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Better Call Saul ***Spoilers***

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,741 ✭✭✭Mousewar


    Loving the show but eternally confused by Mike's granddaughter. Don't like nitpicking but she actually seems older in Better in Saul than she was in Breaking Bad.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,383 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    Mousewar wrote: »
    Loving the show but eternally confused by Mike's granddaughter. Don't like nitpicking but she actually seems older in Better in Saul than she was in Breaking Bad.
    Seems 2 actresses have played her in BCS so far, she did look older swimming than the girl playing with the pig, maybe that was the same actress though.

    http://breakingbad.wikia.com/wiki/Kaylee_Ehrmantraut


    https://www.reddit.com/r/betterCallSaul/comments/30y0fl/how_much_time_passes_between_the_first_episode_of/

    -Mike's granddaughter looks the exact same age in BCS as she does in BB. If it were three or four years later, the little girl should be like almost 10

    -Well BCS is set in the year 2001, and BB well I think it starts in 2008

    -I don't know the exact age of Faith Healey but Kaija Roze Bales who played Kaylee in BrBA at this time is apparently 15 years old, which means in Breaking Bad she could've been from 10 to 13 maybe even 14. I think the actor definitely looks young enough to be 3 years old.


    I posted this a while back
    rubadub wrote: »
    Many were wondering if Jesse would appear, I was thinking he would be too young for Aaron Paul to play.

    Wikipedia says BCS is set in 2002. This BB site says Jesse was born in 1989, so he would only be about 13.

    http://breakingbad.wikia.com/wiki/Jesse_Pinkman

    however that same page says jesse was 27 in the final series.

    The same site has a timeline page. Which says it ended in 2011, which would mean jesse was 22. So I guess the birthday quoted is wrong.

    http://breakingbad.wikia.com/wiki/Timeline

    He could come into later episodes, but would obviously would be an older actor by then too. Or he could come into the current "cinabon time"

    Wiki has a different birthday. "Jesse was born on September 14, 1984", so Jesse should be around 18 in BCS.

    They could possibly do a beverly hills 90210 with him!
    Andrea Zuckerman on Beverly Hills, 90210. At age 29, she was the oldest cast member to portray a 16-year-old.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,739 ✭✭✭scamalert


    Mousewar wrote: »
    Loving the show but eternally confused by Mike's granddaughter. Don't like nitpicking but she actually seems older in Better in Saul than she was in Breaking Bad.
    if you didnt notice Mike is way worse his age is really showing,after Tuco beat the crap of him- at the end seemed Mike is way out of his shape -given this is pre BB period,while they managed to pull many characters but its most likely their age being young and a bit of haircut,with mike they seem to leave him as he is,which doesnt really go with tough character in BB series he was.

    That said this episode was different intro scene i guess where slippin Jimmy was determined,thus part of his father and his story,also it was confusing him looking at those floating balloons ? until he pulled out his style in suits so this seems to go well how his dress code went.

    Still no sign of Guss and Mike seemed to smth up - need for cash drive thus guess someone will have to pull him out and Guss seems like perfect character to do that,but imagining one thing i guess it will be twisted other way around,since predicting this show is guessing game :o


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,383 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    scamalert wrote: »
    if you didnt notice Mike is way worse his age is really showing,
    Jonathan Banks (Mike) is 69 now in real life. This BB site says Mike is early 60s when BB finished.

    http://breakingbad.wikia.com/wiki/Mike_Ehrmantraut

    So the character should be about 55 in BCS.

    Here is Banks around that age in the epic classic "Crocodile Dundee 3, in Los Angeles", in the brown leather jacket.



    -and yes, I am a little obsessed with ages and years, I really wish they would show the year in these programs, or have official sites you could check if you wished.

    2001 in Dundee below
    500px-Dundeeinloseangeles32.jpg

    BCS season 1 below
    Jonathan-Banks-in-Better-Call-Saul-Season-1-Episode-6.jpg


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,807 ✭✭✭Custardpi


    Not to be morbid or anything as I wish (as I'm sure we all do) Mr Banks a long & healthy life but I wonder has Vince Gilligan considered the possibility that there might come a time when "Mike" is not available for his rôle? Has the necessary flexibility been built into the writing or planned writing for future BCS series?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,994 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    Custardpi wrote: »
    Not to be morbid or anything as I wish (as I'm sure we all do) Mr Banks a long & healthy life but I wonder has Vince Gilligan considered the possibility that there might come a time when "Mike" is not available for his rôle? Has the necessary flexibility been built into the writing or planned writing for future BCS series?

    I assume he will do what John Sullivan did when the actor who played "Grand-dad" (Lennard Pearce) died in 'Only Fools and Horses', and find a long lost brother of the character. Problem solved!
    I figure it would only take the rewriting of an episode or two!?:D
    And a bigger beard....

