Sickened while stalking

marcp

Came across these yerterday morning while stalking on my lease. No damage by birds or foxes so only shot Friday nite. A pregnant hind and a calf.

This is about 60 yards from the road and someone who knew what they were at. 2 clean strikes and 2 very clean grallochs.

Rots me to the core. Plucks we're not on the ground so obviously a game dealer jobbie.

shoot to kill

marcp wrote: »

Came across these yerterday morning while stalking on my lease. No damage by birds or foxes so only shot Friday nite. A pregnant hind and a calf.

This is about 60 yards from the road and someone who knew what they were at. 2 clean strikes and 2 very clean grallochs.

Rots me to the core. Plucks we're not on the ground so obviously a game dealer jobbie.

What a sickener. Did u tell any one u were going. F**king 60 yards from the road. Hero. I can imagine them sitting in the field not even bothered by the light. The person done that should be made eat the guts.

marcp

shoot to kill wrote: »

What a sickener. Did u tell any one u were going. F**king 60 yards from the road. Hero. I can imagine them sitting in the field not even bothered by the light. The person done that should be made eat the guts.

I don't get ya "did I tell anyone I was going. "

endasmail

Hopefully they`ll be caught, fleabags

snipe49

I'm afraid it's a case of the same thing that put this country in the hole it's in. GREED.There will be no dear left in the wild soon . some might say that would be a good thing. But with so little wild life in this country we do need them. Here in the west there is a dealer giving 100 euro a animal. so lad's are out all night lamping them. one gun was said to have shot 280 deer last year. Yes GREED..

meathstevie

Shower of cnuts....even this evening I was driving to a local permission when I came across a kitted out pick up driving the roads through the particular bog. Can't say anything with any certainty but the location and time of day would make one very suspicious. On top of that a local nuisance informed me one of his mates had him helping building a cool room that holds a dozen carcasses. About time legit hunters start getting very very thick me reckons....

zen260

This is a sad sight I must say, unfortunately its the world we live in and people don't respect human life let alone that of a wild animal,,,these people are sick in the head,,

marcp

Whoever done this was no amatures either. Two perfects strikes on the ground. No mess gralloched perfectly and no plucks on the ground so obviously heading straight to a game dealer.

Only way to stop poaching is to take the money out of the equation.

Tawny Owl

It's very hard to keep tabs on the like's of this, it's the honest Hunter that will suffer in the end, where maybe permissions will be pulled,or curtailed or as said no Deer it should start with who ever is buying the Deer,its not that easy to police, would be nice to hear from people with ideas as to how it might be sorted,big changes compared to 30 years ago, but then again there was always an element of poaching, but I have noticed its getting worse and more reports and court cases.

snipe49

If that could be done then the furture for deer
hunting in this country would be better.

marcp

I think tags would be a good idea. Works for the rest of the world.

Tawny Owl

meathstevie wrote: »

Shower of cnuts....even this evening I was driving to a local permission when I came across a kitted out pick up driving the roads through the particular bog. Can't say anything with any certainty but the location and time of day would make one very suspicious. On top of that a local nuisance informed me one of his mates had him helping building a cool room that holds a dozen carcasses. About time legit hunters start getting very very thick me reckons....

There is no law against building your own cold room, if you say you saw a jeep kitted out what do you mean, they or the person driving may be legit, take the jeep number and report it if their Licenced Hunters well all is well, if not you have just removed another poacher. this is how we will at least control some of the illegal shooting, I know your p####ed off but unless we stick together and report no one else will the Garda have enough on there plate, with all the goings on so I think it's up to us I would love to hear your comments I am not against you as I said.I hope you understand what I am trying to say.

Tawny Owl

marcp wrote: »

I think tags would be a good idea. Works for the rest of the world.

Might be something to add to the discussion alright.

marcp

Problem is would the powers that be bother with the control of it. As is coillte and farmers are on a beano getting money off people for stalking. Why would they change anything.

Tawny Owl

marcp wrote: »

Problem is would the powers that be bother with the control of it. As is coillte and farmers are on a beano getting money off people for stalking. Why would they change anything.

