So what do ye know about Islam?

King Mob

///3power wrote: »

dude, anything that starts with wiki is not to be trusted! internet rule 101.

If you want to talk about research. Research who has bought up all main stream media including the rights to edit wiki sites, for their own agenda. They give you 90% ordinary truth and then mix in their lies.

So you're saying that there is nothing in the Quran that is scientifically inaccurate and all of those on the wiki are made up?

And can you provide an example of a scientific truth in the Quran that predates the actual scientific discovery?

And can you explain why you used a false example?

TwoShedsJackson

///3power wrote: »

Anyway, sorry i made a mistake. It takes 46 chromosomes to make a baby. 23 from each sex. Each sex is mentioned 23 times in Qur'an. I guess that's a total of 46 coincidences then.... -_-

No, that's one coincidence.

dude, anything that starts with wiki is not to be trusted! internet rule 101.

Meanwhile, anything written down in a 1400 year old book is to be trusted?

Standman

///3power wrote: »

... Do some online searches of miracles in the Qur'an to find out more. ...

I did some online searches for "examples of confirmation bias" yesterday and had my fill thank you very much!

kylith

///3power wrote: »

Is this a trick question? I say yes, you say "i want (insert depraved, evil and immoral act here).

When you obey what the scriptures say, you inevitably become "purer". Your desires and intentions change.

So when you say that following the Quran makes you purer, does that include the hundred-and-odd verses about killing and maiming infidels? Does following them make you purer? How about the bits about marrying pre-pubescent girls?

Following scripture makes you 'pure' in the eyes of that scripture only; if you follow what god says then you are good in the eyes of god. The problem comes when what god says is morally reprehensible.

Dave!

kylith wrote: »

So when you say that following the Quran makes you purer, does that include the hundred-and-odd verses about killing and maiming infidels? Does following them make you purer? How about the bits about marrying pre-pubescent girls?

Following scripture makes you 'pure' in the eyes of that scripture only; if you follow what god says then you are good in the eyes of god. The problem comes when what god says is morally reprehensible.

Yeah but anything that god says by definition cannot be immoral, so y'see, you've got no problem.

Mark Hamill

///3power wrote: »

All creation serves and praises God. It's the only reason He created it! As for why He wants us to serve Him, i don't know. Like, i know we're here to serve, but as for the ultimate reason - i have my own personal theories but that's all they are.

Who said anything about metaphors? The Qur'an speaks directly. It doesn't shy away from sensitive subjects or talk cryptically. It's very easy to read and understand. It's straight forward and plain. The more you look into it though, the more meaning you can find. The One who has complete knowledge inspired it. So therefore a brilliant mind could read a verse ("ayat", meaning sign) and see the ordinary meaning that a 5 year old could interpret, and also see a deeper meaning for example by the ways the words are arranged or by the number of the words etc.

But what possible purpose could our servitude and praise serve god? He has no needs, so our servitude is useless, and presumably as a perfect being he has no insecurity, so our (massively ignorant) praise falls on deaf ears.

If the quran was forward and plain then it would easily translatable (it's not, I've heard in many places that it pretty much has to be read in its original language to get the true meaning from it) and what meaning it has would not change the more you read into, it would singular and self-evident. That muslim countries themselves range from the extremes of hardline "sentence a woman to death for marrying a non-muslim" fundamentalists to semi-liberal proves that the quran is a horrible mess of allegory and ambiguity.

///3power

Hoagy wrote: »

Not according to this clever little tool.

Lies, damned lies and statistics?

Nice tool, but i'm not talking about comparing words between the different scriptures. I mean everyone is well aware that the Bible has been altered/corrupted. That's (part of) why the last revelation came; to rectify the man made mistakes in the previous ones. Along with a promise by God to preserve the final revelation, a promise that has been true as we can see the Qur'an has never been changed. There's no more revelations to come. If you can't step back and see the state of the world today, and if you don't have that gut feeling that something is very wrong and that something big is about to happen, then i'm sorry for you..

The revelations are one set of proofs. The future prophesies that have come true are another. People choose not to believe before they even do any real research. Why sell yourself short? If you're going to make a big decision not to believe, at the very least do your homework. Do yourself the biggest favour you could ever do. This life is but a short fleeting thing. Look into the true religions of God, the ONE God religions. Why disregard all religion just because Catholicism has left your belief in God waning. Get a much more complete picture by learning about Judaism and Islam. Just because you have no affiliation with those religions, doesn't mean you can't learn about them.

