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Your Ireland 23 for Nov. 9th versus Samoa

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    #62
    Kayless
    Registered Users Posts: 817 ✭✭✭Kayless


    Hagz wrote: »
    I'd love to see it, but I'd imagine this place would erupt if Zebo was omitted. Understandably there'd be a few 'Schmidt loyalty/bias' comments. Personally I think when he's fit he's still our best wing option outside of Bowe. But then again Fitz is my fav player.

    I think Fitz is going to be a big winner under Schmidt, we could end up seeing Zebo at full back with Bowe and Fitz on the wings


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    #63
    Thekidneybean
    Registered Users Posts: 90 ✭✭Thekidneybean


    If Fitzgerald was fit it could be him 11 bowe 14 zebo 15, Trimble,kearney, McFadden go for the 23 shirt


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    #64
    bilston
    Registered Users Posts: 17,766 ✭✭✭✭bilston


    Tomtom364 wrote: »
    I think back row is the most contentious area for november.

    Personally Id go for

    6. POM
    7. SOB
    8. Heaslip

    20. TOD (offers more options from the bench then Henry)

    Give TOD some good time in the 1st team as he has come on leaps and bound this season.
    I think with the players availible Henry is a waste of a bench spot. He should either start or not feature IMO

    Sure Henry covers the entire back row.


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    #65
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 53,553 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    Thekidneybean wrote: »
    If Fitzgerald was fit it could be him 11 bowe 14 zebo 15, Trimble,kearney, McFadden go for the 23 shirt

    Zebo would need to start playing at full back for Munster then.


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    #66
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    If our back line under Schmidt is the same system as he used for Leinster then I think Fitz would be more suited to it than Zebo.

    But he might just re-work the system so that it includes a space for a Zebo-esque player.


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    #67
    former legend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,309 ✭✭✭former legend


    awec wrote: »
    Zebo would need to start playing at full back for Munster then.

    This, this and this again.


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    #68
    wittycynic
    Registered Users Posts: 532 ✭✭✭wittycynic


    Thekidneybean wrote: »
    If Fitzgerald was fit it could be him 11 bowe 14 zebo 15, Trimble,kearney, McFadden go for the 23 shirt

    I like fitz, but his international try scoring record is dismal. The likes of zebo and Trimble should be ahead of him in the reckoning.


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    #69
    bilston
    Registered Users Posts: 17,766 ✭✭✭✭bilston


    When's Fitzgerald due back?


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    #70
    Manuel Deafening Rent
    Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ Manuel Deafening Rent


    awec wrote: »
    Zebo would need to start playing at full back for Munster then.

    11. Earls / Luke O'Dea
    ..
    ..
    14. Conway
    15. Zebo

    I don't see why this couldn't happen.


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    #71
    former legend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,309 ✭✭✭former legend


    Deleted User wrote: »
    11. Earls / Luke O'Dea
    ..
    ..
    14. Conway
    15. Zebo

    I don't see why this couldn't happen.

    There's no reason it couldn't happen, but it didn't happen this year when:
    11. Earls
    14. Howlett
    15. Zebo
    would have been an option. I'd say he'll be on the wing and he'll stay there.

    Besides, it's a massive stretch to go from "Zebo did well in his two games at full-back" to "Zebo would start ahead of Kearney" so it's a moot point really.


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    #72
    Glass Prison 1214
    Registered Users Posts: 1,153 ✭✭✭Glass Prison 1214


    former legend wrote: »
    There's no reason it couldn't happen, but it didn't happen this year when:
    11. Earls
    14. Howlett
    15. Zebo
    would have been an option. I'd say he'll be on the wing and he'll stay there.

    Besides, it's a massive stretch to go from "Zebo did well in his two games at full-back" to "Zebo would start ahead of Kearney" so it's a moot point really.

    Well if Kearney doesn't regain top form then its quite possible Zebo will start ahead of him.


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    #73
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    bilston wrote: »
    When's Fitzgerald due back?

    He was back training at the end of the season so I'd say soon.


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    #74
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    Glass Prison 1214 wrote: »
    Well if Kearney doesn't regain top form then its quite possible Zebo will start ahead of him.

    He's a massive way to go tbh. Even when Kearney isn't on top form he's still one of the most pragmatic FB options available to us, his positioning and kicking game are still unmatched by any FB in Ireland.

    The only player plying their trade here I'd have in my team at FB ahead of him right now isn't Irish qualified....