It will change when there are no Deer left no way will I pay €€€€€€ to shoot Deer, if the Deer poaching keeps moving at the pace something has to be changed, a course where you have to be a nominated Hunter shoots and vouches for his or her own kill, and then tags the Deer, now we can trace who shot and prepped the Deer for sale should you want to sell the Deer on.I dont know lads throw in your comments thats how things change, and hopefully for the better.

Dian Cecht

Deer do serious damage to crops, especially to young plantations, which costs people money :mad:

Apart from our native red deer the others eg Fallow & Sika are invasive species in the same way as mink, grey squirrels etc and should be eliminated.

Nobody's cribbing about foxes being hunted night & day with hounds, guns & snares. If deer stalking wasn't making money for Coilte it'd have been a free for all years ago.

PL05

B**tards did,nt even try to conceal grallochs and feet, witch makes me think, was this opportunistic or is this the norm. Just wondering have you came accross this before on your lease. Not saying it makes a differance whether its concealed or not, but if it was regular pr**ks poaching on a certain patch, surely they would do their best not to be noticed. Anyway, we,ve been over this before and same old, F**k all will be done or nothing will change until the amount of carcasses that an individual can sell to a game dealer is capped eg: 2-3 per person per season.

PL05

Dian Cecht wrote: »

Deer do serious damage to crops, especially to young plantations, which costs people money :mad:

Apart from our native red deer the others eg Fallow & Sika are invasive species in the same way as mink, grey squirrels etc and should be eliminated.

Nobody's cribbing about foxes being hunted night & day with hounds, guns & snares. If deer stalking wasn't making money for Coilte it'd have been a free for all years ago.

Think maybe you mean controlled not eliminated. Deer eg: sika and fallow are protected animals foxes are,nt but that does,nt meen that they should be wiped out either and nobody wants to see that either.

Dian Cecht

PL05 wrote: »

Think maybe you mean controlled not eliminated. Deer eg: sika and fallow are protected animals foxes are,nt but that does,nt meen that they should be wiped out either and nobody wants to see that either.

If I'd meant controlled I'd have written controlled.

To me a deer is a bigger agricultural pest than a fox, mink or a rabbit and if they were all gone it'd save farmers a fortune.

Deer are only protected as the Government has a financial interest in them through shooting leases on State land. If there were no money in it they'd be moved to the vermin list with foxes etc

PL05

Dian Cecht wrote: »

If I'd meant controlled I'd have written controlled.

To me a deer is a bigger agricultural pest than a fox, mink or a rabbit and if they were all gone it'd save farmers a fortune.

Deer are only protected as the Government has a financial interest in them through shooting leases on State land. If there were no money in it they'd be moved to the vermin list with foxes etc

I agree that deer can do a lot of damage, but if managed/controlled properly this sort of damage can be reduced. But to say eliminated is over the top and coming from a shooting man is even worse. [i take it you are a shooting man?] but your entitled to an opinion i suppose, but i,ll be straight with you and say your wrong and hope that you dont have a license to hunt deer, because between people with attitudes like that and poachers, pretty soon you might see them wiped out alright. Sad.........................

dodderangler

Dian Cecht wrote: »

Deer do serious damage to crops, especially to young plantations, which costs people money :mad:

Apart from our native red deer the others eg Fallow & Sika are invasive species in the same way as mink, grey squirrels etc and should be eliminated.

.

So your saying poachers are doing our country a favour?
Pull the other one will ya.
Fallow deer were introduced back in the 1100s by the Normans so I'd hardly call them invasive considering they've lived amongst us for 900 years or so.
Sika were brought in the 1800s and have been with Irish almost 150 years so i wouldn't call them invasive species anymore either. They are game and as such a licence is to be permitted to hunt them. Simple as! Sika and fallow aren't exactly eating us out of house and home.
As for grey squirrels they were released to improve diversity in estates which is a load if me b0llox.
it's clear the damage they have done towards the red squirrel decline and thus should be taking care of.
All these animals were released for a purpose.
Mink escaped from fur farms but a lot were released by a bunch of do-gooders that protested against the cruelty they are put through. Of course they also didn't think of the impact a foreign predator would have on our local wildlife and now we're having to deal with that.
Should really do your research before making a statement like that.
Especially on this forum were there is a lot of lads who work hard to maintain they're licence every year for deer and treat them with a lot of respect.
This photo is giving deer hunters a bad name and making them all out to be poachers when they're not.

