M21 - Limerick to Rathkeale/Foynes [advance works to commence shortly]

marno21

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

I hate to say it but I agree with it. I'd much rather a motorway end at a roundabout than a GSJ knowing our driving habits. Don't forget the number of accidents at the Beehive when the M11 just ended and went down a hill to a junction. No-one slowed down.

Since the motorway will never go to Foynes, end it at a roundabout to break up traffic.

Accidents at the end of the existing M20 -> N21 are a rarity and it's a motorway -> WS2 taper

I hope the M21 is continued on past Newcastlewest soon enough and we won't have to talk about it much more

Aontachtoir

What is happening to the N21 as it curves southwest just before entering Adare? The map has the motorway ploughing straight ahead with no evidence of an exit at that point, but doesn't state that the 500 m or so of old N21 will be closed off.

It looks to me like non-motorway traffic will be diverted along the L1427 Monearla Road (which presumably will be reclassified as part of the R-road replacing the old N21) across the motorway towards the R526.

EDIT: On closer inspection, it looks like they're running the old N21 directly into the L1427 and eliminating the junction at that point. Guess they're closing it.

Limerick74

marno21 wrote: »

Accidents at the end of the existing M20 -> N21 are a rarity and it's a motorway -> WS2 taper

I hope the M21 is continued on past Newcastlewest soon enough and we won't have to talk about it much more

The Lantern Lodge Roundabout and traffic queues calms the traffic after the end of the N21 WS2, otherwise the collision rates would be higher.

marno21

Aontachtoir wrote: »

What is happening to the N21 as it curves southwest just before entering Adare? The map has the motorway ploughing straight ahead with no evidence of an exit at that point, but doesn't state that the 500 m or so of old N21 will be closed off.

It looks to me like non-motorway traffic will be diverted along the L1427 Monearla Road (which presumably will be reclassified as part of the R-road replacing the old N21) across the motorway towards the R526.

EDIT: On closer inspection, it looks like they're running the old N21 directly into the L1427 and eliminating the junction at that point. Guess they're closing it.

The L1427, or Monearla Road, was the old N21 from Patrickswell to Adare before the M20 and N21 extension were opened in 2001. At a guess, it'll go back to being the alternative route post M21 opening

The N21 extension to Adare will become part of the M21, and the small bit between the old N21 and new N21 just outside Adare will likely be returned to pasture or used to service dwellings if required.

Limerick74 wrote: »

The Lantern Lodge Roundabout and traffic queues calms the traffic after the end of the N21 WS2, otherwise the collision rates would be higher.

Ah yes, but the Lantern Lodge is 2-3km from the end of the M20. I was on about roundabouts directly at the end of new roads, which usually have to be removed when the road improvement is extended.

The Lantern Lodge roundabout does calm traffic although these days the traffic is often further back from the LL roundabout and closer to the end of the motorway.

It's worse coming from the Croagh side as the Adare traffic usually backs up onto those horrific bends and people come flying around the bends into stopped traffic.

Kermit.de.frog

Surprised no one has mentioned it yet but this road may be particularly vulnerable to sulky racing near Rathkeale which would be very dangerous.

Measures would have to be put in place to prevent that the way they struggle to prevent it now.


Also the way the Limerick Design Office has overseen the design of this road would worry you for the M20!

marno21

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Surprised no one has mentioned it yet but this road may be particularly vulnerable to sulky racing near Rathkeale which would be very dangerous.

Measures would have to be put in place to prevent that the way they struggle to prevent it now.


Also the way the Limerick Design Office has overseen the design of this road would worry you for the M20!

I haven't seen or heard of any sulky racing on the existing S2 Rathkeale bypass so I wouldn't be too worried about it.

What's wrong with this that will be an issue for the M20?

Kermit.de.frog

No freeflow for link to Foynes.

Cheap and shoddy option.

marno21

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

No freeflow for link to Foynes.

Cheap and shoddy option.

Foynes link is low volume single carriageway. It won't be congested.

It would be far handier if there was a clear plan for continuing the M21 past this junction, as it will definitely be required into the future. The existing N21 west of here is going to break down when this motorway opens as the only thing keeping it going at the minute is Adare acting as a giant traffic calming measure.

marno21

Shane Ross mentioned in the Seanad on Thursday that he expects this scheme to be complete by 2026.

Personally, I think that is scandalous.

pajoguy

The section between rathkeale and foynes is going to be dual carriageway. This change im told is not expected to delay the application to An Board Pleanala.

