HKC VS Siemens App Discussion Stickey Temp

fred funk }{

Evolution1 wrote: »

You would have gotten a New GSM communicator in order to have the app.

The companies offering free apps and notifications are only going to be free when you connect them to your homes wifi. If your wifi goes down that's your notifications gone. The rumours of price increases can be applied to any system. There's nothing stopping any company from adding a charge.

The €60 covers the top-up of the HKC GSM SIM card which is constantly using data and the maintenance of the servers. Your' real paying for a service which entitles you to complain should you have issues. You've no right to complain when using a free service. The HKC system will still Alert you to all system events in the event of a power fail unlike the free systems which will only do this when you pay a yearly fee for a GSM unit. You will pay around €60 per year possibly more to use other "FREE" systems when using a GSM unit to be alerted by text and push notification.

I don't agree with the app charge.

Agreed re the app charge but for the GSM SC it's decent value as it covers all the data costs and eliminates the risk of the end user forgetting to top up the credit.

Evolution1

fred funk }{ wrote: »

Agreed re the app charge but for the GSM SC it's decent value as it covers all the data costs and eliminates the risk of the end user forgetting to top up the credit.

Completely agree. Suppose you get what you pay for.

KoolKid

Evolution1 wrote: »

The companies offering free apps and notifications are only going to be free when you connect them to your homes wifi. If your wifi goes down that's your notifications gone.

I think you need to do your research here on a couple of points. All panels can have multiple comms paths back ups. Siemens doesn't even use WiFi. Notifications are not gone once broadband goes down. GSD will notify you in 5 minutes of a network fail, Siemens /Vanderbilt can be set up for notifications within 30 seconds if you want. I believe HKC poll fail is eight hours, is that still the case. Siemens /Vanderbilt and GSD give smash and grab alerts in the event of total system destruction. These alerts come from the servers not the panel so the connection becomes less relevant.

Evolution1 wrote: »

There's nothing stopping any company from adding a charge.

Actually there is. Siemens /Vanderbilt give users direct connection options to the built in web server. That's can't be taken away. HKC for some reason block that feature, I wonder why??

Evolution1 wrote: »

€60 covers the top-up of the HKC GSM SIM card which is constantly using data and the maintenance of the servers.

All system are constantly using data and bandwidth. All companies servers require maintenance.

Evolution1 wrote: »

' The HKC system will still Alert you to all system events in the event of a power fail unlike the free systems which will only do this when you pay a yearly fee for a GSM unit.

Not true either. I get regular notifications of power fails and network fails on both GSD system and Siemens Vanderbilt. There is no requirement to pay a yearly fee to use a GSM unit.

Evolution1 wrote: »

You will pay around €60 per year possibly more to use other "FREE" systems when using a GSM unit to be alerted by text and push notification.

Again not true. You really need to do your research on Sim card charges, services and options.

Evolution1

Oh so GSM units are free to use ?? Really ?

Siemens doesn't require a broadband connection to use the service when not using a GSM ?? Explain please

Yes your notifications are gone if you're relying on your home broadband ONLY for alerts. It will tell you the network has gone down but you'll get no notifications after that. What good is that ?

I have done my research. You're telling people they can have this and that free without telling them it's all useless without a second comms path mainly a GSM unit which requires a yearly fee whether it be a top up or a service. So the system isn't FREE

At the end of the day.
A system only using broadband is useless when power goes. You get your poll fail Alert but no events after that.

If a system is using a GSM unit then it is NOT FREE !

If you recommend that people use multiple comms paths EG a GSM and WIFi/LAN card then the system is NOT free. GSMs don't top themselves up

Evolution1

fred funk }{ wrote: »

How is it a rip off? If I'm reading it correctly, the op chose to include a service agreement for that price. That's very good value. As a supplier of these services myself, €150 for the hkc sim and contract is very good value considering a service call out charge can range from anything from €70 to €180.

Some installers in here offer similar services for far greater cost but will still jump at the chance to get a dig in when HKC are mentioned.

KoolKid

Evolution1 wrote: »

Oh so GSM units are free to use ?? Really ?

Siemens doesn't require a broadband connection to use the service when not using a GSM ?? Explain please

Yes your notifications are gone if you're relying on your home broadband ONLY for alerts. It will tell you the network has gone down but you'll get no notifications after that. What good is that ?

I have done my research. You're telling people they can have this and that free without telling them it's all useless without a second comms path mainly a GSM unit which requires a yearly fee whether it be a top up or a service. So the system isn't FREE

At the end of the day.
A system only using broadband is useless when power goes. You get your poll fail Alert but no events after that.

If a system is using a GSM unit then it is NOT FREE !

