Fiancé has an issue with my salary

Neyite

anysolutionsunreg wrote: »

I fully intended on bowing out of this thread yesterday however on reflection a lot of posters have been exceptionally helpful and I am utterly grateful for their contributions which have alerted me to things which I can only deal with at my own pace.

I really am disheartened by the contributions dismissing my efforts to come to terms with this in a very short-space of time whilst I am openly having small discussions and trying to investigate these things whilst also dealing with my own emotional overload etc. I am trying to make good choices here so please, I would ask kindly for posters to appreciate this.

Last night I stayed up to watch the end of a movie after he had gone to bed and I (for the first time in my life) decided to open his laptop. His gaming account was logged in and open and I found myself looking at his profile and transaction history. There are no words to describe how horrible and malicious I felt checking up on him and honestly, I'm even more distraught by what I found. I am ashamed and embarrassed for being so oblivious but yes, there's a lot more money moving around the betting account than I have been led to believe....in fact, about twice what I would have even considered to be a problem.

I went to bed and didn't even want to touch him, I feel sad for him if he has this problem but also, I feel quite numb.

Any advice or opinions on how I should tackle this will be greatly recieved. I have not yet said this too him, I'd rather he didn't know I went on to his laptop so if there's a way I could coax it out of him it would be better. I'd rather help him than lose him but at the same time, today, I'm not even sure who he is. Sorry if this sounds very dramatic it's just not the outcome I expected. If anything on some level I was hoping looking at his account would set my mind at ease.

I'm so sorry to hear that you found out something awful, but I am glad that you are finding out the truth, however much it hurts you.

Firstly, I would contact gambling anon and get advice on how to handle it with him. Now you know that he has a serious problem, you need to try to get a handle on the typical mindset of a gambler.

I'm sad to say, many lose houses, savings, and families before they are willing to face up to their addictions and address their behaviour. I know someone who willingly let his children be fostered rather than spend the money he was gambling on rearing them.

So, dont confront him just yet. Gather your information - get printouts or screenshots of his gambling accounts, talk to GAnon. Go back and re-read Big Bag of Chips posts about her friend and husband who have trudged down that road.

And may I offer massive virtual hugs to you. I'm so sorry, you dont deserve this.

December2012

anysolutionsunreg wrote: »

I fully intended on bowing out of this thread yesterday however on reflection a lot of posters have been exceptionally helpful and I am utterly grateful for their contributions which have alerted me to things which I can only deal with at my own pace.

I really am disheartened by the contributions dismissing my efforts to come to terms with this in a very short-space of time whilst I am openly having small discussions and trying to investigate these things whilst also dealing with my own emotional overload etc. I am trying to make good choices here so please, I would ask kindly for posters to appreciate this.

Last night I stayed up to watch the end of a movie after he had gone to bed and I (for the first time in my life) decided to open his laptop. His gaming account was logged in and open and I found myself looking at his profile and transaction history. There are no words to describe how horrible and malicious I felt checking up on him and honestly, I'm even more distraught by what I found. I am ashamed and embarrassed for being so oblivious but yes, there's a lot more money moving around the betting account than I have been led to believe....in fact, about twice what I would have even considered to be a problem.

I went to bed and didn't even want to touch him, I feel sad for him if he has this problem but also, I feel quite numb.

Any advice or opinions on how I should tackle this will be greatly recieved. I have not yet said this too him, I'd rather he didn't know I went on to his laptop so if there's a way I could coax it out of him it would be better. I'd rather help him than lose him but at the same time, today, I'm not even sure who he is. Sorry if this sounds very dramatic it's just not the outcome I expected. If anything on some level I was hoping looking at his account would set my mind at ease.

I think you were right to do what you did.

I think you're starting to process a lot of information and you're head, quite understandably, is spinning.

Your boyfriend will probably justify his spend on gambling - tell you it's not that much, that he can afford it, etc.

He is going to try and blame you for it - somehow you will have caused the problem by "not trusting" him, "snooping" and probably he will justify his insecurities about money by saying it's you who make him feel this way by examining his money. He's wrong of course, but that doesn't matter.

He may be an addict or just an asshole but you love him, you want this to work and that's fine too.

Maybe the best thing to do right now is nothing direct. Contact Gam Anon and see if they can give you advice on how to deal with this.

Or you could try an alternative approach and try and bring this out in the open by making an appointment with a mortgage broker, forcing him to list his expenditure. This might highlight whether it not the gambling is an addiction or an expensive hobby.

For now, don't tell him you know.

strandroad

OP I am very sorry for you, it must have been horrible to see it all in black and white.

But at least you are no longer groping in the dark and doubting yourself - you have identified the problem. Also, none of this is your fault, your fiance is an addict. I don't have any advice to offer on gambling addiction (i'm sure you can plenty of good advice here and in support griups) but I hope that you can start dealing with it once you've seen the situation clearly - you seem to be a very decent and balanced person.

tinkerbell

Oh OP, I'm sorry you found what you did. You did the right thing by snooping - after all, you are bank rolling him so when he's costing you money, you need to know why he can't afford to pay for his own things.

