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Allergic to Work
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My opinion may be an unpopular one; but its the truth.
I am 39 years old and the dole. I resigned from my job as I had enough of it.
Am I fit and able to work? Yes. Do I want to? No.
The thing is, I am happier on the dole and not stressed. When I worked I didn't have a work/life balance. I left home at 7.00am and got home 7.00pm. I did an honest days work for an honest days pay; about 5 hours out of my 8 hour shift would be productive if I am honest.
But I always remembered working with my father; as a moody teenager; and he said, son if your heart isn't in a job don't do it. And he sent me into the house.
Its very true that, if a mans heart isn't in a job then its not worth doing.
I know mortgages need paying, and kids need feeding etc. But I don't have either, so I can live without much income.
Would I take a 9.15 Euro per hour job? No. I could do it but would only last say 2-3 months until I either got sacked or jacked it in due to it not being rewarding or stimulating enough; that's the reality.
The problem is; once you have been a manager and earned good money, it's hard to ever go back to less money in a lower position.
But then you get the stage where you think; do I want to do this job any more? And be stressed every day, leaving home at 7.00am for the big money? I did in my early 30's but now at 39 I don't.
I wake up around 10.00am naturally, and have a lay in when I want now. After 20 years of getting up at 5.30am that is priceless to me; honestly that's the truth. Maybe I worked too hard and burned myself out? I don't know.
My father had a very strong worth ethic; as many men of the 50's did. He did the work of 2 men to support our family and mortgage through tough recessions long before the Celtic Tiger boom and bust.
I worked hard from 21 to 38 in career jobs; but if I am honest it was more to live up to my parents and friends expectations; rather than my own aspirations or ambition.
I am happier on the dole than I ever was when I worked, that's the reality. OK I don't have the money, but I have time; and at 39 its more time I want not money.
So am I allergic to work? Yes, I suppose I am. I only did it because I had to. Now I regret all the years I spent working doing something I didn't really enjoy.
I changed jobs, but that was never the answer I hoped it would be. The truth is, I just hate work.
The way I see it is this; if you want to work then fair play to you. And if you don't then that's fine too. One shouldn't try to impose one's views on another man; its freedom of choice.
When I worked I paid my taxes and supported the sponges on the dole, the lifers that have never worked. And now I am one of them. I probably won't ever work again. Do I feel any guilt in being fit and able to work, but choosing not to? None at all.
I suppose if I had a mortgage and kids I would have to, but I don't have to; that's the point.
I never got into debt or borrowed money. I saved. I lived within my means. I see the dole like a weekly pension really. I just think its like retiring early at 39 rather than 65.
If I kept working like I was I would probably have a heart attack or breakdown from it.
Having a strong work ethic is admirable, but it ruined my father's health. And when he retired at 65 he wasn't able to enjoy it as a result.
I always swore to myself that I would never make the same mistake, and would retire at 50. But then last year at 38 I thought; fk this man. I am done working in this office or any office until I am 65. And so I resigned.
My friends all think I am mad, and can't understand how I could be happy not working.
The truth is, there isn't a job out there I want to do.
Yesterday I was listening to the radio laying on my sunlounger in the sun, drinking a mug of tea. I could have been stuck in that office. I thought about that. Money isn't everything you know, happiness is worth more.
Im really glad someone has come out and said what you have said, I am working and will continue to because Im only in my 20's and need money to have a better life but honestly If I had a choice I would not work either, I suffer from anxiety directly related to work but i feel like its something you cant say, that you dont want to work. but a bit different to you though I have felt not much better on the dole either.0 -
Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,470 Mod ✭✭✭✭
Join Date:Posts: 26391
Well said buddy and brave too on boards.ie lol. Prepare yourself. I'm in the same boat as yourself, worked for years but on the dole now. No wife kids just myself and am happy out. Do what I want, go running, play music, chill out, visit the mother, take dog to the beach whatever really. No ones going to build a statue to you for paying tax, and like you watched my dad work himself to the bone and die early. Life is for living and I found it hard to rationalise why I had to go and do something I didn't enjoy everyday not getting nearly compensated for my time which is incredibly valuable.
No doubt you'll be quick to bitch and moan when you are older when they cut medical card and that basic state pension you'll be on because you didn't bother your arse to save into your own pension.