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,807 ✭✭✭Custardpi


    Possibly but in OFAH it was acknowledged that Grandad had died & they didn't have the burden of having to line up with a pre-existing sequel several years into the future. If BCS goes right up to the time that Walter White enters the picture then Mike will be a central character in the criminal underworld inhabited by both Gus Freng & by that stage Jimmy/Saul, making his absence (again, touch wood) difficult to explain away.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,383 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    I think they would just get another actor in to play the part. It would be very hard to write him out, not even like they could say "oh he's on holidays".

    The actress who was the voice of Howards mother in the big bang theory died and they wrote her out, there was talk of one of the current actresses taking over as she was never actually seen onscreen, she just roared at him from other rooms, and the other actress was very close sounding. But they decided against it. But not like it was a prequel.

    I remember Becky in Roseanne changed actress and there was voice over at the start saying "the actress playing Becky has changed in this episode". However when an actor dies it is a bit different.

    There is a massive list on wiki of characters who changed actor, they often change after the pilot but many were during it.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_television_programs_in_which_one_character_was_played_by_multiple_actors


  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 35,576 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    What was the pilot of being human like?

    Well, we like the story but every once of the actors has to go.

    I loved Jimmy's commitment to getting fired. Those suits were fantastic!


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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    More BB-world stuff in this episode; The realtor who showed Mike and Stacey around the new house in the latest episode of BCS was the same one from the open house where Marie stole an item in BB episode 5.3.

    I liked this episode, and it featured my favourite opening scene of the season, maybe series, with the flashback to Jimmy's childhood experience with his father. By the look of things, Mr. McGill Senior was quite the pushover and having witnessed this first hand, Slippin' Jimmy was born. I was disappointed though to see Jimmy actually take money out of the till and pocket it himself. I thought it was initially going in the direction that Mr McGill Snr's own actions would be the reason why that money went missing from the family business while Chuck was away at college. As of now though, the show is pushing us in the direction that it was in fact Jimmy. By the conclusion of that thread though, I'm hoping for something with a bit more depth than simply 'Yes, Jimmy siphoned the $14,000 dollars from his father for his own use'.

    Elsewhere in the episode, I like that Jimmy finally admitted to Kim that he needs to be himself in order to succeed at what he's doing, more importantly though, in order to be happy. When he first lied to her in the scene about being 'straight-up', I almost face-palmed but it was good to see him find some sense in the moment and give Kim a bit of honesty. This is important to me as a viewer because if he had have lied to her once again, I would have lost a bit of faith in Jimmy in terms of he not learning from past mistakes. No doubt Jimmy will make mistakes again going forward on his journey towards 'Saul', and probably lie to Kim again, but I do need to see the odd scene that makes me feel the character is trying to help himself and doesn't really deserve to be living that lonely, nervous life as a Cinnabon manager in Omaha in the eventual timeline.

    I'm interested to see where the story is going with Mike and Stacey, his daughter-in-law. He appears to be dropping a lot of money on this new house for her, but he knows that there was no one shooting at her previous house. So what's going on in Mike's head? Does he think that Stacey is maliciously playing him? Or does he think that she is just stressed to the point of paranoia now and that the change will genuinely do her good?

    With a man like Mike, it might not matter. All that could matter to him is that she is his son's widow, his granddaughter's mother, and needs to be provided for and made felt safe at all costs. I would like to see some progression on that though. When Mike was on that stake-out outside Stacey's old place one night, I was almost expecting someone to come by and start shooting. It was a tension filled scene if I remember correctly. I wasn't too surprised when there was no shots fired, but when the next day Stacey was adamant that there were, despite Mike knowing there wasn't, that was an interesting turn. I guess I'd just like to see some progression. Maybe that will happen in a few episodes when Stacey starts 'hearing shots' again at her new dream home, and Mike might have to tell her a hard truth - there are no gunshots.

    As for Mike and the Salamancas, is anyone else thinking that this will end up with Mike getting so deep that he'll have to be somewhat saved/vouched for by Gus and this will be his introduction to the show? We saw in Breaking Bad (stop reading here if you haven't yet watched BB and don't want to be spoiled)..........Gus getting fúcked over by a group including a laughing Tio Salamanca sometime in the 80s. There's already established beef there. Maybe Mike will come onto Gus' radar by kicking up a bit of a storm with the Salamancas, and their relationship will be born out of a 'The enemy of my enemy is my friend' situation.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,994 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    Custardpi wrote: »
    Possibly but in OFAH it was acknowledged that Grandad had died & they didn't have the burden of having to line up with a pre-existing sequel several years into the future. If BCS goes right up to the time that Walter White enters the picture then Mike will be a central character in the criminal underworld inhabited by both Gus Freng & by that stage Jimmy/Saul, making his absence (again, touch wood) difficult to explain away.

