Malaysia Airlines flight MH370-Updates and Discussion

Spanish Eyes

Weathercheck wrote: »

Why is there so much hearsay and secrecy. Can the authorities not just join up and supply ALL information, all companies etc. all the information should be in the public domain.

The whole thing stinks IMO.

I'd like to think they are as much in the dark as everyone else.

But you can't help thinking in this day and age of constant surveillance, the fact that NOTHING was tracked or noticed (apart from some vaguely reported pings) is very strange really.

But on the other hand, I'd be very happy if they are negotiating with hijackers in the background and leaving us in the dark for the moment.

But the silence and obfuscation could also be for other...eh commercial reasons.

Baffling.

relaxed

sully2010 wrote: »

I really don't need to keep repeating myself as you seem to keep doing, I made my points a few posts ago with facts on how it "could" be the pilots. Please read them. A few subsequent posts also give a few pointers as to how it could be.

No need to repeat yourself, you think the pilots possibly did it because you find it strange a 53 year old would have a simulator in his house. We get that bit.

sopretty

relaxed wrote: »

I agree - the pilot having a simulator is irrelevant and is just a conspiracy theory.

Also his age being 53 is irrelevant and best left to lads that dream of conspiracy theories.

There is now some train of thought that somebody in the know took control of the flight and took it here or there, for unknown reasons, it may have been a pilot under his own initiative, it may have been a pilot with a gun to his head or it may have been a passenger who took control of the plane, or somebody else. We really don't know.

But, if it's some randomer with no knowledge of how to fly a plane, how could he know that it might be possible to fly completely undetected? To me, it seems clear, the turning off of comms etc. and flying under the radar equals seriously technical aviation knowledge!

Jack1985

You can't rule out the pilot on hunches or by looking at pictures of him.

Nor can you really speculate as to pilots going rogue or their motives when there is zero evidence of either, everything I have said has happened before, there's where I back my speculation.

Theresalwaysone

Jack1985 wrote: »

Rogue to do what? I can only speak from evidence I've read about the Captain, a family man, flying with MAS since '81, into fitness/sports and practising normal scheduled flights on days off using his sim. He comes across as a nice individual, well trained, well experienced - After 33 years of flying, the speculation of him allowing a suicide/rogue event to take a place is bull, in my own opinion.

The first officer had just transferred to the 777 after months of training, again he was young - in nearly all suicide events by pilots they are old, he was 27. And going by what I also read on him, had many friends - The pictures surfacing of him with those women in the flight deck shows the type of person he was welcoming amongst other things.

Explaining what happened from IGARI to VAMPI and then GIVAL is the key, a pilot isn't going to fly that sort of route unless, being threatened again in my opinion.

Blaming either pilot - easy answer when there are none.

lo. Very good. Lets try and bend the narrative a bit more...

Jack1985

Captain's Youtube channel - Take a look at the video's he liked and watched, gives you a great deal of insight into his character, rather then some of speculation on this.

https://www.youtube.com/user/catalinapby1

relaxed

sopretty wrote: »

But, if it's some randomer with no knowledge of how to fly a plane, how could he know that it might be possible to fly completely undetected? To me, it seems clear, the turning off of comms etc. and flying under the radar equals seriously technical aviation knowledge!

I said somebody in the know, so if somebody did take over the plane then they would be somebody with technical knowledge.

Happyman42

Jack1985 wrote: »

Nor can you really speculate as to pilots going rogue or their motives when there is zero evidence of either, everything I have said has happened before, there's where I back my speculation.

I can speculate all I want and it's up to you whether it is credible.
What you cannot do, is rule something out on a hunch, false info (young people don't commit suicide but old people do) and assume that ordinary happy people don't come up against circumstances that change how they would ordinarily behave. Your opinion that the co-pilot is 'welcoming' is rather missing the point too- that it is extremely unprofessional and a clear sign of somebody not committed to his job - the safe transit of fare paying passengers.

sopretty

relaxed wrote: »

I said somebody in the know, so if somebody did take over the plane then they would be somebody with technical knowledge.

And you think the authorities won't have checked out who has technical knowledge by now or not?