Also you'll be setting a fine example to any kids you may have in the future, "hey kids, don't work....leave everyone else pay for your lifestyle".
:rolleyes:
You'll also no doubt bitch when they cut education and how it affects any kids you might have, something you won't be contributing to at the same time.0 -
Ask yourself this; honestly,
you are raging that people like me sponge off the dole.
And I am apathetic whether people work or sponge in life.
So who is the happier one? The man who is raging, or the man who is apathetic?
Serious questions.
You see working if it makes you rage about sponges on the dole isn't making you happy.
But I am sponging, and feel nothing either way about workers/spongers.
But I am happy, that is a given.
Doing what is right for you, is fair enough. But expecting all men to do what you feel is right, isn't.
Freedom of choice, doesn't mean we all work. It means choice; work/sponge.
We live in a society where one can choose, so I take full advantage of it. There is no shame in doing so.
Yes but your choice impacts others negatively. Feel free to stay at home on your ar$e, but do it out of your own pocket.0 -
The experts reckon that 5 to 7 million jobs in the EU will be lost to further automation and substitution of IT and technoligical ways of doing things and people will be got rid of in the workplace.
It will be up to governments to figure out how to share out the incomes of the few people earning as more people find themselves locked out of work for longer stages in their lives.
People will start work later in their lives....this is already happening.
People will be let go earlier in unprotected jobs as the cost of retraining will be greater than the returns from older workers.
Nations will have to figure out how to keep the affected people alive in the face of non existent opportunities for more and more people.
We see even so called high demand jobs in technology such as Intel are to let go 11% of their workforce and there will be a knock on effect across the technology sector as the least qualified and least competitive people in that sector are displaced out of work by this sudden surplus of labour in this sector.
Being on the dole can no longer be seen as a badge of shame or incompetence in an individual, often a life long time in work is now down to sheer luck.0 -
I worked and paid 40% tax myself. Then had enough of it.
When I worked I felt the same about dole spongers.
But then I thought I would be happier not working, and so I resigned.
The way I see it is this, I paid my taxes for 20 years; and now I am sponging off those taxes.
Fair's fair.
I don't want to go on working until 65 then sit in the sun, I want that now at 39.
That's the reality.
That kind of attitude is why this country was driven to almost financial ruin. I have no problem with you choosing to retire early at 39 if you were continuing to live off your life savings but you are using dole payments to allow you live your life of leisure when you are completely capable of working and contributing to society. The dole allowance is suppose to be a means of helping the less fortunate to make end meat in every day life and pay bills while being expected to actively seek a return to the work force of which you clearly have indicated that you are doing. You should be aware people get their welfare payments cut if they are seen to not being making a genuine effort in a finding new employment0 -
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No doubt you'll be quick to bitch and moan when you are older when they cut medical card and that basic state pension you'll be on because you didn't bother your arse to save into your own pension.
Also you'll be setting a fine example to any kids you may have in the future, "hey kids, don't work....leave everyone else pay for your lifestyle".
:rolleyes:
You'll also no doubt bitch when they cut education and how it affects any kids you might have, something you won't be contributing to at the same time.
I don't bitch and moan, in fact I got away from everyone who does that. No time for it now just enjoying my life.0 -
My opinion may be an unpopular one; but its the truth.
I am 39 years old and the dole. I resigned from my job as I had enough of it.
Am I fit and able to work? Yes. Do I want to? No.
The thing is, I am happier on the dole and not stressed. When I worked I didn't have a work/life balance. I left home at 7.00am and got home 7.00pm. I did an honest days work for an honest days pay; about 5 hours out of my 8 hour shift would be productive if I am honest.
But I always remembered working with my father; as a moody teenager; and he said, son if your heart isn't in a job don't do it. And he sent me into the house.
Its very true that, if a mans heart isn't in a job then its not worth doing.
I know mortgages need paying, and kids need feeding etc. But I don't have either, so I can live without much income.
Would I take a 9.15 Euro per hour job? No. I could do it but would only last say 2-3 months until I either got sacked or jacked it in due to it not being rewarding or stimulating enough; that's the reality.
The problem is; once you have been a manager and earned good money, it's hard to ever go back to less money in a lower position.
