Minister Shatter and Commissioner Callinan should both resign in disgrace

Hootanany

golfball37 wrote: »

And therein your last line lies the problem imo. We need to break the Political link between our Police force and government. Have an Independent police board with no political appointments. We should appoint a commissioner from outside the force as a first step to this reform.

Even more corruption then

rodento

Simon O’Brien, chairman of the Garda Síochána Ombudsman Commission, strongly criticised the Garda Síochána for its level of cooperation — criticisms strongly rejected by Commissioner Martin Callinan.

Mr O’Brien, a former senior officer in the London Met, where he served for 32 years, said the protocol agreed between GSOC and the gardaí for the exchange of information was “not working”.



http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/gardai-withheld-information-in-clare-daly-inquiry-232179.html#at_pco=smlwn-1.0&at_tot=1&at_ab=per-14&at_pos=0

Red Crow

Enda Kenny is coming across as very weak here. Disappointing as for once you would hope that he would seize an opportunity like this.

I've gained respect for Varadkar over this though. Seems to be reasonable in comparison to his ministerial colleagues.

Sierra Oscar

Red Crow wrote: »

Enda Kenny is coming across as very weak here. Disappointing as for once you would hope that he would seize an opportunity like this.

Enda Kenny has always been very weak. He is not a leader, he is a mouthpiece for advisor's and that's about it. Take away the advisor's and the hacks and you are left with little substance.

I have respect for both Coveney and Varadkar for coming out and saying what is common sense - that labelling whistle-blowers as 'disgraceful' is wrong.

tayto lover

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

Enda Kenny has always been very weak. He is not a leader, he is a mouthpiece for advisor's and that's about it. Take away the advisor's and the hacks and you are left with little substance.

I have respect for both Coveney and Varadkar for coming out and saying what is common sense - that labelling whistle-blowers as 'disgraceful' is wrong.

Unless there's a leadership challenge in the pipeline.
If so then they're just putting themselves forward.
I wouldn't pay much heed to what politicians say as they are all liars in my view. History backs my opinions too.

guinnessdrinker

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

I have respect for both Coveney and Varadkar for coming out and saying what is common sense - that labelling whistle-blowers as 'disgraceful' is wrong.

I can't help but feel that Varadkar's little intervention on the whistleblower controversy was extremely self-serving and the timing of it was a little strange. Remember he was not just speaking off the cuff or responding to a questoin, he was reading from a pre-prepared script.

Maybe I am being cynical but I find it hard to believe that somebody in government did not pre approve his comments on the issue.

The data protection commissioner has stated that the whistleblowers accessed private information from the garda pulse system when there was no reason for them to do so.

This appears to be the action that the garda commissioner described as 'disguting'

Does this excuse what he said, in the publics opinion?

Floppybits

bubblypop wrote: »

The data protection commissioner has stated that the whistleblowers accessed private information from the garda pulse system when there was no reason for them to do so.

This appears to be the action that the garda commissioner described as 'disguting'

Does this excuse what he said, in the publics opinion?

The data commissioner must have got a call from Enda to get out there and discredit the whistleblowers.

The problem here is that the data was accessed to prove corruption in the penalty points system, now if the Garda had of handled the information the correct way and didn't try bury it then the whistle blowers would not have had to give the information to independent members of the Dail. It's is the Garda commissioners fault for the mess that has been made of this because of his jack of leadership in dealing with issues in the correct manner in the first place. This data commissioner stuff is just the Kenny, shatter and callinan trying save some face and another attempt to discredit the whistle blowers.

rodento

Quinn just gave two fingers to kenny

http://m.rte.ie/news/touch/2014/0321/603625-garda-whistleblower/

Floppybits

rodento wrote: »

Quinn just gave two fingers to kenny

http://m.rte.ie/news/touch/2014/0321/603625-garda-whistleblower/

Is Kenny loosing control?

Banjo String

bubblypop wrote: »

The data protection commissioner has stated that the whistleblowers accessed private information from the garda pulse system when there was no reason for them to do so.

This appears to be the action that the garda commissioner described as 'disguting'

Does this excuse what he said, in the publics opinion?

The two whistleblowers have been completely and utterly vindicated.

You obviously must have missed the memo.


Give it up.

Banjo String

Banjo String wrote: »

The two whistleblowers have been completely and utterly vindicated.

You obviously must have missed the memo.


Give it up.

