Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 3 ***Updated Mod Note Post 1***

crottys lake

Mountainlad wrote: »

Its a terrible indictment of their defense. Good an all as he was, hes 33 now and hasn't played inter county for two full years.

Lorcan Mc Loughlin is a solid hurler, no more, think he'd be lucky to be coming in off the bench in the great Cork team of 2004 and yet his injury you'd think they'd just lost Paudie Maher. I would imagine Aidan Walsh will go back wing back, and theyll have Kearney and O Shea midfield which would be an improvement but theyll need a third man out their given Dunfords tendency to drop out their.

The concern I'd have is will we be able to take advantage of their ailing defense? I don't doubt the ability of any of the players, but Devine and the two Bennetts are only in their first full season. Brick is starting to look more comfortable but still a converted forward. Outside of him, Jake Dillon is the most experienced forward and in a way hes only really in his second full season as he missed most of last year with injury.

Plenty of potential, but its all going to have to click.

I disagree about Brick being a converted forward, more the opposite he was a converted centre back, he is totally at ease in his role and don't forget he started out as a forward and midfielder for us There were many years wasted for him at centre back .I have absolutely no worries at all about the two Bennetts and Devine being in their first full season, in fact I see it as a positive. They are young,hungry, brave and fear nobody. Their stick work is of the highest calibre with huge scoring potential. I predict all three will have a big influence on the game Sunday.

I take the opposite view insofar as all will have to click for Waterford. All will have to click for Cork.

Mountainlad

crottys lake wrote: »

I disagree about Brick being a converted forward, more the opposite he was a converted centre back, he is totally at ease in his role and don't forget he started out as a forward and midfielder for us There were many years wasted for him at centre back .I have absolutely no worries at all about the two Bennetts and Devine being in their first full season, in fact I see it as a positive. They are young,hungry, brave and fear nobody. Their stick work is of the highest calibre with huge scoring potential. I predict all three will have a big influence on the game Sunday.

I take the opposite view insofar as all will have to click for Waterford. All will have to click for Cork.

He was a brilliant center back, but his striking was never brilliant he was just a great outlet at half forward and a phenomenal athlete. That was my opinion from watching back the few games from around 2003-2007. Since he went back up center forward, both this year and for the brief spell in 2013 he was inclined to look for the pass rather than trust himself to take on his own score. He had one woeful miss v Limerick I think it was and he'd find it very easy to be discouraged by that whereas the other forwards will take it on no matter if they just had a bad miss.

All that said he took two cracking scores against Cork so that may be changing. I get the impression though with the league final that the tails were up and confident teams often can do no wrong. Tom Devine got 1-1 coming on, Brian O Halloran got a point towards the end. It was the same for me as watching the replay last year when every shot Cork took was going over the bar, it's amazing what confidence will do.

I don't doubt Devine's hurling, his touch has been brilliant to me in every game I've seen him in. Stephen Bennett was very good in the first half v Tipp, I know there is more to come but I do think it's a lot to expect it immediately. We know these guys will improve a lot over the next 3 to 4 years, Shane Bennett sounds like he's in great form and that's exactly what you want for any player starting.

If the lads play with the same intensity and work rate they showed through the league, then I think they will be hard to beat. I expect an improved Cork but they've a lot of ground to make up, and they've only had about 13 days together since the league defeat so that's not ideal in my opinion. Don't think we can afford to have 15 wides as I don't think we'll be creating 40 scoring chances this time, if they use the ball as well as they have and keep it tight at the backs again then I think they will win. I have the utmost faith in midfield.

JeffKenna

TyrionPower wrote: »

I'd say he is back on board for matches later in the summer, throwing a guy in with two weeks under his belt would be insane in my mind

We'll agree to disagree...cork admit themselves that they lack a toughness in defense and no better man to bring it than Mr Murphy.

PTH2009

The first 15 mins on Sunday will be helter skelter . Cork will come out flying and Waterford will be out to do it for pauric. I think it will be a draw From watching Sunday I think galway could beat us, it's hard to know with dublin. So the qualifiers will be a tough road to take . Hopefully Waterford surprise me and we will all be looking forward to a Munster final

I'd hate to be knocked out of the championship in Walsh park. It would not be right

Professey Chin

PTH2009 wrote: »

The first 15 mins on Sunday will be helter skelter . Cork will come out flying and Waterford will be out to do it for pauric. I think it will be a draw From watching Sunday I think galway could beat us, it's hard to know with dublin. So the qualifiers will be a tough road to take . Hopefully Waterford surprise me and we will all be looking forward to a Munster final

I'd hate to be knocked out of the championship in Walsh park. It would not be right

What?
They were sh!te. And so were Dublin. I couldnt see anything to fear

JeffKenna

PTH2009 wrote: »