If you recommend that people use multiple comms paths EG a GSM and WIFi/LAN card then the system is NOT free. GSMs don't top themselves up

Please quote me correctly if you are going to..
You said a GSM requires annual fees. They do not...
They can be topped up when they run low on credit. As GSM is only a backup this is not going to cost much.
Mine has used less than €10 in the last year, another user here has said the same.
You said Siemens/Vanderbilt rely on WiFi. They don't use WiFi, they do use broadband.
I though you were well up on all these systems. If so you already know there are plenty of other paths Siemens /Vanderbilt can use as well as GSM. Again do some research please.
So on my free systems you could have GSM back up for as little as €10 per annum. You can have land line as another back up for free and there are multiple other options available also as these panels give access to the web server to use as you wish. Not to mention the fast response to poll failure. I noticed you never mentioned that compared to HKCs 8 hours.

Evolution1

KoolKid wrote: »

Please quote me correctly if you are going to..
You said a GSM requires annual fees. They do not...
They can be topped up when they run low on credit. As GSM is only a backup this is not going to cost much.
Mine has used less than €10 in the last year, another user here has said the same.
You said Siemens/Vanderbilt rely on WiFi. They don't use WiFi, they do use broadband.
I though you were well up on all these systems. If so you already know there are plenty of other paths Siemens /Vanderbilt can use as well as GSM. Again do some research please.
So on my free systems you could have GSM back up for as little as €10 per annum. You can have land line as another back up for free and there are multiple other options available also as these panels give access to the web server to use as you wish. Not to mention the fast response to poll failure. I noticed you never mentioned that compared to HKCs 8 hours.

If you've to top up the GSM unit every year then that is a yearly fee.. So it's not free. They have to be topped up at least once a year or they'll be deactivated. ( ones available to end users looking after the systems themselves anyway ).

I never mentioned "Siemens" I mentioned "free systems" .
Wifi as in home broadband. Not too many would pick up LAN as local area network and associate it with broadband.

LAN will also be useless in the event of power loss so your Siemens system will require another paid for path.

Sorry but your landline will be useless if your broadband is gone.. They use the same cable.

I've mentioned that you will get a poll fail on all these systems. Yes correct HKCs basic poll fail is 8 hours . Also this only affects the GSM sc. so if your using wifi this won't matter. Mine is much much lower than 8 hours.

KoolKid

Evolution1 wrote: »

If you've to top up the GSM unit every year then that is a yearly fee.. So it's not free.

And if its only topped up when you need it its not a years fee. I never said GSM was free. I said it does not require a yearly fee.

Evolution1 wrote: »

They have to be topped up at least once a year or they'll be deactivated.

Again false.
I posted a pic previously of my SIM account.I know you seen it so I'm not going looking for it at this hour of the night.

Evolution1 wrote: »

I never mentioned "Siemens" I mentioned "free systems" .
Wifi as in home broadband. Not too many would pick up LAN as local area network and associate it with broadband.

Your statement was still false. If WiFi goes down it does not affect the systems I was referring to.

Evolution1 wrote: »

LAN will also be useless in the event of power loss so your Siemens system will require another paid for path.

Not if the router is backed up & we have already covered other paths which might not require extra subscriptions.
(Lets not get into the silly free/not free debate. We know you will end up at the electric has to be paid for so its not free or something similar)

Evolution1 wrote: »

Sorry but your landline will be useless if your broadband is gone.. They use the same cable.

Landlines use the same cable as broadband?
There are lots of exceptions to this.You really do need to do a lot of research before making such crazy statements.

Evolution1

What do you mean by "We" ? Who do you think you are speaking on behalf of ?

Yes a lot of landline phones use the same cable as broadband. Have you done any research ? It's very rare for a homeowner to have seperate lines.
Examples
Sky Broadband.
Eircom.
UPC.
Vodafone.
WiMAX ( although fed from a dish it's still the same cable ).

Sorry I wasn't aware that you backup all your installations as standard. Which brand of UPS do you prefer ?

KoolKid

Going by the responses and PMs I get here every day and that we are installing GSD and Siemens /Vanderbilt systems most days I'd say I'm speaking for a lot of people.
Also going by the fact that every day I am pricing people for these systems who are telling me their previous installers won't install for them unless they sign up for annual subscriptions.

All the way through this thread you are making false statements and them coming back wilth silly excuses.
Now you want me to justify your mistakes with examples from my own installations???

loublue82

fred funk }{ wrote: »

You're paying 150 per year which includes the sim charges and a service agreement? That sounds like very good value to me.

Hi Fred,

Just to give the overall picture. I paid 700 to have this HKC system installed 18 months ago. When the SIM card was cancelled by the mobile provider after not topping up within their time limit, I called the security company who installed it to come out and put in a new SIM.
They mentioned that they would discuss an alternative, which is the mobile app. Their price was 150 fit plus 150 per year for 2 years (and ongoing after that, I assume). I did not ask for this new system, they convinced my husband that it was a good idea, so I had them call over this morning to revert back to SIM card system.