No no no, you must've missed the latest report from the data commissioner, he stated that once they had made their allegations there was no need for them to view private data.
Not the data they accessed in relation to their complaint.

mickdw

bubblypop wrote: »

No no no, you must've missed the latest report from the data commissioner, he stated that once they had made their allegations there was no need for them to view private data.
Not the data they accessed in relation to their complaint.

But if they were handled properly and the initial allegations properly investigated, there would have been no need for these Gardai access anything else. As it was, I feel they were backed into a situation where they were left with little option but to do whatever they had to clear their names.

Busted Flat.

Floppybits wrote: »

Is Kenny loosing control?

The clown never had control, you remember auld fuzzy head, he had no control either. The heave has started, big changes will happen before the local and EU elections takes place. The fox is contaminated.

mickdw

mickdw wrote: »

But if they were handled properly and the initial allegations properly investigated, there would have been no need for these Gardai access anything else. As it was, I feel they were backed into a situation where they were left with little option but to do whatever they had to clear their names.

The data commissioner is there to make sure that gardai ( or anyone else) don't access details of private individuals for no good reason.
He has investigated & that is what he said.
He is in no way saying they were wrong in what they did, but after they had ' whistleblowed' that whatever they accessed AFTER that, was a breach of data protection.

I suppose most people won't care now anyway, was just wondering if the public would understand that's what the commissioner seems to suggest he was referring to with his 'disgusting' comment.

He should be gone long ago anyway but on the particular issue, he may have believed he was in the right.

Going Forward

bubblypop wrote: »

No no no, you must've missed the latest report from the data commissioner, he stated that once they had made their allegations there was no need for them to view private data.
Not the data they accessed in relation to their complaint.

No. No one missed it.

Godge

bubblypop wrote: »

The data protection commissioner has stated that the whistleblowers accessed private information from the garda pulse system when there was no reason for them to do so.

This appears to be the action that the garda commissioner described as 'disguting'

Does this excuse what he said, in the publics opinion?

Do you have a link to that report?

mickdw wrote: »

But if they were handled properly and the initial allegations properly investigated, there would have been no need for these Gardai access anything else. As it was, I feel they were backed into a situation where they were left with little option but to do whatever they had to clear their names.

No excuse for breaking the law.

Godge

rodento wrote: »

Simon O’Brien, chairman of the Garda Síochána Ombudsman Commission, strongly criticised the Garda Síochána for its level of cooperation — criticisms strongly rejected by Commissioner Martin Callinan.

Mr O’Brien, a former senior officer in the London Met, where he served for 32 years, said the protocol agreed between GSOC and the gardaí for the exchange of information was “not working”.



http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/gardai-withheld-information-in-clare-daly-inquiry-232179.html#at_pco=smlwn-1.0&at_tot=1&at_ab=per-14&at_pos=0

What has a May 2013 Report got to do with anything?

Especially when said Mr. O'Brien said something completely different to the Dail Committee?

mickdw

Godge wrote: »

Do you have a link to that report?





No excuse for breaking the law.

There are many excuses for breaking the law. Many are valid and are accepted as good defence legally.
In these cases, where their jobs and good names were on the line and when they were fighting their own organisation, an organisation they knew to be corrupt and an organisation that enforces the law, working to the letter of the law doesnt cut it. Doing what was required for the common good would seem more appropriate.

rodento

Shatter accused McCabe of not cooperating with a garda investagation, here is an article from the examiner outlining the garda's no-cooperation with gsoc in its investigations and the commissioner denying that the garda are doing anything wrong

Something you may find quite frankly disgusting

rodento

Gilmore joins the chorus


http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/gilmore-repeats-calls-for-garda-chief-to-withdraw-unfortunate-comments-on-whistleblowers-30116830.html

Busted Flat.

rodento wrote: »

Gilmore joins the chorus


http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/gilmore-repeats-calls-for-garda-chief-to-withdraw-unfortunate-comments-on-whistleblowers-30116830.html

Forced into it, interesting times ahead. Heave Ho, Heave Ho.

tayto lover

rodento wrote: »

Gilmore joins the chorus


http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/gilmore-repeats-calls-for-garda-chief-to-withdraw-unfortunate-comments-on-whistleblowers-30116830.html

Gimmemore is just coming out to increase the Labour vote in the upcoming elections. If they do poorly then he loses the leadership.

He couldn't care less about whistleblowers or penalty points.

take everything

Kaiser2000 wrote: »

Enda Kenny is coming across as exactly what he has always been - a figurehead without any charisma or leadership ability. Someone who can be led rather than lead, whether it's Merkel pulling the strings, or Cameron, or the favours that must be owed to Shatter and others since Bruton's failed attempt to oust him.