But then you get the stage where you think; do I want to do this job any more? And be stressed every day, leaving home at 7.00am for the big money? I did in my early 30's but now at 39 I don't.
I wake up around 10.00am naturally, and have a lay in when I want now. After 20 years of getting up at 5.30am that is priceless to me; honestly that's the truth. Maybe I worked too hard and burned myself out? I don't know.
My father had a very strong worth ethic; as many men of the 50's did. He did the work of 2 men to support our family and mortgage through tough recessions long before the Celtic Tiger boom and bust.
I worked hard from 21 to 38 in career jobs; but if I am honest it was more to live up to my parents and friends expectations; rather than my own aspirations or ambition.
I am happier on the dole than I ever was when I worked, that's the reality. OK I don't have the money, but I have time; and at 39 its more time I want not money.
So am I allergic to work? Yes, I suppose I am. I only did it because I had to. Now I regret all the years I spent working doing something I didn't really enjoy.
I changed jobs, but that was never the answer I hoped it would be. The truth is, I just hate work.
The way I see it is this; if you want to work then fair play to you. And if you don't then that's fine too. One shouldn't try to impose one's views on another man; its freedom of choice.
When I worked I paid my taxes and supported the sponges on the dole, the lifers that have never worked. And now I am one of them. I probably won't ever work again. Do I feel any guilt in being fit and able to work, but choosing not to? None at all.
I suppose if I had a mortgage and kids I would have to, but I don't have to; that's the point.
I never got into debt or borrowed money. I saved. I lived within my means. I see the dole like a weekly pension really. I just think its like retiring early at 39 rather than 65.
If I kept working like I was I would probably have a heart attack or breakdown from it.
Having a strong work ethic is admirable, but it ruined my father's health. And when he retired at 65 he wasn't able to enjoy it as a result.
I always swore to myself that I would never make the same mistake, and would retire at 50. But then last year at 38 I thought; fk this man. I am done working in this office or any office until I am 65. And so I resigned.
My friends all think I am mad, and can't understand how I could be happy not working.
The truth is, there isn't a job out there I want to do.
Yesterday I was listening to the radio laying on my sunlounger in the sun, drinking a mug of tea. I could have been stuck in that office. I thought about that. Money isn't everything you know, happiness is worth more.
While I admire you putting yourself in the crosshairs on AH, especially on such a hot topic & applaud your honesty POA, I don't agree with you, but wish you well never the less...Ask yourself this; honestly,
you are raging that people like me sponge off the dole.
And I am apathetic whether people work or sponge in life.
So who is the happier one? The man who is raging, or the man who is apathetic?
Serious questions.
You see working if it makes you rage about sponges on the dole isn't making you happy.
But I am sponging, and feel nothing either way about workers/spongers.
But I am happy, that is a given.
Doing what is right for you, is fair enough. But expecting all men to do what you feel is right, isn't.
Freedom of choice, doesn't mean we all work. It means choice; work/sponge.
We live in a society where one can choose, so I take full advantage of it. There is no shame in doing so.0 -
Ask yourself this; honestly,
you are raging that people like me sponge off the dole.
And I am apathetic whether people work or sponge in life.
So who is the happier one? The man who is raging, or the man who is apathetic?
Serious questions.
You see working if it makes you rage about sponges on the dole isn't making you happy.
But I am sponging, and feel nothing either way about workers/spongers.
But I am happy, that is a given.
Doing what is right for you, is fair enough. But expecting all men to do what you feel is right, isn't.
Freedom of choice, doesn't mean we all work. It means choice; work/sponge.
We live in a society where one can choose, so I take full advantage of it. There is no shame in doing so.
How are you surviving on 188 a week? How are you paying for your accommodation, food etc?0 -
MRnotlob606 wrote: »No wonder we have such a problem in this country with mental health. People flippantly being called lazy for being unemployed or being told to stick a in a job they don't like.
Its not a popular view with the majority; but you speak the word of truth.
My best friend struggles to hold down 3 jobs at the same time.
He bought a big house in the Celtic Tiger on a 30 year mortgage.
His wife can't work due to depression, so he has her and 2 kids on the payroll; hence the 3 jobs.