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    #75
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 53,553 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    Glass Prison 1214 wrote: »
    Well if Kearney doesn't regain top form then its quite possible Zebo will start ahead of him.

    Only if Zebo consistently starts and plays well at full back for Munster. At the moment Kearney is in no danger of losing his spot.

    Given that I don't think Zebo will be shifted to full back I suspect Kearney will keep his spot at 15 until Payne is eligible.


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    #76
    Glass Prison 1214
    Registered Users Posts: 1,153 ✭✭✭Glass Prison 1214


    .ak wrote: »
    He's a massive way to go tbh. Even when Kearney isn't on top form he's still one of the most pragmatic FB options available to us, his positioning and kicking game are still unmatched by any FB in Ireland.

    The only player plying their trade here I'd have in my team at FB ahead of him right now isn't Irish qualified....

    On form hes lethal, no doubt about that. But in recent months I have just found him infuriating to watch, he has been wasteful of possession and his decision making and defense have been poor. He has thrown away a lot of try scoring opportunities for Leinster for not passing when it was on, instead running into contact. Getting dropped could be the kick up the backside that he needs to rediscover 2009/2012 form.


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    #77
    former legend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,309 ✭✭✭former legend


    Glass Prison 1214 wrote: »
    Well if Kearney doesn't regain top form then its quite possible Zebo will start ahead of him.

    Kearney was injured most of the season and was brilliant when he came back so I'm not too worried on that front, but the real point is that it's hard to see Zebo even being considered for Ireland if he's not playing there for Munster.

    Edit; Just saw your post above, disagree with nearly all of it.


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    #78
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 53,553 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    Glass Prison 1214 wrote: »
    On form hes lethal, no doubt about that. But in recent months I have just found him infuriating to watch, he has been wasteful of possession and his decision making and defense have been poor. He has thrown away a lot of try scoring opportunities for Leinster for not passing when it was on, instead running into contact. Getting dropped could be the kick up the backside that he needs to rediscover 2009/2012 form.

    The main thing is he needs to remember he is allowed to pass the ball.


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    #79
    Glass Prison 1214
    Registered Users Posts: 1,153 ✭✭✭Glass Prison 1214


    awec wrote: »
    The main thing is he needs to remember he is allowed to pass the ball.

    That is an issue though, he has had plenty of time to sort that out since he came through quite early but he is still holding onto possession at the wrong times.


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    #80
    Mahatma Geansai
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,668 ✭✭✭Mahatma Geansai


    Zebo could be a real option to start ahead of Kearney. He's a superior running threat, shows better awareness of his teammates, and has a similarly good kicking/fielding game. The only real issue would be his lack of game time at 15 meaning his positioning wouldn't be as good, but his pace would definitely help if his positioning is slightly off. His reading of the game from 15 wouldn't be near as good either, so he wouldn't be able to get on the ball as much as he can from the wing.


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    #81
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 53,553 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    Mahatma Geansai wrote: »
    Zebo could be a real option to start ahead of Kearney. He's a superior running threat, shows better awareness of his teammates, and has a similarly good kicking/fielding game. The only real issue would be his lack of game time at 15 meaning his positioning wouldn't be as good, but his pace would definitely help if his positioning is slightly off. His reading of the game from 15 wouldn't be near as good either, so he wouldn't be able to get on the ball as much as he can from the wing.

    He is nowhere near a real option to start ahead of Kearney until he consistently plays full back at Munster.

    If he wants to play at 15 for Ireland then he needs to be playing 15 at Munster, and not just when injury to other players dictates he has to.


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    #82
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    Glass Prison 1214 wrote: »
    On form hes lethal, no doubt about that. But in recent months I have just found him infuriating to watch, he has been wasteful of possession and his decision making and defense have been poor. He has thrown away a lot of try scoring opportunities for Leinster for not passing when it was on, instead running into contact. Getting dropped could be the kick up the backside that he needs to rediscover 2009/2012 form.

    Not sure about any of this, I think his Lions performances show exactly what he's capable of, right now. He's a solid FB option and his positioning, kicking and even running game is hugely effective. At club level he's still massively influential, his come back to Leinster after the near year saw him score a try in every game in Europe. For Ireland we didn't get to see the backs in action at all really apart from Wales. His decision making was awry in that game in fairness, but that's what coming back from injury on the big stage does to you.

