Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 3 ***Updated Mod Note Post 1***

revisionist

Mountainlad wrote: »

Too many wise after the event here. Home advantage irrelevant. The better team won. Well get there eventually.

Home advantage irrelevant ? Ludicrous....

thinkstoomuch1

Dick phelan wrote: »

Sometimes fans baffle me, The reality is Tipp were red hot favorites for a reason, what happened today was what most people expected, it's hardly a massive letdown they didn't win a game almost nobody thought they would. They hit some bad wides and distribution wasn't what it could be but all of a sudden some people want us to abandon our style of play because we've lost by 5 points to either the favorites or second favorites for the AI? We're a work in progress not the finished article did people honestly think we would win Munster and go on to win the AI? Wishful thinking in all honesty.

You have good points but to be fair you were one of those type of fans you now question in you went on kk thread and said on any given day ye could beat any team in ireland and felt ye had the talent and were the real deal and complained waterford weren't been taken seriously enough

Naturally enough a defeat does make views more rational and fair enough you now realise yere very very much a work in progress

tomwaterford

revisionist wrote: »

Home advantage irrelevant ? Ludicrous....

How would playing in Limerick in material way affected the result??


Look it...I think they can improve enough to beat Dublin and kk (A semi v kk could be. A real cracker!!)....could they get a second shot at tipp???

Deise Hurler

What changes would lads like to see for the Dublin match. Personally would like to see Shane Bennett or Patrick Curran in for Eddie Barrett, as they offer more of a scoring treat.
Great effort from all the players today.
Plenty to be learned from it. Hope Gleeson is watching the Sunday game and Donal Ogs analysis in particular.
Onwards and upwards.

TGV

revisionist wrote: »

Home advantage irrelevant ? Ludicrous....

I agree the better team won and congrads to Tipp. To be honest I am not criticising the decision on the venue, but it is worth a few point to the home team. We needed to play much better in the 2nd half to offset this unfortunately this did not happen today.

revisionist

tomwaterford wrote: »

How would playing in Limerick in material way affected the result??


Look it...I think they can improve enough to beat Dublin and kk (A semi v kk could be. A real cracker!!)....could they get a second shot at tipp???

We will never know how playing anywhere else would have been different but it was hugely influential today. It was a decision of monumental,unmitigated,incredible stupidity to play in Thurles, It was made I understand for financial consideration ....shameful,,,,, we are worse than the fai

culbaire

revisionist wrote: »

Home advantage irrelevant ? Ludicrous....

Correct. Would Tipperary concede home advantage to Waterford? You bet it would not.
In that case why play any National League games at home? Why not concede home advantage?
Tipperary players have more experience playing at Semple Stadium. Can be very important for forwards aiming to strike long range points. Tipperary also had the majority support. Killarney would have been my choice.

culbaire

revisionist wrote: »

We will never know how playing anywhere else would have been different but it was hugely influential today. It was a decision of monumental,unmitigated,incredible stupidity to play in Thurles, It was made I understand for financial consideration ....shameful,,,,, we are worse than the fai

You hit the nail on the head. Would Cork concede home venue to Tipperary? It would not.

carter10

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

You have good points but to be fair you were one of those type of fans you now question in you went on kk thread and said on any given day ye could beat any team in ireland and felt ye had the talent and were the real deal and complained waterford weren't been taken seriously enough

Naturally enough a defeat does make views more rational and fair enough you now realise yere very very much a work in progress

You have some cheek coming on here now. no sign of you since you embarrassed yourself after the league final. You've been waiting like a snake in the grass to come back on the minute we lose- worse type of wun. now toddle along and ruin some other thread with your really poor writing style

tomwaterford

revisionist wrote: »

We will never know how playing anywhere else would have been different but it was hugely influential today. It was a decision of monumental,unmitigated,incredible stupidity to play in Thurles, It was made I understand for financial consideration ....shameful,,,,, we are worse than the fai

Waterford would have been even more outnumbered if it was in Limerick

I could understand your complaint if cork was available but it's not....and sour grapes to think it being in thurles affected the result IMO
What would Waterford have done different in a stadium where they haven't won in championship in a long time


It would be as bad as blaming one ref descision when you've 70 mins to go out and beat the team

Stacksofwacks

Mountainlad wrote: »

Too many wise after the event here. Home advantage irrelevant. The better team won. Well get there eventually.

