Tánaiste Moany Burton: IW protesters 'seem to have extremely expensive phones'

joe swanson

ennis81 wrote: »

I will be attending the protest on Saturday
I lost my job in January 2013 got a p/t job in dublin 4 straight away (I am a northsider) I have since applied for an average of 10 jobs per week, I have had 2 interviews from all those applications and didn't get the positions, I am a fully qualified book keeper and part qualified accountant, I decided to borrow to go back to college, I can't even get a crappy tax credit for my college fees as they have increased the amount that is disregarded for part time college fees. So all of you full time workers who think we are all spongers are wrong, I am really upset after reading some of the comments here from people, people like me really want a job but there so many applications for each job it seems hopeless.
Aside from the fact my water supply is so bad it is undrinkable, (I have contacted Irish water and the local council about what they propose to do about our filthy water, they both said someone would call me back... Still waiting on those calls) I spend an average of €10 on bottled water every week that is €520 per year (including vat) so am I not already paying for water??? Or should I take my chances and drink my filthy tap water and hand over my money to Irish water instead? I will march on Saturday because I'm so sick of paying for mistakes I didn't make, shame on everybody who has labelled every protester a lazy sponger, by the way my friend gave me her old Samsung phone, I certainly can't afford a fancy phone myself

Well, if your water is undrinkable you don't have to pay for it. Maybe you need to look into this a bit more instead of hopping on the uninformed bandwagon

crusher000

ennis81 wrote: »

I will be attending the protest on Saturday
I lost my job in January 2013 got a p/t job in dublin 4 straight away (I am a northsider) I have since applied for an average of 10 jobs per week, I have had 2 interviews from all those applications and didn't get the positions, I am a fully qualified book keeper and part qualified accountant, I decided to borrow to go back to college, I can't even get a crappy tax credit for my college fees as they have increased the amount that is disregarded for part time college fees. So all of you full time workers who think we are all spongers are wrong, I am really upset after reading some of the comments here from people, people like me really want a job but there so many applications for each job it seems hopeless.
Aside from the fact my water supply is so bad it is undrinkable, (I have contacted Irish water and the local council about what they propose to do about our filthy water, they both said someone would call me back... Still waiting on those calls) I spend an average of €10 on bottled water every week that is €520 per year (including vat) so am I not already paying for water??? Or should I take my chances and drink my filthy tap water and hand over my money to Irish water instead? I will march on Saturday because I'm so sick of paying for mistakes I didn't make, shame on everybody who has labelled every protester a lazy sponger, by the way my friend gave me her old Samsung phone, I certainly can't afford a fancy phone myself

Be careful some posters on here won't like reality pointed out to them. Far more happier with their blurred versions of protestors as crusties or track suit wearring scumbags. Assertions on here are.

1. Protestors are jobless scroungers
2. lefties
3. Sinn Fein organise all protests in Ireland and use IRA members to recruit protestors.
4. Crusties
5. Dutch gold drinkers,tracksuit wearing scumbags.

joe swanson

crusher000 wrote: »

Be careful some posters on here won't like reality pointed out to them. Far more happier with their blurred versions of protestors as crusties or track suit wearring scumbags. Assertions on here are.

1. Protestors are jobless scroungers
2. lefties
3. Sinn Fein organise all protests in Ireland and use IRA members to recruit protestors.
4. Crusties
5. Dutch gold drinkers,tracksuit wearing scumbags.

Pretty accurate description. Well done.

Albertofrog

joe swanson wrote: »

Yeah and who pays the protesters dole that their happy to take?

I'd wager that none of the protesters are getting as much as the most lowly TD, never mind the Taniste.

Remind me again - why can a TD not pay for their own iPads/iPhones/tablets?

Honestly, do TDs not engage their brain before speaking?

joe swanson

Albertofrog wrote: »

I'd wager that none of the protesters are getting as much as the most lowly TD, never mind the Taniste.

Remind me again - why can a TD not pay for their own iPads/iPhones/tablets?

Honestly, do TDs not engage their brain before speaking?

God love them. Is their dole not enough?

ennis81

joe swanson wrote: »

Well, if your water is undrinkable you don't have to pay for it. Maybe you need to look into this a bit more instead of hopping on the uninformed bandwagon

Yes I am indeed uninformed joe, I have received no water pack, they have not attempted to install water meters yet, I have contacted both Irish water and the council and they have fobbed me off with "possible reduced rates" not that I won't have pay at all so I'm not sure where you heard that. They certainly won't be attempting to fix our water supply or water pressure. So I will still have to pay for bottled water and reduced rates for waste water? Right I've just finished applying for a few jobs is it okay if I put on me tracksuit, grab a can of Dutch gold and head off to harass the old bill now please?

