Aer Lingus Fleet/Routes Discussion

Aer Lingus about to put pen to paper on an order for 4 A321LR's

kevinandrew

Deleted User wrote: »

Aer Lingus about to put pen to paper on an order for 4 A321LR's

I would have expected a few more than that, perhaps 4 firm and 4 options?

We know there's 4 757s to replace but none for expansion?

midfield dynamo

roundymac wrote: »

Martinair were subbed in to cover the JFK flights. My wife is still spitting teeth over it, worst airline she says she was ever on.I won't argue with her,,, I never win.:p

I flew to JFK a few days later and the other plane involved (Caoimhe) was starting back in service that day. Didn't help that I was a nervous flyer back then. When I realised I was getting on one of the planes involved in this, the nervousness went off the scale!

Tenger

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Aer Lingus about to put pen to paper on an order for 4 A321LR's

Nice nugget. As above, surprised its not more, assume its IAG converting existing A320neo order into firm allocation for EI.
About bloody time is all I can see. Its pretty much a petfect fit for the EI fleet/network.

sandbelter

kevinandrew wrote: »

Deleted User wrote: »

Aer Lingus about to put pen to paper on an order for 4 A321LR's

I would have expected a few more than that, perhaps 4 firm and 4 options?

We know there's 4 757s to replace but none for expansion?

Let wait and see, a A321LR would presumably be for in house flying which would be the only one to appear on IAG's balance sheet.

There are various other options that may still play out. They may still keep the ASL contract and extend it in which case ASL would order A321LR's off its own balance sheet (again assuming it was financially feasible), then there's leasing options.

Zonda999

Theres also no hurry in getting rid of the 757's, three of the four 757's are only 18 years old so presumably have plenty life left in them. I've no doubt the North American carriers have much older birds regularly doing Transatlantic runs.

EI also have be conservative about their expansion. For example Norweigan have recently ordered 30 A321LR's presumably for Transatlantic services and the A321LR's transatlantic capabilities aren't as great as the 757-200W if i'm not mistaken, meaning there still aren't a whole load of European options for transatlantic operations. EI won't have it all their own way in this market I suspect

Stovepipe

IF we are getting new A321s, it's because the existing ones are falling to bits and are sucking up maintenance like there's no tomorrow.

Noxegon

Zonda999 wrote: »

and the A321LR's transatlantic capabilities aren't as great as the 757-200W if i'm not mistaken

I did some research on that. The A321LR has slightly longer range than the 757-200.

Van.Bosch

These aren't available until 2019 unless I'm mistaken? Surprised to see an order for 4 from both EI and IAG point of view, thought it would have been rolled into a 100+ wider A320/A321/A321LR at IAG level for all op co's.

Locker10a

Stovepipe wrote: »

IF we are getting new A321s, it's because the existing ones are falling to bits and are sucking up maintenance like there's no tomorrow.

I'm sorry to hear this about my old favourites!! But I think this order is specifically to replace the 757s for transatlantic !
I also hope a refreshment of the short haul fleet is on the cards too, some of the EI-Cxx fleet are getting on now will become costly I imagine in the next 5 years

billy few mates

Noxegon wrote: »

I did some research on that. The A321LR has slightly longer range than the 757-200.

Any links to this research? How do they compare head to head..?

billie1b

billy few mates wrote: »

Any links to this research? How do they compare head to head..?

He/She is correct, the 757-200 v A321LR is 3850nm v 4000nm but the 757-200W v A321LR is 4050 v 4000, so it depends on what model 757 they are comparing to.

billy few mates

billie1b wrote: »

He/She is correct, the 757-200 v A321LR is 3850nm v 4000nm but the 757-200W v A321LR is 4050 v 4000, so it depends on what model 757 they are comparing to.

Thanks, looking for a link with a bit more info if you have one, with more details for comparison, payloads, fuel burn etc to see how they compare head to head..?

I presume the 757-200W you're referring to is a -200 'winglets'...?

billie1b

billy few mates wrote: »

Thanks, looking for a link with a bit more info if you have one, with more details for comparison, payloads, fuel burn etc to see how they compare head to head..?

I presume the 757-200W you're referring to is a -200 'winglets'...?