He might be trying to silence his ministers, but he's also trying to silence public debate on the issue. Can't have the "peasants" getting ideas after all. These things are for discussion behind closed doors - it's the Irish way!

Isn't it great living in Ireland's "democracy".....

On the button.
The guy is a spineless embarrassment, a tool for others like Reilly and Shatter to use and hide behind (it's like the heave against him has defined who and who can abuse his loyalty). A lucky, largely clueless general.

The only possible thing that he has in his favour is he doesn't have Cowen's grumpy demeanour.

take everything

guinnessdrinker wrote: »

I can't help but feel that Varadkar's little intervention on the whistleblower controversy was extremely self-serving and the timing of it was a little strange. Remember he was not just speaking off the cuff or responding to a questoin, he was reading from a pre-prepared script.

Maybe I am being cynical but I find it hard to believe that somebody in government did not pre approve his comments on the issue.

The comments, like any Irish politician's, are self-serving, but at least the guy has a bit of balls. Labour (chief smirker and smug eyes-closer Rabbitte and Gimmemore) have come out really badly from this. Afraid of their lives to rock the boat until Varadker said something.
I'm actually disappointed in Burton. Thought she had more guts. But yeah, this will do Varadker's profile no harm, and even if self-serving I admire him more than the gutless rest. And I wouldn't be his biggest fan.

Edit: Just reading your post there again, and like you I initially cynically felt Varadker could just be another stooge in this pantomime (like get Leo to give a strongly worded denouncement to keep the public happy and that slap on the wrist might make everyone forget about the apology) but I've stopped myself being that cynical.
I actually think apart from being a good move politically for Leo he's actually saying what he thinks.

rodento

Shatter and Kenny back the wrong horse, FG backbenchers overwhelmingly support Leo
http://www.pressdisplay.com/staging/timesonline/iphone/homepage.aspx#_title895120140323000000000010017/watitle895120140323000000000010017/8951/89512014032300000000001001/7/true

And shatter like the rest of us ignores Leo for weeks

http://www.pressdisplay.com/staging/timesonline/iphone/homepage.aspx#_title895120140323000000000010016/watitle895120140323000000000010016/8951/89512014032300000000001001/6/true

Muahahaha

rodento wrote: »

Shatter and Kenny back the wrong horse, FG backbenchers overwhelmingly support Leo
http://www.pressdisplay.com/staging/timesonline/iphone/homepage.aspx#_title895120140323000000000010017/watitle895120140323000000000010017/8951/89512014032300000000001001/7/true

And shatter like the rest of us ignores Leo for weeks

http://www.pressdisplay.com/staging/timesonline/iphone/homepage.aspx#_title895120140323000000000010016/watitle895120140323000000000010016/8951/89512014032300000000001001/6/true

That's interesting. The longer this whole debacle goes on the weaker Enda Kenny looks. He is still in firefighting mode and it's been nearly a month now. There are two separate inquiries underway and also two High Court cases due surrounding the controversy. All that will come from this is bad news over the coming weeks. Enda needs to realise that his backing to the Garda Commissioner and Shatter is flying in the face of public opinion for weeks now.

sparkling sea

Have Shatter, Callinan and at this stafe Kenny resigned yet? No!!!!!!!!!!!


What a surprise :rolleyes:

Muahahaha

sparkling sea wrote: »

Have Shatter, Callinan and at this stafe Kenny resigned yet? No!!!!!!!!!!!


What a surprise :rolleyes:

The Sindo are saying that Kenny and Shatter are concocting a plan for Callinan to at least retract the disgusting remark, if he refuses for the fourth time to do so then he could well be toast. He's too much of a politician for that and he's such an arrogant individual that I'm predicting he will come out with a non-apology tomorrow or Tuesday, it'll begin with 'If my remarks caused offence....blah de blah'. In any case anything that comes out of the Commissioners mouth at this stage is insincere and holds no value.

periodictable

I seem to remember Callinan talking about "my force"...I thought we empolyed them and him too?
He will not apologize because he's typical of those twits in power who lack the basic decency and common sense to admit they fcuked up, to apologize and move on.
Kenny is reverting to type.
Labour ought to risk all by demanding the firing of both Shatter and Callinan.
Leadership ambitions aside, Varadkar read the public mood correctly when he made his remarks-he got a great round of applause from his audience.
Kenny, Hogan and Shatter could teach FF a thing or two about dirty tricks and politics.
Plus ca change, etc.