I'd hate to be knocked out of the championship in Walsh park. It would not be right

Never know...we could get lucky and be knocked out in an away game

seananigans

Is anyone else proper buzzing, ? PTH put us down for a draw high praise indeed

It's great to know win lose or draw , our lads will fight to the final whistle

a harder game than last time no doubt , but JBM has zero tactical nous, im really thinking we can edge this one

PTH2009

seananigans wrote: »

Is anyone else proper buzzing, ? PTH put us down for a draw high praise indeed

It's great to know win lose or draw , our lads will fight to the final whistle

a harder game than last time no doubt , but JBM has zero tactical nous, im really thinking we can edge this one

It's a pity one of our best players is exam tied hopefully he still plays it will good for his brain. Just has to miss the drink Sunday night lol

seananigans

PTH2009 wrote: »

It's a pity one of our best players is exam tied hopefully he still plays it will good for his brain. Just has to miss the drink Sunday night lol

he should focus on his exams, hurling is a pastime not a career

PTH2009

seananigans wrote: »

he should focus on his exams, hurling is a pastime not a career

True pity about the timings. He will be back for the next game please god not a replay

tomwaterford

PTH2009 wrote: »

It's a pity one of our best players is exam tied hopefully he still plays it will good for his brain. Just has to miss the drink Sunday night lol

He have years to play for Waterford....his exams are head and shoulders more important than playing cork....esp if he have any designs on going to collage

The blue blaa

PTH2009 wrote: »

True pity about the timings. He will be back for the next game please god not a replay

You should be over on one of those fishing threads PTH2009 your still reeling lads in lol

PTH2009

tomwaterford wrote: »

He have years to play for Waterford....his exams are head and shoulders more important than playing cork....esp if he have any designs on going to collage

Remember I was doing my leaving the last time we played cork in the Munster semi final after winning the league. Good times .

But I'd he plays in a challenge game a week before makes u wonder

tomwaterford

PTH2009 wrote: »

Remember I was doing my leaving the last time we played cork in the Munster semi final after winning the league. Good times .

But I'd he plays in a challenge game a week before makes u wonder

Only other insistent I can recall is Andrew oshagnassy of Limerick playing during leaving cert....but he was afaik going onto the army

ovalu

tomwaterford wrote: »

Only other insistent I can recall is Andrew oshagnassy of Limerick playing during leaving cert....but he was afaik going onto the army[/QUOT


Shaughnassy didn't play if I remember correctly, but Pat Kirby did

tomwaterford

ovalu wrote: »

tomwaterford wrote: »

Only other insistent I can recall is Andrew oshagnassy of Limerick playing during leaving cert....but he was afaik going onto the army[/QUOT


Shaughnassy didn't play if I remember correctly, but Pat Kirby did

Taught he played the first day and not the replay.or vice verso......I may be awlful wrong here

Cake Man

O'Shaughnessy did play against us in 2003 in the cracker of a drawn game (4-14 each if I recall correctly), think he may have also played te replay a week later which we won by 2pts.

Why are people talking as if Shane Bennett won't be involved Sunday, has anything been mentioned ruling him out? You'd have to think if he's involved in a challenge game a few days before it starts, there's every possibility he'll be making himself available for Sunday. I agree with others that his exams are more important but to be fair if he wants to make himself available I'm happy to support him all the way. To be fair, if he doesn't play on Sunday hell most likely be in Thurles watching or at the very least at home watching on telly. No way he'll be doing an ounce of studying when the game is on!

Nerves starting to build but I'm buzzing for it.

carter10

While id love to have Shane Bennett available for Sunday I think it would be foolish and detrimental to his exams the following day. Going from the cauldron of Thurles on Sunday afternoon to the quiet of an exam hall on Monday morning wont work. Id be surprised if Derek McGrath a teacher would allow it. As someone said he has years ahead playing. His education is more important than any match.

stumblingblock

carter10 wrote: »

While id love to have Shane Bennett available for Sunday I think it would be foolish and detrimental to his exams the following day. Going from the cauldron of Thurles on Sunday afternoon to the quiet of an exam hall on Monday morning wont work. Id be surprised if Derek McGrath a teacher would allow it. As someone said he has years ahead playing. His education is more important than any match.

McGrath has come out and said hes leaving the decision entirely up to Shane. Which says to me that he will play him if he makes himself available

stumblingblock

seananigans wrote: »

Is anyone else proper buzzing, ? PTH put us down for a draw high praise indeed

It's great to know win lose or draw , our lads will fight to the final whistle

a harder game than last time no doubt , but JBM has zero tactical nous, im really thinking we can edge this one

I am. As someone who grew up going to Waterford games during the ‘good times’ eg; 98 – 2008, I haven’t felt as much of a buzz about a Munster championship match since probably about 07’ as I have of this one.