Jack1985

Happyman42 wrote: »

I can speculate all I want and it's up to you whether it is credible.
What you cannot do, is rule something out on a hunch, false info (young people don't commit suicide but old people do) and assume that ordinary happy people don't come up against circumstances that change how they would ordinarily behave. Your opinion that the co-pilot is 'welcoming' is rather missing the point too- that it is extremely unprofessional and a clear sign of somebody not committed to his job.

I never said that, this is why people are refraining from posting on this forum, I said the history has shown those who committed suicide were older, he was 27, I have not said older people commit suicide I have shown the statistic. Not committed to his job, where you can back that up is beyond me, how do you know he asked them into the flight deck? Who is to say the Captain did not on that particular flight, as the most pictures were with that Captain and in fact! the only pictures with him were on the ground.

theKillerBite

elmolesto wrote: »

The AF447 FDR and CVR were recovered from 4000m nearly 2 years after the crash.

Yes but they found wreckage within a couple of days and could work out pretty well where exactly the wreckage would be underwater.

sopretty

Jack1985 wrote: »

I never said that, this is why people are refraining from posting on this forum, I said the history has shown those who committed suicide were older, he was 27, I have not said older people commit suicide I have shown the statistic. Not committed to his job, where you can back that up is beyond me, how do you know he asked them into the flight deck? Who is to say the Captain did not on that particular flight, as the most pictures were with that Captain and in fact! the only pictures with him were on the ground.

Personally, I feel, that people are refraining from posting in this forum, as they don't know what is going on either, and are afraid of being ridiculed if they have an incorrect theory which is later proven to be incorrect.
If I was a doctor, and some inexplicable set of symptoms presented in a patient, I would be keeping my mouth shut too, rather than hazarding a guess!

I don't think 'experts' in the area are refraining from posting in this thread as they look down on us all (even when they're not mid-flight ), but rather because, THEY SIMPLY HAVE NO MORE OF A CLUE THAN THE REST OF US!

Happyman42

Jack1985 wrote: »

I never said that, this is why people are refraining from posting on this forum, I said the history has shown those who committed suicide were older, he was 27, I have not said older people commit suicide I have shown the statistic. Not committed to his job, where you can back that up is beyond me, how do you know he asked them into the flight deck? Who is to say the Captain did not on that particular flight, as the most pictures were with that Captain and in fact! the only pictures with him were on the ground.

I was referring to what you said about suicides among pilots, not generally.
You are supposing that because it never happened before that it can't happen.

As regards the photo's, I don't know who invited them or allowed them, the fact that they where lax about it is enough to show me that they didn't take the core part of their job - the safe transit of passengers - seriously or seriously enough.

That allows me to 'speculate'.

wretcheddomain

sopretty wrote: »

Personally, I feel, that people are refraining from posting in this forum, as they don't know what is going on either, and are afraid of being ridiculed if they have an incorrect theory which is later proven to be incorrect.

THEY SIMPLY HAVE NO MORE OF A CLUE THAN THE REST OF US!

I don't think this is true at all.

We may not know the exact cause of what happened but this does not mean we can't rule certain hypothesis out.

The information that we've gathered so far allows us to rule out particular hypothesis and hence get closer to the truth of exactly what happened.

So no, it's not that we have no idea, we've a much better idea of what happened in the sense of we know what didn't happen i.e. originally an immediate mid-air disintegration was proposed, but now we know from the evidence that this almost certainly did not occur.

In addition, knowing particular information (such as the change in altitude down to FL295) is very suggestive and evidential for certain hypothesis.

Discussion should continue henceforth with this in mind - rather than dismissing all statements as equally invalid because some people think "sure we're all in the same boat, we all know nothing".

As I said previously, that is simply false.

sopretty

wretcheddomain wrote: »

I don't think this is true at all.

We may not know the exact cause of what happened but this does not mean we can't rule certain hypothesis out.

The information that we've gathered so far allows us to rule out particular hypothesis and hence get closer to the truth of exactly what happened.

So no, it's not that we have no idea, we've a much better idea of what happened in the sense of we know what didn't happen i.e. originally an immediate mid-air disintegration was proposed, but now we know from the evidence that this almost certainly did not occur.

