Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread III

Hagz · 31-01-2014 2:19pm

Bridge93 wrote: »

Owen Farrell doesn't always kick for Saracens, should he not be picked at 10 by England? Jackson will be fine and had proven he'll be fine.

Ah now in fairness Farrell wouldn't be the best comparison. Farrell has already proved that he is a fantastic goal kicker.

shuffol · 31-01-2014 2:35pm

former legend wrote: »

This, this and this again.

The guy was a superstar at full-back when he was at underage level. Not just in a "that guy will play for Ireland" kind of way, but in a "that guy is going down as an all-time great" kind of way. At full-back.

Now, obviously being a star at underage is no guarantee of anything (cf: Andrew Conway) but when Fitzgerald came on to the pro scene he had first Girvan Dempsey, then Rob Kearney, then Isa Nacewa in his way for the full-back jersey. So he moved to the wing and lo and behold, he was pretty good there too.

Then came the 2011 Six Nations; he had a pretty bad couple of games at full-back having not played there for years and suddenly he's a joke, that he should never be let near the full-back jersey again, etc etc.

It's ill-informed and it's pretty annoying. He has all the skills to play FB, he has more experience there than most and I'd back him to slot in there if needed, more than I would for any of the other back-three players we have.

Rant over. For now.

I dont like fitz at full back myself, he regularly struggles for distance with his kicks and his running game from deep is poor, for some reason the more time he has the worse his decision making. How many times did we see him collect the ball from deep, do that thing where he spins the ball around in his hands a few times and then run head on into a wall of defenders. Now perhaps he'd be better now but you cant disregard his form there from a few years ago, I never noticed his poor form much when he started on the wing.

shaka · 31-01-2014 2:39pm

former legend wrote: »

No, I'm saying he has the skills and ability to do it and that one or two bad games does not mean anything. If we based our opinions on small numbers of performances, no-one would ever be good enough for international rugby.

The Zebo thing is what does my head in most, tbh. Two games in his entire career, one a forward-dominated meat-grinder of a match and the other a canter in the park, is somehow a basis for thinking he's an option at FB at international level.

It's just bad logic, that's all.

I have some reservations about zebo in a few ways but one place where he is very good is under the high ball , I do think full back might eventually be a good option for him but not just yet. Saying that I wouldn't seeing him get a run there now for Munster

molloyjh · 31-01-2014 3:00pm

Ugo Monye spacecraft experience wrote: »

So because he was really good there as a 17 year old he would suddenly be grand to slip back in there for Ireland despite having looked at sea in the position the last time he played there at test level?

I just don't think he's a 15 and I'd have D Kearney and Zebo ahead of him for Ireland if push came to shove

Tbh I'd be slow to pass judgement on him. He came back from injury in January 2011 and had practically no time to find any form before being launched into Test level rugby in a position he'd never played in at that level. It was never, ever going to end well. It just couldn't.

I'd agree he'd be down the list, but I do think peoples opinions of him at FB have been coloured by a situation where he was never going to be able to excel.

shuffol wrote: »

I dont like fitz at full back myself, he regularly struggles for distance with his kicks and his running game from deep is poor, for some reason the more time he has the worse his decision making. How many times did we see him collect the ball from deep, do that thing where he spins the ball around in his hands a few times and then run head on into a wall of defenders. Now perhaps he'd be better now but you cant disregard his form there from a few years ago, I never noticed his poor form much when he started on the wing.

Saracens in January 2011. The game he threw the intercept for Strettles(?) try. Right before his appearances at FB for Ireland. He wasn't in a good place at the time at all, be that at wing or FB, hence I wouldn't be using anything in that period to judge the guy.

irishbucsfan · 31-01-2014 3:25pm

Interesting how when Paul O'Connell was asked who Ireland's biggest hitter was he immediately answered Stephen Ferris, I found that surprising given how long he's been out and also given it was at the 6 Nations launch! God I wish we had him back.

awec · 31-01-2014 3:35pm

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Interesting how when Paul O'Connell was asked who Ireland's biggest hitter was he immediately answered Stephen Ferris, I found that surprising given how long he's been out and also given it was at the 6 Nations launch! God I wish we had him back.

