Dublin GAA Discussion Thread MOD WARNING POST #2944

Cu Baire

keane2097 wrote: »

His comments about Fitzgerald are pretty poor, but a guy is entitled to a small moan the odd time without accusations of mask-slippage I think!

Maybe wrong choice of words. But there is a definite change in demeanour from the Dublin Management team over the last 12 months.
Then again most intercounty set ups these days like to develop a siege mentality to bond the group.

DDC1990

Think the comments are a being a bit harsh on Gavin.

Yes the comments on Fitzgerald are poor, but then you have to consider he got one look at the incident (and judging from his comments he didn't even get a good look at it).

If he'd come out with that this morning having watched it back, it'd be embarrassing, as it was for me, as clearcut a red card as you can get, charging in from the other side of the pitch to strike a guy in the head area. Whether it was a push to the head or a strike the the head is rather irrelevant.

If he'd questioned O'Brien being on the field after striking out at Cooper, that would be reasonable, or a number of other descisions that went against Dublin, including a couple of clear picks off the ground, that would have been fine. But to suggest that any of the cards were influenced by Kerry players as he suggested was poor judgement.

(Also in response to whether Donaghy is the most dislikeable footballer in Ireland... not by a longshot. Donaghy gives as good as he gets, isn't slow in getting involved in a schmozzle, and will trash talk all day, which is his most dislikeable feature IMO. However, there are plenty of footballers around the country that are sly, filthy and do things to put other players in danger (throwing guys into the hoarding for example). You'd never see Donaghy stamp on an injured players ankle or the likes )


EDIT: The only comment that I was disappointed with was saying "I am happy with how my players conducted themselves". I wouldn't be! A lot of lads let themselves down for both sides getting involved in off the ball rubbish, and leaving late elbows and fists in. I don't think Fitzmaurice is happy with some of the stupid fouls committed by Kerry, and the melee at the end, despite the result. Those sort of incidents can get you in trouble down the line, and Kerry are already picking up a repuation having been involved in a scrap in the last 3 close games we were in (Mayo Replay, Donegal and Yesterday)

DoctaDee

I was up in a well known trainers yard last year, watching the horses being rode out on the gallops at 7.00am on a Saturday morning but my jaysis I still think it was colder in Killarney last Sunday, but I digress :rolleyes: anyways the lad that was with me, his Dad was part of a syndicate who owned a horse that the trainer had bought at the sales for them schooled etc etc.

I don't know how many times it had raced, but my mate was getting stuck into the trainer in a non too serious way .. jaysis that yoke you got my father is a pony... kin useless, they're throwing good money after bad on that thing. The trainer looked up at us from his cuppa ... "Don't you fackin worry, it'll win when it has to"

This of course becomes the big leap of faith, trusting the man at the helm that he'll be true to his word - and in some respects wishing that you were in the inner circle knowing what race will be that race.

I like Killarney, always have, be it for football matches or just a few days away. I went down last weekend confident of a good showing from Dublin but more so because the CCC2 underage football had a week off last week and it fitted in nicely with that schedule. It's never nice to see your team lose and not being privy to the internal workings of the set up, it can be hard to understand where the greater good is served by that result.

It's clear to me that Gavin doesn't have a care for the NFL this year. I said as much before the 1st ball was thrown in - the biggest challenge for Dublin will be to make the top 4 for the semis. When Gavin talks of "a process to be followed through" in response to being asked when the big boys will come out to play, it becomes a lot like that horse trainer - Dublin will win when they have to win, and that's the leap of faith that we must take.

There were no saints and sinners last Sunday .. just sinners and sinners. The last 2 NFL games involving Dublin were risible charades for settling old scores - and yes you do feel short changed. I think anyone that was at the game or watched it on TV would have the good grace to admit that the better team won.