    I had forgotten the obvious like an eejit! That BCS is supposed to focus on the past, they would have to contrive some story if Jonathan Banks dies, your right. Banks does look fairly f**ked and worn out. I hope for his sake and BCS he looks after himself.

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,243 ✭✭✭deandean


    Just finished season 2 episode 7 tonight.

    It is the development of Kim, who I think is the mutt's nuts!

    But IIRC she doesn't appear in Breaking Bad so I guess she and Saul are gonna call it a day some time.....

    Also I see the start of Saul Goodman, with the clothes etc.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,752 ✭✭✭johnpatrick81


    I thought it with the Bell Man vs Mike showdown in the previous episode that Mike is going to be the cause of a serious turn in Salamanca's health, and tonight with him hiding in the shadows I imagine we might see it sooner rather than later.

    Even though it was more "eventful" I felt it was one of the poorest episodes of the season so far.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,133 ✭✭✭Patty O Furniture


    jooksavage wrote: »
    Totally agree! Kim is a great character and is superbly written. Unlike Saul and Mike, we have no idea what's ultimately in store for her. Gilligan is really making the most of her unique position.

    If BB had any shortcomings it was the female characters - they were usually on the margins or there to serve a particular purpose: Skyler as the somewhat emasculating wife who has a hand in creating Heisenberg, Jesse's dead girlfriend(s), Lydia as the punchable villain. Marie Shrader was probably the most likeable and interesting but she was also usually there on the periphery, reacting to events rather than shaping them.

    It looks like Kim is going to have a much bigger role in shaping the story of BCS. I'm intrigued to know where she is in the BB period (or if she makes it there at all....) On top if this, she's funny, hot and very likeable.

    I came across an article on that here
    • Is Kim Wexler part of the Breaking Badverse, even if we never saw her in it? When panel moderator Debra Birnbaum of Variety expressed worry that Kim doesn’t exist in the world of Saul Goodman, Gilligan responded: “Just because we never saw her on Breaking Bad doesn’t mean she doesn’t’ exist in it.” Quipped Seehorn: “If she was in Jimmy’s life and important enough, would he bring her up to Heisenberg? ‘By the way, there’s someone I care deeply about…’ I feel like all possibilities are open, and I refuse to hear otherwise.”
    Yeah Jesse says "We don't need a criminal lawyer, we need a CRIMINAL Lawyer"

    I hope that the ending of the show is the moment Jesse and Walt walk into Sauls office and it's just ends there.

    I don't think anyone would mind that, as it leads into another chapter we've already visited!

    Although the writers had thought of ending on introducing Saul at end of S01, but were having too much fun with Jimmy McGill

    • The last scene of the season 1 finale was written with the transformation of Jimmy into Saul in mind. Jimmy’s driving off after rejecting the job offer and humming “Smoke on the Water” was “obviously Saul Goodman, that’s the kind of thing he would do,” said Gilligan, and the writers entered season 2 thinking that the switch would happen very quickly...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,409 ✭✭✭topmanamillion


    jooksavage wrote: »
    Totally agree! Kim is a great character and is superbly written. Unlike Saul and Mike, we have no idea what's ultimately in store for her. Gilligan is really making the most of her unique position.

    If BB had any shortcomings it was the female characters - they were usually on the margins or there to serve a particular purpose: Skyler as the somewhat emasculating wife who has a hand in creating Heisenberg, Jesse's dead girlfriend(s), Lydia as the punchable villain. Marie Shrader was probably the most likeable and interesting but she was also usually there on the periphery, reacting to events rather than shaping them.

    It looks like Kim is going to have a much bigger role in shaping the story of BCS. I'm intrigued to know where she is in the BB period (or if she makes it there at all....) On top if this, she's funny, hot and very likeable.

    Really? You liked Marie Shrader? I thought she was the definition of a C U Next Tuesday and my least favorite character in the whole show.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,631 ✭✭✭Dirty Dingus McGee


    Really good episode again.

    Very funny episode and Saul admitting he was the one not flushing the toilets was hilarious.The episode reminded me of this.



    The opening flashback scene of Sauls childhood was excellent as it shows why he is like he is and doesn't want to end up being a complete sap like his father was.I think Kim is in for a big let down at Sweigert and Coakley as I have a feeling that Sweigert is a real Wolf as described in Sauls flashback sequence and is going to use her purely to win the case against HHM.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,631 ✭✭✭Dirty Dingus McGee


    stankratz wrote: »
    More BB-world stuff in this episode; The realtor who showed Mike and Stacey around the new house in the latest episode of BCS was the same one from the open house where Marie stole an item in BB episode 5.3.