Albertofrog

joe swanson wrote: »

God love them. Is their dole not enough?

So why can't a TD pay for their own iPad/iPhone/tablet?

joe swanson

ennis81 wrote: »

Yes I am indeed uninformed joe, I have received no water pack, they have not attempted to install water meters yet, I have contacted both Irish water and the council and they have fobbed me off with "possible reduced rates" not that I won't have pay at all so I'm not sure where you heard that. They certainly won't be attempting to fix our water supply or water pressure. So I will still have to pay for bottled water and reduced rates for waste water? Right I've just finished applying for a few jobs is it okay if I put on me tracksuit, grab a can of Dutch gold and head off to harass the old bill now please?

Why should you get reduced rates for waste water? I presume your not going to try and drink that?

KomradeBishop

Barely There wrote: »

There is a huge majority of Irish people who recognise that extra taxes and charges are an inevitable consequence of cleaning up the mess the country was left in.
These people have their heads down, work hard, pay their taxes and hope for a better future.

The water-meter protestors are a tiny minority of society that represent nothing more than they whinging, whining, Celtic-Cub moaners, seasoned with a some professional protestors who've never made a positive contribution to society in their lives but have a sense of entitlement that their every want should be provided to them and paid for by others.
They have no popular mandate for their actions, which ultimately only further damages the economy and places a heavier burden on the majority who pay their taxes and charges.

The view of these whiners, that they represent some kind of popular uprising of the people is deluded and laughable - they don't and they never will.

The rest of us will simply get on with things, as we always have. The Guards will ensure that law and order prevails, the meters will be installed, the debtors will be pursued for their unpaid charges.
The country slowly but surely will drag itself back on its feet.

The protestors will find some other cause-du-jour to give try to give their pathetic lives some semblance of meaning

It was ever thus.

Saying the protestors have no 'popular mandate', while claiming to speak for the majority yourself...you speak for nobody but yourself.

Your rantings here come off as those of a bitter authoritarian, who despises any challenge to current policies, and who snobbishly looks down on anyone who might be disadvantaged enough to become unemployed - even moreso if they become 'uppity' and decide to protest current policies.

What is pathetic is your desire to look down on people, who actually make the effort to express their political grievances in a way that is effective at generating public attention - you'd rather they do nothing, be quiet, and shut up, rather than present an actual challenge.

I might not agree with all the arguments against the water charges (though I definitely agree it's being handled badly - which alone is worth protesting about), but fair play to anyone who will actually make the effort to go out there and protest - they make a bigger contribution to having a politically active society, than the politically-apathetic (or rather, more politically-subservient) garbage you come out with here.

AudreyHepburn

Albertofrog wrote: »

So why can't a TD pay for their own iPad/iPhone/tablet?

Who said they can't?

I was under the impression that most, if not all of them, do so.

KomradeBishop

Barely There wrote: »

No, I don't and am grateful for it.

From what I can see the kind of 'communities' that the protests are taking place in correspond pretty well with the areas where long-term unemployment and social welfare lifestyle are deeply engrained.

Name those communities. This is one I know you're going to try and dodge, as if you try naming them, it will expose your massive ignorance here.

Sunnyisland

KomradeBishop wrote: »

Saying the protestors have no 'popular mandate', while claiming to speak for the majority yourself...you speak for nobody but yourself.

Your rantings here come off as those of a bitter authoritarian, who despises any challenge to current policies, and who snobbishly looks down on anyone who might be disadvantaged enough to become unemployed - even moreso if they become 'uppity' and decide to protest current policies.

What is pathetic is your desire to look down on people, who actually make the effort to express their political grievances in a way that is effective at generating public attention - you'd rather they do nothing, be quiet, and shut up, rather than present an actual challenge.

I might not agree with all the arguments against the water charges (though I definitely agree it's being handled badly - which alone is worth protesting about), but fair play to anyone who will actually make the effort to go out there and protest - they make a bigger contribution to having a politically active society, than the politically-apathetic (or rather, more politically-subservient) garbage you come out with here.

Well said sir.

Un Croissant

Albertofrog wrote: »

I'd wager that none of the protesters are getting as much as the most lowly TD, never mind the Taniste.

Remind me again - why can a TD not pay for their own iPads/iPhones/tablets?

Honestly, do TDs not engage their brain before speaking?