In other news there was a hugely competitive game between the seniors and the U21's the week before last, which may have been part of Gavins "process to be followed" - O'Moore Park this weekend may hold some of the answers. Ta

davegrohl48

I think OGara may revert to an impact sub role. With defenders fresher and not on ticks/yellows he has much less freedom. Coming in off the bench I think he can be more effective.
James Mccaffrey is playing such excellent stuff right now I think ye should seriously consider him for midfield or half forward. He looks really assured in his passing n shooting. Mix into that MDMA/OSullivan returning and thats a really strong middle third.

DDC1990

McCaffrey has to be played at Wing Forward IMO.

Totally exposed as a defender in big games (Kerry v Dublin 2013 and Dublin v Donegal 2014 to name 2), but a wonderful attacking prospect. Electric pace, good point scorer and gets the odd cracking goal.

A half forward line of Flynn, Connolly, McCaffrey would cause any team difficulty IMO.

However, with my Kerry hat on, proceed with him at half-back... nothing to see here!

Pierce_1991

O'Gara should be nowhere near the starting lineup for me.

davegrohl48

DDC1990 wrote: »

McCaffrey has to be played at Wing Forward IMO.

Totally exposed as a defender in big games (Kerry v Dublin 2013 and Dublin v Donegal 2014 to name 2), but a wonderful attacking prospect. Electric pace, good point scorer and gets the odd cracking goal.

A half forward line of Flynn, Connolly, McCaffrey would cause any team difficulty IMO.

However, with my Kerry hat on, proceed with him at half-back... nothing to see here!

Mccaffrey is alot bigger n stronger now for tackling as a defender. But I agree with you would be lethal forward line of potentially:
Flynn Connolly Mccaffrey
Costello McManamon B. Brogan
Then ya have Rock/Andrews/OGara.
One tactic I'm suprised Dublin haven't tried is to pick Cian OSullivan corner forward but play him out around the middle. I'v always followed his kick passing closely n he can pick out guys with accuracy n is great as a running threat. At midfield he has to get involved with more defensive duties at times. Picked in the corner he has a bit more licence to stay around the 45. Dublin have sufficient cover at midfield once MDMA is back.

smileyj1987

Pierce_1991 wrote: »

O'Gara should be nowhere near the starting lineup for me.

He does offer a tank of a player who is hard to knock off the ball but he doesn't seem to offer very much else !
I would be using him as a sub and that's about it.

Pierce_1991

smileyj1987 wrote: »

He does offer a tank of a player who is hard to knock off the ball but he doesn't seem to offer very much else !
I would be using him as a sub and that's about it.

I don't even think he offers that to a huge extent, he runs down cul de sacs so often, seems incapable of soloing the ball and isn't great at hitting points. He's a great finisher of goals but he doesn't get the chances often enough. Impact sub would be the most I want to see of him.

Gael85

Dublin have used 29 players in 3 League games.Appearances+Subs for 2015 League Games

Bastic, Denis 3
Brady, Tomas 3
Cooper, Jonny 3
Costello, Cormac 3
Currie, Sean 3 (2 Clean Sheets)
Daly, Darren 3
McManamon, Kevin 3
O'Gara, Eoghan 3
Rock, Dean 3
McCaffrey, Jack 2+1
Lowndes, Eric 1+2
Carthy, Shane 2
Culligan, Eoin 2
Fitzsimons, Michael 2
O'Carroll, Rory 2
O'Conghaile, Emmett 2
Small, John 2
Kilkenny, Ciaran 1+1
McMahon, Philip 1+1
Brogan, Bernard 0+2
Byrne, Davy (Ballymun) 0+2
Reddin, Ciaran 0+2
Fenton, Brian 0+2
Andrews, Paddy 0+1
Byrne, David (Olafs) 0+1
Deegan, Michael 0+1
Devereux, Nicky 0+1
McHugh, Conor 0+1
O'Sullivan, Cian 0+1



Dublin have scored 3-36 and conceded 1-41 in 3 League games. Scorers 2015 League Games