I'd echo what the others have said - contact GamAnon, they'd be best placed to advise you how to proceed next. I know it's an awful lot to process right now and your life has been turned upside down in the space of a few days but you are best finding out about this now than further down the road.

kylith

Definitely take the advice to contact GamAnon, or a similar help group, get printouts and screenshots of his account.

The only thing is, I know you want to get him to admit to it so that you don't look like the bad one for snooping but I honestly don't think that that will ever happen. You will have to gather your evidence and confront him with it. You will have to say "I checked your online gambling account and you have been lying to me", or words to that effect. There is no way that you can ask if there's anything he wants to talk about and have him confess that he's been blowing all his money, and probably some of yours, on gambling. He is a liar and he will continue to lie until he knows that he has been caught out.

Think of it like a cheater, if you ask them if they're cheating they'll say no. Tell them you saw them kiss someone and they'll swear blind it was just a kiss until you tell them you saw them go to a hotel, and so on. A habitual liar will admit to only as much as they know you know.

There will be a fight. He will accuse you of snooping, driving him to it, making mountains out of molehills, all kinds of stuff. Stay strong and stay calm.

When he admits that he has a problem, and you may have to be prepared for the fact that he may not be at the point where he can admit it, I think that he can contact the sites and ask them to block him and they will do that.

rainbowtrout

anysolutionsunreg wrote: »

I fully intended on bowing out of this thread yesterday however on reflection a lot of posters have been exceptionally helpful and I am utterly grateful for their contributions which have alerted me to things which I can only deal with at my own pace.

I really am disheartened by the contributions dismissing my efforts to come to terms with this in a very short-space of time whilst I am openly having small discussions and trying to investigate these things whilst also dealing with my own emotional overload etc. I am trying to make good choices here so please, I would ask kindly for posters to appreciate this.

Last night I stayed up to watch the end of a movie after he had gone to bed and I (for the first time in my life) decided to open his laptop. His gaming account was logged in and open and I found myself looking at his profile and transaction history. There are no words to describe how horrible and malicious I felt checking up on him and honestly, I'm even more distraught by what I found. I am ashamed and embarrassed for being so oblivious but yes, there's a lot more money moving around the betting account than I have been led to believe....in fact, about twice what I would have even considered to be a problem.

I went to bed and didn't even want to touch him, I feel sad for him if he has this problem but also, I feel quite numb.

Any advice or opinions on how I should tackle this will be greatly recieved. I have not yet said this too him, I'd rather he didn't know I went on to his laptop so if there's a way I could coax it out of him it would be better. I'd rather help him than lose him but at the same time, today, I'm not even sure who he is. Sorry if this sounds very dramatic it's just not the outcome I expected. If anything on some level I was hoping looking at his account would set my mind at ease.

So sorry to hear OP that your fears have been confirmed.

First off the bit I've highlighted above: Don't think posters here are attacking you, I think everyone here is on your side and is just trying to help you protect yourself in the long run. It's a huge shock to the system to find out that your partner of 8 years has this problem and probably doesn't sit with what you know about him.

However, it is there is black and white. I don't have direct experience of dealing with a gambling addict but I would echo what others have said, gather the evidence where you can and go to GamAnon where people with vast experience in this area can advise you.

Perhaps it would be better for now to avoid conversations about gambling with him when it comes to financial matters. You know it's going on, you need to gather information to protect yourself - and to help him if you want the relationship to survive.

You probably do need to cut back on giving him handouts, but tackle it from the point of view that you both need to start budgeting for mortgage and marriage, rather than 'i know you have a gambling problem and i'm not going to feed it'.

You probably need to spend some time thinking over what you have seen and learned in the last few days and get some help from people that know what they are doing, but it's something you need to do for both of you, but particularly yourself OP, because if it's not tackled and you get a mortgage together or get married, you will end up shouldering the debt for the rest of your life. In worst scenario you could lose everything you've worked for due to his addiction.

Look after yourself OP.

LegacyUser

another thought wrote: »

Hi OP.

Something struck me about your situation. It may not have any bearing, but it's worth noting. You mentioned that you were in an RTC and have some scarring. Don't discount the massive effect this will have had on your self-esteem.

You mention how "handsome" and "charismatic" your fiancé is and how he could have anyone he wants and to me that comes across as a genuine fear that he could leave you at any time if you kick up a fuss. On some level you may be feeling "If he leaves me, will I ever meet someone else?"

Yes....this.

I didn't want to say this, or even acknowledge it to myself but there is definitely a feeling that post accident my own stocks have plummeted. I feel like no man would find me attractive, that's not something I would ever divulge to family or friends, or to seek reassurance. It feels like a fact. I've secretly felt (selfishly maybe) like I'm lucky to have been in a solid relationship before this accident happened as nobody would find me attractive now. It all sounds pathetic, I know. In some ways I've felt guilty for expecting him to deal with the things that have happened to me. I have always seen him as perfect, even moreso when he stuck by me and although it's hard for me to completely change my perspective overnight I now thing at least on some level he has been using this to his advantage.