The majority (i'm talking scores) of prophesies made by the last prophet, about what the world will witness before the "hour", have come true.

Israel announced last week they're going to be the first country to make cash illegal.

A one world rule is around the corner. Don't be naive, WWIII has already started. When things become violent, we will witness complete collapse of the ponzi scheme that are the fiat currencies of euros and dollars. Things are going to be as bad as they can be! The majority of people will cry out for an ("anti")saviour. That's why you need to exercise your spiritual muscles now, while you have the chance.

It's very real and it's happening right before our very eyes. Call me names all you want or say i'm a conspiracy theorist (even though all these plausible conspiracies are turning out to be true), i'm just trying to help. If i have to sacrifice my dignity and open myself up to ridicule on this site then so be it.

wretcheddomain wrote: »

The Q'uran is probably the most unscientific book one could find. In science, you develop a theory only after finding evidence to prove that theory. You're suggesting that we should start with the theory and work backwards to find the evidence to prove it. And the Earth isn't round, it's an oblate spheroid...but leaving that to one side. So as well as violating a fundamental scientific principle, what else can we find that's unscientific.

Well, you mentioned that all life comes from water. A chap called Thales of Miletus first came to this conclusion around 500BC so it certainly wasn't a novel idea. In fact, let's back that up with the Q'uran, why not?

"Have not those who disbelieve known that the heavens and the earth were of one piece, then We parted them, and we made every living thing of water? Will they not then believe?”

You claimed above that nothing contradicts modern science, well, you've obviously overlooked this. We know from cosmology that the heavens and the Earth were not one piece and parted but rather the Earth was formed violently from the excrement of a nebula. Very different account I'm sure you'll agree - one is filled with theology and faith while the other is filled with reality and evidence.

Let's take a look at 71:15, "See ye not how Allah has created the seven heavens, one above another" - He is stating this with no evidence, therefore unscientific, therefore dismiss-able.

Probably the most interesting attack against science in Islam comes from the shooting star argument, a concise summary of this argument can be found here.

You have no legs to stand on - the Q'uran is wholly unscientific and the retrospective nature of the endeavour is something to be suspicious of and not proud of.

1. I never said the Qur'an was a scientific journal. It's a guide book. It doesn't claim to be scientific, so therefore it doesn't need to have a scientific format or give the reader a theory, introduction, lab report, conclusion, etc.

2. It doesn't matter when the first theory of life originating from water was hypothesised, it only matters that it is found in the Qur'an. There was probably thousands of theories. Yet only one is in Qur'an.

3. We don't "know" where the earth came from. That's why it's called the big bang theory. Having said that God does tell us the universe is expanding, as has been proven only within the past decade. So, it would be logical to conclude it originated from a point source. How you can conclude that the idea of that interferes with the heavens is beyond me, as we don't know where the heavens are.

4. Dismissing something because there is no proof offered is foolish. If everyone had that mindset we'd still be in the dark ages.. As i said, the Qur'an is not a science book. If God doesn't want to give us evidence of seven heavens, that's entirely up to Him. There is so much other evidence. How much more do you want?

5. Satanic anti-Islamic sites are a dime a dozen... The fact that there is soooo much guidance and truth found in the teachings, is all the more reason to put so much effort into keeping people away from it, by any means possible... If you want to make money writing a book. Write an anti-Islam book and you're guaranteed publication. Also, research who has taken over all the major publishing companies. The same people who are controlling what your kids learn in school with books titled things like: "Lucy and her two mommies" or "Daddy's new roommate Tom" (not the actual titles, but similar). There is an agenda working behind the scenes to corrupt you. It's all part of their world domination/degradation plan. Look at which minister resigned lately and what he promoted; gay marriage, abortion and he was the main driving force behind the abolition of the Seanad, in an effort to make unjust laws get passed more easily. His loyalty was not to Ireland. These same people have their talons in most every government, in all aspects of society. They own Hollywood and are directly responsible for polluting your mind with filth. They own the music industry, and the charming lyrics we're forced to listen to. Singers with target audiences of 6 and 7 year old girls, sing about things such as "going all the way with boys" etc. Take a step back, look, listen. Read the lyrics of your childrens favourite singers, you'd be shocked and disgusted.