Rock, Dean 0-14
McCaffrey, Jack 1-3
Brogan, Bernard 1-2
O'Gara, Eoghan 0-4
Costello, Cormac 1-1
McManamon, Kevin 0-3
Brady, Tomas 0-2
Carthy, Shane 0-2
Kilkenny, Ciaran 0-2
Byrne, Davy (Ballymun) 0-1
Deegan, Michael 0-1
O'Conghaile, Emmett 0-1

Dublin have used 34 players in 5 O'Byrne Cup games.Appearances+Subs for 2015 O'Byrne Cup

Brady, Tomas 5
Culligan, Eoin 5
Devereux, Nicky 5
O'Conghaile, Emmett 5
Rock, Dean 5
Small, John 5
Daly, Darren 5
Fitzsimons, Michael 4+1
Bastick, Denis 4
O'Gara, Eoghan 4
Hannigan, Graham 3+1
Ryan, Philip 2+2
Carthy, Shane 1+3
Scully, Niall 0+4
Costello, Cormac 3
McManamon, Kevin 3
Molloy, Lorcan 3 (1 Clean Sheet)
Collins, Niall 2+1
O'Carroll, Rory 2+1
Cooper, Jonny 1+2
Dawson, Harry 1+2
Lowndes, Stuart 0+3
Currie, Sean 2 (1 Clean Sheet)
McCaffrey, Jack 1+1
Dunleavy, Craig 1+1
Deegan, Michael 0+2
Kavanagh, Ian 0+2
Macauley, Michael Darragh 0+2
O'Higgins, Paddy 0+2
McCarrick, Alan 0+1
McGowan, Ross 0+1
McGuire, Conor 0+1
McLoughlin, Diarmuid 0+1
McMahon, Philip 0+1

Dublin have scored 3-80 and conceded 3-43 in 5 O'Byrne Cup games. Scorers 2015 O'Byrne Cup Games

Rock, Dean 0-38
O'Gara, Eoghan 2-7
McManamon, Kevin 1-6
Brady, Tomas 0-7
O'Conghaile, Emmett 0-6
Carthy, Shane 0-5
Ryan, Philip 0-3
Costello, Cormac 0-2
Deegan, Michael 0-2
Cooper, Jonny 0-1
Culligan, Eoin 0-1
McLoughlin, Diarmuid 0-1
Scully, Niall 0-1

ProudDUB

smileyj1987 wrote: »

He does offer a tank of a player who is hard to knock off the ball but he doesn't seem to offer very much else !
I would be using him as a sub and that's about it.

I wouldn't be too quick to discount what he brings to the table, in terms of winning dirty ball. Not all of the forwards are willing or able to do. I've no complaints with BB, Dermo & Flynn in that regard, but Rock and Costello don't even attempt to do it & Kev Mc seems to get called a lot for over carrying when he tries to do it. The champo may be different, but in this years O'Byrne Cup and 3 league games, that's what I've seen. I'd be reluctant to discard that aspect of his game, unless we know for sure we have it covered else where. It is something that Paddy Andrews did very well & to great effect when he was fully fit back in 2013.

Nidgeweasel

Pierce_1991 wrote: »

O'Gara should be nowhere near the starting lineup for me.

I have to be honest here, I think the guy is ****e.

Purely from an opposition stand point I like to see him lining out against us.

keane2097

This time last year O'Gara was one of the form players in Division 1 IIRC. He seems to have regressed badly over the last nine or ten months.

Godge

Pierce_1991 wrote: »

O'Gara should be nowhere near the starting lineup for me.

A few posts below yours is the scoring stats for the League and O'Byrne.

Leading both is Rock as free-taker.

McCaffrey and Brogan are the next two in the league but O'Gara is the leading points scorer from play in the League and second-highest scorer overall in the O'Byrne Cup.

On Sunday I thought the amount and quality of ball into the full-forward line was very poor. The game was lost in the middle of the park. O'Gara wasn't playing midfield last I checked.