Yeah sorry, its a 752WL I believe

duskyjoe

Stovepipe wrote: »

IF we are getting new A321s, it's because the existing ones are falling to bits and are sucking up maintenance like there's no tomorrow.

Not a very professional thing to say from someone close to these ships. EIN keep their aircraft like their rivals in blue in top shape irrespective of age.

billy few mates

billie1b wrote: »

He/She is correct, the 757-200 v A321LR is 3850nm v 4000nm but the 757-200W v A321LR is 4050 v 4000, so it depends on what model 757 they are comparing to.

billy few mates wrote: »

Thanks, looking for a link with a bit more info if you have one, with more details for comparison, payloads, fuel burn etc to see how they compare head to head..?

I presume the 757-200W you're referring to is a -200 'winglets'...?

billie1b wrote: »

Yeah sorry, its a 752WL I believe

Not dismissing your figures but just wondering where youre getting them as they just don't seem right. Your figure of a 200nm range improvement for a 752WL seems a little short of figure of almost 5% performance improvement I always thought it was?
200nm seems a little low, that's little more than an additional thirty minutes of flight...

Here's what Boeing says about winglets...
http://www.boeing.com/commercial/aeromagazine/articles/qtr_03_09/article_03_1.html

Does anyone have a link to an article that compares the performance both A/C head to head.

Mebuntu

I also hope a refreshment of the short haul fleet is on the cards too, some of the EI-Cxx fleet are getting on now will become costly I imagine in the next 5 years

Interesting that you should say that. The EI-Dxx 320's seem to be the ones causing the most problems at the moment as you can see from the list below of recent cases where the return flights had to be cancelled due to the a/c going tech.

May 2016

05 DVE ORK
06 DEP ORK
10 DEC LGW
12 EZW GVA
13 CVA MAD
21 DEH LHR

June 2016

06 DER LHR
12 FNJ LHR
25 DEK HAM
26 DVJ NOC
30 DVL LPA

July 2016 (up to 23rd)

02* DVG LIN
19 CPG LPA (A321)
22 DVK DUS
22 DEJ FRA

*This incident affected two sets of passengers because the aircraft that subsequently operated the rescue mission was taken off an LHR-DUB return flight which was cancelled.

Source: http://www.thelingussource.com/

john boye

Mebuntu wrote: »

Interesting that you should say that. The EI-Dxx 320's seem to be the ones causing the most problems at the moment as you can see from the list below of recent cases where the return flights had to be cancelled due to the a/c going tech.

May 2016

05 DVE ORK
06 DEP ORK
10 DEC LGW
12 EZW GVA
13 CVA MAD
21 DEH LHR

June 2016

06 DER LHR
12 FNJ LHR
25 DEK HAM
26 DVJ NOC
30 DVL LPA

July 2016 (up to 23rd)

02* DVG LIN
19 CPG LPA (A321)
22 DVK DUS
22 DEJ FRA

*This incident affected two sets of passengers because the aircraft that subsequently operated the rescue mission was taken off an LHR-DUB return flight which was cancelled.

Source: http://www.thelingussource.com/

Surely the Dxx series are bound to have more incidents given that there are an awful lot more of them. There are only 6 Cxx in the fleet

Bussywussy

yea and some cancelled are weather related cancellations like the one in FRA

Locker10a

Mebuntu wrote: »

I also hope a refreshment of the short haul fleet is on the cards too, some of the EI-Cxx fleet are getting on now will become costly I imagine in the next 5 years

Interesting that you should say that. The EI-Dxx 320's seem to be the ones causing the most problems at the moment as you can see from the list below of recent cases where the return flights had to be cancelled due to the a/c going tech.

May 2016

05 DVE ORK
06 DEP ORK
10 DEC LGW
12 EZW GVA
13 CVA MAD
21 DEH LHR

June 2016

06 DER LHR
12 FNJ LHR
25 DEK HAM
26 DVJ NOC
30 DVL LPA

July 2016 (up to 23rd)

02* DVG LIN
19 CPG LPA (A321)
22 DVK DUS
22 DEJ FRA

*This incident affected two sets of passengers because the aircraft that subsequently operated the rescue mission was taken off an LHR-DUB return flight which was cancelled.