In addition, knowing particular information (such as the change in altitude down to FR295) is very suggestive and evidential for certain hypothesis.

Discussion should continue henceforth with this in mind - rather than dismissing all statements as equally invalid because some people think "sure we're all in the same boat, we all know nothing".

As I said previously, that is simply false.

Well why not share your opinions?

wretcheddomain

sopretty wrote: »

Well why not share your opinions?

I just have.

adamski8

I wonder has the audio from that japanese airline that said it heard static and mumbling when it tried to contact mh370 been analysed. We havent heard much about it.

Duiske

geneva geneva4444 wrote: »

Oh dear, Channel 5 is now pitching an "act of god" theory. Chalk another one up to the list of unlikely's.

Little green men, from a planet just to the left of Arcturus, are more likely to have had a hand in this than God.

Colser

wretcheddomain wrote: »

I don't think this is true at all.

We may not know the exact cause of what happened but this does not mean we can't rule certain hypothesis out.

The information that we've gathered so far allows us to rule out particular hypothesis and hence get closer to the truth of exactly what happened.

So no, it's not that we have no idea, we've a much better idea of what happened in the sense of we know what didn't happen i.e. originally an immediate mid-air disintegration was proposed, but now we know from the evidence that this almost certainly did not occur.

In addition, knowing particular information (such as the change in altitude down to FL295) is very suggestive and evidential for certain hypothesis.

Discussion should continue henceforth with this in mind - rather than dismissing all statements as equally invalid because some people think "sure we're all in the same boat, we all know nothing".

As I said previously, that is simply false.

Would be interested to hear what particular hypothesis you have ruled out?

Growler!!!

sopretty wrote: »

I'm not impressed with the arrogance of the 'silent' posters however.

sopretty wrote: »

I don't think 'experts' in the area are refraining from posting in this thread as they look down on us all (even when they're not mid-flight ), but rather because, THEY SIMPLY HAVE NO MORE OF A CLUE THAN THE REST OF US!

What's changed your opinion of the silent posters?

Happyman42

Duiske wrote: »

Little green men, from a planet just to the left of Arcturus, are more likely to have had a hand in this than God.

Catholic or Protestant Little green men?

sopretty

wretcheddomain wrote: »

I just have.

Your opinion of my opinion is not what I was looking for!

By the way, the plural of hypothesis is hypotheses.

It is again, like my doctor analogy. It is a process of elimination.

I'd be delighted if you could explain why you(the royal version!) (presumably with some knowledge?) would debunk a theory based on your knowledge with no explanation by simply stating 'This thread has gone to hell'.

*Disclaimer, I have no idea whether you have even posted on this thread before, as I don't have a good head for names!

Jack1985

Happyman42 wrote: »

I was referring to what you said about suicides among pilots, not generally.
You are supposing that because it never happened before that it can't happen.

As regards the photo's, I don't know who invited them or allowed them, the fact that they where lax about it is enough to show me that they didn't take the core part of their job - the safe transit of passengers - seriously or seriously enough.

That allows me to 'speculate'.

For two reasons I come to the conclusion it was not suicide by either pilot, my information about Captain Zaharie shows his background well, here's a statement from a colleague of his,

Zaharie Ahmad Shah, was a flying enthusiast who spent his off days tinkering with a flight simulator of the 777 that he had set up at home. It is absolutely clear from my own colleagues and within Malaysia Airlines that he did not sabotage the flight - He had a great family, was really enjoying life and was loved by colleagues, he was through the real tough years of Malaysia Airlines, he always fought to keep his job, he loved his job.

In relation to F/O, Fariq Abdul Hamid

He was a good student. He worked very hard to get where he was. His parents are so proud of him, He is a good person, respectful to elders and religious. The Fariq I know is soft spoken and quite shy, when joining the team, it was quite intimidating for him there were some situations he was put in he didn't like, I know that.