If I hadn't wound up with the post-accident issues, I probably would have fought the financial thing more. Up until this week I was happy to accept it, I just wanted him to appreciate me more financially. He doesn't feel I work hard, he thinks it's because I've been with my employer so long but plenty of staff are there longer than me and haven't progressed very far.

I've taken down the phone number for Gam Anon in my city and will phone them once I've left work.

For those with experience dealing with gamblers. Is it something they cannot help? Is he lying to me because he disrespects me, or can he not help himself?

If it's an addiction then surely he would prefer to not be gambling at all?

My plan - for now, unless I'm advised against by a professional is to have a formal finance meeting tonight and I will take out my bank statements and will ask him to do the same. My efforts will be with a plan to make sure he makes it to the end of the month - this will be in response to his refusal re the joint account suggested on Tuesday.

When he refuses to produce his statements, which I assume he will, I will ask him to log in to online banking. No doubt he'll have forgotten his password. I'll ask him to phone his bank and reset his online banking. I believe this is a 24 hour service although he may need to wait until after the weekend. I hope not, I don't think I can keep this in all weekend. I know I wont be my usual self.

I would like to help him through this but I don't know what's ahead. Is it possible he's not addicted? He plays every night I think, even on holiday he's played on his phone. I know, I am so stupid to believe it was just €10 a week but I was equating it to a play station and thought I was lucky he wasn't forcing me to watch football...

Help

alibab

I think when you started this thread you most certainly did not expect this outcome and you are now in shock .

Sometimes a outside perspective is what is needed and a lot of posters here very quickly regonised there was a issue and that is from very personal experiences they have been through so it's invaluable advice .

You have a lot of thinking to do but be prepared for the defensive behaviour and I would fully expect him now to try and put the blame back on you in some way and somehow make this all your fault . This is not your fault it's his problem remember this . I took loans out in my name in the past on promises of a new start etc do not go down this road .

Only you can decide if this is salvageable and weather you can get through this . My experiences were not good I won't say they were but it's your decision. I married had 2 kids and separated after 7 years and took me another 5 to get back to where I was before .

Twas Not

anysolutionsunreg wrote: »

I fully intended on bowing out of this thread yesterday however on reflection a lot of posters have been exceptionally helpful and I am utterly grateful for their contributions which have alerted me to things which I can only deal with at my own pace.

I really am disheartened by the contributions dismissing my efforts to come to terms with this in a very short-space of time whilst I am openly having small discussions and trying to investigate these things whilst also dealing with my own emotional overload etc. I am trying to make good choices here so please, I would ask kindly for posters to appreciate this.

Last night I stayed up to watch the end of a movie after he had gone to bed and I (for the first time in my life) decided to open his laptop. His gaming account was logged in and open and I found myself looking at his profile and transaction history. There are no words to describe how horrible and malicious I felt checking up on him and honestly, I'm even more distraught by what I found. I am ashamed and embarrassed for being so oblivious but yes, there's a lot more money moving around the betting account than I have been led to believe....in fact, about twice what I would have even considered to be a problem.

I went to bed and didn't even want to touch him, I feel sad for him if he has this problem but also, I feel quite numb.

Any advice or opinions on how I should tackle this will be greatly recieved. I have not yet said this too him, I'd rather he didn't know I went on to his laptop so if there's a way I could coax it out of him it would be better. I'd rather help him than lose him but at the same time, today, I'm not even sure who he is. Sorry if this sounds very dramatic it's just not the outcome I expected. If anything on some level I was hoping looking at his account would set my mind at ease.

A key point to know is that the only solution is for him to quit gambling COMPLETELY !

It is no use try to cut down. It's an addiction. Part of the thrill for gamblers is to bet up to and beyond the point of losing more than they can afford.

Expect major aggression when you confront him. Anything that will deflect away from his gambling problem.

A letter to him with all your feelings and thoughts set out may be the way to go.

Obviously you will need to control all finances and accounts if you are to marry this man. That is important. He has shown that he lies and attacks if his addiction is questioned. He cannot be fully trusted again with money

Ever.

Dark Phoenix

OP you poor thing I am so sorry that it has turned out that he has been lying and does have a problem. It cannot have been at all easy for you to check his laptop. Do not beat yourself up for doing so - you only did it because he flat out refused to talk to you about money no matter how often you brought it up. I know it probably feels like you have been punched in the stomach and this must all be a big shock. Is there anyone you can talk to? When I found out what my ex had been doing I rang a friend I could trust, sat down with them and talked it out and it was a massive relief just to share the burden with someone and sometimes in talking about you acknowledge its real and its a little bit easier to deal with. Please please mind yourself now instead of minding him. Take solace in the fact that you are not married and dont have a mortgage so whats yours is yours he can;t take it from you and you can walk away from him and this mess tomorrow if you want to. It is a good thing that you have found this now before kids and marraige were in the equation.