I did not find the 450+ plan to be value for money, since it was adding very little to the working system that we had.
Cost-wise, the above price would not be worth it for me. The app costs 8 euro from the App store too.

KoolKid

What I am finding from the calls I do is people do not want to pay for apps and do not want to have to pay annual subscriptions to use them..
Whether they want to pay for other backup paths is a seperate argument.
The ones who are paying, generally speaking, appear not to be informed of the alternatives.
Those who are informed actually tell me multiple installers turn down the job because customers won't agree to the paid app options.
Some people have a strange business logic I guess.

hatchman

loublue82 wrote:

I did not find the 450+ plan to be value for money, since it was adding very little to the working system that we had. Cost-wise, the above price would not be worth it for me. The app costs 8 euro from the App store too.

Some irony in this that the alarm installer is the one robbing you :-)

Stoner

I've merged these threads as they belong together,

KoolKid

SPC Connect has shiney new apps now available on Play Store & App Store.
A nice new fresh look.
New SPC Connect portal testing at the moment also.

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.siemens.spcconnect&hl=en
https://itunes.apple.com/ie/app/spc-connect/id948318844?mt=8

dunnerspaul

trying to get the app to alert me of when the system goes into alarm on the spc.
anyone talk me through setting this up as im receiving nothing?

KoolKid

At the moment SPC alerts are via email.
These are configured via your SpcConnect.Com account.
Use a new Gmail account for notifications and set the alert tone to something you will react to.
The Gmail notifications will give you a push notification to the phone.

dunnerspaul

not great just receiving a email for a elert.
is this coming soon or is it down a long road yet?

KoolKid

No definite date I'm afraid. I use the Gmail alert all the time. It's as quick as push notifications.

dunnerspaul

sorry if this is a stupid question.
i have my email set up but my phone checks every 30 minutes for mail on my account.
do i need to set this lower, as i only receive it when it checks my mail account?

KoolKid

You can set it lower or use an email service and app where notifications are pushed to the phone, like Gmail.

KoolKid

Just a quick update to the GSD app & features...

GSD now also offer duel path units with Wifi/Lan for IP & GPRS back up via an international SIM card which will roam on any network.
With their system you could now have triple path comms , Voice, App over IP & App over GPRS in the event of an IP fail.
Cost is €40 per annum . Poll notifications on comms fail can be set at 5,10 or 15 minutes & smash & grab alerts will notify in 1 minute if an alarm event is followed by a total comms fail.

kub

KoolKid wrote: »

Just a quick update to the GSD app & features...

GSD now also offer duel path units with Wifi/Lan for IP & GPRS back up via an international SIM card which will roam on any network.
With their system you could now have triple path comms , Voice, App over IP & App over GPRS in the event of an IP fail.
Cost is ?40 per annum . Poll notifications on comms fail can be set at 5,10 or 15 minutes & smash & grab alerts will notify in 1 minute if an alarm event is followed by a total comms fail.

On the HKC v's Siemens thread?

KoolKid

kub wrote: »

On the HKC v's Siemens thread?

Just following orders.

KoolKid wrote: »

PS as there are many panels now offering free apps & remote access over IP could we include all or have a few separate threads?

Stoner wrote: »

Include all I'd say

kub

KoolKid wrote: »

Just following orders.

Ah fair enough, i just saw the thread title, your last post and wondered what was GSD doing in here.

gogreen81

Hi , not sure if this is the right thread . Am looking for some advice for my hkc panel . Looking for instructions to change my wifi id and password . Getting a new broadband so would need to enter the new details to the hkc panel
Am hoping it's simple enough

altor

gogreen81 wrote: »

Hi , not sure if this is the right thread . Am looking for some advice for my hkc panel . Looking for instructions to change my wifi id and password . Getting a new broadband so would need to enter the new details to the hkc panel
Am hoping it's simple enough

Other than changing the name and password of old router to that of the new one you would need engineer access to do this.

sphinx501

KoolKid wrote: »

You can set it lower or use an email service and app where notifications are pushed to the phone, like Gmail.

I noticed the SPC Connect app was updated 2 days ago (on iOS anyways, Play Store not showing any recent update), the release notes state support for Push Notifications. Has anyone who has an SPC tested push notifications yet?

- Push Notification support - get notifications for alarms, arming, etc.
- New Icon & Splash screen

https://itunes.apple.com/ie/app/spc-connect/id948318844?mt=8
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.siemens.spcconnect&hl=en

KoolKid

Yes. Push notifications are now available on SPC Connect for IOS.
Now you can have double notifications via push notifications and email.
You also have double options for connecting to the panel via the app or any web browser.
Android to follow.

yannakis

Can someone explain the polling delay being mentioned for HKC?

Is that only for alerts in regards to power failures? In case there is a GSM module, would the actual events (triggered by the sensors) be sent in realtime?