I never met a more stressed out man in my life. When I go for a pint with him; he talks about his work; all 3 jobs, and its hard to steer him off the subject.
He talks about bills, taxes, money, mortgage; and work.
Same age as me, and about half a million in debt. He will probably have it all paid off by 65.
But at what cost to his mental health?
He thinks I am mad having resigned from my job last year. Sponging off his taxes etc.
But my mental health has never been better; while he suffers (often in silence).
I am no psychologist, but he is a ripe candidate for suicide.
Pride as a man means he can't confide to his already depressed wife. She has her own problems.
But when I look at them all; the whole family, none of them are happy. The 2 kids with a depressed mother and stressed out father; worried about money.
The truth is, they would be happier and less stressed on the dole.
But you can't tell people that, its their choice.
I think good mental health is priceless. More important to me than paying tax, and living up to my friends and families expectation that I should be doing well in my career.
I have gone past caring what people think of me at 39. I care less, and am happier as a result.
Now don't get me wrong, I don't have the 500K house, wife and 2 kids, new BMW 520d my friend has etc. All I have is my freedom and my happiness.
But if you asked me to trade places with him? I wouldn't at any price.
People often let their mental health slip for money. But it's not so easy to buy it back after.0 -
Its not a popular view with the majority; but you speak the word of truth.
My best friend struggles to hold down 3 jobs at the same time.
He bought a big house in the Celtic Tiger on a 30 year mortgage.
His wife can't work due to depression, so he has her and 2 kids on the payroll; hence the 3 jobs.
I never met a more stressed out man in my life. When I go for a pint with him; he talks about his work; all 3 jobs, and its hard to steer him off the subject.
He talks about bills, taxes, money, mortgage; and work.
Same age as me, and about half a million in debt. He will probably have it all paid off by 65.
But at what cost to his mental health?
He thinks I am mad having resigned from my job last year. Sponging off his taxes etc.
But my mental health has never been better; while he suffers (often in silence).
I am no psychologist, but he is a ripe candidate for suicide.
Pride as a man means he can't confide to his already depressed wife. She has her own problems.
But when I look at them all; the whole family, none of them are happy. The 2 kids with a depressed mother and stressed out father; worried about money.
The truth is, they would be happier and less stressed on the dole.
But you can't tell people that, its their choice.
I think good mental health is priceless. More important to me than paying tax, and living up to my friends and families expectation that I should be doing well in my career.
I have gone past caring what people think of me at 39. I care less, and am happier as a result.
Now don't get me wrong, I don't have the 500K house, wife and 2 kids, new BMW 520d my friend has etc. All I have is my freedom and my happiness.
But if you asked me to trade places with him? I wouldn't at any price.
People often let their mental health slip for money. But it's not so easy to buy it back after.
It's a nice picture you paint bue the unfortunate reality is you can only live how you live because of people like your hardworking friend.0 -
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Yeah once you get over the "what will the neighbours think" you realise society is somewhat self-policing. The norms of how you are supposed to live your life have been set down and if you deviate from the norm the people will be there to brow beat you back into line. Many people do jobs they despise for fear of being thought ill of should they go on the dole and their health/mind suffers as a result.0
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How are you surviving on 188 a week? How are you paying for your accommodation, food etc?
I worked hard for 20 years and saved.
I bought my apartment with my savings, so no mortgage required.
As I have stated before, I don't have kids; so it's just me to support.
So that is how I survive.0 -
I worked hard for 20 years and saved.
I bought my apartment with my savings, so no mortgage required.
As I have stated before, I don't have kids; so it's just me to support.
So that is how I survive.
I have no problem with you deciding not to work. That's your decision and you have very good reasons for it.
I absolutely have a problem with you claiming dole. You should find another way to fund your lifestyle. Work for 6 months of the year, work part-time, be self-employed and just do enough to get by, whatever.
Expecting others to fund your lifestyle is what I find unreasonable about your position.0 -
Max respect to you man. There are many like us who know the score, but often afraid to tell it how it is; due to it being unpopular with the majority.
Work is like prostituting yourself, doing something you hate because you need money.
My freedom is worth more to me than 9.15 Euro per hour.