As for what you do next I think there are other posters on here who would advise you better than I would. Contacting Gamanon is a very good idea. You need to understand a gamblers mindset and to understand how an addictive personality operates. They will lie, they will guilt trip, they will think firstly of themselves, they will try and make you think this is your fault, they will think only of the next thrill. I agree with the poster who said there is no cutting down here - he has to stop 100% - he cannot just reduce his gambling. That would be like an alcoholic only having three drinks a day its not a solution and it will escalate again. I;d also be prepared, if he does quit gambling that if he has an addictive personality it may errupt somewhere else because he has conditioned himself to thrive on a thrill and he struggles to control himself. This might come out as problems with alcohol or with drugs or even with obsession with exercise. In my case while the drugs stopped as far as I knew, but i ended up with someone who was drinking a six pack of beer a night and couldnt go out for a night out without drinking every shot he got his hands on. When he would go on the dry for a few months he would become obsessed with exercise instead. What I mean is if you do decide to stay with him (your decision) and he agrees to get help understand its more than just fixing a gambling problem its fixing a mindset. Also bear in mind that sometimes when you catch someone at something they will keep doing it but they just learn to lie better and hide it better than they did before.

As for how you tell him you can subtely bring it up, you can say nothing or you can rip off the bandage which is terrifying I know and you can ask him outright. I;d imagine his repsonse will tell you a lot. He will probably either deny it and accuse you of breaking trust by going through his stuff and making you out to be the bad guy to deflect from himself or he will break down and admit theres a problem. At the moment you know he has a problem. He may or may not know you know. You know you cannot trust him. You know he has been lying. I guess I'd say to you what more have you got to lose by challenging him on it?

Either way please mind yourself, confide in someone you trust and do not give him a penny from today onwards.

pookie82

Very sorry to hear about your discovery OP. It's rare enough on here to see a thread start on one issue only to gradually turn into something much bigger and then to have that confirmed when it wasn't even something you considered writing your first post.

I'm glad that you kept reading what people had to say, and listened enough to take action, that in itself shows both the value of threads like this (with the objective advice of strangers) and how much of a rational and capable person you are... many people reading what they simply didn't want to hear would have logged off long ago. You have shown great courage and determination to tackle this bit by bit.

First thing's first, before ANYTHING else, cut him off. No more petrol money, no more lunch money, no more discretionary spending on massive sofas of his choosing. If he goes to his mother, so be it, it might be time for her to find out where his money is really going.

I understand you don't want to admit you snooped but you were utterly driven to it. You have shown more than once in this thread that you gave him every chance to open up to you the easy way and were met with resilience and accusations of dramatics.

I would tell him what you've found, unapologetically, although the advice about speaking to Gamblers Anon first to gauge how to broach it is good advice. He will undoubtedly rail against you for invading his privacy, perhaps try to excuse or lie his way out of it, and maybe even in some twisted way insinuate you carry some of the blame ... all known tactics of someone with an addiction problem. You have the luxury now (I know that's a bad phrase given the circumstances) of spending a little time with this new knowledge yourself before confronting him.

Is there any way you could get away for a couple of days somewhere? I know you won't want to approach friends or family with this ... even an afternoon alone to clear your head and process what you have found? Once you have come to terms with it you'll be more able to confront him in a manner which will allow you to keep your calm, and believe me, you'll need to be able to, because he won't see this coming and by all accounts sounds like the type who will explode and panic and turn it all somehow back on you.

Bottom line is, you've been funding someone who has been p*ssing your hard earned cash away, while simultaneously resenting your very ability to be a source of income. There's a lot of issues to be worked through here, so first and foremost, protect your finances now by making sure he has no more access to a penny of anything you've earned.

Try not to think too far down the line either, you've had a massive shock. All sorts of thoughts might enter your head, such as can I trust anything he says, does he really love me, is my future marriage a sham, is my life as I know it over? There's no point in pondering these issues until you know more. For now, you need to concentrate on arming yourself with the full truth and get him to agree that he has a problem before you even look ahead to anything more. And remember, it might feel like your whole world is currently imploding, but THANK GOODNESS you found this out now, not a mortgage, marriage, and 2 kids down the line.

Take one step at a time.

Big Bag of Chips

Hi OP, you mightn't like what I say, but I say tell him. Tell him what you found. Tell him you had no choice but to look for yourself where his money was going because he kept turning it back on you.

I know I keep going on about my friend and her husband, but when my friend started to question him, and pushed him for answers as to why there were unpaid bills, why he wouldn't let her see bank statements etc, he started, like your bf, drip feeding little bits. She ended up having a panick attack and being brought to A&E. While she was in hospital she asked him to tell her the truth. He swore there was nothing else. She knew he was lying. She threatened him that she was leaving, their marriage was over and he had nothing else to lose now. That his only chance was to be honest about exactly how much money he owed. He told her another bit... Etc.

A month later she was still finding out about loans, money borrowed from friends etc.

You have to be straight with him. Even though he will not be straight with you at first. He will twist it. He will blame you. He will tell you that's all, there's nothing else etc.. You can guarantee he owes a lot more money to a lot more people.