Nidgeweasel

keane2097 wrote: »

This time last year O'Gara was one of the form players in Division 1 IIRC. He seems to have regressed badly over the last nine or ten months.

Form is temporary, class is permanent!

DoctaDee

keane2097 wrote: »

This time last year O'Gara was one of the form players in Division 1 IIRC. He seems to have regressed badly over the last nine or ten months.

I was in the middle of a long winded reply, but ^^^ covers my point to a T. There were certain periods particulalrly v Mayo when he was good to the point of being unplayable. I think O'Gara's biggest drawback at the moment is the fact he's quite 1 dimensional. Big men like Murphy and Donaghy have the ability to adapt their game further out the field, whereas EOG relies on his strength inside the 45. The fact that he was tied up by 4 or 5 men at a time by Donegal would make anyone look ineffective

keane2097

DoctaDee wrote: »

I was in the middle of a long winded reply, but ^^^ covers my point to a T. There were certain periods particulalrly v Mayo when he was good to the point of being unplayable. I think O'Gara's biggest drawback at the moment is the fact he's quite 1 dimensional. Big men like Murphy and Donaghy have the ability to adapt their game further out the field, whereas EOG relies on his strength inside the 45. The fact that he was tied up by 4 or 5 men at a time by Donegal would make anyone look ineffective

There's also the question of whether people are expecting too much/the wrong things from him at times.

He's at his most effective when he has the likes of Brogan taking attention off him, and definitely isn't good enough to cope with the fact that early in the league he's the forward teams actually plan to counteract.

With a properly stacked forward line buzzing around I'd take O'Gara winning ball, laying it off quickly, generally being a nuisance any day of the week over Dean Rock floating around pretending like he's ever going to do anything.

O'Gara is certainly not elegant, but used right can be very effective and help others around be as well.

Padraig1888

Anything on after the game Saturday? Seen there's Erin Go Bragh on in Tolka Park after the game. The 1916 Societies organising it, don't know anything about them.

DoctaDee

Padraig1888 wrote: »

Anything on after the game Saturday? Seen there's Erin Go Bragh on in Tolka Park after the game. The 1916 Societies organising it, don't know anything about them.

Ah I think you do

Padraig1888 wrote: »

Free Irish lessons – Tallaght


Fettercairn Community Centre – Monday February 23rd @ 7:30pm (every Monday thereafter)
Lessons are beginner conversational Irish and the lessons are completely free.


Organised by Pádraig Pearse 1916 Society, Clondalkin/Tallaght

Past30Now

keane2097 wrote: »

There's also the question of whether people are expecting too much/the wrong things from him at times.

He's at his most effective when he has the likes of Brogan taking attention off him, and definitely isn't good enough to cope with the fact that early in the league he's the forward teams actually plan to counteract.

With a properly stacked forward line buzzing around I'd take O'Gara winning ball, laying it off quickly, generally being a nuisance any day of the week over Dean Rock floating around pretending like he's ever going to do anything.

O'Gara is certainly not elegant, but used right can be very effective and help others around be as well.

I agree with this completely. O'Gara is such a nightmare for defenders. Its fine for them when they can concentrate solely on him but when Bernard, Flynn and Connolly are in the team he'll run riot. I think that Gavin will continue to start him in the white heat of the championship. The point about Dean Rock isn't far wrong either and I don't see him on our starting 15.

copacetic

Agree with above, O'Gara has his ups and downs and the ball bounces off him a bit, but he got in much better form last year and often tied up two defenders or at the very least the biggest meanest defender, saving someone else having to deal with them. He also takes what seems like 80% of the rough stuff on himself over and over again and has gotten amazing at not responding too much. He also doesn't go in to hiding when the going gets tough the way some of our forwards can.

If imagine the whole rest of the front line is delighted when he is on the pitch and he is the only real out and out ball winning target man full forward we have (even if he isn't the best he could be it). He just isn't suited to carrying a forward line in league games, he needs to fit in to a line up of clinical scorers around him.