I believe the above is in relation to smoking, I 100% agree that is a joke.

theKillerBite

This is interesting:

Expert skeptical on theory of a long flight through several countries
Quoted by AFP news agency, Neil Hansford , chairman of consulting firm Strategic Aviation Solutions admits he's skeptical on the hypothesis of a long flight of missing MH370 plane through the airspace of several countries. "An aircraft, without any transponders on, going over the top of anybody's airspace would have become a military incident and somebody would have done something," Hansford said. Flying from the point where radar contact was lost to the Indian Ocean would have taken the plane through airspace monitored by Malaysian, Thai, Vietnamese, Chinese, Indonesian and Indian military radar.
"How did it get past all of that?" said Gerry Soejatman, an independent aviation analyst based in Jakarta. "Defence is not only about having the capability but also not disclosing what capabilities you don't have," said David Kaminski-Morrow, the London-based air transport editor for Flight International.

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/369677/Malaysia-Airlines-Flight-370-search-is-DOWNGRADED-as-investigators-head-to-Indian-Ocean

Happyman42

Jack1985 wrote: »

For two reasons I come to the conclusion it was not suicide by either pilot, my information about Captain Zaharie shows his background well, here's a statement from a colleague of his,



In relation to F/O, Fariq Abdul Hamid



I believe the above is in relation to smoking, I 100% agree that is a joke.

And what is generally said about the demeanour of most victims of suicide before they commit the act? Are most people not shocked that somebody whom seemed happy would do such a thing?

As I said, your speculation isn't credible.

sopretty

Growler!!! wrote: »

What's changed your opinion of the silent posters?

I concluded that they knew no more than meself!

Jack1985

Happyman42 wrote: »

And what is generally said about the demeanour of most victims of suicide before they commit the act? Are most people not shocked that somebody whom seemed happy would do such a thing?

Well here's a fact, the EgyptAir flight that went down, the demoted Captain had been told he would not fly when he returned home again, The suicide last Nov, another company issue.

As I said, your speculation isn't credible.

And by the way, nor is your speculation!

zoe 3619

Sorry to ask.know it's here somewhere,but so many pages...anyone tell me the name of the journalist who first reported plane had flown on for four hours.think it was an aviation reporter,who had leaked information from r.r

wretcheddomain

sopretty wrote: »

Your opinion of my opinion is not what I was looking for!

By the way, the plural of hypothesis is hypotheses.

It is again, like my doctor analogy. It is a process of elimination.

I'd be delighted if you could explain why you(the royal version!) (presumably with some knowledge?) would debunk a theory based on your knowledge with no explanation by simply stating 'This thread has gone to hell'.

*Disclaimer, I have no idea whether you have even posted on this thread before, as I don't have a good head for names!

Yes - and I'm sure you're aware it's a cyber criminal offence on boards.ie to be a Grammar Nazi. I'm aware of that spelling mistake but who cares?

While you believe that people are avoiding commenting on the thread because of a fear of vilification, I believe they come here to listen to the opinions of those more educated and informed than themselves as a way of updating their knowledge about the ongoing investigation. Where is my evidence? Myself, as that's the reason I haven't posted up until now, that is until I saw your post which must have included me as I hadn't offered my view.

A previous poster challenged me on what hypothesis I've ruled out. The answer to this is the same hypothesis that everyone else has ruled out i.e. that the plane did not crash suddenly due to a bomb or disintegration as was initially proposed.

The evidence, as far as I'm aware, can only lead to the following conclusions:

1) Clearly the plane was under the control of an expert in aviation. This can only lead to three possibilities:

a) That the existing pilots decided to sabotage the flight - either one or both in the varying scenarios.

b) That a terrorist "held the gun to the pilots heads" in deciding the fate of what happened to the aircraft.

c) That terrorist pilots themselves flew the aircraft.

This is where more investigative work is needed to shine more light on what happened next. We're only dealing with probabilities after this point. Probabilistically, I think options (b) and (c) are more likely than (a) but, as I said, more evidence is needed.

Does this answer your question?

Jack1985

zoe 3619 wrote: »

Sorry to ask.know it's here somewhere,but so many pages...anyone tell me the name of the journalist who first reported plane had flown on for four hours.think it was an aviation reporter,who had leaked information from r.r

Andy Pasztor and Jon Ostrower.

(a) but, as I said, more evidence is needed.

Here, here.