500 Euro per week won't buy 40 hours of my freedom any more. It used to, but these days I want time to do what I want.
Say I had a mortgage and kids, I would work until 65 for sure. But I don't, and so don't see why I should bother. Be unhappy for another 26 years, and have money in the bank for what? I don't have any kids to pass it on to. So it's all pointless.
Working hard then having a heart attack on the golf course at 65? No thanks.
I want to enjoy my health now while I have it. I did 20 years stuck in offices on sunny days, when I could have been out in the sun.
I won't ever go back to work, I am done with taking orders from the man.
Ha ha go on out of it you scoundrel. "Sticking it to the man"? Apartment fully paid off at age 38 or whatever? You're definitely on a wind up and more the fool people here buying into it.0 -
Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,470 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Join Date:Posts: 26391
I don't bitch and moan, in fact I got away from everyone who does that. No time for it now just enjoying my life.
Don't think you'll be bitching and moaning when you're 70 and the basic state pension is cut in the budget, other benefits are cut and you find you have no medical card and you can't afford a decent health insurance plan?
You're deluded if you think you'll be happy about it.
Anyone I know of on a basic state pension wishes they put more money aside in their youth,0 -
Yeah once you get over the "what will the neighbours think" you realise society is somewhat self-policing. The norms of how you are supposed to live your life have been set down and if you deviate from the norm the people will be there to brow beat you back into line. Many people do jobs they despise for fear of being thought ill of should they go on the dole and their health/mind suffers as a result.
Agreed.
My parents put huge pressure on me to marry young and have kids (as they did).
And then get a mortgage as soon as possible to get on the property ladder (as they did).
It was their culture and work ethic, they tried to breed into me too.
I decided to take a different path in life; and never married or had kids.
I worked hard for 20 years and saved, rather than borrowing money from the bank.
Then I bought my apartment with my savings.
They still don't agree with my way, and that's that.
They pity me for not having a wife and kids, and not working, and that's that.
I suppose in my 20's it bothered me, but at 39 I am gone past caring what they or anyone thinks.
I have my freedom, and do what I want when I want. Each to their own.
I am not going to rage over whether someone works and pays tax, or sponges on the dole.
It really doesn't matter to me either way at this stage.
I worked and was unhappy, and now I don't work and am happy.
So that is all there is to it. I just do what makes me feel happier.
I have learned to take the path of least resistance in life, just like electricity.0 -
Don't think you'll be bitching and moaning when you're 70 and the basic state pension is cut in the budget, other benefits are cut and you find you have no medical card and you can't afford a decent health insurance plan?
You're deluded if you think you'll be happy about it.
Anyone I know of on a basic state pension wishes they put more money aside in their youth,
That's the trap, worry, stress, fear, etc etc.0 -
That kind of attitude is why this country was driven to almost financial ruin. I have no problem with you choosing to retire early at 39 if you were continuing to live off your life savings but you are using dole payments to allow you live your life of leisure when you are completely capable of working and contributing to society. The dole allowance is suppose to be a means of helping the less fortunate to make end meat in every day life and pay bills while being expected to actively seek a return to the work force of which you clearly have indicated that you are doing. You should be aware people get their welfare payments cut if they are seen to not being making a genuine effort in a finding new employment
Could agree, however, he worked 20 years/paid in for 20 years ...the money he's receiving is the money he made/paid in.
Therefore he's not taking from anyone but himself.
Additionally, hes likely paying vat and indirect taxes on daily purchases and will pay for land and other charges if he ever buys a gaff.
So probably net contributor after all considered.0 -
MacauDragon wrote: »Could agree, however, he worked 20 years/paid in for 20 years ...the money he's receiving is the money he made/paid in.
Therefore he's not taking from anyone but himself.
Additionally, hes likely paying vat and indirect taxes on daily purchases and will pay for land and other charges if he ever buys a gaff.
So probably net contributor after all considered.
That doesn't come close to adding up. How much income tax was he paying? Income tax is used to pay for all kinds of services, as well as funding social welfare, so not all of his income tax can be counted against dole.
He's planning on never working again. Let's say he dies at 80 - between dole and pension that's more than 40 years drawing out of the system - do you really think he paid enough income tax in 20 years working to cover that?0 -
Agreed.
My parents put huge pressure on me to marry young and have kids (as they did).
And then get a mortgage as soon as possible to get on the property ladder (as they did).