EICVD

Talking of O'Gara was anyone at the U21 game last night? Is young Killian similar in physic to his big brother? Sounded like Laois made a game of it for 50 minutes at least. Longford will be hoping for a repeat of 2013 on the 18th. Does anyone actually know the venue for this game too? Haven't seen anything yet.

EICVD

Just seen the the U21 game is in Navan, just up the M3 from me, perfect!

Billy Mays

EICVD wrote: »

Talking of O'Gara was anyone at the U21 game last night? Is young Killian similar in physic to his big brother? Sounded like Laois made a game of it for 50 minutes at least. Longford will be hoping for a repeat of 2013 on the 18th. Does anyone actually know the venue for this game too? Haven't seen anything yet.

I was at the game. He's very similar in size to Eoghan and was a real handful. Scored 1-3 from play.

DoctaDee

Billy Mays wrote: »

I was at the game. He's very similar in size to Eoghan and was a real handful. Scored 1-3 from play.

I have to be honest and say I don't know much about the chap, but if you were a man up a tree at the recent Seniors v U21's challenge game I believe you couldn't fail but be impressed by the lad

DoctaDee

Dublin team to face Tyrone

Cluxton

Culligan, O'Carroll, Cooper,

Devereaux, McMahon, McCaffrey,

Bastick, O'Conghaile,

Brady,Rock, Kilkenny,

McMenamon, Andrews,Brogan


9th start in a row for Rock at CF, personally would've liked Kilkenny in there and Davey Byrne on the wing

ProudDUB

Very strong team that. Wouldn't be surprised to see another change or two before throw in. Another start for Dean Rock. I hate to sound harsh, but he needs to $hit or get off the pot. If he is not going to contribute from open play, it's time to start giving others a chance to show that they can.

DoctaDee

ProudDUB wrote: »

Very strong team that. Wouldn't be surprised to see another change or two before throw in. Another start for Dean Rock. I hate to sound harsh, but he needs to $hit or get off the pot. If he is not going to contribute from open play, it's time to start giving others a chance to show that they can.

Oh 100% agreed on Rock PD. personally don't think he has what is required to pull the strings in attack. I tend to cast my mind back to the AI Club final when he was needed most he was found wanting (and I say this as an ex Kickhams player) I'm guessing the 21's are being left to recharge the batteries.

It's the first panel this year that I've got the impression that there's a bit of attacking menace waiting for Tyrone. I hope that Paddy Andrews is left inside with BB rather than the roving role he's played recently - I think he's a good target man capable of winning his fair share of ball - he was the best forward in club football 3-4 years ago, so it'sin the locker if he can find the confidence. I'd be interested to know how far along Cian O'Sullivan is in his rehab/training, I know last week was a forced entry with Basticks black card but I'd expect him to make some contribution. As others have said I would've liked to have seen how Jack Mc would get on at wing forward, Jim Gavin raised my hopes in the OBC semi against Meath but he doesn't appear to want to follow thru on the experiment - Jim if yer reading this stick COS half back and Jack Mc half forward :rolleyes:

pluszap

Dublin (HL Division 1A v Cork) - Alan Nolan; Cian O'Callaghan, Michael Carton, Paul Schutte; Chris Crummey, Peter Kelly, Conal Keaney; Shane Durkin, Niall McMorrow; Ryan O'Dwyer, Eamonn Dillon, Danny Sutcliffe; David Treacy, Liam Rushe, Mark Schutte.

pluszap

Dublin (HL Division 1A v Cork) - Alan Nolan; Cian O'Callaghan, Michael Carton, Paul Schutte; Chris Crummey, Peter Kelly, Conal Keaney; Shane Durkin, Niall McMorrow; Ryan O'Dwyer, Eamonn Dillon, Danny Sutcliffe; David Treacy, Liam Rushe, Mark Schutte.