    I liked this episode, and it featured my favourite opening scene of the season, maybe series, with the flashback to Jimmy's childhood experience with his father. By the look of things, Mr. McGill Senior was quite the pushover and having witnessed this first hand, Slippin' Jimmy was born. I was disappointed though to see Jimmy actually take money out of the till and pocket it himself. I thought it was initially going in the direction that Mr McGill Snr's own actions would be the reason why that money went missing from the family business while Chuck was away at college. As of now though, the show is pushing us in the direction that it was in fact Jimmy. By the conclusion of that thread though, I'm hoping for something with a bit more depth than simply 'Yes, Jimmy siphoned the $14,000 dollars from his father for his own use'.

    But the father was taking money from the till and giving it to supposed charity cases so not all the missing money is down to Saul.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,631 ✭✭✭Dirty Dingus McGee


    I had forgotten the obvious like an eejit! That BCS is supposed to focus on the past, they would have to contrive some story if Jonathan Banks dies, your right. Banks does look fairly f**ked and worn out. I hope for his sake and BCS he looks after himself.


    Having googled him he does look a lot fresher in real life.The effect of moving from a cold climate in Philadelphia to desert climate in Albuquerque would have a big of an impact on you I would imagine.

    His skin looks horrific but I'd imagine if I moved to live in the desert my skin would look horrific after a while as well, so I'd say his worn out look is part of his character as it reflects his personality in the show.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,056 ✭✭✭steve_r


    Re stankratz, interesting points re Mike and Stacey. Of all the relationships on the show, they are the ones least open about things. Whilst Mike knows there were no shots, I think he knows the damage his world does, and has done, to Stacey and Kayleigh. I'm not quite sure whether Stacey is playing him or not. It could well be (and this is all speculation) that she is aware, on some level, that Mike is getting the money from criminal activities. It's very hard to know what either of them are thinking.

    Re the Gus thing, that makes a whole lot of sense. I nearly think you should put spoiler tags on that!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,133 ✭✭✭Patty O Furniture


    Really good episode again.

    Very funny episode and Saul admitting he was the one not flushing the toilets was hilarious.The episode reminded me of this.

    The opening flashback scene of Sauls childhood was excellent as it shows why he is like he is and doesn't want to end up being a complete sap like his father was.I think Kim is in for a big let down at Sweigert and Coakley as I have a feeling that Sweigert is a real Wolf as described in Sauls flashback sequence and is going to use her purely to win the case against HHM.

    Is she still gonna set up her own different part of the business - Wexler & McGill separately uptown & not go with S&C?

    How much would they gain to lose if they didn't have Kim?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,383 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    I do think Stacey is playing Mike and that he is now aware. I can't recall fully but thought the money in BB was only being left to the grand daughter and nothing to her?

    Few things I thought would happen but didn't.

    -Thought the grifter/conman would just play along the same game in front of young Jimmy, and not so blatantly show it was a scam.

    -When he didn't I thought young Jimmy would call out to the father to expose the fact the conman had plenty of money. Or that young Jimmy would show the father the new money in the till and tell him he was scammed.

    -Thought Kim was being led along and that the new firm wanted her out of HHM, hoping if they rejected her HHM would not take her back. Probably no logic to that just seemed like it was going to happen.

    -Was certain Jimmy was going to have Saul Goodman as the answering machine message after the first few.


  • Registered Users Posts: 455 ✭✭Skullface McGubbin


    I had forgotten the obvious like an eejit! That BCS is supposed to focus on the past, they would have to contrive some story if Jonathan Banks dies, your right. Banks does look fairly f**ked and worn out. I hope for his sake and BCS he looks after himself.

    Yep. The slower the pace of the series, the longer it will take to reach its conclusion. And the more seasons get made as years go by, the more likely it is that Banks might kick the bucket. So the writing staff will have to be careful as to how long they want draw out the storyline for & so on.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,409 ✭✭✭topmanamillion


    rubadub wrote: »
    I do think Stacey is playing Mike and that he is now aware. I can't recall fully but thought the money in BB was only being left to the grand daughter and nothing to her?

    Few things I thought would happen but didn't.

    -Thought the grifter/conman would just play along the same game in front of young Jimmy, and not so blatantly show it was a scam.

    -When he didn't I thought young Jimmy would call out to the father to expose the fact the conman had plenty of money. Or that young Jimmy would show the father the new money in the till and tell him he was scammed.

    -Thought Kim was being led along and that the new firm wanted her out of HHM, hoping if they rejected her HHM would not take her back. Probably no logic to that just seemed like it was going to happen.

    -Was certain Jimmy was going to have Saul Goodman as the answering machine message after the first few.

