Lack of new routes at Cork airport

draiochtanois

This post has been deleted.

Bacchus

draiochtanois wrote: »

And you think they are flying their staff around EMEA wholesale?
You are having a laugh right?

I think it's pretty obvious he is saying that there are a lot of big companies in Cork that use European routes. Are you really contesting that?

notharrypotter

Bacchus wrote: »

I think it's pretty obvious he is saying that there are a lot of big companies in Cork that use European routes. Are you really contesting that?

There is no disputing that there are a number of large businesses in Cork.
There is no disputing that they send employees on business trips.

The actual amount of business travel undertaken by Cork based businesses may be over estimated by some people.

Bacchus

notharrypotter wrote: »

There is no disputing that there are a number of large businesses in Cork.
There is no disputing that they send employees on business trips.

The actual amount of business travel undertaken by Cork based businesses may be over estimated by some people.

Who's over estimating? Who's even estimating figures here? The only comments I see are making the two points you list at the start of your post - that the routes are used by businesses and Cork has a well established pool of businesses. Keeping the routes open is a positive thing in terms of attracting more business to the area.

JCX BXC

Just because a company with several hundred employees sends 5 people to Rome a week doesnt warrant a service, people seem to think if a company wants a route to somewhere that they will fill all the seats. That's over estimating.

Bacchus

Carnacalla wrote: »

Just because a company with several hundred employees sends 5 people to Rome a week doesnt warrant a service, people seem to think if a company wants a route to somewhere that they will fill all the seats. That's over estimating.

I don't believe that companies alone can support all the routes currently available but it's a factor. I don't think it is unreasonable to count business travel towards the volume of traffic on European routes (also, your example is extreme, I could do the same.... just because one family goes to Barcelona once a year doesn't warrant a service). You put the service there to attract custom. If the customer base isn't there, then yes it's not viable. However, with businesses, I feel there is a greater economic impact in play in terms of attracting businesses to the area. If being able to drop that debt would help keep routes open, there is a greater potential for keeping existing business and attracting new business. It's not going to be THE deciding factor, but it is a factor.

keithclancy

notharrypotter wrote: »

There is no disputing that there are a number of large businesses in Cork.
There is no disputing that they send employees on business trips.

The actual amount of business travel undertaken by Cork based businesses may be over estimated by some people.

Not the point at all, when companies choose to locate to a region they also take the transport links into account.

For the business to be able to conduct it's business.
For the employees to be able to relocate and visit their home easily.

Ireland is an Island, without an airport Cork is screwed, many potential expats wouldn't bother coming to Cork if there wasn't an airport.

snotboogie

Seen the discussion on this on the journal yesterday. The hostility towards Cork airport from the rest of the country is incredible. The general consensus from the posters outside Cork seemed to be "Shannon and Dublin are enough to serve all of Munster"

http://businessetc.thejournal.ie/ethiopian-airlines-dublin-2051624-Apr2015/

shnaek

No one gives it to ya, you have to take it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V4nUFxsZqpA

keithclancy

snotboogie wrote: »

Seen the discussion on this on the journal yesterday. The hostility towards Cork airport from the rest of the country is incredible. The general consensus from the posters outside Cork seemed to be "Shannon and Dublin are enough to serve all of Munster"

http://businessetc.thejournal.ie/ethiopian-airlines-dublin-2051624-Apr2015/

Using Dublin as a Refueling stop ?


Jesus I hope they don't get any stretched petrol .. those Dreamliners ain't cheap :pac:

rebs23

snotboogie wrote: »

Seen the discussion on this on the journal yesterday. The hostility towards Cork airport from the rest of the country is incredible. The general consensus from the posters outside Cork seemed to be "Shannon and Dublin are enough to serve all of Munster"

http://businessetc.thejournal.ie/ethiopian-airlines-dublin-2051624-Apr2015/

And yet Cork is the busier the Airport with the bigger population hinterland than Shannon.(for now anyway)

stevielenihan

It seems Shannon Airport will replace Cork Airport as the 2nd Busiest this year.

rebs23

http://www.irishexaminer.com/viewpoints/ourview/another-blow--cork-airport-324180.html

Editorial in the Examiner recently which says it all really including the following line "Shannon Airport has enjoyed a new lease of life since it achieved independence and is to be congratulated for that wonderful achievement. The fact that it was relatively debt-free and enjoys a €38m annual rental income contributed to that revival."

keithclancy

You have to love the description of Shannon on Wikipedia


"Shannon, County Clare, Ireland, a town near Shannon Airport"

Population of 10000 people

Makes more sense for Clonmel to have an International Airport :pac:

imurdaddy

keithclancy wrote: »

You have to love the description of Shannon on Wikipedia


"Shannon, County Clare, Ireland, a town near Shannon Airport"

Population of 10000 people

Makes more sense for Clonmel to have an International Airport :pac:

SNN was built to service the whole western seaboard not Shannon town which wasn't built till around the same time.