Too right. I think the expectations of some have got a bit unreasonable. Whatever happens, it will go down as a good year. If we can get over Dublin and then put up a good showing against Kilkenny it will go down as an excellent year. I just hope this loss dosen't take the wind out of the sails of some players particularly the u21's who have a real chance of going all the way this year.

Figsy32

culbaire wrote: »

You hit the nail on the head. Would Cork concede home venue to Tipperary? It would not.

We've already conceded it to Kerry in the football this year so that's not exactly true!

wallywhittle

<SNIP>

culbaire

O Riain wrote: »

When you listen to the media and label this system as defensive then you are going to come up with replies like you just made. Yes the system involves boys hanging back but also an extremely big part of it, is boys racing forward for support. We are able to put up big scores with this style but today we just did not fire completely. That's not to say we capitulated and got hammered because we didn't. It just didnt go 100% today. But I am now convinced that the "system" is a good one. To lose by 5 points to Tipp in their home grown is proof that the "system" works. In fact it was only the last 5 minutes that they actually pulled away, i will accept that any day of the week.

What is developing is a type of bastardised hurling with massed defenses, short passes, ruck and maul pick and poke hurling. It has infected several counties but especially Waterford. It is horrible to watch. Waterford will not beat Kilkenny with one or two players in the full forward line. There is a glaring weakness in the full back-line. Tadhg De Burca is wasted as sweeper who covers this weakness. So essentially Waterford is playing with 14 men. Then we have short pucks out which yielded two soft points to Tipperary today. We had the usual nonsense with the team selection. Waterford should have gone for broke in the last 15 minutes. Instead the players were hampered by the system. We just might have snatched it. Another interesting question: How many ground balls were struck by players on either side today? Practically none. The system is too predictable. Clever coaches like Cody know exactly what to expect.. What is developing now is a form of rugby/soccer/hurling. It is a bastardised game that I detest. It is going down the same road as Gaelic "football". Contrast it with the free flowing hurling played by Waterford teams under Justin McCarthy and Gerald McCarthy

TGV

wallywhittle wrote: »

hope your all ready down there for another bateing off kilkenny.

And this why it is so hard for a neutral to shout for Kilkenny.

STIG83

wallywhittle wrote: »

hope your all ready down there for another bateing off kilkenny.

Need to beat Dublin first!!

Stacksofwacks

wallywhittle wrote: »

hope your all ready down there for another bateing off kilkenny.

Groundhog day. thats probably wots gonna end up happening, the stripey men look in serious shape again. Maybe if we learn some UFC techniques we could have a chance..

culbaire

Figsy32 wrote: »

We've already conceded it to Kerry in the football this year so that's not exactly true!

That should not have happened.

thinkstoomuch1

culbaire wrote: »

That should not have happened.

Were else were going to play it

The Páirc is out of action

Mountainlad

culbaire wrote: »

That should not have happened.

They've a home and away agreement with Tipp. Completely banal point to make.

Dick phelan

Forget home advantage before today i think most Waterford people were happy for it to be in Thurles. Reality is we can be proud of our lads but Tipp just had the bit extra and would have had whether it was in Semple or Gaelic Grounds.

JeffKenna

It doesn't matter if the match was held in timbuktu, if you only score 6 points in 35 minutes of hurling then you're not going to win a Munster Final.