Capercaille

dodderangler wrote: »

So your saying poachers are doing our country a favour?
Pull the other one will ya.
Fallow deer were introduced back in the 1100s by the Normans so I'd hardly call them invasive considering they've lived amongst us for 900 years or so.
Sika were brought in the 1800s and have been with Irish almost 150 years so i wouldn't call them invasive species anymore either. They are game and as such a licence is to be permitted to hunt them. Simple as! Sika and fallow aren't exactly eating us out of house and home.
As for grey squirrels they were released to improve diversity in estates which is a load if me b0llox.
it's clear the damage they have done towards the red squirrel decline and thus should be taking care of.
All these animals were released for a purpose.
Mink escaped from fur farms but a lot were released by a bunch of do-gooders that protested against the cruelty they are put through. Of course they also didn't think of the impact a foreign predator would have on our local wildlife and now we're having to deal with that.
Should really do your research before making a statement like that.
Especially on this forum were there is a lot of lads who work hard to maintain they're licence every year for deer and treat them with a lot of respect.
This photo is giving deer hunters a bad name and making them all out to be poachers when they're not.

No Red Deer in Wicklow due to Sika deer. Go to the national park and there is hardly any understory trees and limited native tree like oak regeneration. Any area that are deer fenced off has lush growth. Sika should be classified as invasive and exterminated. The only reason there not classified as vermin is because there a game animal.

dodderangler

No they shouldn't. They're a game animal and shouldn't be treated as vermin.
You put them as vermin and you'll end up with every clown with a shotgun out there hitting them with 4s and 5s and injured deer limping everywhere.
Also they'll be making money out of it aswell. Selling the meat ( as most poachers are probably doing anyway) to foreign lands.

Dian Cecht

I am a "shooting man" not that I see what that has to do with anything.

I understand people like to shoot deer for what's basically "sport" & in saying that I don't mean they shoot them for the craic.

I've been reading older threads on this forum and the one thing that I notice is the herd mentality here is very strong and anyone with a different opinion is "jumped on" by said herd.

Deer may be game to you & the people making money from them but to a lot of people they are, to put it politely, an agricultural pest.

I do not agree with poaching or lamping them but if lads are shooting them legally and are selling their surplus then fair dues to them. On this forum it seems any lad who's talking a few to the game dealer is poaching as far as I can see.

A lot of posters here only see things their way. They do not want to see things from others perspective. This is the main problem with hunters/shooters in this country. They think they are right & everyone else is wrong.

A shooter/hunter sees it's quarry as game/food/sport whereas most landowners see the shooters quarry as an agricultural pest/vermin. The only reason you are allowed access to land it to facilitate the removal of these agricultural pests. If you only want to control them then you are not keeping you're part of the deal in my opinion.

aaakev

I have never met a farmer who had asked me to kill everything on his land be that rabbits or foxes or anything else....

rowa

Dian Cecht wrote: »

I've been reading older threads on this forum and the one thing that I notice is the herd mentality here is very strong and anyone with a different opinion is "jumped on" by said herd.

Deer may be game to you & the people making money from them but to a lot of people they are, to put it politely, an agricultural pest.

I do not agree with poaching or lamping them but if lads are shooting them legally and are selling their surplus then fair dues to them. On this forum it seems any lad who's talking a few to the game dealer is poaching as far as I can see.


A shooter/hunter sees it's quarry as game/food/sport whereas most landowners see the shooters quarry as an agricultural pest/vermin. The only reason you are allowed access to land it to facilitate the removal of these agricultural pests. If you only want to control them then you are not keeping you're part of the deal in my opinion.