    1. I think when the conman saw Jimmy talking to his father he realised jimmy knew and the conman already had his 10 dollars so what was the point in pretending.

    2. Jimmy had already tried to tell his father it was a scam and had most likely done the same when "the mexican" scammed him a few days previously leading to the current wave of scammers seeing his father as a soft touch.
    He had been dismissed by his father so it was clearly pointless. The conmans "some people are sheep and some are wolves" line clearly resonated with jimmy.

    3. I think there's possibly more to the new firm wanting Kim but HHM is a huge firm with presumably an array of lawyers as talented as Kim so I don't see how taking her would weaken HHM at all. The fact Kim would be partner in 2 years doesn't add up with it being a trick. Theres also the fact she's being treated very poorly at HHM so if she swaps one firm that's treating her poorly for another she really won't be any worse off. I'd be willing to take the new firms approach at face value and they just see a good lawyer that they want to recruit, pissing off HHM in the process may well be a bonus.

    4. Ya I thought Saul was going to make an appearance too. But I think we probably need a back story before he goes full Saul. I'd have to rewatch BB but I can't remember if we got one there. I'd assume he chooses a Jewish persona because he thought that would make him more professional sounding/trustworthy (Jimmys thinking not mine).


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,910 ✭✭✭squonk


    I think the transition from Jimmy to Saul has begun now. Once those loud suits appeared it was only a matter of time. Now he's out on his own they'll probably hold over Saul's genesis to the finalé. Something has to happen probably between Jimmy and Chuck. It's possible that maybe Chuck demands that Jimmy never practice law again or at least under the McGill name.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,383 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    I'd assume he chooses a Jewish persona because he thought that would make him more professional sounding/trustworthy (Jimmys thinking not mine).
    yes, he openly said something along those lines in BB, I think to Walt.

    He was watching his old commercials at the start of season 1, and after the success of the one with the granny I expect there will be more.

    Can't wait for more of them.


    Thanks for your other comments, all make sense.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,343 ✭✭✭✭rob316


    ^

    As hank said " Your commercials suck, I've seen better acting in an epileptic whore house"

    Great line :D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 716 ✭✭✭Red King


    I don't get the love for the Kim character. I find her quite hard to watch to be honest. She is just a stereotypical career woman in her 40's who has put her job ahead of everything else in her life. She is not very interesting as a result, even her work is meaningless and directionless.

    She has also made it clear that her career is more important than her relationship with Jimmy. I think she will play a pivotal role in making Jimmy into Saul Goodman. I think her career over everything else approach to life will serve to destroy their relationship, she will ditch him or blame him for her own failure to make good decisions in her career.

    Ultimately, despite her strong career woman aspirations, it is already clear that everything is not going to plan. She has made bad decisions and is getting played. Jimmy has tried to warn her and even made her an offer to be partners but she has turned him down, blinded by her ambitions to be at a big firm.

    Ultimately she will lose Jimmy and her career will hit a dead end.

    I think it is actually quite a damning statement by Gilligan, perhaps unintentionally. She is supposed to be a "strong independent woman" but in the end she wlll be a lonley spinster in a dead end job. People will probably blame Jimmy of course, despite her own deeply flawed judgement.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,017 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    Red King wrote: »
    I don't get the love for the Kim character. I find her quite hard to watch to be honest. She is just a stereotypical career woman in her 40's who has put her job ahead of everything else in her life. She is not very interesting as a result, even her work is meaningless and directionless.

    She has also made it clear that her career is more important than her relationship with Jimmy. I think she will play a pivotal role in making Jimmy into Saul Goodman. I think her career over everything else approach to life will serve to destroy their relationship, she will ditch him or blame him for her own failure to make good decisions in her career.

    Ultimately, despite her strong career woman aspirations, it is already clear that everything is not going to plan. She has made bad decisions and is getting played. Jimmy has tried to warn her and even made her an offer to be partners but she has turned him down, blinded by her ambitions to be at a big firm.

    Ultimately she will lose Jimmy and her career will hit a dead end.

    I think it is actually quite a damning statement by Gilligan, perhaps unintentionally. She is supposed to be a "strong independent woman" but in the end she wlll be a lonley spinster in a dead end job. People will probably blame Jimmy of course, despite her own deeply flawed judgement.

    Everyone (apparently) loves Kim but I agree with you. I'd even go so far to say that she's "using" Jimmy as an ego boost - on her terms and when it suits her (such as the "ditch work and come scam this guy cause I'm bored" thing a few weeks back). She doesn't approve of his methods or ethos and it's clear that she doesn't love him the same way he does her though. Maybe she's even jealous of him - after all they started in pretty much the same way (the mailroom) yet he got a high profile case and the rewards that came with it and then ditched it on his own terms to go back out on his own, while she is being left in limbo by HHM, and played by the other firm.