The same people own all major financial institutions. They are responsible for every man made and preplanned "depression" or recession there ever was.

The same people own all the major food companies. 90% of the food in your presses (kellogs, heinz, hellmans, etc) are all owned by one company.

They own the pharmacuetical companies and the ceo's of these companies are in turn the same people who work for government agencies such as the FDA which approves these killer drugs.

It's illegal for a doctor to prescribe natural medicines!

The word cure is not allowed in cancer "research", even though there has been at least a half dozen proven different treatments which can cure. 160 billion dollars profit a year is too much to lose for a cure for us worthless "little people".

GMO food and monsanto are owned and controlled by them. The food is toxic and causes tumours, yet they keep pushing and pushing to get it into every country. We don't need it so why are they pushing it, when it's so dangerous?

All the major media outlets that used to be owned by scores of individual companies, are now owned by 6 corporate giants. The ceo of each one is a zionist!

All the chairmen of the PRIVATELY OWNED federal reserve in America (the non government agency that prints, owns and controls the US dollar with no permission for any government body to investiage or audit them. It's called the FED but there's nothing federal about it). All the chairmen and women are zionists.

The company the provides all news agencies around the world with their headlines is called Reuters, a very much zionist affiliated company with it's biggest client none other than the Rothschilds family.

A little history lesson they wont teach you in school: When Britain and France were about to engage in the battle of Waterloo. Britain was at the time the worlds superpower. They were expected to destroy their opponent easily. The Rothschilds (the richest family in the world, trillions with a T, who pretty much own Israel and are zionists) they made a gamble/investment and bought thousands of British bonds. Expecting Britain to win, and for the bonds to increase in value. Britain was beaten in the battle within days. News back in those days travelled very slow. So Rothschilds sent word on horseback that Britain had in fact won (using Reuters company). Word reached Britain and the people were jubilant. The value of the bonds went up and Rothschild quickly sold all his bonds to unsuspecting common fools like me and you. The truth about the battle then reached Britain. The bonds plummeted in value. Britain went into a recession and everyone who bought bonds lost their money, meanwhile the Rothschilds sipped martinis on a ship made of human bones and suffering!

They have an agenda, a plan to make all us gentiles subservient to them. Their plan is outlined in a document called the "the protocols of the elders of zion", they claim it's a forgery, yet everything in it is or has come true in the world today. The world is the evidence to Mr.science boy above.

I've researched all this stuff for the past 3 or 4 years before i became religious.

Religion all ties back in to everything that's happening today. The zionists "cup of iniquity is (nearly) full".

They are ruling every aspect of society and you don't even know.

They are the ones behind this mass-immigration. They want to mix all the races, so that we lose our cultures. They are the ones pushing for all these unions so we are no longer soveirgn states and easily controlled.

They founded the tri-lateral commission, a group of the most powerful and wealthiest people from all over the world. With members like the very righteous Denis O'Brien, who owns most of Irelands radio stations, calling the shots on what the radios broadcast.

There's too much info to go over, but know that it's all connected and know that God has given these prophecies to His chosen prophets so that we may be guided. It's inevitable that some will be consumed by greed and they in turn will control the world. Awareness is half the battle.





I've said to much

Gordon wrote: »

No, I'm asking you personally, so is that a yes? Do you actually receive everything that you want?

I believe so, but i can't say for sure Gordon as i'm still alive. There is scripture that says if you sell the hereafter for this life, you'll get neither. If you don't, you'll get both. There's also scripture that says no one gets everything they want in this life, as doing so would negate the need for an afterlife. Plenty of scripture says in the afterlife you'll get anything and everything you want. There's already a mansion built for you there, if you only accept it. The greatest gift we'll get is actually seeing our Creator.

wretcheddomain wrote: »

Alright, you got me here. Let's distrust WiKi because anybody can edit it to fix their agenda but let's trust Mohammad who heard voices in his head and had no reason to forward an agenda through editing his thoughts.

Logical consistency right there. :rolleyes:

What was his agenda? People love to say religion is just a means to control, it's a cult, and that might be so when you have an organisation like the church profiting. In Islam there is no hierarchy! No one profits. No one is in control. You either follow or you don't. I was a Muslim for months before anyone even knew. No one benefited except me.

