parking), taxi ranks and more bus and coach parking.

Among the above will be new Luas services, extra buses, extra coaches, more frequent Dart services, Kildare line commuter services running into the central business district, more DublinBikes etc.

Will this be a substitute for Dart Underground or metro? No.

Will it be better than doing nothing and keeping our heads down for waiting for Godot? Hell yes. Putting our heads in the sand waiting for Godot isn't a solution.

Dyr

ezra_pound wrote: »

What is your solution?


Transport infrastructure and service providers need improving and car access needs to be limited in the city centre. I think we're all in agreement on that.

That would an underground metro system and linked light rail, its mental I know

but lets kids ourselves that dublin bus and bikes could fill the gap that banning cars would leave until we got a government that's not scared stiff of infrastructure projects that will take longer than our election cycle to complete.

And I say that as a non car owner who buses it everywhere.

LeinsterDub

monument wrote: »

More Luas routes could and can be funded partly by ring-fenced development levies.

Wasn't there money ring fenced for mn? What happened to that?

monument

Bambi wrote: »

That would an underground metro system and linked light rail, its mental I know

but lets kids ourselves that dublin bus and bikes could fill the gap that banning cars would leave until we got a government that's not scared stiff of infrastructure projects that will take longer than our election cycle to complete.

Exactly what car ban are you talking about? Cars being banned from a small number of streets to enable Luas and buses to work?

Let's kid ourselves that dublin bus and bikes could fill the gap? What? Did you miss the bit where Luas, Dart, commuter trains and private cars were mentioned?

Re bicycles alone: Amsterdam and Copenhagen are fairly equivalent to Dublin in international terms when you look at population etc.

Amsterdam has a great national and regional train system, a load of tram lines and and a few metro lines, yet "32% of traffic movement in the city is by bike compared to 22% by car and 16% by public transport. In the city centre, 48% of traffic movement is by bike."

And Copenhagen with it's massive S-tog (S-ban) system and reasonable metro system, bicycles are still ahead: "In 2013, the modal split of Copenhagen showed a very low rate of car use with 29%. public transport was at 28%, cycling at 36% and walking at 7%."

Bambi wrote: »

And I say that as a non car owner who buses it everywhere.

So what? How is this relevant?

LeinsterDub wrote: »

Wasn't there money ring fenced for mn? What happened to that?

Councils are still holding it, effectively. It's not there's, as they were only collectors.

It's unclear what happens to it given that Metro North is going back to planning -- people could have a good case in looking for the money to be returned to them.