Thinking back all those years 02,03,04 etc going on a bus with the lads to Thurles and the huge crowds and buzz and excitement of those games. After the 07’ semi defeat to Limerick a lot of people (including the players) were a bit deflated the following year and all that went on with Justin after the Clare game the buzz just hasn’t been the same since. The county did rise briefly later that summer for the All Ireland but that buzz was short-lived after what happened in the final. Since then the big crowds have waned, for various reasons, and despite relative success under Davy Fitz (One Munster and 4 AI Semi Appearances) it has never been the same as those days under Gerald and Justin.

I don’t think Sunday will hit the heights of the great Cork–Waterford clashes of the naughties by any stretch, certainly not for colour and excitement. But Its definitely been a while since I’ve looked forward to a game this much. With a young, fearless side with no baggage going out with a real belief that they can topple the rebels. I often feared over the past few years that we would not see these days again for a long time. I think a win on Sunday would be massive for us and could be the start of something great. A lot of people still don’t rate us but a win Sunday would firmly put us on the map as being a genuine force again.

TyrionPower

It's not the time watching the match or being in thurles.
Imagine how mentally and physically drained he would be after the whole experience, he would be totally empty facing into the maths and Irish papers the next day, no way he could do himself justice on those papers, he would be wrecked

PTH2009

McGrath basically writing us off in the papers saying he doesn't think our performances on the league will stand to us .

I think he's playing a cute game

Heart says Waterford but my head says cork by 4

stumblingblock

PTH2009 wrote: »

McGrath basically writing us off in the papers saying he doesn't think our performances on the league will stand to us .

I think he's playing a cute game

Heart says Waterford but my head says cork by 4

Well youve predicted us to lose in pretty much every game so far this year so thats a good omen

Mountainlad

Archie was right about Fives it seems. Observer reporting an injury sustained last week.

Jjjjjjjbarry

So who is the most likely to be on the frees?

3ships

Just 8 of the 20 players used in the last years relegation final played a part in the league final win. Just 2 in Shane Fives and Pauric Mahony retained their positions.

Including Noel Connors who limped off after 3 minutes there will be 7 changes to the Waterford team next Sunday from the 14 point loss to Cork last year. For Cork there will be 3. I expect 11 positional changes for Waterford while Cork will mostly line out the same.

In fairness to management they have done well but equally it's hard to get results without the players and this has to be acknowledged as well.

Before Mahony's injury I thought things were fitting into place. That a team was almost formed. They may well yet , there will be more improvement to come but Pauric loss is a big one.
However there are options for the no 11:

-Bennett (Stephen) to the Wing – Dillon to the Centre, prob most likely or at least most alike
-Brick CF but seems to have more licence to roam from Wing
-Daniels in – Aussie goes forward, the purists choice, 1 or 2 spectacular points from WB or a few handy ones from in front of posts and that goal threat. Your choice. WIT started him at CB but had him up top by time of Fitzgibbon Cup. The Fintan O Connor link could make that happen yet.
-Dunford or O Halloran CF roving and running at defence, a good option but maybe not for the whole 70.
-Pat Curran – straight swap but maybe he isn't up to speed yet (tackle count not ability)
-Connors and Breathnach have done well enough there in challenges as well

Another outstanding player Daragh Fives has not played yet this year so in a way doesn't need replacing. His presence would open up various avenues over the summer. I hope he comes back soon, all the other long term absentees are back now so that shows the good work that has been done in physical prep. On that, I thought Martin O Neill and Shane O Sullivan were flying the other evening against Wexford, Paudie Prender too, so there is good options there around HB and MF.

With 2 vice Captains out, you would hope for the 50-50 Maurice Shanahan to be ok. He is the free taker after Pauric and provides the outlet for this team. His return got us over the line in the league.
If he does not make it Tom Devine looks a fine replacement. Improving all the time this lad.

Shane Bennett may well be better than any of them but I would like to see him do well in his exams.
There are plenty of big games to come. Hope he is free by June 17th for 21's.

I expect Cork to be at it from the off this time. There will be no reluctance seen in the first half of Clare and Limerick. Don't think both teams need to suss each other out, there should be no caginess.

Waterford won the last day by 10, cork won last year by 14, even the draw before had a nine point swing. I think its hard to call but I'm gonna tip Waterford of course.

3ships

Great read on Pauric Mahony here


http://www.thestar.ie/star/my-leg-broke-like-cisses-63154/


Hope the Tadgh O Sullivan factor gets him back sooner than Woolock. Mahony will be missed alright. Also fair play to Woodlock for offering to help.

archieknox

3ships wrote: »

Just 8 of the 20 players used in the last years relegation final played a part in the league final win. Just 2 in Shane Fives and Pauric Mahony retained their positions.