    I think you're basically being harsh. Maybe because we're expecting the 2009 form. In reality, dropping players doesn't necessarily result in players finding form, sometimes it can mean the opposite. It is, ofcourse, up to the coach to decide how long the player needs to get back up to speed. Kearney has always struck me as someone that can take a while to motor back up to full speed, like he did in 2012.


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    #83
    shuffol
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭shuffol


    I think Kearneys kicking game has been very hit and miss the last few months of the season, if thats not going well and people arent kicking garryowens to him he becomes quite a limited player, definately a position where some competition would be welcome.


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    #84
    Kayless
    Registered Users Posts: 817 ✭✭✭Kayless


    shuffol wrote: »
    I think Kearneys kicking game has been very hit and miss the last few months of the season, if thats not going well and people arent kicking garryowens to him he becomes quite a limited player, definately a position where some competition would be welcome.

    Agreed. He runs into traffic on his own way to much and ends up turning the ball over and don't even get my started about him under high ball, in saying that Kearney is a quality player and has shown what he can do when he hits form, hopefully not getting picked for the Lions tests and with some time off over the summer he can get back to his old form because against Aus and NZ we will need everyone to be on top of their game


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    #85
    former legend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,309 ✭✭✭former legend


    Kayless wrote: »
    Agreed. He runs into traffic on his own way to much and ends up turning the ball over and don't even get my started about him under high ball, in saying that Kearney is a quality player and has shown what he can do when he hits form, hopefully not getting picked for the Lions tests and with some time off over the summer he can get back to his old form because against Aus and NZ we will need everyone to be on top of their game

    Hang on. Are you saying that Kearney is not good under the high ball?


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    #86
    Kayless
    Registered Users Posts: 817 ✭✭✭Kayless


    former legend wrote: »
    Hang on. Are you saying that Kearney is not good under the high ball?

    I'm not saying he's never been good under high ball :eek: I just can't remember the last time I seen him win a high ball, can you? I do remember Zebo beat him under a few last Oct/Nov... I really hope he can find some form going into the AIs and the 2014 6 nations


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    #87
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    Kayless wrote: »
    I'm not saying he's never been good under high ball :eek: I just can't remember the last time I seen him win a high ball, can you? I do remember Zebo beat him under a few last Oct/Nov... I really hope he can find some form going into the AIs and the 2014 6 nations

    I'd say the Amlin cup final is good example of how good he was under highball recently. They were desperate after a few phases so most of the ball went high. RK was imperious under it.


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    #88
    Buer
    Registered Users Posts: 24,197 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    Kayless wrote: »
    I'm not saying he's never been good under high ball :eek: I just can't remember the last time I seen him win a high ball, can you?

    Yes, this tour.


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    #89
    former legend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,309 ✭✭✭former legend


    Kayless wrote: »
    I'm not saying he's never been good under high ball :eek: I just can't remember the last time I seen him win a high ball, can you? I do remember Zebo beat him under a few last Oct/Nov... I really hope he can find some form going into the AIs and the 2014 6 nations

    No. Just no to all of the above.

    I'm impressed by your memory of Zebo beating Kearney in the air in October or November. There was me thinking Madigan played fb that night after Kearney was injured.

    Hmmmm


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    #90
    Kayless
    Registered Users Posts: 817 ✭✭✭Kayless


    former legend wrote: »
    No. Just no to all of the above.

    I'm impressed by your memory of Zebo beating Kearney in the air in October or November. There was me thinking Madigan played fb that night after Kearney was injured.

    Hmmmm

    Well for the sake of argument it was the night POC kicked D Kearney in the head, now that I think about it might not have been Oct/Nov

    Zebo went up for the ball as did Kearney and Zebo go it, this then resulted in handbags between Dave, Rob and Zebo I'm sure a few people on here will remember it, the point I'm making is that the Kearney of old would have won that ball but also Zebos not to bad in the air himself

    Also just so know I'm a Leinster supporter


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    #91
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    Kayless wrote: »
    Well for the sake of argument it was the night POC kicked D Kearney in the head, now that I think about it might not have been Oct/Nov

    Zebo went up for the ball as did Kearney and Zebo go it, this then resulted in handbags between Dave, Rob and Zebo I'm sure a few people on here will remember it, the point I'm making is that the Kearney of old would have won that ball but also Zebos not to bad in the air himself

    Also just so know I'm a Leinster supporter

    That was the game in Thomond. Zebo did win the aerial battle that night, in fairness.

    Still has a long way to go if he wants to usurp Kearney tho.


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