    The poor sap genuinely cares for her though and as you say, has tried to warn her and even offered her a partnership but because he's not "good enough" for her she turned it down - but is willing to split the utility costs?!

    I think their relationship will hit a wall and will serve as the catalyst for Jimmy taking on the Saul persona completely myself


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,902 ✭✭✭frozenfrozen


    all of this is in my humble opinion... She left a small town to make something more of herself, rather than just marry into the local supermarket, so she is reluctant to settle for Jimmy and the potential death of her career by partnering with someone who she knows well breaks the law every day. Obviously we know what Jimmy becomes but as far as she is concerned up until this point she was really trying to help him out and get him to go straight (in terms of law..). Her confusing the new bossman just cements her fears that she would end up in the same situation again as with hamlin and I think the idea of her being her own boss is genuinely what she wants now. I don't think she believes she is getting the job for real either, they ate up everything she said in the meeting including the name slip which is probably leading her to think that it's just to take her off the old people case / upset the apple cart at HHM, without her there and Jimmy trying to impress her by doing good work, there's no way the case will be won by HHM. It's far cheaper for them to pay her a few hundred grand and the rest of her law school fees, than to have to pay out several million for the class action suit.

    I think she's a great character anyway, very realistic dynamic between her and Jimmy. Not another token female character like in so many other shows.


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Red King wrote: »
    I don't get the love for the Kim character. I find her quite hard to watch to be honest. She is just a stereotypical career woman in her 40's who has put her job ahead of everything else in her life. She is not very interesting as a result, even her work is meaningless and directionless.

    She has also made it clear that her career is more important than her relationship with Jimmy. I think she will play a pivotal role in making Jimmy into Saul Goodman. I think her career over everything else approach to life will serve to destroy their relationship, she will ditch him or blame him for her own failure to make good decisions in her career.

    Ultimately, despite her strong career woman aspirations, it is already clear that everything is not going to plan. She has made bad decisions and is getting played. Jimmy has tried to warn her and even made her an offer to be partners but she has turned him down, blinded by her ambitions to be at a big firm.

    Ultimately she will lose Jimmy and her career will hit a dead end.

    I think it is actually quite a damning statement by Gilligan, perhaps unintentionally. She is supposed to be a "strong independent woman" but in the end she wlll be a lonley spinster in a dead end job. People will probably blame Jimmy of course, despite her own deeply flawed judgement.

    What bad decisions has she made...? Who is playing her?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,785 ✭✭✭jcsoulinger


    Red King wrote: »
    I don't get the love for the Kim character. I find her quite hard to watch to be honest. She is just a stereotypical career woman in her 40's who has put her job ahead of everything else in her life. She is not very interesting as a result, even her work is meaningless and directionless.

    She has also made it clear that her career is more important than her relationship with Jimmy. I think she will play a pivotal role in making Jimmy into Saul Goodman. I think her career over everything else approach to life will serve to destroy their relationship, she will ditch him or blame him for her own failure to make good decisions in her career.

    Ultimately, despite her strong career woman aspirations, it is already clear that everything is not going to plan. She has made bad decisions and is getting played. Jimmy has tried to warn her and even made her an offer to be partners but she has turned him down, blinded by her ambitions to be at a big firm.

    Ultimately she will lose Jimmy and her career will hit a dead end.

    I think it is actually quite a damning statement by Gilligan, perhaps unintentionally. She is supposed to be a "strong independent woman" but in the end she wlll be a lonley spinster in a dead end job. People will probably blame Jimmy of course, despite her own deeply flawed judgement.

    I'm not her biggest fan either, but I think your way off the mark here. She has rejected the big firms in favour of starting her own firm, maybe not the wisest move but should be commended non the less as it shows courage. Saying she will end up as a lonely spinster is wild speculation, and how is her character in her 40s?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,383 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    how is her character in her 40s?
    Has anything being said to make you think otherwise?

    The actress is 43


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,785 ✭✭✭jcsoulinger


    rubadub wrote: »
    Has anything being said to make you think otherwise?

    The actress is 43

    That does not mean her character is 43, look at mike ffs, Nothing has been said regarding her age so why jump to conclusions.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,383 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    That does not mean her character is 43
    I never said it did mean that, I was asking if you have seen anything to think otherwise, I thought I might have missed something. I am genuinely interested since you seemed to be saying she was not in her 40's. I guessed she was.

