Science! Ask you question here. Biscuits NOT included and answers not guaranteed.

Brian Shanahan

koth wrote: »

Atheists go to hell, just like anyone God casts away. If I'm on a list for the fiery place then I don't fancy my odds when he gets in a drowning mood again.

Hey, if heaven and hell really exist, I bet most who get into heaven slip down below after a few days. Sitting on a cloud polishing a halo gets old very quickly.

J C

Todd Toddington III wrote: »

Well no actually my father is John. And his father was Vincent.

... if you keep going back about 300 generations or so ... you will come to God.

Todd Toddington III

(Wouldn't that also have seen the flood coming?)

J C wrote: »

... if you keep going back about 300 generations or so ... you will come to God.

Well if you go back a few million more generations you get some slime. And millions before that, a star. So really, god is a star, or some slime. Im happy with either

J C

Brian Shanahan wrote: »

Hey, if heaven and hell really exist, I bet most who get into heaven slip down below after a few days. Sitting on a cloud polishing a halo gets old very quickly.

... beats sitting in a pit getting your toes toasted any day!!!:)

... but of course halo polishing is only practiced during the first week in Heaven ... you then go on the fabulous expeditions into paradise and attend the really stimulating science talks given by Darwin and Huxley ... yes they sneaked in the back door when nobody was looking ... and now they are creation experts!!!:)

Rayne Wooney

J C wrote: »

That's a bit like asking why murderers are made out to be the bad guys ... when its the judges who sentence them to death and the executioners who execute them?

Satan is the lawless one ... and God is always patient, always loving ... but ultimately a just judge ... when He has to be.

Can you explain what Satan has done to topple killing millions of innocent people?

I'm genuinely interested in how someone could do worse

Howard Juneau

Todd Toddington III wrote: »

Well if you go back a few million more generations you get some slime. And millions before that, a star. So really, god is a star, or some slime. Im happy with either

Miley Cyrus is a star QED god is Miley Cyrus!
Oh help

J C

Todd Toddington III wrote: »

Well if you go back a few million more generations you get some slime. And millions before that, a star. So really, god is a star, or some slime. Im happy with either

... would that be the slime that infests everyones' patios after a wet summer?

... and is that a 'living fossil' as well?

J C

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

Can you explain what Satan has done to topple killing millions of innocent people?

I'm genuinely interested in how someone could do worse

Satan is the proximate cause of all death ... and you can't top that!!!

Rayne Wooney

J C wrote: »

He is the ultimate reason for all death ... and you can't top that!!!

But you said earlier people died because of weather and tectonic activity?

And god controls those, so would that not in a way make god=satan?

Brian Shanahan

J C wrote: »

That's our Fallen World allright ... fallen because of Satans nefarious system of good and evil.

JC when you reply to my posts, at least do me the justice of reading them. When I reply to you I read your posts.

And, yes, it is obvious that you didn't read my post, as you'd have realised that I quoted a passage recommending that we should hold such gods as the one you believe in the lowest contempt possible, if they even exist, not the drivel I have just replied to.

smcgiff

J C wrote: »

... if you keep going back about 300 generations or so ... you will come to God.

Zeus?

Todd Toddington III

(Wouldn't that also have seen the flood coming?)

J C wrote: »

... would that be the slime that infests everyones' patios after a wet summer?

... and is that a 'living fossil' as well?

The primordial soup, from whence we came. Google it, plenty to read on it too. Lots of sources and papers published in science magazines.

Brian Shanahan

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

Can you explain what Satan has done to topple killing millions of innocent people?

I'm genuinely interested in how someone could do worse

He killed ten people, well maybe 60 (if you read further).

smcgiff

J C wrote: »

... beats sitting in a pit getting your toes toasted any day!!!:)

... but of course halo polishing is only practiced during the first week in Heaven ... you then go on the fabulous expeditions into paradise and attend the really stimulating science talks given by Darwin and Huxley ... yes they sneaked in the back door when nobody was looking ... and now they are creation experts!!!:)

Thanks for the smiley, because, you know, of the stuff you post it'd be hard to tell when you're not being serious.

pauldla

FYI: This is Option Number Twenty-Five. Isn't this being a bit, uh, mean on the hamsters?

Brian Shanahan wrote: »

He killed ten people, well maybe 60 (if you read further).

Only Boba Fett surpasses him as 'fictional bad guys who are actually big girls' blouses'.

Cabaal

OMG! Spoiler!

J C wrote: »

He really doesn't like evil obviously.
... and He will answer the prayers of those who call on Him ... in His own chosen way.

He will? Wow,
Didn't answer the prayers of the jews during the camps in the 40s, all 6million of them.
Didn't answer the prayers of sex abuse victims.
Didnt answer the prayers of americans during 9/11.

Got any credible recent examples of where he answered a group of peoples prayers?

pauldla

FYI: This is Option Number Twenty-Five. Isn't this being a bit, uh, mean on the hamsters?