So its deer shooters now as well as those pesky pistol shooters ?

Selling surpluses ? Lads turing up at game dealers with 20 + carcasses in a van is some surplus. As for deer being an agricultural pest , fine, get a section 42 licence and bang away, i don't see a problem with exterminating deer on your own land.

PL05

Dian Cecht wrote: »

I am a "shooting man" not that I see what that has to do with anything.

I understand people like to shoot deer for what's basically "sport" & in saying that I don't mean they shoot them for the craic.

I've been reading older threads on this forum and the one thing that I notice is the herd mentality here is very strong and anyone with a different opinion is "jumped on" by said herd.

Deer may be game to you & the people making money from them but to a lot of people they are, to put it politely, an agricultural pest.

I do not agree with poaching or lamping them but if lads are shooting them legally and are selling their surplus then fair dues to them. On this forum it seems any lad who's talking a few to the game dealer is poaching as far as I can see.

A lot of posters here only see things their way. They do not want to see things from others perspective. This is the main problem with hunters/shooters in this country. They think they are right & everyone else is wrong.

A shooter/hunter sees it's quarry as game/food/sport whereas most landowners see the shooters quarry as an agricultural pest/vermin. The only reason you are allowed access to land it to facilitate the removal of these agricultural pests. If you only want to control them then you are not keeping you're part of the deal in my opinion.

The reason i asked are you a shooting man is. any man that i know or met that hunts is conservation minded and im surprised that someone who shoots , would be ok with a spieces wiped out. As i said earlier you are entitled to an opinion but that does,nt mean everyone has to agree with it. As said on here by others, i too have to meet a farmer or landowner who would like to see any spieces eliminated. Not going to argue here because it only gives fodder to the anti,s and makes us look bad, so we,ll agree to disagree and leave it there.

Lotharmike

If people read the op's post before losing the run of themselves he says a stalk on his lease,that entails a HCAP Course & a nice lump of change to Coillte to boot.For some opportunistic gob****e to Poach from a let he has paid for.Aside from the rights & wrongs of the current system we have that is criminality & needs to be dealt with as such.Report to Gardai as a theft.Enough people do it & question local game dealers as to the source of their carcasses then you might see some action.My own personal belief is we as licensed hunters who wish to stalk Deer should have to Buy Tags from NPWS to fund a proper herd management program & all sale of wild Venison be banned for a minimum of 10 years until a proper study of numbers & habitat is undertaken.Might not be to popular a proposal but would wipe out Commercial Deer poaching overnight.If you return a kill on a tag to NPWS you should get another in season free.Just a thought.

Dian Cecht

aaakev wrote: »

I have never met a farmer who had asked me to kill everything on his land be that rabbits or foxes or anything else....

Really All the farmers I know, which is a lot all over the country, must be the only ones loosing money to deer, rabbits, foxes & grey crow damage so

Dian Cecht

rowa wrote: »

So its deer shooters now as well as those pesky pistol shooters ?

Selling surpluses ? Lads turing up at game dealers with 20 + carcasses in a van is some surplus. As for deer being an agricultural pest , fine, get a section 42 licence and bang away, i don't see a problem with exterminating deer on your own land.

In the near future, once we know what they've brought down on us, we'll discuss the legacy of as you call them "the pesky pistol shooters".

Unless you can prove those 20 deer were not legally killed you cannot assume it's the result of poaching. Or has the innocent until proven guilty concept been done away with. Or is it more to do with my earlier post in so far as the stalker is doing what he's been asked to do by the landowner/s?

Dian Cecht

PL05 wrote: »

The reason i asked are you a shooting man is. any man that i know or met that hunts is conservation minded and im surprised that someone who shoots , would be ok with a spieces wiped out. As i said earlier you are entitled to an opinion but that does,nt mean everyone has to agree with it. As said on here by others, i too have to meet a farmer or landowner who would like to see any spieces eliminated. Not going to argue here because it only gives fodder to the anti,s and makes us look bad, so we,ll agree to disagree and leave it there.

I am a shooter more so of necessity than as a hobby. That's means you & I see things differently.