Anyone can edit wiki, but the top mods are paid zionists as was leaked about 4 months ago. They have the power to lock pages, and forward their own agenda. Do you really believe that wikipedia always being the first google result is just another "coincidence"? Open your eyes. See the truth. I've read all kinds of rubbish on wikipedia when it comes to Islam or zionism or anything that conflicts with their plan. Look up any alternative medicines on wikipedia and all you'll get is "ohh no, don't try that medicine its a scam. Here, have these pharmacueticals".

King Mob wrote: »

So you're saying that there is nothing in the Quran that is scientifically inaccurate and all of those on the wiki are made up?

And can you provide an example of a scientific truth in the Quran that predates the actual scientific discovery?

And can you explain why you used a false example?

Sorry for using a false example, my explanation is that i wanted to show that people who spoke the truth or challenged traditional beliefs throughout history have always been persecuted.

I didn't look at the wiki site. I have absolute trust and belief that every single letter in the Qur'an is the absolute unmolested and beautiful truth, that confirms the Bible and the Torah before it.

As for examples, i've already listed a few. You know the Qur'an is only 70,000 words. You could read it easily if you wanted.

Mark Hamill

///3power wrote: »

Anyway, sorry i made a mistake. It takes 46 chromosomes to make a baby. 23 from each sex. Each sex is mentioned 23 times in Qur'an. I guess that's a total of 46 coincidences then.... -_-

That would 2 coincidences, at best. If it were true. This word counting website gives 483 for man and 16 for woman .

Tell me, when you picked up these so called miracles off some blog post somewhere, did you actually check any of them?

Mark Hamill

///3power wrote: »

Or the word day appearing 365 times, or the word days (plural) appearing 30 times.

There are 354 or 355 days in the islamic year. Why would the quran contain the same number of "days" as the christian calender? (not that it does). Also neither the islamic nor the christian years contain 12 months all with 30 days each.

Dave!

///3power wrote: »

[mad ravings]

Mother of god... Anti-Semitism, anti-GMO, pro-quack medicine, Illuminati... This post has it all!

Everything except homeopathy, and chemtrails. Go on, put me out of my misery – what do you make of those?

Gordon

///3power wrote: »

I believe so, but i can't say for sure Gordon as i'm still alive. There is scripture that says if you sell the hereafter for this life, you'll get neither. If you don't, you'll get both. There's also scripture that says no one gets everything they want in this life, as doing so would negate the need for an afterlife. Plenty of scripture says in the afterlife you'll get anything and everything you want. There's already a mansion built for you there, if you only accept it. The greatest gift we'll get is actually seeing our Creator.

Ah right ok, so you don't get everything that you want then. So when you said this:

///3power wrote: »

if you knew with absolute and undeniable proof that you were created by a personal God. He owned you, and your life and destiny were in His hands. He promised you all that you could ever want, so long as you served Him.

You were only referring to after you die, after you've served your god.

Hope springs.. eternal..

Nodin

///3power wrote: »

............

Nodin, there's literally too much proof to even recall and write. Do some online searches of miracles in the Qur'an to find out more. I'm not talking hocus pocus "if you add that number, and then divide it by 666 and then bla bla bla". I'm talking solid evidence.

Feck it i might aswel give a few examples, even though my coffee machine is now overheating.

For a start, every piece of scientific info found in the Qur'an that can be verified IS verified. Such as universe expansion. All life originating from water. The solar system and the paths of the planets. Fingerprints being unique to everyone. Microscopic stages of human development in the womb. and on and on and on.

80% of scientific knowledge in Qur'an has been confirmed. Scientific methods can't confirm or debunk the remaining 20% yet.

Then there's the mathematical miracles. Which honestly will blow your mind considering the prophet who used to go into trances and convulsions while revealing this revelation, was an illiterate orphan.

In English the biggest anagrams we have are like "level" and "racecar". In the Qur'an, there's full verses that are anagram. The poetic verses in the Qur'an are regarded by all as something that has never been surpassed in terms of eloquence.