This is something that cannot be tiptoed around. For too long you've allowed him to dictate the tone of your relationship. Now it's your turn.

My friend's husband threatened to leave, etc, but he never did. He knew he needed he help. He broke down after a few weeks begging for her to forgive him. Go to GamAnon. It's for people who live with a gambler in their lives. Trust me, you will learn exactly how devious the gambler cam become and you will realise that every story of the partner/wife etc is almost identical.

You are slightly out of the age bracket of my friend and her husband, and you are way out of their wage bracket, but his behaviour, excuses, and arguments with you are a mirror image of them.

You have no choice but confront him.. And please realise, things are about to get very very much worse. It is going to take a long time to recover from this. It all started about 5 years ago with my friend, and it's only in the past year things are settling down for them.

I wish you luck, you will need a lot of personal strength to tackle this, because he will try everything he can to make you and your questions go away. This thread can stay open for as long as you need it.

Big Bag of Chips

And one other thing... Find one friend to confide in. I was invaluable to my friend at the time. I could offer her no advice because I knew nothing about it... My advice would have been leave him But she was getting her advice from GamAnon.. What she got from me was an ear.

I listened. I let her cry. I let her get mad. I let her say all the things she thought that she couldn't say to him... Etc.

Please confide in 1 person.

pookie82

Big Bag of Chips wrote: »

And one other thing... Find one friend to confide in. I was invaluable to my friend at the time. I could offer her no advice because I knew nothing about it... My advice would have been leave him But she was getting her advice from GamAnon.. What she got from me was an ear.

I listened. I let her cry. I let her get mad. I let her say all the things she thought that she couldn't say to him... Etc.

Please confide in 1 person.

I would echo this but try, if you think it's possible, to "pick" someone who won't judge or force opinions onto you about what they think you should do. Do you have someone in mind who might just do like BBOC did... be an ear and a comfort?

I have lots of friends but some I just wouldn't go to about something so personal, because I know certain people would be pushy about leaving him/maybe even want to get involved.

Gauge who you tell carefully, try to choose someone who you know will be the support you need but not intrusively.

Big Bag of Chips

In my friend's case I am one of only 2 people who knew what was happening. He told one of his friends.

Their families don't even know the extent... I'm not even sure their families know about GA etc, I think they just knew he was giving up the bookies.

MissFlitworth

If I were you I'd hold my counsel for the moment while I set up support systems and got advice from Gamblers Anonymous on how to approach this and I would also go back to his laptop and gather more information.

What you've seen is what can be passed off as acceptable, fun gambling. He was very careful to show it to you, little games that he played that were no concern at all, only the odd tenner here and there. My concern would be is that there might be other gambling that he has hidden from you entirely that he couldn't as easily explain to you (one of my parents is an alcoholic and for years the other parent used to wonder how they got so drunk on the 3 or 4 pints that they insisted they had when they went out, little knowing that when they went to the bar they always went as far away as possible, so they couldn't be seen and got a double short that they necked before they came back. Addicts can be very, very careful to cover their trails and set themselves up with A Very Acceptable Story. It can make you feel like you are losing your mind, genuinely like you're mentally ill because your gut tells you one thing but all that you see and are told tells you another.), look through his history for more betting sites. Screenshot and save info that you find, because he is going to get very careful when you confront him. Prepare yourself for anger and lies and for accusations of you driving him to this, over exaggerating what he's doing & being a kill joy. None of it is true and it's something that quite possibly will be flung at you.

Definitely talk to a friend and also get yourself someone to talk to who will be entirely neutral, sometimes friends and family members can be so angry on your behalf that while they are amazing to talk to they don't always give you the best advice

Neyite

He will accuse you of all sorts, try to distract you with other hurtful things like maybe telling you horrible things he says his mother /friends/ siblings thinks about you. He'll try to list your faults and failings.

Remember this: Do not listen or believe to these kind of things. Not for a second. Ever see a chase in a movie where the person throws obstacles in the path of the baddie chasing them? That is what he will do, he will throw emotional obstacles in your way to try to slow you down finding out the truth.

Dont let yourself be sidetracked by these, however hurtful they are. He is an addict who will do and say lots of things to keep his addiction minimised and hidden. Like a drug or alcohol addict.

I really think that you should speak to Gamblers Anon a good bit first before you speak to him. Contact them today if you can.

Neyite

Matteroffact wrote: »

However, he points out a lot that "It's a pity I didn't apply for your job back then, imagine what I'd be on if that's what you're getting"

To me this just means that if he had gone down the route you took he would be getting similar money if not more and I don't see how this is a put down, in fact I think it is a compliment. He is acknowledging that you are on good money and saying that he could be on good money too had he done what you did.

This by the way is BS. He would never have the self-discipline, concentration or attention to detail to do my job. I find this comment particularly offensive as he has said it so often it's almost like the big shame in his life that he never applied to my company.


Do you not think that the above statement comes across as you thinking you are better than he is and you are accusing him of thinking he is better than you ?

