organic farming

TheClubMan

Is anyone here supplying organic milk to Glenisk or other organic processors? What is the current milk price and has the milk price risen in line with inflation? Organic milk is supposed to be a premium product so I'd imagine it has gone up. Be interesting to hear

endainoz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119324236#Comment_119324236

Even if they had enough space on the slats? Isn't there a poster here that doesn't use straw? I may have read that wrong.

orchard farm

Up to 50%area can be slats but at least half has to be dry bedded.straw,rushes,woodchip etc how much or how little is open to interpretation

Siamsa Sessions

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119325884#Comment_119325884

I spoke to an organic dairy farmer two months ago and his co-op/company were paying 50c then. Conventional was low 40s at that stage. Not sure if they have increased organic price since. He claimed conventional price would drop over time but organic price wouldn't.

tractorporn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119326309#Comment_119326309

Yes if you house cattle on only slats and the inspector comes out it's a higher non-compliance and the Department fine you 50% of your organic payment.

TheClubMan

Not much of an incentive for farmers to go down the organic dairy route if conventional is making more. Glanbia were paying suppliers 52c in May. Fair enough conventional suppliers have massive fertiliser bills this year but they have higher milk output than organics who have still been affected by higher electricity, contractor, silage plastic etc. costs this year. I know the price is more for organic winter milk but conventional is the same

893bet

I am still trying to figure if organic is worth the hassle for the extra payment.

An extra 5k. Lose 700 of it to Registration. Weanling quality has to suffer. No fert or meal bills as such but hard to house cows in the winter without the odd shake of meal for a cow that’s gone bare etc.

endainoz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119328514#Comment_119328514

Once you see the price of organic nuts you'll soon lose the habit of an "odd shake" of nuts 🤣

Cran

I think key to organic livestock farming is keeping much if not all feed production in house. Problem seen on some organic walks is difficulty in finishing animals on land type being used, and lot of organic tillage farms are near 100% tillage as there is demand for food standard cereals. Have yet to see how dairy would work except large scale low stocking rate & low invest debt.

Organic farms that seem to work really well are good mixed farm setups.

Silverdream

An organic farm near us and it's not much of an advertisement for it. Thistles as big as trees, no grass now in this dry weather yet there are hardly any cattle on the farm. The place just looks abandoned and wild in places. I think a lot of Organic farming here is done with the cheque in the post in mind only. No real difference from a conventional farm other than neglect and poor output. Farmland is a limited commodity and should be used properly

youllbemine

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119329970#Comment_119329970

Was that farm any different before it went organic? Management is a huge aspect of it. A poorly managed farm is a poorly managed farm. Might have a few more beasts about the place with fertiliser being spread but only really masking problems.

Sad Professor

test

Edit: bumping worked! Thread is back

JohnChadwick

Saw these figures and quite interested to see how close organic beef farms would be to this bottom line, with suckler to weanling instead of suckler to beef.

On similar hectares here and on similar land (circa 55ha) but no direct selling so sales are around 28.5k, but don't have abattoir costs of 4.5k then. Probably end up with the same bottom line. Just curious to compare it as direct selling looks like time consuming craic to be at.

blue5000

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119327312#Comment_119327312

I think part of the problem might be the big processors. If for example one of them started making organic butter and exported it to Germany. It would not be long before conventional butter sales to Germany would dry up. The domestic market for organic dairy produce is probably well supplied already.

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119339067#Comment_119339067

That's great going.

Does that person do their own silage.

JohnChadwick

Yea silage is contractor I'd say.

Probably would account for another 2k in under contractor costs myself though (for silage and slurry). And remove the motor from that as that's not really a farm expense in my case.

blue5000

Bumping this for James2022 it’s here

Tomjim

is there a good supply of organic suck calves from the dairy farmer ie if I went organic would I be able to access 10/12 whitehead /aa organic calves every spring?

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119364376#Comment_119364376

No. Organic calves have to be fed whole milk for 12 weeks. By the time they are that old you might as well hold onto them. You would hardly get Friesian calves not to mind Hex calves

MIKEKC

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119327178#Comment_119327178

I would think the rule about keeping half your stock on straw would keep a lot of people out

893bet

Is the organic payment going up? Plus a participation payment flat rate also?

JohnChadwick

In organic 5 or 6 years and don't use any straw. Cubicles and open yard space only.

893bet

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119366387#Comment_119366387

Which organic society are you with?

blue5000

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119366304#Comment_119366304

2k of a sweetner for new entrants announced this morning.

893bet

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119366901#Comment_119366901

Payments up to 300 per ha and 250 when converted then.

Prop Joe

What about existing participants

Siamsa Sessions

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119367129#Comment_119367129

It is getting harder and harder not to be cynical about the Govt approach to organics.

Throwing more money at it coz not enough farmers signed up last time hardly addresses the concerns farmers had only last year. Lack of market, large scale changes at farm level (stock levels, possible new enterprises, new buildings), additional red-tape, transitioning land to zero synthetics, and what ever other reasons farmers had.

By the way, did anyone in DAFM ask/survey farmers about what their concerns are around converting?

So, I would suggest what the Govt are doing isn't about existing participants, and possibly not even about the food being produced or the environment. It's about numbers and optics to show they are doing something. Throwing money at a complex issue is the laziest option.

endainoz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119367129#Comment_119367129

Seems to be 250 instead of 170 I think. Pretty decent jump.

tanko

What is the minimum stocking rate for organics?

minerleague

See in journal Tullamore farm going to cost changing to organic at open day, be interesting to see what changes would be needed even if they don't change