So protesters, who in this example are on the dole, should get paid the same as members of parliament?

ennis81

ennis81 wrote: »

I will be attending the protest on Saturday
/QUOTE]

This protest? https://www.facebook.com/DublinSaysNo.DSN/photos/a.850657604960748.1073741827.850647988295043/978160988877075/?type=1&theater

The one against Cronyism, Stealth Taxes, Protection for Bailed Out Bank Evictions, Forced Emigration and Suicide? No mention of water charges!

ennis81

joe swanson wrote: »

Why should you get reduced rates for waste water? I presume your not going to try and drink that?

??? Waste water according to Irish water means " water for shower, toilet, washing machine, doing dishes etc" not water fit for consumption, so I would have reduced rates for having water I can't actually drink, I would still have my weekly water bill for water to drink and water bill from Irish water for waste water, please tell me where we apply to get free water as you said in your previous post?

KomradeBishop

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

As usual people are jumping to conclusions about Joan Bs thinking and meaning instead of actually read and thinking logically about what she is saying.

Personally I can see her point. It is a bit rich to be out protesting against the water charge and whining about the fact that you are struggling with the bills when you can clearly afford a nice phone or and ipad.

Surely the money you spent and are spending on these items would be better put to use on those bills? And perhaps if you spent less time protesting and more time job hunting you might not be in such apparent dire straights.

Just because there might not be work in your sector, does not mean there is no work at all.

A decent smartphone (new) will cost you around ~€100, and a decent second-hand one about half that, and will last you years - this talking point is nonsense, you'd need to be practically homeless to be unable to afford a smartphone.

Same with the out-of-date 'LCD TV' talking point - who the fúck can't afford one of those now that they're so cheap?

These talking points also display the same ignorance that has been displayed throughout the thread, of assuming the protestors are unemployed (and you talk of jumping to conclusions...) - and then moralizing/judging unemployed people as a whole.

There also is not enough work, because there are 24 unemployed people per job vacancy:
http://www.nerinstitute.net/imglibrary/2014/09/201409021647131.jpg
http://www.nerinstitute.net/blog/2014/09/02/latest-data-on-the-vacancy-rate/

So that's more ignorance once again, of basing your judgment of the unemployed, on there being enough jobs available for them all, when there are not.

Tigger

Un Croissant wrote: »

So protesters, who in this example are on the dole, should get paid the same as members of parliament?

Makes sense

I think that if the protestors acually protested instead on interfering with the poor fellas trying to install the meters public support would be far higher

flutered

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

Who said they can't?

I was under the impression that most, if not all of them, do so.

sorry to dissapoint you, ipads were given out as freebies a while back, the are allower two fones in an eighteen month period, they have a massive unvouched expense account which would take care of the rest.

ennis81

Deleted User wrote: »

ennis81 wrote: »

I will be attending the protest on Saturday
/QUOTE]

This protest? https://www.facebook.com/DublinSaysNo.DSN/photos/a.850657604960748.1073741827.850647988295043/978160988877075/?type=1&theater

The one against Cronyism, Stealth Taxes, Protection for Bailed Out Bank Evictions, Forced Emigration and Suicide? No mention of water charges!

This Maryanne84
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Protest-against-water-charges-in-the-republic-of-Ireland/213410058694008

joe swanson

flutered wrote: »

sorry to dissapoint you, ipads were given out as freebies a while back, the are allower two fones in an eighteen month period, they have a massive unvouched expense account which would take care of the rest.

The protesters also have an unvouched expense account. It's called the dole.

ennis81

joe swanson wrote: »

The protesters also have an unvouched expense account. It's called the dole.

Jesus Joe do you not understand there are genuinely alot of people on the dole who don't want to be, like myself??? Do you have any idea what it is like to scratch and save and be worried EVERY WEEK?? Obviously you don't, I literally can't not afford to be squeezed any tighter, I can not afford another bill
If I live to be an auld woman and I doubt it at this rate, I will never EVER forget how I have been treated not only by the system (the social welfare) but by my fellow Irish Citizens who are lucky enough that they have enough, and are fully financially able to pay all these taxes.

KomradeBishop

ennis81 wrote: »

Jesus Joe do you not understand there are genuinely alot of people on the dole who don't want to be, like myself??? Do you have any idea what it is like to scratch and save and be worried EVERY WEEK?? Obviously you don't, I literally can't not afford to be squeezed any tighter, I can not afford another bill
If I live to be an auld woman and I doubt it at this rate, I will never EVER forget how I have been treated not only by the system (the social welfare) but by my fellow Irish Citizens who are lucky enough that they have enough, and are fully financially able to pay all these taxes.