"Not all of us earn over a hundred grand a year"

Why read things into this statement, would this not be a common jibe about people who earn less, a common joke as it were ?

Your interpretation on the couch thing is a bit petty I think. I feel he has a right to give his opinion on which couch to buy, just like you have. Asking him was he going to sit on 20% of it was way below the belt.

The worst part is, as much as we are in love. I know if something happened at work, if I got a paycut or lost my job; He would be delighted. This is very wrong.


This is a ridiculous thing to say, of course he would not want you to lose your job or get a paycut, that is just your negativity playing up. Sorry.

I just feel he is not the right man for you OP because you resent him because he is not earning as much as you are and you want to lord it over him, instead of sharing with him. Sorry but you asked for opinions and that is what I think, something different to what everyone else thinks here I guess.

I think you didnt read the full thread, there has been massive developments.

LegacyUser

^ no offence to your post, but I think the OP has a serious amount on her plate right now. Nit picking her first post is a waste of your time, bigger issues have to come to light now anyway.

Twas Not

Matteroffact wrote: »

However, he points out a lot that "It's a pity I didn't apply for your job back then, imagine what I'd be on if that's what you're getting"

To me this just means that if he had gone down the route you took he would be getting similar money if not more and I don't see how this is a put down, in fact I think it is a compliment. He is acknowledging that you are on good money and saying that he could be on good money too had he done what you did.

This by the way is BS. He would never have the self-discipline, concentration or attention to detail to do my job. I find this comment particularly offensive as he has said it so often it's almost like the big shame in his life that he never applied to my company.


Do you not think that the above statement comes across as you thinking you are better than he is and you are accusing him of thinking he is better than you ?

"Not all of us earn over a hundred grand a year"

Why read things into this statement, would this not be a common jibe about people who earn less, a common joke as it were ?

Your interpretation on the couch thing is a bit petty I think. I feel he has a right to give his opinion on which couch to buy, just like you have. Asking him was he going to sit on 20% of it was way below the belt.

The worst part is, as much as we are in love. I know if something happened at work, if I got a paycut or lost my job; He would be delighted. This is very wrong.


This is a ridiculous thing to say, of course he would not want you to lose your job or get a paycut, that is just your negativity playing up. Sorry.

I just feel he is not the right man for you OP because you resent him because he is not earning as much as you are and you want to lord it over him, instead of sharing with him. Sorry but you asked for opinions and that is what I think, something different to what everyone else thinks here I guess.

Sorry but above is nonsense.

Matteroffact

Neyite wrote: »

I think you didnt read the full thread, there has been massive developments.

You are right I didn't. Message now deleted, thanks.

Toots

OP my heart just sank reading your post today, I was really really hoping we'd be wrong about the gambling, but as rough as it is, it's much better that you've found out. Don't feel bad about looking at his laptop, this is one of the few cases where looking at a partner's laptop is warranted.

I agree that you need to confront him with what you've found, but not yet!

Firstly, speak to GamAnon and get some advice from them.

Secondly, take a day off work (an annual leave day but tell him you're sick, or actually take a sickie) and while he's gone, go through the house and find his bank statements. The reason I'm saying this is that he may be (probably is) using more than one gaming site. If you confront him about the account you found, he may come clean about it, but keep quiet about any other sites he's a member of. You need to find out as much as you can on your own, because you can be damn sure he won't tell you anything other than what you've already discovered. He'll swear up and down that that's all of it.

Thirdly, see your GP and ask them to recommend a good counsellor/therapist for you, who specialises in addiction. Most of all during this time you need to look after yourself, it's going to be unbelievably difficult and stressful. Your self esteem has already taken a pounding following your RTA and combine that with how he's been chipping away at you over the years, and the inevitable blame etc you'll be getting when this all comes out, you need to have a good support system in place. (and he will blame you, he will say horrible things to you, that's what addicts do when they get found out) As Big Bag of Chips said about telling one friend, you need to have somebody to talk to about all of this, but also I think you need someone to help with your self esteem and help you realise that you are a wonderful person. Have at least one session with a counsellor to prepare before you confront him and I'd book a session for the day after your planned confrontation because your head will be all over the place.

In the meantime, do what I said about cutting him off. Don't give him any more money. Buy in nice food for him to make lunches with, if he is able to take public transport then buy him a bus/rail ticket. DO NOT give him money for lunch or travel because he'll just spend it on gambling. Don't let on that you know anything yet, otherwise he'll go to even greater lengths to keep it from you. You could even bring a packed lunch to work yourself for a few days to lend to the pretense that you're trying to save super hard so you can have a house almost mortgage free before you get married. It's going to be very very very hard, but OP at least you know and that's important. Best of luck, I hope everything works out in whatever way is best for you.

Big Bag of Chips

One thing to keep in mind though is that none of this means he doesn't love you. He has been lying to you all this time because he DOES love you.

He started off in a small bit of bother, but didn't tell you because "he could sort it out", so no need to worry you... Then the problem got bigger, and so did the lies to cover it up, until "he could sort it out". He still probably thinks he has this under control and will be able to sort it out.