BelfastVanMan

pajoguy wrote: »

The section between rathkeale and foynes is going to be dual carriageway. This change im told is not expected to delay the application to An Board Pleanala.

A sensible move, but more delays are not good..

marno21

If this is true then it raises a few questions:

1. If the stretch to Foynes is to be DC, will it be motorway or 2+2? Motorway is a possibility to comply with TEN-T requirements
2. The M21/N21/Foynes Link junction will surely have to be redesigned
3. What effect will this have on the existing design, coupled with additional CPO required for the wider cross section?

Limerick74

marno21 wrote: »

If this is true then it raises a few questions:

1. If the stretch to Foynes is to be DC, will it be motorway or 2+2? Motorway is a possibility to comply with TEN-T requirements
2. The M21/N21/Foynes Link junction will surely have to be redesigned
3. What effect will this have on the existing design, coupled with additional CPO required for the wider cross section?

Most likely answers:

1. Type 2 Dual (2+2). Don’t need motorway for TEN-T. TII standards allow for various cross sections for an express road.
2. None
3. Minimal - CPO was always wide enough to allow for future widening.

Irish_rat

Type 2 dual surely or else it's overkill.

marno21

According to Sponge Bob on SSC this is to go to ABP in December.

Happy Dragon

marno21 wrote: »

According to Sponge Bob on SSC this is to go to ABP in December.

I got an e-mail from the Foynes to Limerick Project Team saying, "the next project update will be released in the coming weeks expected mid November".

dashoonage

does that mean ABP will give a decision on dec ? how soon do we expect to see lads tearing round the gaf in dumper trucks?

marno21

dashoonage wrote: »

does that mean ABP will give a decision on dec ? how soon do we expect to see lads tearing round the gaf in dumper trucks?

Unfortunately not it's just being submitted to An Bord Pleanala in December. It's currently taking approximately a year for decisions on projects like these

dashoonage

marno21 wrote: »

Unfortunately not it's just being submitted to An Bord Pleanala in December. It's currently taking approximately a year for decisions on projects like these

thank you!

The N69 is falling apart...its starting to sink badly in spots between clarina and kildimo.

marno21

dashoonage wrote: »

thank you!

The N69 is falling apart...its starting to sink badly in spots between clarina and kildimo.

I'm not one bit surprised.

That road is totally inadequate for both the volume and type of traffic it is handling. The lack of political will to get this Foynes road done is disappointing. You'd swear there wasn't daily multi kilometre tailbacks in Adare and that this was some sort of vanity project.

dashoonage

Looks like the auld N69 is gonna get a slap of some tar and chippings

Limerick City and County Council advise Motorists and Road Users that a Topographical Survey will take place along the N69 from Monday 26th November to Wednesday 05th December 2018, between 09:30am to 16:30pm each day. The Survey will take place between Court Cross and Bolane, including Kildimo village.

The Topographical Survey is being carried out to assist in the design of a future Pavement Improvement Scheme.

Treepole

dashoonage wrote: »

Looks like the auld N69 is gonna get a slap of some tar and chippings

The section of road they are referring to has subsided considerably, and it's very noticeable in recent months. It will take far more than tar and chip to resolve. There have been a number of accidents on that stretch recently.

pajoguy

Preliminary Design wont be finished until the New Year is the latest news on this project.

Edit: I see the website is now showing "Guest Area" enter password. Maybe there is an update on the way.

dashoonage

Treepole wrote: »

The section of road they are referring to has subsided considerably, and it's very noticeable in recent months. It will take far more than tar and chip to resolve. There have been a number of accidents on that stretch recently.

The tar and chip comment was a bit tongue in cheek :P

Kermit.de.frog

"Design Update - Nov 2018" on the website but as above requires password.

Mango Joe

Due for completion by 2026?????

13 years after the process started? Why would this be?

How long does it take other European countries to complete comparable projects does anyone know?

marno21

Mango Joe wrote: »

Due for completion by 2026?????

13 years after the process started? Why would this be?

How long does it take other European countries to complete comparable projects does anyone know?

Most European projects don't have to deal with Shane Ross, or the infrastructural policy of Fine Gael.

Limerick74

Design Update on website now https://www.foyneslimerick.ie/

Kermit.de.frog

Meh, cheap is about the best that can be said. No substantial changes.

marno21

The length of time it's taking to get this scheme to ABP is frustrating as ****. Why isn't it being adequately resourced by Government? It's not a pet project or a vanity project

ABP submission in "early 2019" as per website now.