    Mike is totally different, he was an actor in BB. If BCS was made today and no BB was ever made then I guess they would have selected an actor around the age they wanted Mike to be currently. I guessed they selected an actress in her 40's to play a character in her 40's, I think its a fair "conclusion to jump to", unless you have something else to go on.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 716 ✭✭✭Red King


    I didn't even know the age of the actress. She just looks in her 40's so I assumed the character is the same. Wouldn't make much sense to have her in her early 30's because she doesn't look the part.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,992 ✭✭✭wawaman




  • Closed Accounts Posts: 716 ✭✭✭Red King


    He's gotta show up at some point.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,785 ✭✭✭jcsoulinger


    rubadub wrote: »
    I never said it did mean that, I was asking if you have seen anything to think otherwise, I thought I might have missed something. I am genuinely interested since you seemed to be saying she was not in her 40's. I guessed she was

    Apologies, I've no information regarding the characters age, I disagree that the actresses age is any indication bar putting you in a ball park as to what Kims age is. Imo the OP on this topic decided she was in her 40 to support their argument that she is going to be an unsatisfied spinster.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 716 ✭✭✭Red King


    Apologies, I've no information regarding the characters age, I disagree that the actresses age is any indication bar putting you in a ball park as to what Kims age is. Imo the OP on this topic decided she was in her 40 to support their argument that she is going to be an unsatisfied spinster.

    Really? I mean REALLY?

    How about:

    Looks in her forties
    Actress is in her forties
    Has clearly worked her way up from the mailroom, indicating years in her career
    Is angling to be a partner, again indicating years in her career
    Is being manipulated by older bosses and rival firms
    Is putting her career before relationship
    Looks destined to lose Jimmy and possibly end up in a dead end career because her bosses see her as a pawn, not an asset


    And in keeping with Gilligan, just as with Walt, it is the people around Jimmy who will ultimately suffer most from his actions. You think precious snowflake Kim is going to be any different to Skyler, Marie or Lydia?

    She is a boring one dimensional character, a stereotype career first woman. The signs are however that neither her career nor her relationship are going to survive Saul Goodman. What is she left with then?

    And like Skyler and Marie she is annoying, a nag and she doesn't appreciate the man in her life.

    This is how Gilligan writes female characters. He thinks they are good female characters because they are morally superior but in actuality they ate thoroughly unlikeable because he is just not as good at writing women as he is with anti-hero male characters.

    If you want to see a well written female character look at either Carmela Soprano or Dr. Melfi in the Sopranos. They could equally be bitchy but they were far more interesting and well written than any of the female characters Gilligan created.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,785 ✭✭✭jcsoulinger


    Red King wrote: »
    Really? I mean REALLY?

    How about:

    Looks in her forties
    Actress is in her forties
    Has clearly worked her way up from the mailroom, indicating years in her career
    Is angling to be a partner, again indicating years in her career
    Is being manipulated by older bosses and rival firms
    Is putting her career before relationship
    Looks destined to lose Jimmy and possibly end up in a dead end career because her bosses see her as a pawn, not an asset


    And in keeping with Gilligan, just as with Walt, it is the people around Jimmy who will ultimately suffer most from his actions. You think precious snowflake Kim is going to be any different to Skyler, Marie or Lydia?

    She is a boring one dimensional character, a stereotype career first woman. The signs are however that neither her career nor her relationship are going to survive Saul Goodman. What is she left with then?

    And like Skyler and Marie she is annoying, a nag and she doesn't appreciate the man in her life.

    This is how Gilligan writes female characters. He thinks they are good female characters because they are morally superior but in actuality they ate thoroughly unlikeable because he is just not as good at writing women as he is with anti-hero male characters.

    If you want to see a well written female character look at either Carmela Soprano or Dr. Melfi in the Sopranos. They could equally be bitchy but they were far more interesting and well written than any of the female characters Gilligan created.

    I dont think you can say she definitely looks over 40.
    She could have been working at the firm for the last 15 years and still not be in her 40s.
    Dont get your manipulation point.
    I think its equally possible she is 35 as 43. we can agree to disagree.

    I have said before that I dont like her character and shes badly written. I just think you are off the mark regarding her agenda, If she is as you say career first why would she take the huge risk of starting her own firm besides taking the offer from the opposing firm. I also disagree that she will end up as a lonely spinster.

    There isnt a character in BCS that wouldnt pale in comparison to someone in the sopranos.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,739 ✭✭✭scamalert


    Red King wrote: »

    This is how Gilligan writes female characters. He thinks they are good female characters because they are morally superior but in actuality they ate thoroughly unlikeable because he is just not as good at writing women as he is with anti-hero male characters.