Every single letter is accounted for. The Qur'an is perfectly preserved and unchanged since it was revealed 1400 years ago. When people uploaded the Qur'an into computers what they discovered was mind bobbling. The book is alive with all manners of signs and miracles. Such as the word man appearing 23 times and the word woman appearing 23 times, and the fact that it takes 23 chromosomes to create a human. Or the word day appearing 365 times, or the word days (plural) appearing 30 times. Or the word moon appearing 12 times.
Or if you count how many times the word sea appears, and divide it into how many times the word land appears, you get the exact same ratio of land is to sea on earth.

I could honestly go on and on because there's so many signs and proofs. If you want to achieve contentment in this life and develop a relationship with your Creator, it is so much easier when you have so many reassuring signs.

So you've none then. Ah well.

///3power

Mark Hamill wrote: »

But what possible purpose could our servitude and praise serve god? He has no needs, so our servitude is useless, and presumably as a perfect being he has no insecurity, so our (massively ignorant) praise falls on deaf ears.

If the quran was forward and plain then it would easily translatable (it's not, I've heard in many places that it pretty much has to be read in its original language to get the true meaning from it) and what meaning it has would not change the more you read into, it would singular and self-evident. That muslim countries themselves range from the extremes of hardline "sentence a woman to death for marrying a non-muslim" fundamentalists to semi-liberal proves that the quran is a horrible mess of allegory and ambiguity.

True, He has no needs. So i really don't know what purpose our praise has, but we're here now, when once we were nothing and we didn't create ourselves. So it's most logical to believe.

You can't listen to the radio and watch tv at the same time. Yet God tells us He hears and see's all! So there is no reason for anything God says in the Qur'an to have a singular meaning. I believe every word could potentially have infinite meanings because He is the infinite. There's so many more secrets yet to be discovered in the revelation, every day new discoveries are made.

When i say a deeper thinker could derive more meaning, that doesn't mean the initial straight forward meaning is changed. No way, the straight forward meaning is the most important. But those who ponder over the revelation, can find deeper more detailed meanings. It's hard to explain. But there's volumes of books (tafsir) on it.

What laws a society imposes on its people in the name of God, are not always synonymous with Gods commands. Muslim woman are prohibited from marrying non Muslims it's true, but the death penalty for it is nowhere to be found in the authentic teachings. Likewise Muslim men are prohibited from marrying non believing women, yet they do, and they live! Surprise surprise...

kylith wrote: »

So when you say that following the Quran makes you purer, does that include the hundred-and-odd verses about killing and maiming infidels? Does following them make you purer? How about the bits about marrying pre-pubescent girls?

Following scripture makes you 'pure' in the eyes of that scripture only; if you follow what god says then you are good in the eyes of god. The problem comes when what god says is morally reprehensible.

This my brothers and sisters is a typical example of the brainwashing and lies people are fed through mass media. Everything taken out of context and outright lies. Show me the verses you talk about if it is the truth. Quran(dot)com.

Mark Hamill wrote: »

That would 2 coincidences, at best. If it were true. This word counting website gives 483 for man and 16 for woman.

Tell me, when you picked up these so called miracles off some blog post somewhere, did you actually check any of them?

As was stated above you can't translate Arabic to English, you can only interpret. The singular words for man and woman appear 23 times each. Men, mankind, etc are not included.

Mark Hamill wrote: »

There are 354 or 355 days in the islamic year. Why would the quran contain the same number of "days" as the christian calender? not that it does. Also neither the islamic nor the christian years contain 12 months all with 30 days each.

Regardless of calenders, it takes 365 days for the earth to complete one full rotation of the sun. Which is another proof because if the book was manmade, they would have used there own number of days in a calender year. Yet the book didn't. Glory be to god.

Again regardless of days in a month or calenders, it takes the moon 30 days to complete it's cycle. The Qur'an is talking facts, not manmade calenders.

Dave! wrote: »

Mother of god... Anti-Semitism, anti-GMO, pro-quack medicine, Illuminati... This post has it all!

Everything except homeopathy, and chemtrails. Go on, put me out of my misery – what do you make of those?

LOL how can i be anti-semitic when i'm part semitic? Answer me that...

and saying my post was "ravings of a madman" is a complement to me, as i want to be like the prophets in every sense and the people in their lifetimes said the same about them So thanks

Take from it what you will. In time you will know the truth, whether you like it or not. Hopefully sooner rather than later, for your own sake.