It was their culture and work ethic, they tried to breed into me too.
I decided to take a different path in life; and never married or had kids.
I worked hard for 20 years and saved, rather than borrowing money from the bank.
Then I bought my apartment with my savings.
They still don't agree with my way, and that's that.
They pity me for not having a wife and kids, and not working, and that's that.
I suppose in my 20's it bothered me, but at 39 I am gone past caring what they or anyone thinks.
I have my freedom, and do what I want when I want. Each to their own.
I am not going to rage over whether someone works and pays tax, or sponges on the dole.
It really doesn't matter to me either way at this stage.
I worked and was unhappy, and now I don't work and am happy.
So that is all there is to it. I just do what makes me feel happier.
I have learned to take the path of least resistance in life, just like electricity.
The dole isn't an open ended benefit, you will get cut off after a certain point.0 -
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maudgonner wrote: »That doesn't come close to adding up. How much income tax was he paying? Income tax is used to pay for all kinds of services, as well as funding social welfare, so not all of his income tax can be counted against dole.
He's planning on never working again. Let's say he dies at 80 - between dole and pension that's more than 40 years drawing out of the system - do you really think he paid enough income tax in 20 years working to cover that?
Calm down, Maud.0 -
maudgonner wrote: »That doesn't come close to adding up. How much income tax was he paying? Income tax is used to pay for all kinds of services, as well as funding social welfare, so not all of his income tax can be counted against dole.
He's planning on never working again. Let's say he dies at 80 - between dole and pension that's more than 40 years drawing out of the system - do you really think he paid enough income tax in 20 years working to cover that?
well there are people who have never paid in, will get payments for their entire life, so don't be having a go at someone who has already worked.0 -
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That kind of attitude is why this country was driven to almost financial ruin. I have no problem with you choosing to retire early at 39 if you were continuing to live off your life savings but you are using dole payments to allow you live your life of leisure when you are completely capable of working and contributing to society. The dole allowance is suppose to be a means of helping the less fortunate to make end meat in every day life and pay bills while being expected to actively seek a return to the work force of which you clearly have indicated that you are doing. You should be aware people get their welfare payments cut if they are seen to not being making a genuine effort in a finding new employment
Our country was close to financial ruin by people living beyond their means and borrowing more than they could afford to repay. Also by banks loaning money irresponsibly, with poor financial control and credit checks; relying to much on the speculation that property prices would always increase. I think that is a fair assessment of reality during the Celtic Tiger boom and bust after.
Don't blame those who exploit the system, it is open to it; and therefore will be used and abused.
Blame those who create a system whereby it can happen. If you give people free money for a zero hour working week; some will take that option. I am one of them.
Being seen to make an effort to avoid cuts is meaningless. I can apply for jobs and get rejection emails all day long. The dole office doesn't have the manpower nor the motivation to cut lifers benefits.
Jobbridge massages the unemployment figures for the government's mandate; that is their real concern, not cutting dole.
The bottom line is this; a man has the choice of work or sponging.
Some choose the former, and some choose the latter. Freedom of choice (like it or not), means some men choose one and some men choose the other.
The majority work, and the minority don't work. So the workers pay for the sponges. That is the reality, and will go on being the reality ad infinitum.
Cuts may well happen, but that won't change the reality of choice.
Communism works in some Republics, but in Ireland its Capitalist, and I don't see that changing. So we will continue to have the workers paying taxes, and the sponges living off the dole.
One can rage about this all day long, does it change anything? No.
That is the reality.0 -
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Everyone should work if they are able to. Nobody makes your bed for you. I think Noonan has hit the nail on the head, there is for certain people who have lived off the dole their whole lives.
I think even safe inmates should be out working, supervised of course. They can give back to the society they took from.0 -
Penny Tration wrote: »One of the requirements is to actually be seeking work!
Ya which is very easy to show, print off applications you have sent off, interviews you have attended.0 -
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If he paid only 100 into the tax pot every week for 20 years he'd be at around +104,000.
Say he used up 50,000 worth of public infrastructure in his life thusfar.
He's still 54,000 in the black.
Which works out at ~5.5 years on 188 a week.
Not counting taxes he paid on purchases.
He owes nothing.0
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