    If you want to see a well written female character look at either Carmela Soprano or Dr. Melfi in the Sopranos. They could equally be bitchy but they were far more interesting and well written than any of the female characters Gilligan created.
    Its a bit pointless comparing shows as Sopranos to BB or BTC.If you ever put on any sopranos episode it would have something going on,parts missed,experiences,action not sure how to describe it,watching BB or BTC you dont get that once you seen it once fully thats sorta it- since it was developed pretty straight forward within each season being more intense and leading to disaster,thus no point in really giving much to female characters roles that would put them into positions where they would be of much interest,if outcome is already screened.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,631 ✭✭✭Dirty Dingus McGee


    I dont think you can say she definitely looks over 40.
    She could have been working at the firm for the last 15 years and still not be in her 40s.
    Dont get your manipulation point.
    I think its equally possible she is 35 as 43. we can agree to disagree.

    I have said before that I dont like her character and shes badly written. I just think you are off the mark regarding her agenda, If she is as you say career first why would she take the huge risk of starting her own firm besides taking the offer from the opposing firm. I also disagree that she will end up as a lonely spinster.

    There isnt a character in BCS that wouldnt pale in comparison to someone in the sopranos.

    Meadow Soprano was quiet possibly one of the worst characters to appear on TV.A completely pointless and boring character that purely existed in order for Tony to have a daughter.

    Anthony junior and Carmella were dreadful characters (although that is just because I hated both of them).

    I don't see anything wrong with Kim as a character.She's probably going to end up being Sauls a sacrificial lamb and is a complete counterbalance to Saul. She does everything the right way an dis more than likely going to suffer for it while Saul will benefit from his dodginess (in the short to medium term at least)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,631 ✭✭✭Dirty Dingus McGee


    Is she still gonna set up her own different part of the business - Wexler & McGill separately uptown & not go with S&C?

    How much would they gain to lose if they didn't have Kim?


    I think she will go with Sweigert and Coakley and get screwed over them and end up going to Saul as a second option and then end up being screwed over by him (probably unintentionally) and after raising herself up from the bottom with hard work and dedication and after leaving a small one horse town to make herself in the world she'll end up with nothing for it.

    I wouldn't be surprised to find her ending up in jail at some stage for something involving Saul.

    All the above is complete speculation of course and I haven't a bulls clue what will happen.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,078 ✭✭✭Muff Richardson


    here's my deep analysis into the character that is Kim, to me she looks about 42 and a half but is apparently 43, she doesn't come close to falling into the hot mom, MILF or whatever else they may be called bracket...she seems like a boring pain in the hole nagging skylar type person but what kills me is that f***ing Kermit the Frog voice box thing she's got going on. all round train wreck of a yoke...thanks for reading.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 564 ✭✭✭Checkmate19


    I have lost my interest in this. To slow. They are milking it.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,473 ✭✭✭✭Liam O


    I think what will happen is that Jimmy is going to become quasi-Saul, making his dodgy deals and defending scum, start raking in the money while Kim will struggle along playing the straight and narrow but become disillusioned with how Jimmy/Saul makes his money. Her and Chuck have a relationship now so he might try to have Jimmy disbarred or something and she will eventually reluctantly help to get back in with HHM.

    Would make somewhat sense would it?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,761 ✭✭✭el diablo


    I have lost my interest in this. To slow. They are milking it.

    Bye.

    We're all in this psy-op together.🤨



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,383 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    she doesn't come close to falling into the hot mom, MILF or whatever else they may be called bracket.
    I think she is great looking, it was one thing I wondered about, how slipping Jimmy scored such a good looking woman. I also like her voice! better than these put on squeaky "I'm just a gurl" voice some have.

    here is a bit on her age.
    http://forums.previously.tv/topic/40750-s02e06-bali-hai/
    How old is Kim supposed to be? Close up she looks mid-forties in that video.

    -Rhea Seehorn will be turning 44 soon. I don't know how old Kim is supposed to be. Normally, if someone goes straight through college and law school with no Masters degrees, breaks or clerkships, 44 seems a little old to be a law firm associate (again, with no breaks, other degrees or first careers). However, this isn't the case for Kim. She was working in the mailroom as an intern in her 30s, according to Rhea Seehorn's description of Kim's backstory--usually a straight out of college-type position, as the actress acknowledges--meaning that there was a significant hiatus for Kim between college and law school and she probably didn't finish law school until her late 30s. Given that, Kim being 44 seems entirely plausible.

    Only 3 episodes left this season


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,343 ✭✭✭✭rob316


    Feck sake its nearly over again for another year, 3 episodes left. Hope we see the birth of Saul Goodman before the season ends, like I thought we were going to see at the end of the last season.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 22,559 ✭✭✭✭AnonoBoy


    here's my deep analysis into the character that is Kim, to me she looks about 42 and a half but is apparently 43, she doesn't come close to falling into the hot mom, MILF or whatever else they may be called bracket...she seems like a boring pain in the hole nagging skylar type person but what kills me is that f***ing Kermit the Frog voice box thing she's got going on. all round train wreck of a yoke...thanks for reading.

    No, thank you for writing such a well thought out analysis of a character.


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