Also i said nothing about illuminati. If you want to know a little history about secret societies see my post in the magic/paranormal section. Something tells me though that you're not interested in truth.

Lastly Jews and Christians are my extended family. Don't confuse zionism with Judaism. They've hijacked the Jewish name, and there are many righteous Jews speaking out against them, and getting killed for it....

ShooterSF

///3power wrote: »

Nice tool, but i'm not talking about comparing words between the different scriptures. I mean everyone is well aware that the Bible has been altered/corrupted. That's (part of) why the last revelation came; to rectify the man made mistakes in the previous ones. Along with a promise by God to preserve the final revelation, a promise that has been true as we can see the Qur'an has never been changed.

Brilliant. All knowing deity doesn't foresee man, as publisher, changing his first two books so he needs to write a tell all story to fix it. Genius.

Zamboni

Love this guy!

Nodin

Zamboni wrote: »

Love this guy!

It gets old after a while .

legspin

Zamboni wrote: »

Love this guy!

Just watched this week's 'Mock the Week' and one of the topics on 'scenes we'd like to see' was 'Unlikely Film Trailers'. Milton Jones went off a similar theme.

From the makers of 'Dead_One'...

Appearing in an A+A thread near you....

'Dead_Two'

This time it's proper Gobbledegook

Mark Hamill

///3power wrote: »

True, He has no needs.
<snipped for brevity>
Likewise Muslim men are prohibited from marrying non believing women, yet they do, and they live! Surprise surprise...

This is just nonsense. Going from believing in god in a general sense to praising and serving him is a non-sequitor. So god exists, but his act of creation took absolutely no effort and was entirely ambiguous - there is nothing to praise, from his point of view, so he shouldn't need us to praise and serve him. That he does is a contradiction.

If god understood humans he would have known not to put important information hidden in allegory and verse, obscured by different levels of meaning. Humans figured that out ourselves, its why we don't write scientific documents like that. That there are violent oppressive regimes that can hold up quranic verses as validation, using the same deeper meaning argument as you, just proves that the quran is not simple and clear.

///3power wrote: »

As was stated above you can't translate Arabic to English, you can only interpret. The singular words for man and woman appear 23 times each. Men, mankind, etc are not included.

More proof that the quran is not simple and clear. And according to the site I linked before, there are 46 exact matches for "man" and 16 for "woman". Did you not check that before trying to correct me? Did you check your own claim? Do you have a list of those supposed 23 verses that contain "man" and 23 that contain "woman"?

///3power wrote: »

Regardless of calenders, it takes 365 days for the earth to complete one full rotation of the sun. Which is another proof because if the book was manmade, they would have used there own number of days in a calender year. Yet the book didn't. Glory be to god.

Again regardless of days in a month or calenders, it takes the moon 30 days to complete it's cycle. The Qur'an is talking facts, not manmade calenders.

The Julian calender (46BC) uses 365 days for a year, so the quran is about 600 years late to that party.
Also a moons cycle takes 29.5 days.

PopePalpatine

Nodin wrote: »

It gets old after a while .

See: J C, Jerry Falwell etc.

Is it a coincidence that my phone's auto-correct tried to turn "Falwell" into "falsely"?

lazygal

I feel like this thread is making me forget the stuff I did know about Islam.

shruikan2553

lazygal wrote: »

I feel like this thread is making me forget the stuff I did know about Islam.

Did you know the quran has the words half* and life in them? That means they confirmed Half Life 3.

*Note: The word half may not have been in the book.

wretcheddomain

shruikan2553 wrote: »

Did you know the quran has the words half* and life in them? That means they confirmed Half Life 3.

*Note: The word half may not have been in the book.

Did you know the Q'uran has exactly 666 references to the word 'Pork' highlighting how only the devil can consume such a substance. Wicked eh?

On a side note, McDonald's is mentioned as Abu Abdonaldah and how when it does become available that Muslims must only eat at the Halal variants.

It really does cover everything in life. So proud is Allah of his creation that he requires our dick's to be slashed to perfect the human body in a way that no omnipotent biological engineer could possibly do.

King Mob

///3power wrote: »

Sorry for using a false example, my explanation is that i wanted to show that people who spoke the truth or challenged traditional beliefs throughout history have always been persecuted.