Including Noel Connors who limped off after 3 minutes there will be 7 changes to the Waterford team next Sunday from the 14 point loss to Cork last year. For Cork there will be 3. I expect 11 positional changes for Waterford while Cork will mostly line out the same.

In fairness to management they have done well but equally it's hard to get results without the players and this has to be acknowledged as well.

Before Mahony's injury I thought things were fitting into place. That a team was almost formed. They may well yet , there will be more improvement to come but Pauric loss is a big one.
However there are options for the no 11:

-Bennett (Stephen) to the Wing – Dillon to the Centre, prob most likely or at least most alike
-Brick CF but seems to have more licence to roam from Wing
-Daniels in – Aussie goes forward, the purists choice, 1 or 2 spectacular points from WB or a few handy ones from in front of posts and that goal threat. Your choice. WIT started him at CB but had him up top by time of Fitzgibbon Cup. The Fintan O Connor link could make that happen yet.
-Dunford or O Halloran CF roving and running at defence, a good option but maybe not for the whole 70.
-Pat Curran – straight swap but maybe he isn't up to speed yet (tackle count not ability)
-Connors and Breathnach have done well enough there in challenges as well

Another outstanding player Daragh Fives has not played yet this year so in a way doesn't need replacing. His presence would open up various avenues over the summer. I hope he comes back soon, all the other long term absentees are back now so that shows the good work that has been done in physical prep. On that, I thought Martin O Neill and Shane O Sullivan were flying the other evening against Wexford, Paudie Prender too, so there is good options there around HB and MF.

With 2 vice Captains out, you would hope for the 50-50 Maurice Shanahan to be ok. He is the free taker after Pauric and provides the outlet for this team. His return got us over the line in the league.
If he does not make it Tom Devine looks a fine replacement. Improving all the time this lad.

Shane Bennett may well be better than any of them but I would like to see him do well in his exams.
There are plenty of big games to come. Hope he is free by June 17th for 21's.

I expect Cork to be at it from the off this time. There will be no reluctance seen in the first half of Clare and Limerick. Don't think both teams need to suss each other out, there should be no caginess.

Waterford won the last day by 10, cork won last year by 14, even the draw before had a nine point swing. I think its hard to call but I'm gonna tip Waterford of course.

Donie Breatnach has left the panel. Heading to America for the summer,not overjoyed at the lack of game time he has received. Probably a wise decision as with Paddy Curran's arrival onto the squad I would imagine it only pushed him further down the pecking order.
Donnelly,Foran,Mark O Brien and Conor Gleeson are all released back to the u21 panel. Darragh Lyons also introduced to the u21 squad which on paper looks a strong panel.Personally I think Shane McNulty should be back there too but obviously McGrath wants him in his squad. Not too many of them being used for the intermediate either on Sunday which is no harm. Playing a meaningless game 10 days out from their own championship game makes little sense.
As for Sunday I would expect Shane Bennett, Paddy Curran and Stephen Daniels all to be very close to starting or at least to see alot of game time. Will they take the chance of starting Daniels and pushing Ossie up front? Alot of questions to be answered,we'll know all on Sunday! Can't beat the Munster championship and everyone's opinions,the pints in the square beforehand and the post mortem afterwards!!

PTH2009

archieknox wrote: »

Donie Breatnach has left the panel. Heading to America for the summer,not overjoyed at the lack of game time he has received. Probably a wise decision as with Paddy Curran's arrival onto the squad I would imagine it only pushed him further down the pecking order.
Donnelly,Foran,Mark O Brien and Conor Gleeson are all released back to the u21 panel. Darragh Lyons also introduced to the u21 squad which on paper looks a strong panel.Personally I think Shane McNulty should be back there too but obviously McGrath wants him in his squad. Not too many of them being used for the intermediate either on Sunday which is no harm. Playing a meaningless game 10 days out from their own championship game makes little sense.
As for Sunday I would expect Shane Bennett, Paddy Curran and Stephen Daniels all to be very close to starting or at least to see alot of game time. Will they take the chance of starting Daniels and pushing Ossie up front? Alot of questions to be answered,we'll know all on Sunday! Can't beat the Munster championship and everyone's opinions,the pints in the square beforehand and the post mortem afterwards!!

I'd fear that the same thing may happen to Shane Bennett and Paddy curran that happened to Brian o halloran in 2010 vs tipp. They will not be up to the speed of senior championship hurling yet .

Hopefully we will know the starting line up tonight or 2morrow

seananigans

PTH2009 wrote: »

I'd fear that the same thing may happen to Shane Bennett and Paddy curran that happened to Brian o halloran in 2010 vs tipp. They will not be up to the speed of senior championship hurling yet .

Hopefully we will know the starting line up tonight or 2morrow

cork squad announced

http://gaacork.ie/news/360647/