Source: http://www.thelingussource.com/

Regardless of operational efficiency it's no secret that when planes hit the 15-20 year mark they cost much more in maintenance and engineering

Jamie2k9

22 DEJ FRA

That was weather and a curfew, FRA cleared to taxi before deciding sorry we are closing for the night....

As for LPA A321, chances are a tiny delay and crew out of hours.

Tenger

I appreciate the research by mebuntu but I would have issues with the details published on the website. Some very odd interpretation of data there.
As for that list of "tech incidents" well as notrd above, one was definitely weather related.Nothing actually to do with the age of lack thereof the airframe.

Locker10a

EI494 operated this morning by Titan, are EI short an aircraft? tech ?
I don't recall a pre planned sub in for the summer as other years but i may have missed it ?

Mebuntu

Thanks for the follow-ups on FRA and LPA.

That was weather and a curfew, FRA cleared to taxi before deciding sorry we are closing for the night....

For the record are you saying that the info on the website is incorrect in that there was no technical issue minor or otherwise?

As for LPA A321, chances are a tiny delay and crew out of hours

"chances are" or fact? Would sound foolish to send a crew out with only a tiny delay margin?

I would have issues with the details published on the website. Some very odd interpretation of data there.

What do you find odd about the other 13 cases? All of them are cited there as tech issues.

There are similar interesting "source" websites for other airlines and it would be a shame if the info they are providing is inaccurate.

Locker10a

None of the "Airline" source websites are official !! They are run by amatures!!!! So I wouldn't take them as gospel! While I'm sure most* contributors are conscientious and provide sound information, it's not always guaranteed!!

Jamie2k9

Mebuntu wrote: »

Thanks for the follow-ups on FRA and LPA.

For the record are you saying that the info on the website is incorrect in that there was no technical issue minor or otherwise?

"chances are" or fact? Would sound foolish to send a crew out with only a tiny delay margin?

What do you find odd about the other 13 cases? All of them are cited there as tech issues.

There are similar interesting "source" websites for other airlines and it would be a shame if the info they are providing is inaccurate.

As Locker10A said the Lingus Source clearly states it's an unofficial, independent and impartial and most of the updates are unlikely coming from somebody within EI ops.

Over 7,000 passengers slept in the terminals in FRA on Friday night, now the airport are calling for the ban to be relaxed in times of disruption (not the 1 hour allowed). All EI pax were taken to hotels.

As for LPA, past experience of ops to the Canaries a delay of more than an hour and the probability of aircraft been grounded overnight are almost certain. It's the nature of the business, more cost effective than employing for example another 20 crew members for 6 months. Unlike some other carriers, EI don't have a magic crew tap to use when they are needed.

As for the other issues, yes I am sure there were some tech issues and it's nothing unusual, most of the time they are simple little things and by the time handlers in x airports get around crewing would be the main issue.

TheFitz13

I was on a flight from TFS about two weeks ago and I was delayed by an hour and a half, not gonna lie I was dreading coming home so I was hoping they were going to turn around and tell us the flight was cancelled

Jamie2k9

TheFitz13 wrote: »

I was on a flight from TFS about two weeks ago and I was delayed by an hour and a half, not gonna lie I was dreading coming home so I was hoping they were going to turn around and tell us the flight was cancelled

Chances are if the outbound was delayed they would of made sure crew had sufficient time.

L1011

The relatively accurate A330 spreadsheet has the two new orders as MSN1791 and 1831 - that's a good 6-7 months between them and would suggest maybe early summer '17 and winter '17 deliveries.

joeysoap

I've been on those 319's to faro ex Belfast . Make you think twice about booking again. EJ have them as well but the legroom 'seems' better.

Not Ei related: was recently on one of those new Ry 737's. Night flight. Staff were new to the aircraft. Spent lots of time 'playing' with the lighting system. On, dip, 'mood' lighting along the side of the aircraft(blue and pink). Overhead bins were excellent , sort of came down to put bags in and when closed up curved to the ceiling, under seat space was big, aisle was definitely wider, seats were wafer thin but not uncomfortable.