Nope, that's a lie. You were asked to supply an example of something that the Quran knew before science. You provided that as if no one at the time knew the Earth was round, but the Quran did.
This was false.
Why did you claim this in the first place?

Furthermore, you are now insisting that people were persecuted for saying the Earth was round. This is not true.
People were persecuted for saying the Earth orbited the Sun.

The Quran says the Sun orbits the Earth.

///3power wrote: »

I didn't look at the wiki site.

So you haven't looked at the site, but you're confident that they are all lies?

///3power wrote: »

I have absolute trust and belief that every single letter in the Qur'an is the absolute unmolested and beautiful truth, that confirms the Bible and the Torah before it.

Well if you're including the Bible, then it's easy to point out scientific inaccuracies. For example: the Global Flood.
As for the Quran specifically:

27:61 Is not He (best) Who made the earth a fixed abode, and placed rivers in the folds thereof, and placed firm hills therein, and hath set a barrier between the two seas ? Is there any God beside Allah ? Nay, but most of them know not!
35:13 He maketh the night to pass into the day and He maketh the day to pass into the night. He hath subdued the sun and moon to service. Each runneth unto an appointed term. Such is Allah, your Lord; His is the Sovereignty; and those unto whom ye pray instead of Him own not so much as the white spot on a date-stone.

36:38 And the sun runneth on unto a resting-place for him. That is the measuring of the Mighty, the Wise.

36:39 And for the moon We have appointed mansions till she return like an old shrivelled palm-leaf.

36:40 It is not for the sun to overtake the moon, nor doth the night outstrip the day. They float each in an orbit.

The Sun does not orbit an unmoving Earth.

///3power wrote: »

As for examples, i've already listed a few. You know the Qur'an is only 70,000 words. You could read it easily if you wanted.

You have not listed any except the one that you got completely wrong.

housetypeb

"3. We don't "know" where the earth came from. That's why it's called the big bang theory........"

That's my favourite line in the thread so far.

papu

housetypeb wrote: »

"3. We don't "know" where the earth came from. That's why it's called the big bang theory........"

That's my favourite line in the thread so far.

Lol... Like the theory of gravity
In science everything is a theory and everything has to be questioned ,if you are never doubtful or unsure you're doing it wrong ..

///3power

papu wrote: »

In science everything is a theory

So true you don't even know.

You can't prove any of this is real. Hypothetically this entire world as you perceive it could just be processes and programs in some advanced computer in the 'other' universe, with "you" being uploaded and updated every day by other worldly creatures who decide everything in this "world". Highly unlikely i know, but no one can prove or disprove it none the less. I think therefore i am, doesn't cut it.

With this fact in mind, it's only fair to ascertain that everything you know or think you know is based on a belief that you are and this is real.

So see, you atheists do have faith!



*will reply to previous posts tomorrow God willing.. Too many miracles and truths to recollect off the cuff, so i'll need time to compile my favourite examples.

papu

///3power wrote: »

So true you don't even know.

You can't prove any of this is real. Hypothetically this entire world as you perceive it could just be processes and programs in some advanced computer in the 'other' universe, with "you" being uploaded and updated every day by other worldly creatures who decide everything in this "world". Highly unlikely i know, but no one can prove or disprove it none the less. I think therefore i am, doesn't cut it.

With this fact in mind, it's only fair to ascertain that everything you know or think you know is based on a belief that you are and this is real.

So see, you atheists do have faith!



*will reply to previous posts tomorrow God willing.. Too many miracles and truths to recollect off the cuff, so i'll need time to compile my favourite examples.

Fact? What fact? You made a load of stuff up and said there was no way of proving you wrong. .. Or of you proving it right.. This is the most unscientific thing imaginable a theory in limbo , a theory created specifically so that can never be proven or disproven is utterly useless.

What difference would it make if everything around us was a simulation , or a holographic projection. science aims to understand the world around us , there is no belief that what is around us is real .. It is what it is , and it is proven by experimental evidence and observation . in science you doubt , in religion you believe without question .that is the difference .

Gordon

///3power wrote: »

Too many miracles and truths to recollect off the cuff, so i'll need time to compile my favourite examples.

I get that all the time. Recently someone asked me to tell them a word, so I recollected the dictionary I read previously and just realised that there were so many words in it, I couldn't remember one of them.