That is why he will continue to lie to you. He will not want to worry you with the extent of it, so will tell you a fraction of it, at first.

You need to break through that with him. That is why GamAnon would be invaluable to you.

In the meantime he will, as others have said, say horrible things to you. He might threaten to walk out. He will threaten to "expose" you to all his family etc... All to stop you digging further and finding out more. Because he will be ashamed, embarrassed and won't want to worry you with the extent of it all.

As I mentioned you will need a lot of personal inner strength to weather this storm. It's going to drain you, and him. But coming out the other side is entirely possible.

Twas Not

How much is involved ? Hundreds per month?

greenieted

Hi OP
sorry for the developments that have happened. If it were me I would get all the evidence you need from his laptop but don't use it unless you have to. Try all ways to get him to open up to you himself first but at least you will have the evidence to confront him with as a last resort. If you mention it to him too early he will change passwords, delete evidence etc.

Your idea of a meeting about finances sounds like a good starting point. If it doesn't go to plan suggest going to see a financial advisor-tell him you want to start saving towards the wedding or buying a house or something and you want advice on ways to tighten your budget. First thing advisor will do is get you each to list your expenses for the month.

Lastly do not feel bad that you didn't see this and do not feel that it is any reflection on how he feels towards you. Gambling is a horrific addiction-just as bad as alcohol or any other addiction. It gets a grip of a person and they just think one more bet and I'll be in the money but it never works out that way so the viscous cycle continues. My brother became addicted to poker machines in his late teens. My parents were oblivious for years. They were good parents, they loved him and he loved them but he got into a bad habit which turned into an addiction. My brother was a great brother and is a great man and great husband and father to his children now in his late thirties but at his lowest point he stole my Confirmation money to gamble with!! It completely takes a person over, consumes them and changes their personality.

Your fiance needs help-professional help and then you both probably need couples counselling. You are in for a long hard road and he will, as another poster said, do everything he can to deflect attention away from his problem. He will blame you and make you feel guilty. Let this wash over you, stick by him and but persist and don't give in. Hopefully he will thank you in the end and you will get back the man you fell in love with but it will be long and it will be hard. Good luck !

Tigger99

I'd be worried about what happens when you stop subsidising him. Does he have access to your Internet banking or know your pin codes for cards etc? He's an addict
When you cut him off will he get access to your money in more sneaky ways, like stealing?

Tokyo

Can I remind posters that requesting PM's from the OP is forbidden, as per the reasons laid out in the forum charter.

Regards,
Mike

ivytwine

anysolutionsunreg wrote: »

I fully intended on bowing out of this thread yesterday however on reflection a lot of posters have been exceptionally helpful and I am utterly grateful for their contributions which have alerted me to things which I can only deal with at my own pace.

I really am disheartened by the contributions dismissing my efforts to come to terms with this in a very short-space of time whilst I am openly having small discussions and trying to investigate these things whilst also dealing with my own emotional overload etc. I am trying to make good choices here so please, I would ask kindly for posters to appreciate this.

Last night I stayed up to watch the end of a movie after he had gone to bed and I (for the first time in my life) decided to open his laptop. His gaming account was logged in and open and I found myself looking at his profile and transaction history. There are no words to describe how horrible and malicious I felt checking up on him and honestly, I'm even more distraught by what I found. I am ashamed and embarrassed for being so oblivious but yes, there's a lot more money moving around the betting account than I have been led to believe....in fact, about twice what I would have even considered to be a problem.

I went to bed and didn't even want to touch him, I feel sad for him if he has this problem but also, I feel quite numb.

Any advice or opinions on how I should tackle this will be greatly recieved. I have not yet said this too him, I'd rather he didn't know I went on to his laptop so if there's a way I could coax it out of him it would be better. I'd rather help him than lose him but at the same time, today, I'm not even sure who he is. Sorry if this sounds very dramatic it's just not the outcome I expected. If anything on some level I was hoping looking at his account would set my mind at ease.

Again I have not read all the replies, so if it's been mentioned previously apologies.

In my job, we can't discuss accounts with third parties for obvious reasons. However we do have procedures in place if a person contacts worried about a loved one.

Please contact GamAnon, or ring his betting company for advice. It would depend on who you get (like all call centres) but my own company in fairness takes it extremely seriously.

If you talk to him and he admits it's a problem, it literally takes us under 5 mins to shut his account permanently. So don't be afraid to come to a betting company about this. I always note the tone of relief on the phone whenever a customer shuts down the account. It could be one of the most liberating things he'll ever do.

And from the other side of the equation, I really am sorry you and your partner are going through this x

rainbowtrout

anysolutionsunreg wrote: »

My plan - for now, unless I'm advised against by a professional is to have a formal finance meeting tonight and I will take out my bank statements and will ask him to do the same. My efforts will be with a plan to make sure he makes it to the end of the month - this will be in response to his refusal re the joint account suggested on Tuesday.