Ya that kind of dole-bashing is just ignorance bordering on outright bigotry.

In Lonesome Dove

ennis81 wrote: »

I will be attending the protest on Saturday
I lost my job in January 2013 got a p/t job in dublin 4 straight away (I am a northsider) I have since applied for an average of 10 jobs per week, I have had 2 interviews from all those applications and didn't get the positions, I am a fully qualified book keeper and part qualified accountant, I decided to borrow to go back to college, I can't even get a crappy tax credit for my college fees as they have increased the amount that is disregarded for part time college fees. So all of you full time workers who think we are all spongers are wrong, I am really upset after reading some of the comments here from people, people like me really want a job but there so many applications for each job it seems hopeless.
Aside from the fact my water supply is so bad it is undrinkable, (I have contacted Irish water and the local council about what they propose to do about our filthy water, they both said someone would call me back... Still waiting on those calls) I spend an average of €10 on bottled water every week that is €520 per year (including vat) so am I not already paying for water??? Or should I take my chances and drink my filthy tap water and hand over my money to Irish water instead? I will march on Saturday because I'm so sick of paying for mistakes I didn't make, shame on everybody who has labelled every protester a lazy sponger, by the way my friend gave me her old Samsung phone, I certainly can't afford a fancy phone myself

This is such a brilliant reply. Thank you.

There is a lot of ignorant assumptions online that unemployed people are the source of the country's woes. That they are all lazy scum who never worked a day in their life's and never intend to. The people with these assumptions are misdirecting their anger at the wrong people. Anger brought about due to work like working more for less and financial stress perhaps.

I remember a piece some months back about the long term unemployed as in unemployed since the boom and it's coming into the 40,000's. But even at that, that's just a figure. How much of those were unemployed for a brief period to be replaced other people briefly unemployed. Perhaps college students coming out fron college and unable to get work straight away.

Back on topic, There's about 450,000 people unemployed. A jump of around 410,000. These 400,000 would have lost work through the crash. The credit in the banks dried up which would have had an impact on the construction sector. Lending from the banks were less which would have had an impact on say for example some small businesses relying on bank credit from time to time. Unable to get credit they would have closed doors. We were a country who became too expensive and a lot of manufacturing companies closed to move to cheaper countries letting go of their workforce. These would have had an impact on the services and hospitality sector. With many countries outside of Ireland also in a downturn, that would have had an impact on the tourism sector. Along with these people losing jobs, we having youngsters coming out from college and courses unable to get work.

Albertofrog

Un Croissant wrote: »

So protesters, who in this example are on the dole, should get paid the same as members of parliament?

Did I say that?
Are all the protesters on the dole?
Or is that an assumption on your behalf?

Banjo String

Barely There wrote: »

From what I can see the kind of 'communities' that the protests are taking place in correspond pretty well with the areas where long-term unemployment and social welfare lifestyle are deeply engrained.

You're talking through your hoop here tbh.

Or is their other estates we've had a media blackout from?

Un Croissant

Albertofrog wrote: »

Did I say that?
Are all the protesters on the dole?
Or is that an assumption on your behalf?

Note I said in this example as you seemed to be running with that idea when answering Joe Swanson about 'is there dole not enough'

GarIT

While she wasn't correct to assume all protesters are unemployed I agree with her sentiment. It is sickening hearing about a group of 5 people I know on the dole going up to Belfast to buy the new iPhone on launch day, when an iPhone is something I don't think I'll ever be able to afford.

On the dole you should get food, shelter, light, heat and clothing, everything else is a luxury that only employed people should be able to buy.

Banjo String

GarIT wrote: »

While she wasn't correct to assume all protesters are unemployed I agree with her sentiment. It is sickening hearing about a group of 5 people I know on the dole going up to Belfast to buy the new iPhone on launch day, when an iPhone is something I don't think I'll ever be able to afford.

I wonder which one of the 3 family cars they travelled up in, and if it was before or after their twice annual holiday to Lanzarote?

GarIT

Banjo String wrote: »

I wonder which one of the 3 family cars they travelled up in, and if it was before or after their twice annual holiday to Lanzarote?

I don't get your point?

ennis81

ennis81 wrote: »

Deleted User wrote: »

This Maryanne84
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Protest-against-water-charges-in-the-republic-of-Ireland/213410058694008

Isn't it a bit silly having them both on the same day?