Extreme cruelty at puc fair.

Sir Arthur Daley

Puck fair fond memories indeed.

Herb Powell

Ah yeah, look at all those stupid, inbred country people, nowhere near as enlightened or cultured as us city folk! They must all be so thick and cruel!

Absolute non-issue, if it was anywhere near as cruel as ye are claiming, it wouldn't have continued.

septictank

Funny that nobody is talking about Puck over in the Kerry Forum.

wexandproud

i will tell you what i find most distressing, its that someone suggested putting the goat and michael healy rae in the same cage. now that would be cruel to the poor goat.
jebus i wish i was in killorglin this weekend

RustyNut

Diabhal Beag wrote: »

That goat racially abused me about 15 years ago. Pure scum.

Was that when you were out runnin nakid around the hills and he slagged the fact that you only had one horn and it was tiny..:D

Ave Sodalis

darkpagandeath wrote: »

How do you know what the animal equivalent of fear is ? Fear is a human term used and invented by us. People are making out that their "Fear" is a kin to sense of immanent doom impending death like the moments before you are killed. Animals fear predation, In the wild zebras run from lions, one is eaten a few hundred meters away. Other zebras go back to grazing few mins later after this and watch the other zebra being eaten.

The goat is 60ft in the air well away from the predators, I'm sure its feeling quite indifferent to the situation.

Animal behaviour goes deeper than what's visual. Animals (and people) will stop reacting eventually, even though they are still distressed. It's called learned helplessness. They give up trying to escape and appear by all accounts normal, except for the high levels of stress hormones still running through their veins.
To say animals don't feel fear, or their fear is not as great, is crazy and ridiculous.
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/B9780123945860000032
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S016815911200367X
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0165032700003438
http://curiosity.discovery.com/question/animals-feel-fear-and-pain
http://www.nuffieldbioethics.org/sites/default/files/files/Animals%20Chapter%204%20The%20Capacity%20of%20Animals%20to%20Experience%20Pain,%20Distress%20and%20Suffering.pdf

In terms of this, no, I don't think it's extreme. Not particularly pleasant, and I wouldn't protest if it was gotten rid of but there's far worse forms of cruelty. I think if better facilities were provided for the goat, like more room, better shelter, then it shouldn't have any lasting effect on the goat.

As for those comparing it to horses in stables, and other pets, there is a difference between acceptance and learned helplessness. Dogs and horses are (or at least should be) taught that it's okay, and that they aren't in any great danger. If they aren't, then yes, it's cruel too.

Frank Lee Midere

The cruelty, as far as I can see it, is in the confinement not the height. Mountain goats are not scared of heights.

But lots of animals are confined.

Roquentin

chris the unhappy sheep

whirlpool

monflat wrote: »

As. An animal lover I hate to see any animal harmed or likewise however I do think. By saying this is " extreme cruelty " is goin a bit far.

Extreme cruelty would be like letting the goat starve no food r water subject to high or low temperatures with no shelter.

Causing harm to the animal
.

The organisers claim that the goat is monitored and not harmed.

I think people jump on the PC wagon and say this ain't right.

There's plenty of cases of "extreme cruelty " in the four corners of Ireland unfortunately and they involve a lot more than a goat in.a cage.

Grand. So it's not "extreme" cruelty. So one description in that article was inaccurate. That changes nothing. It's still, cruelty and the actions of complete dumbasses.

whupdedo

whirlpool wrote: »

Grand. So it's not "extreme" cruelty. So one description in that article was inaccurate. That changes nothing. It's still, cruelty and the actions of complete dumbasses.

Take a walk over to Dublin zoo sometime and you'll see modern day captivity in its finest form

Lia_lia

Packrat wrote: »

Puck is not crap. You're just a blow-in who doesent get it.

Anytime I've gone to Puck (and I live about 20 minutes away!) it's been full of drunk teenagers and filth. So yeah, I think Puck is crap.

Packrat

Lia_lia wrote: »

Anytime I've gone to Puck (and I live about 20 minutes away!) it's been full of drunk teenagers and filth. So yeah, I think Puck is crap.

Nice deflection.

My points remain.

Yes, we get it, you live in Killarney, and took the bus back to Killorglin a few times during puck at about seven in the evening when drunk puking Killarney teens were what was left.

Did you ever walk cattle to Puck at 4 or 5 in the morning, watching as the sun rose gradually? Or sell a horse there? Or meet family members home from the US on their annual pilgrimage there? Or buy pullets there? Or first see a roulette wheel there? Or travel on a couple of boards on the arms of a 135 to get there? Or smoke your first cigarette behind a pub there while waiting for the oul fella? Or FINALLY get the shift from ******** there? Or sing till bright day with about ten friends in a pub there?

Do you understand every term in above paragraph ? No? Then you don't get Puck.

ciara_may

I'm from Kerry and I will not go to puck fair putting any live animal in a cage suspended in the air where it is surrounded by drunk idiots is cruel!!! Puck fair just like the rose of tralee is rough and full of grown men and women fighting in the streets they are both festivals for scum and I could think of 101 things I would prefer to do with my time

Macavity.

I'm sorry but I actually laughed at the whole ridiculousness of the story, why are they putting the goat up there? Is there some historical or cultural significance to a goat being high in the air. It's just ridiculous.

shane9689

pUCK FAIR IS GREat

JupiterKid

The Puck Fair is rather bizarre but to say that it is "extreme" cruelty is really pushing it. I'm all for the ethical treatment of animals and maybe they could modernise the Puck fair to improve the goat's treatment but I can think of hundreds of more pressing cases of real animal cruelty that happen each week in this country - usually to pets.

So a bit of perspective is required here methinks.

Simi

Why not just use a fake goat? If a center piece of your festival is hoisting a goat in a cage high into the air, then why not just use a fake goat. Seems obvious tbh.

Deranged96

Simi wrote: »

Why not just use a fake goat? If a center piece of your festival is hoisting a goat in a cage high into the air, then why not just use a fake goat. Seems obvious tbh.

You want to have puc fair without a puc?
Jesus it's already under fire for being pointless as it is

Macavity.

This is a bit like a plot from Father Ted.

MultiUmm

I'm neither for or against either side of the argument really but I can't help but wonder how many of those who are blasting the fair as extremely cruel would pick up a stray dog in need of food and shelter, or how many of them happily eat meat without a second thought...

I'm sure there are some who meet both criteria but as other posters have said in terms of animal cruelty there are far worse cases at this moment being perpetrated across the country.

The irony is that the goat at puc fair might even be distracting people from those cases. :pac:

Egginacup

Gowlasauras Rex wrote: »

We could put a baby in there and proclaim it the king of the babies.

Any babies spare?

No shortage of skangers in Dublin. Take off the trainers but leave on the tracksuit and baseball cap. Hoist up and let the games begin.