JCX BXC

keithclancy wrote: »

You have to love the description of Shannon on Wikipedia


"Shannon, County Clare, Ireland, a town near Shannon Airport"

Population of 10000 people

Makes more sense for Clonmel to have an International Airport :pac:

Haha your very uneducated about Shannon, the town was built for the Airport (and Industrial estates), not the other way around.

keithclancy

imurdaddy wrote: »

SNN was built to service the whole western seaboard not Shannon town which wasn't built till around the same time.

It was a joke

JCX BXC

stevielenihan wrote: »

It seems Shannon Airport will replace Cork Airport as the 2nd Busiest this year.

No, not quite yet.

rebs23

Another article in yesterdays paper about the Airport. It's repeating a lot of what has been discussed here already but it estimates the rent roll from the former Shannon Development Properties at €38 Million which is an astonishing amount. Makes you wonder why the debt deal for Shannon was needed and those politicians from the Mid West in fairness seem to be able to the business for the region.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/cork-airport-could-be-passed-out-as-irelands-second-busiest-324253.html

JCX BXC

I'll only say one thing, if Shannon got €38million per year from "rent", it would have got a hell of alot more than 8 new Ryanair routes.

snotboogie

imurdaddy wrote: »

SNN was built to service the whole western seaboard not Shannon town which wasn't built till around the same time.

To give some perspective, the population of Cork is roughly the same as the population of Connacht, which already has Knock airport (again knock over Galway, typical Ireland). Why is the government aggressively pushing an airport in Co. Clare to "service the western seabord" above the second biggest population centre?

JCX BXC

Shannon has the population centres of Limerick, Galway and Ennis under its belt also, compared to Cork having well, just Cork.

keithclancy

Carnacalla wrote: »

Haha your very uneducated about Shannon, the town was built for the Airport (and Industrial estates), not the other way around.

You're

snotboogie

Carnacalla wrote: »

Shannon has the population centres of Limerick, Galway and Ennis under its belt also, compared to Cork having well, just Cork.

Well the Cork City area (198K) has the same number of people as the greater Limerick, Galway and Ennis areas (102K, 76K and 20K respectively) combined. The area around Cork City which the airport directly serves has a population of 400,000, over double that of the three cities you mentioned together. For instance, Douglas is bigger than Ennis, I think you would be rightly laughed out of the forum if you suggested the proximity to Douglas as a benefit of the location of a major international Airport. Even if you take the combined populations of Co Limerick, Co Galway and Co Clare (558K) there isn't that big difference between them and Co Cork (518k).

Thats without even mentioning that Galway City is over an hour away from Shannon, about the same distance Killarney is from Cork airport. Most of the population centres in Munster (Waterford, most of Kerry and South Tipp) are closer to Cork Airport than Shannon.

stevielenihan

I like Cork Airport I really do but I think the real trouble started for the airport when the new terminal was build. I think the old terminal was much better and easier to get through. Cork needs growth badly. It is unable to recover at the moment. The debs were from the building of new terminal. Had they DAA keep the old terminal open and maby expanded it a bit Cork would still be very busy to this day. I have a point here lads even if ye don,t agree but still Shannon is my favourite.

beer enigma

A lot of the same stuff going round and round on this thread folks & getting snippy...let's not turn it into a Cork v Shannon favouritism thread.

I think most has been said already given current info.....

SpaceTime

snotboogie wrote: »

Well the Cork City area (198K) has the same number of people as the greater Limerick, Galway and Ennis areas (102K, 76K and 20K respectively) combined. The area around Cork City which the airport directly serves has a population of 400,000, over double that of the three cities you mentioned together. For instance, Douglas is bigger than Ennis, I think you would be rightly laughed out of the forum if you suggested the proximity to Douglas as a benefit of the location of a major international Airport. Even if you take the combined populations of Co Limerick, Co Galway and Co Clare (558K) there isn't that big difference between them and Co Cork (518k).