When he refuses to produce his statements, which I assume he will, I will ask him to log in to online banking. No doubt he'll have forgotten his password. I'll ask him to phone his bank and reset his online banking. I believe this is a 24 hour service although he may need to wait until after the weekend. I hope not, I don't think I can keep this in all weekend. I know I wont be my usual self.

I would like to help him through this but I don't know what's ahead. Is it possible he's not addicted? He plays every night I think, even on holiday he's played on his phone. I know, I am so stupid to believe it was just €10 a week but I was equating it to a play station and thought I was lucky he wasn't forcing me to watch football...

Help

From what you've said OP, I very much doubt that he's not addicted. I know that you would like that to be the case, but if you look at the amount of money he is spending on it, and how cagey is he being about where his money goes, and the fact that he told you that the games that don't involve gambling aren't as much fun, I would say that he is addicted.

If he's playing every night and on holiday then it is a problem. And remember that's only what you can see. If he was playing it on his phone on holiday he could easily be playing on his phone while he's at work/not with you.

Don't beat yourself up about it, lots of people hide their addictions, and don't want to face to up to reality. This isn't something you could have stopped and it's something you were unlikely to notice until you gave proper attention to your finances which is why you came on here in the first place.

You are probably right, he will want to avoid you seeing his bank statements etc. He might give you a little more information to get you to back off, and he might throw out a few more nasty digs at you. Remember you are not at fault here. Just keep gathering information in whatever way you can until you can get professional advice.

Do not go ahead with the joint bank account for savings/bills, it will be wiped out by him in no time.

LegacyUser

So, just to give an update as it's been a pretty horrendous weekend. I attempted to broach the issue of finances on Friday evening. We'd opted to both stay in as we haven't in a while. I spoke to an old work colleague in confidence who had a similar issue with her partner a few years back and she has been incredibly supportive. We are not that close these days which has helped me to be completely honest in a not worried about being judged kind if way.

So, as per her advice I approached this in a very (non-typical) and assertive way. I produced as many bank statements as I could and highlighted all the non-essential transactions -coffees, clothes, cinema etc. I calculated all the money I had spent that I didn't need too and when I had finished I pointed out to him that I found it really exciting thinking about how easy it would be to save. I said "I've set myself a target, but it's based on you getting through the month ok, so you probably need to do this more than me!!" I asked him to grab his statements and he said he doesn't keep them. I said I was learning a lot about where I'm spending my money and I should be able to get away with spending way less and pointed out that I think it would be great for us to pinpoint where he's falling down. I said "log in online there and we can go through it.

He went to the loo and while he was at it I believe now that he disconnected the wifi box.... Although I didn't cop this at first. So, he couldn't get online with his laptop and the 3G is terrible where we live. I was frustrated by now. So I told him to make a list and instead of just doing this he made jokes about how I was obsessed with money. I said once, very firmly, that I want to help him, it's not fair on either if us that his budgeting makes it impossible to plan or save or do anything.

I then had to listen to ten minutes about how I am selfish and all I care about is money. In these situations I generally apologise to make it stop. I promised myself not to do that and just said that I wasn't the one with the problem, he is. Then I very impulsively said that I was going out for an hour and when I got back I wanted a list of where his 2600 goes by the middle of the month or I'd be asking some questions and I walked out and literally drove around feeling totally numb for 90 minutes. It worried me that I wasn't upset but I texted my old work colleague who reassured me that I had done the right thing.

When I got back he wasn't there, no notes, no explanation, nothing. He got home at 5am, which would not be typical for him at all and he tried to talk to me but I just ignored him. I didn't want to communicate at that point. I got up at 7, left at 8 and spent the day basically by myself googling gambling stuff on my phone. He didn't try to call or even text. Last night he said he didn't want to fight with me but told me that I'm not his mother and have no right to dictate to him how to spend his money. I said "it's my money too".

He then said he was upset with me for trying to pick fights and I said I want to fix the situation. He said our wages are disproportionate right now and he's doing his best and that I put pressure in him to keep up with me. Neither one if us appears to be able to come up with one example of this.

So. I just said I was going to stay with my parents for a few days and that I have a fair idea of what's been going on, when he's ready to talk I'll be ready to listen and no matter what's going on I will understand as long as he us willing to try rectify things. He said I am ridiculous and a drama queen and if I left that word be the end if everything and after all we've been through etc. I just said I needed him to be honest with me. I can't believe I stayed so calm and I had no emotion at all. I knew he was lying to my face and in that moment I hated him.

I packed a few things and he watched. Said nothing only vicious mumbles under his breath that I wouldn't repeat. I told my parents and they have been great but I feel like I have betrayed our relationship by telling them in a way, I just needed to talk about it.

I've heard nothing from him but he's been very active on Facebook with his friends today, seemed to be having a grand old time while I'm here, in my parents house trying to work out what the hell is going on.

He doesn't seem upset that I am gone but he wouldn't be the most emotional person at the best of times. I'll need to return tomorrow as all my work clothes are at the apartment. I'm a bit lost, very confused, and I've no idea what to do next.