Cabaal wrote: »

He will? Wow,
Didn't answer the prayers of the jews during the camps in the 40s, all 6million of them.
Didn't answer the prayers of sex abuse victims.
Didnt answer the prayers of americans during 9/11.

Got any credible recent examples of where he answered a group of peoples prayers?

There was a recent wedding in Mullingar, where people prayed for the rain to hold off for another hour or two, and He answered that one. It was all over the Chinese media.

God: prevents dampening of wedding-goers, but allows near-annihilation of European Jewry. What a guy!

bumper234

FYI: This is Option Number Twenty-Five. Isn't this being a bit, uh, mean on the hamsters?

J C wrote: »

Satan is the proximate cause of all death ... and you can't top that!!!

But "God" caused the flood that caused the annihilation of mankind (except for one incestuous family).

Cabaal

OMG! Spoiler!

J C wrote: »

Satan is the proximate cause of all death ... and you can't top that!!!

But if somebody dies people say it was gods will, including priests.

So either all these people including priests are worshipping the devil or they all believe god controls death.

Also, god killed more people in the Bible then the devil.

Delirium

FYI: This is Option Number Twenty-Five. Isn't this being a bit, uh, mean on the hamsters?

J C wrote: »

Satan is the proximate cause of all death ... and you can't top that!!!

Oh, please. God kills all life on Earth bar whats on one boat and "it's Satans fault"? How? did Satan compel God to kill? And why would he seeing as he wants evil to suceed?

oldrnwisr

koth wrote: »

Really? Because the last time I checked the one sending plagues, killer angels or global floods was God. Satan seems to get a bad rep even though it's your god running amok through creation slaughtering people.

Satan certainly does seem to get a bad rep, especially when you've got Christians making sh1t up about him, like this:

J C wrote: »

Satan is the proximate cause of all death ... and you can't top that!!!

Satan is not the evil mastermind Sauron-type villain that you have portrayed him as JC. And here's why.

Satan is actually mentioned very rarely in the Old Testament. The word satan actually translates as adversary and in most cases, this is the context in thich it is used. In total the word satan or

שָׂטָ֔ן

only occurs (in its various grammatical forms) 27 times. In some places Satan is portrayed as a benevolent force such as when he appears to Balaam in Numbers 22:

"Balaam got up in the morning, saddled his donkey and went with the Moabite officials. But God was very angry when he went, and the angel of the Lord stood in the road to oppose him. Balaam was riding on his donkey, and his two servants were with him. When the donkey saw the angel of the Lord standing in the road with a drawn sword in his hand, it turned off the road into a field. Balaam beat it to get it back on the road. Then the angel of the Lord stood in a narrow path through the vineyards, with walls on both sides. When the donkey saw the angel of the Lord, it pressed close to the wall, crushing Balaam’s foot against it. So he beat the donkey again.
Then the angel of the Lord moved on ahead and stood in a narrow place where there was no room to turn, either to the right or to the left. When the donkey saw the angel of the Lord, it lay down under Balaam, and he was angry and beat it with his staff. Then the Lord opened the donkey’s mouth, and it said to Balaam, “What have I done to you to make you beat me these three times?”
Balaam answered the donkey, “You have made a fool of me! If only I had a sword in my hand, I would kill you right now.”
The donkey said to Balaam, “Am I not your own donkey, which you have always ridden, to this day? Have I been in the habit of doing this to you?”
“No,” he said.
Then the Lord opened Balaam’s eyes, and he saw the angel of the Lord standing in the road with his sword drawn. So he bowed low and fell facedown.
The angel of the Lord asked him, “Why have you beaten your donkey these three times? I have come here to oppose you because your path is a reckless one before me."

In this story Satan appears to Balaam to dissuade him from taking a reckless path. Satan's non-evil nature is even shown in the way he is introduced "mal'ach Yahwheh", an angel of God.

The only instances where Satan appears to act in any kind of malevolent capacity is when he is described as

הַשָּׂטָ֖ן

which is ha-satan or the adversary or more correctly, the accuser. This form of the word is only found twice in Job and Zechariah. It features more prominently in Job where Satan acts as a prosecutor acting under the direction of God. He is given free reign by God to test Job's faith as he sees fit (apart from physical injury).
It is used in this same form in Zechariah 3:2, where Satan again acts as an accuser.

In her book "The Origin of Satan" Elaine Pagels describes the transformation of Satan from an angel into the supervillain JC talks about. During the Maccabean revolt a divide emerges between nationalistic Jews and those seeking to incorporate Hellenistic influences into Judaic thinking. Pagels states:

"More radical than their predecessors these dissidents began increasingly to invoke the satan to characterise their Jewish opponents; in the process they turned this rather unpleasant angel into a far grander - and far more malevolent - figure. No longer one of God's faithful servants, he begins to become what he is for Mark and later Christianity - God's antagonist, his enemy, even his rival."