If we had Ferris and O'Brien togging out in the same back line it would be amazing.

Eoin · 31-01-2014 3:47pm

I'd probably keep them in the pack!

Tox56 · 31-01-2014 3:49pm

Eoin wrote: »

I'd probably keep them in the pack!

Nonsense, natural successors to BOD and Darce in the centre

Deano7788 · 31-01-2014 3:53pm

Tox56 wrote: »

Nonsense, natural successors to BOD and Darce in the centre

I'm suddenly reminded of Mighty Ducks.

awec · 31-01-2014 4:31pm

I meant back row.

Though a Ferris O'Brien 12 and 13 partnership would be a pretty impenetrable channel for the opposition.

awec · 31-01-2014 4:34pm

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Interesting how when Paul O'Connell was asked who Ireland's biggest hitter was he immediately answered Stephen Ferris, I found that surprising given how long he's been out and also given it was at the 6 Nations launch! God I wish we had him back.

Was just looking this up, in an interview in 2009 Les Kiss said that in his 20 years of coaching he has only met one player who hits harder than Ferris and that was Wycliff Palu.

danthefan · 31-01-2014 4:36pm

awec wrote: »

Was just looking this up, in an interview in 2009 Les Kiss said that in his 20 years of coaching he has only met one player who hits harder than Ferris and that was Wycliff Palu.

Can remember Palu absolutely smashing Rob Kearney a few seasons back, think he got (quite unfairly) binned for his troubles.

awec · 31-01-2014 4:40pm

From the same interview, Ferris said:

“I love a big hit myself,” he said. “Me and Neil Best. We go out there and try and hurt boys, really, so they won’t run back at us. Putting a big hit on somebody, putting them down and looking into his eyes. There’s nothing better.”

That looking into his eyes bit - :pac:

Really hope this guy gets back to playing for Ireland.

rrpc · 31-01-2014 4:43pm

awec wrote: »

From the same interview, Ferris said:

“I love a big hit myself,” he said. “Me and Neil Best. We go out there and try and hurt boys, really, so they won’t run back at us. Putting a big hit on somebody, putting them down and looking into his eyes. There’s nothing better.”

That looking into his eyes bit - :pac:

Really hope this guy gets back to playing for Ireland.

You get the feeling that if Ferris hadn't actually taken up rugby, he might be behind bars by now.

Joking of course

who_me · 31-01-2014 5:09pm

rrpc wrote: »

You get the feeling that if Ferris hadn't actually taken up rugby, he might be behind bars by now.

Joking of course

I think he almost admitted as much himself, in previous interviews.

Kayless · 31-01-2014 5:23pm

Any word on Ferris?

Gidea · 31-01-2014 5:25pm

Kayless wrote: »

Any word on Ferris?

He tweeted last week that he packed his boots for training for the first time in ages, so some progress at least.

mystic86 · 31-01-2014 5:51pm

awec wrote: »

If we had Ferris and O'Brien togging out in the same back line it would be amazing.

Last time that happened was Paddy's day 2012, damn long time! Almost 2 years!
They played together in 4 of the 5 games in that campaign.

Also, prior to the games against Australia and New Zealand in November, Brian O'Driscoll and Paul O'Connell did not play together for Ireland since the WC Quarter Final defeat to Wales on 8th October 2011 - over 2 years!

In fact that quarter final is the last time all 4 of those players played for us at the same time. What a lineup we had that day:

Rob Kearney
Tommy Bowe
Brian O'Driscoll
Gordon D'Arcy
Keith Earls
Ronan O'Gara
Conor Murray
Cian Healy
Rory Best
Mike Ross
Donncha O'Callaghan
Paul O'Connell
Steve Ferris
Sean O'Brien
Jamie Heaslip

Obviously I would have preferred 1 change in that lineup...

I think Wales caught us on the hop that day, what an awful shame.

former legend · 31-01-2014 6:00pm

mystic86 wrote: »

Last time that happened was Paddy's day 2012, damn long time! Almost 2 years!
They played together in 4 of the 5 games in that campaign.

Also, prior to the games against Australia and New Zealand in November, Brian O'Driscoll and Paul O'Connell did not play together for Ireland since the WC Quarter Final defeat to Wales on 8th October 2011 - over 2 years!

In fact that quarter final is the last time all 4 of those players played for us at the same time. What a lineup we had that day:

Rob Kearney
Tommy Bowe
Brian O'Driscoll
Gordon D'Arcy
Keith Earls
Ronan O'Gara
Conor Murray
Cian Healy
Rory Best
Mike Ross
Donncha O'Callaghan
Paul O'Connell
Steve Ferris
Sean O'Brien
Jamie Heaslip

Obviously I would have preferred 1 change in that lineup...

I think Wales caught us on the hop that day, what an awful shame.

Great post, except for the very last line. Wales didn't catch us on the hop at all; they realised we were completely one-dimensional in our tactics and set out to neuter us completely. Where we fell down was our inability to do anything about it in response.

gaius c · 31-01-2014 6:35pm

awec wrote: »

If we had Ferris and O'Brien togging out in the same back line it would be amazing.

Great players individually but they were part of a horribly balanced backrow for Ireland.

Ugo Monye spacecraft experience · 31-01-2014 6:43pm

gaius c wrote: »

Great players individually but they were part of a horribly balanced backrow for Ireland.

in what sense?

Bridge93 · 31-01-2014 6:43pm

gaius c wrote: »

Great players individually but they were part of a horribly balanced backrow for Ireland.

Sean O Brien has come on immeasurably as a 7 since the World Cup. I think they could fit much better as a backrow now.

.ak · 31-01-2014 6:46pm

gaius c wrote: »

Great players individually but they were part of a horribly balanced backrow for Ireland.

Never really understood that idea tbh...

If they we're fit today they'd all be starting on Sunday.

gaius c · 31-01-2014 6:48pm

Bridge93 wrote: »

Sean O Brien has come on immeasurably as a 7 since the World Cup. I think they could fit much better as a backrow now.

Possibly. All more individually talented than the Welsh backrow in the QF yet played off the park by them. SOB has come a long way since then though.

Mahatma Geansai · 31-01-2014 7:14pm

Its a pity that I don't think we ever saw Wallace, Ferris and SOB take the field together. Probably the 3 best athletes we've produced.

Fireball07 · 31-01-2014 7:56pm

former legend wrote: »

No, I'm saying he has the skills and ability to do it and that one or two bad games does not mean anything. If we based our opinions on small numbers of performances, no-one would ever be good enough for international rugby.

The Zebo thing is what does my head in most, tbh. Two games in his entire career, one a forward-dominated meat-grinder of a match and the other a canter in the park, is somehow a basis for thinking he's an option at FB at international level.

It's just bad logic, that's all.

I would say that Zebo has more of the attributes for a full-back than Fitz. He has a monster boot, he is superb in the air and is a good counter-attacker. Positioning is something that you'd have to see over time, same with Fitz.

Fitz's skillset is more suited to centre imo, although both are very good wings.

shaka · 31-01-2014 8:07pm

rrpc wrote: »

You get the feeling that if Ferris hadn't actually taken up rugby, he might be behind bars by now.

Joking of course

Think he was laying tarmacadam for his uncle at one stage

Berticus · 31-01-2014 8:43pm

As a kind of shadow backline going forward, I'm definitely excited about the possibilities of seeing these guys lining up:

9. Marmion
10. JJ Hanrahan
11. Craig Gilroy
12. Stuart Olding
13. Jared Payne
14. Simon Zebo
15. Henshaw

That it has to be said is the Project Player and Academy systems working very well...

Rightwing · 31-01-2014 8:49pm

Mahatma Geansai wrote: »

Its a pity that I don't think we ever saw Wallace, Ferris and SOB take the field together. Probably the 3 best athletes we've produced.

I'm not sure I'd include Ferris in that, how many caps has he? (I know injuries is the problem)

RuggieBear · 31-01-2014 9:08pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8xdOX5iNkC8

Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread III

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