Thats without even mentioning that Galway City is over an hour away from Shannon, about the same distance Killarney is from Cork airport. Most of the population centres in Munster (Waterford, most of Kerry and South Tipp) are closer to Cork Airport than Shannon.

You're forgetting the special Irish demographic maths used by Dubs and culchies (I mean those not living in a city) where all non Dublin counties are equally sized and Dublin is slightly bigger than Tokyo.

What this boils down to is simple though : Cork TDs are underperfoming and forgetting where their bread is buttered. This is a smouldering political disaster especially for Coveney if something isn't done about the debt.

keithclancy

stevielenihan wrote: »

I like Cork Airport I really do but I think the real trouble started for the airport when the new terminal was build. I think the old terminal was much better and easier to get through. Cork needs growth badly. It is unable to recover at the moment. The debs were from the building of new terminal. Had they DAA keep the old terminal open and maby expanded it a bit Cork would still be very busy to this day. I have a point here lads even if ye don,t agree but still Shannon is my favourite.

Shannon is fine. Farranfore is even fine.

It's their location that's terrible.

Cork and Dublin are close to the two largest cities in the country.

Knock, Shannon and Farranfore are not really near anything.

Even Dublin is a bit shonky, you'd expect a large airport for the capital city to have a light rail transit system like Amsterdam, Copenhagen, Düsseldorf, Munich, Cologne, Stansted etc.

Only options are a taxi or an overpriced airport bus.

Closest continental example I could think of in Germany as a comparison to Shannon would be Weeze, Hahn (Germany) or Gronginen in the Netherlands but the Germans or the Dutch wouldnt have intercontinental flights from such isolated places without decent transportation links.

SpaceTime

Well if Cork airport is failing it basically comes down to government incompetence and victimisation of the second city because it doesn't suit two vested interests to have a successful Cork airport.

DAA doesn't need the competition and it suits Shannon very nicely to have the status quo.

At times I can see why Cork people have a chip on their shoulder. They're treated very badly by government on issues like this.

Basically, if the government doesn't deal with this, it'll become an election issue and it'll just result in smaller FG candidates losing seats and add another nail to Labour's coffin.

Further damage to Cork airport will have knock on job loss consequences. It's as simple as that.

It is a hell of a smack in the face for Cork to even have renamed Aer Rianta "the Dublin Airport Authority" and to have it running Cork airport.

The name says it all! It's Dublin Airport and it just has Cork tagged on the end as some kind of minor annoyance. Obviously the policies are all going to be unsuitable for Cork and focused on Dublin...

Do you think handing Dublin airport over to the Belfast Airport Authority would result in a thriving hub or busses to Belfast ?

At least the DAA logo is appropriate : a big hand to slap Cork in the face.

JCX BXC

keithclancy wrote: »

Shannon is fine. Farranfore is even fine.

It's their location that's terrible.

Cork and Dublin are close to the two largest cities in the country.

Knock, Shannon and Farranfore are not really near anything.

Even Dublin is a bit shonky, you'd expect a large airport for the capital city to have a light rail transit system like Amsterdam, Copenhagen, Düsseldorf, Munich, Cologne, Stansted etc.

Only options are a taxi or an overpriced airport bus.

Closest continental example I could think of in Germany as a comparison to Shannon would be Weeze, Hahn (Germany) or Gronginen in the Netherlands but the Germans or the Dutch wouldnt have intercontinental flights from such isolated places without decent transportation links.

How ruthlessly ignorant.
According to Google maps, Limerick city centre is 24mins from Shannon airport.

Cork city centre is 17mins from Cork airport.

That information above single handedly undermines all of your post.

Shannon has a motorway to it, unlike cork which is a pain to get to if your travelling from anywhere north of it. I'd say Shannon is MORE accessible than Cork Airport.

This making up fake facts is really not helping the Cork situation.


Extra info:
*Hahn is 1hr 23mins from Frankfurt city centre

*Dublin Airport is 23mins from Dublin city centre

*Knock is 1hr 30mins from Galway city centre

*Shannon is 1hr 10mins from Galway City centre

*Dublin airport is 1hr 49mins from Waterford city centre

*Cork airport is 1hr 45mins from Waterford city centre

*Cork airport is 1hr 45mins from Tralee

*Shannon is 1hr 41mins from Tralee

Read that and you will find that Shannon is not the rural shack you are trying to make it sound like.