Tramore84

The venue had little to do with the result imo. This evening is difficult because that's another Munster final down the drain but realisticallly the better team won today. Tipp are further along in their development and have a more experienced management team but Waterford played well and could have been closer still to Tipp if wr hadn't given a couple of scores to Tipp on a plate. We have won a national title, reached a Munster final and I expect us to get to a an AI semi- final too - not a bad year so far given how low we had sunk in nowlan park against Wexford last year.

tomwaterford

culbaire wrote: »

What is developing is a type of bastardised hurling with massed defenses, short passes, ruck and maul pick and poke hurling. It has infected several counties but especially Waterford. It is horrible to watch. Waterford will not beat Kilkenny with one or two players in the full forward line. There is a glaring weakness in the full back-line. Tadhg De Burca is wasted as sweeper who covers this weakness. So essentially Waterford is playing with 14 men. Then we have short pucks out which yielded two soft points to Tipperary today. We had the usual nonsense with the team selection. Waterford should have gone for broke in the last 15 minutes. Instead the players were hampered by the system. We just might have snatched it. Another interesting question: How many ground balls were struck by players on either side today? Practically none. The system is too predictable. Clever coaches like Cody know exactly what to expect.. What is developing now is a form of rugby/soccer/hurling. It is a bastardised game that I detest. It is going down the same road as Gaelic "football". Contrast it with the free flowing hurling played by Waterford teams under Justin McCarthy and Gerald McCarthy

Where would you put de burca who is v.effective as the sweeper??
As I do recall him getting a torrid time off harnady??


As far as I can see Waterford played noting to there potential today

Where were the runs from midfield with a player over marking to take the pass??

The real standout point of the success againest cork....no attempt to break into space (which looked available from the terrace) for a pass....no one wants to see a one man full forward line....but why have a supposed system and not implement the few positives aspects of it??

thinkstoomuch1

tomwaterford wrote: »

Where would you put de burca who is v.effective as the sweeper??
As I do recall him getting a torrid time off harnady??


As far as I can see Waterford played noting to there potential today

Where were the runs from midfield with a player over marking to take the pass??

The real standout point of the success againest cork....no attempt to break into space (which looked available from the terrace) for a pass....no one wants to see a one man full forward line....but why have a supposed system and not implement the few positives aspects of it??

Harnedy did not I repeat did not play championship v waterford for Cork like you said

culbaire

tomwaterford wrote: »

Where would you put de burca who is v.effective as the sweeper??
As I do recall him getting a torrid time off harnady??


As far as I can see Waterford played noting to there potential today

Where were the runs from midfield with a player over marking to take the pass??

The real standout point of the success againest cork....no attempt to break into space (which looked available from the terrace) for a pass....no one wants to see a one man full forward line....but why have a supposed system and not implement the few positives aspects of it??

I would play De Burca at wing back. He has the skill. I reckon De Burca has the ability to become a good full back. Hurling is a simple game.

The Waterford style traditionally is to move the ball at speed. Waterford generally used ground hurling as another weapon. Picking the ball in tight situations was frowned upon. You wont beat Kilkenny by continuously picking the ball in tight situations. They are best at that. You move the ball at pace and keep them guessing.
Returning to the system: When Stephen Bennett kicked the ball across the goal today there was no in rushing forward to give it a tap in because the system left us short of forwards.

thinkstoomuch1

JeffKenna wrote: »

It doesn't matter if the match was held in timbuktu, if you only score 6 points in 35 minutes of hurling then you're not going to win a Munster Final.

Valid point
Only nine points from play in seventy minutes for waterford compared to tippeary thirteen show the problem with waterford system imo

paddy13

Lads relax a bit. It was a good effort by the lads. All i hope now is U21's regroup for Wednesday. A win there would be a good boost for the county. We were close to beating Tipp today which is good considering they are second best in the country. Really proud of the lads. Maybe not swashbuckling hurling but more effective in my opinion. If we went man to man they would have hurt us. We don't have the same quality of forwards as Tipp at the moment.
I think going forward we need to start one or two more capable scorers probably paddy Curran but I'm very happy with the level of progress we have made this year.

culbaire

STIG83 wrote: »

Need to beat Dublin first!!

The game will not be one for the purists. Dublin will fancy themselves against Waterford. It is likely to be a slugfest.

Dick phelan

I'm sorry if there's one area and in fact one player who's been used correctly it's De Burca, Nothing wrong with the defense it's more solid then i'v ever seen it.