///3power

papu wrote: »

Fact? What fact? You made a load of stuff up and said there was no way of proving you wrong. .. Or of you proving it right.. This is the most unscientific thing imaginable a theory in limbo , a theory created specifically so that can never be proven or disproven is utterly useless.

What difference would it make if everything around us was a simulation , or a holographic projection. science aims to understand the world around us , there is no belief that what is around us is real .. It is what it is , and it is proven by experimental evidence and observation . in science you doubt , in religion you believe without question .that is the difference .

Step away from the science a minute okay. Not everything has to be about evidence. My statement was intended to be thought provoking, not scientific.

You seem to have missed the point. It's not about whether the world is just a simulation. It's about the FACT that you BELIEVE it's not a simulation.

Observing the world and experimenting with it does not prove it's real. There are many scientific anomalies and freak experiment results outside of the norm, that haven't or can't be explained. Like for example the speed of light changing (one of the most constant observable measurements scientists use in countless applications). The speed of light to physicists is like the foundation of everything, which is why many won't even acknowledge this newish discovery that the speed of light might have actually changed in the past!

Anyway, that's beside the point. The point is you simply can not prove the world is real. You can't, you just can't (that's a fact ). You can't prove it's real, therefore you are left with no alternative but to believe it's real. Hence all scientific observations and laws are based on faith. That wasn't so hard to understand now was it.



As for religion, maybe you were indoctrinated to "believe religion without question", but in Islam we are required/encouraged to ask questions, to ponder over creation. The more you learn about the Creation, the closer it brings you to the Creator.

Just as a general principle in life you shouldn't believe anything without questioning it, a little objective cynicism ensures you won't be lead astray by the blind. I believe the Qur'an is the verbatim word of God, but not before i finished reading it!

I'll give you a good one. You're familiar with the history of the cities of Sodom and Gomorah right? Well, you should be.. They were utterly destroyed by brimstone (sulfur) that allegedly rained down from the sky. In the Bible and Qur'an we're given specific directions to where those cities once stood. So scientists got to work and went to those locations to study them. Sure enough they found ruins and evidence of the cities within a layer of ash and sulphur, and yet no sulphur in the surrounding areas! Okay, that's odd you might think, but it proves nothing. Well that's not all. They took samples of the sulphur and when they examined them they were amazed by the findings. Not only was the sulphur completely unique, like none other found in the world. It was white, while regular sulphur is yellow and it was nearly 100% pure, which is highly unusual because natural sulphur, by it's very nature is an element mixed with all types of impurities in it's volcanic origin.

So to sum up; God tells us in many scriptures what happened, why it happened, who it happened to and where it happened. We then, the intellectuals we are, go and investigate and find that indeed everything God said was true! So you see not just "tales of the ancients" but verifiable facts.


On the off chance that you didn't know about those cities, let me tell you. Not many people will teach you these things anymore. As i said there is an agenda working behind the scenes. They don't want you to know anything that might increase your faith or bring you closer to God. It's up to every individual to seek the truth for his or herself. In this age of info/tech, it's made easy. It's at your finger tips. You think religion being removed from the school curriculum is just civilisation "progressing"? No no no, it's far more sinister and nefarious than that.




You need to learn about these things. Your life depends on it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I can't imagine how much regret people are going to feel some day.

Gordon wrote: »

I get that all the time. Recently someone asked me to tell them a word, so I recollected the dictionary I read previously and just realised that there were so many words in it, I couldn't remember one of them.

Lol.. hate when i forget a.. a...
ummm...
aaaaa...

a word.

phew.

No but honestly though, i'm not pulling a fast one. I just need time to refresh my mind about the dozens of spiritually fortifying discoveries i've encountered.

Dave!

///3power wrote: »

As for religion, maybe you were indoctrinated to "believe religion without question", but in Islam we are required/encouraged to ask questions, to ponder over creation. The more you learn about the Creation, the closer it brings you to the Creator.

What if your inquisitive skeptical mind (which is encouraged in Islam, as you say) results in you moving away from the Creator? Is that cool? No problems there, the Qur'an presumably has a verse somewhere that says "He who through genuine skeptical analysis comes to conclude that this is a load of superstitious fairytale nonsense—He shall be saved."