This is how we see Satan early in the Gospels, a being who no longer tests mankind for God but instead seeks to test God:

"And Jesus answered and said to him, “It is said, ‘You shall not put the Lord your God to the test.’”
Luke 4:12


Oh, and while we're at it one more thing. Satan is not, contrary to common Christian belief, the serpent of Genesis. The appearance of the serpent in Genesis is described thus:

" Now the serpent was more crafty than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made. And he said to the woman, “Indeed, has God said, ‘You shall not eat from URL="http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis+3#fen-NASB-57a"]a[/URLany tree of the garden’?”"
Genesis 3:1

Firstly, the serpent is described as just another beast of the field which god has made and the word used for serpent is the one used to describe all other instances of snakes and serpents in the OT.

The first and only association between the serpent in Genesis and Satan doesn't arrive until Revelations, a book that wasn't written until almost 600 years after Genesis. In Revelations we see the following passage:

"And he laid hold of the dragon, the serpent of old, who is the devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years; and he threw him into the abyss, and shut it and sealed it over him, so that he would not deceive the nations any longer, until the thousand years were completed; after these things he must be released for a short time."
Revelation 20:2-3

Here Satan is described as a dragon, a serpent of old. However this isn't a reference to Genesis. Instead, it is a reference to the Greek, Latin and pretty much every other language's meaning of dragon. The greek word for dragon is:

δράκων

which literally translates as serpent or giant seafish.

Dragon (wiki)

Dragons throughout history have always been portrayed as having some degree of serpentine features.

So, in summary, there's no evidence that the author of Revelation (a book derived from hallucinatory visions btw) intended to refer to the serpent of Genesis when talking about Satan. More importantly, the book was written at a point when the figure of Satan had already been transformed into a supervillain. So the idea that the authors of Genesis ever intended the serpent in Genesis to represent Satan is ridiculous.

Satan is yet another Christian theme which has evolved over centuries as new influences took hold of Judaic thinking, which given the fact we're talking about creationism, is just hilarious.

Sonics2k

J C wrote: »

Satan is the proximate cause of all death ... and you can't top that!!!

Except the ones in the Flood.

Bannasidhe

Sonics2k wrote: »

Except the ones in the Flood.

and the Crusades....

Delirium

FYI: This is Option Number Twenty-Five. Isn't this being a bit, uh, mean on the hamsters?

Bannasidhe wrote: »

and the Crusades....

and the slaughter of Egyptian infants.

bumper234

FYI: This is Option Number Twenty-Five. Isn't this being a bit, uh, mean on the hamsters?

oldrnwisr's posts have taught me one thing......drugs were wayyyyyy more powerful back in "biblical" times. It's the only explanation for some of the sh/it that is written:)

lazygal

Even if God flooded the Earth? How does He destroy THUNDERBIRD 4?

Oldrnwisr, is there anything you don't know?! I flipping love your posts.

eyescreamcone

Was Noah the only guy in the whole world with a boat?

How did Noah collect all the different species?
Including the marsupials and those recently discovered species from South America?

Where did all the water come from - remember it covered Mount Ararat (highest peak ~17,000ft).
Thus a lot of water was needed to cover the world to a depth of 17,000 feet!!!
Then where did it go...after 40 days. Down the plug hole?

Why did god spare the fish and kill so many land animals?

Why does he say that incest is bad and then create scenarios for it to flourish?
Adam and Eve + Noah's gang!

Cabaal

OMG! Spoiler!

eyescreamcone wrote: »

Was Noah the only guy in the whole world with a boat?

How did Noah collect all the different species?
Including the marsupials and those recently discovered species from South America?

Where did all the water come from - remember it covered Mount Ararat (highest peak ~17,000ft).
Thus a lot of water was needed to cover the world to a depth of 17,000 feet!!!
Then where did it go...after 40 days. Down the plug hole?

Why did god spare the fish and kill so many land animals?

Why does he say that incest is bad and then create scenarios for it to flourish?
Adam and Eve + Noah's gang!

We've already learned how all of these logistical barriers were resolved, it was all due to god ultimately.

You can't argue with somebody who believes fairytales are fact,

So anyway, guys any suggestion how I can shop in Aldi later?

Its just my local Aldi has a gingerbread house for sale and I know from the true story's I read as a child that I must ALWAYS stay away from gingerbread houses. Bloody witches!

Obliq

FYI: This is Option Number Twenty-Five. Isn't this being a bit, uh, mean on the hamsters?

Cabaal wrote: »

So anyway, guys any suggestion how I can shop in Aldi later?

Its just my local Aldi has a gingerbread house for sale and I know from the true story's I read as a child that I must ALWAYS stay away from gingerbread houses. Bloody witches!

Send in a Christian.

Cabaal

OMG! Spoiler!

Obliq wrote: »

Send in a Christian.

nah, won't work anymore, :mad:

Back in the good old days they'd have those witches burnt or drowned, but they don't believe in witches anymore so they won't do jack anymore.

I don't know how the don't believe in them anymore, specifically considering that the Vatican used to investigate them and stuff. I mean, surely the Vatican can't be wrong? :pac: