Is Eircom sabotaging SKY or is SKY just useless?

Solair

Chop Chop wrote: »

I do see what you're saying, but for me the line rental is eircom, so to me the service is from eircom.

Look at UPC, they broke away and started their own network that's a decent price for fast broadband. I don't think we will ever see the likes of it outside Dublin.

I'm no huge fan of eircom, that's for sure, but you're paying line rental for the line (the access pathway of copper wires from your house to the local exchange and maintenance / upgrading of those facilities). That's working just fine, the problem is up the stream in the Sky network.

What exactly do you propose eircom do? They don't own the network that's causing you the problems. How can they manage/repair a 3rd party's network?!

On your other point UPC fibre powered cable DOCSIS 3.0 broadband covers Dublin, Cork, Limerick, Waterford, Galway, Kilkenny, Carlow, Sligo, Portlaoise, Clonmel, Thurles, Athlone, Mullingar, Navan, Shannon, Naas, Newbridge, Swords and Malahide and quite a lot of other major (and some minor) urban centres. It's reach is much wider than just Dublin and has been since day one. (Parts of the cable network actually date back as far as the 1960s, and most were fully in place in the 1980s so they're not exactly new, even if they were radically upgraded by UPC)

Dungarvan actually has its own independent cable company providing broadband (and for years before UPC did on a wide scale).

Meanwhile, eircom's rolling out Fibre-to-curb in quite a large number of areas right across the entire 26 counties (mostly cities and large towns, but it's still getting there).

If you're in a rural area, the future's probably going to be wireless. Wired technologies will always be problematic to one-off / very low density housing in rural areas.

Eircom did go through a period of low investment (that is changing though) but a lot of Ireland's rural / urban hinterland areas can't get broadband speeds because of really unusually bad planning.

Digiweb's 30mbit/s service over microwave links using DOCSIS 3.0 (cable modems) already shows what you can do and that's available in quite a few areas.

Small antenna on your roof and you've decent broadband, low ping times and a phone service without any phone lines at all.

Chop Chop

Solair wrote: »

Small antenna on your roof and you've decent broadband, low ping times and a phone service without any phone lines at all.

That's what I have currently, the ping times are high though over 100ms.

keno-daytrader

Solair wrote: »

Are people posting on their forums btw ?

Might be worth annoying them there :

http://helpforum.sky.com/t5/Broadband-Speed/bd-p/sky_broadband_speed

Yes, there is lots of bitching going on in the ROI broadband forum, that one you posted is the UK version.

This is ROI broadband forum. But so far all complaints have been met with stone walling, BS and then silence.

http://helpforum.sky.com/t5/ROI-Broadband-Talk/bd-p/ROIbroadbandtalk

Solair

I'm just looking at some of the responses to the query on Caller ID... They suggested dialling *#234# (a UK code that doesn't work here) and then 1901 which is the eircom helpdesk (where you will be told you're not an eircom cutomer and to call Sky).

Doesn't sound like they've local support on the forums that's for sure.

Bohrio

It definitively looks like sky have some issue with their network.

I would love to see a tracert to ie rte.ie and another to bbc.co.uk

anyone up for it?

cork_south

Bohrio wrote: »

It definitively looks like sky have some issue with their network.

I would love to see a tracert to ie rte.ie and another to bbc.co.uk

anyone up for it?

Not sure why everyone is blaming Eircom (this thread included), Sky are using Eircom exchanges but are clearly using BT routers to route traffic through their network.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=83939685&postcount=87t=87

Bohrio

cork_south wrote: »

Not sure why everyone is blaming Eircom (this thread included), Sky are using Eircom exchanges but are clearly using BT routers to route traffic through their network.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=83939685&postcount=87t=87

Uuummmm.

5 42 ms 37 ms 37 ms teng0-0-0-5.core001.cwt.btireland.net [193.95.12
9.47]
6 41 ms 46 ms 49 ms ge0-1-0.br001.cwt.btireland.net [193.95.129.55]
7 67 ms 65 ms 69 ms google-gw.br001.cwt.esat.net [193.120.250.178]
8 75 ms 37 ms 36 ms 209.85.252.196

Tracerts to google are not normally a good example as traffic is not routed the same way as normal traffic. BT, as most ISPs, have a direct "link" with google (in this case google-gw.br001.cwt), this means that google traffic doesnt go through their international circuits, this link is used for example, to stream google traffic (youtube) freeing these circuits from traffic.

Anyway, the tracert is not really saying much, I am however, surprised to see BT routers handling the traffic and not Sky's. First and last contact points seem to be BTs, the BRAS in ballymount (bas111.bmt) being the first and their Border router in citywest (br001.cwt) as their last. This means that the whole session is managed by BT and not Sky (at least that's how it looks on the surface). Other BT resellers (ie Vodafone) use an interconnects with BT and they handle their own traffic.

Hard to tell from one tracert, as there could be many reasons behind this

So, we are back to square one!

Solair

Bohrio wrote: »

Other BT resellers (ie Vodafone) use an interconnects with BT and they handle their own traffic.

Hard to tell from one tracert, as there could be many reasons behind this

Or do BT just provide a virtual backbone for them with their own addressing / server names ?

I didn't think they'd actually have any physical infrastructure themselves.

cork_south

Bohrio wrote: »

Uuummmm.

5 42 ms 37 ms 37 ms teng0-0-0-5.core001.cwt.btireland.net [193.95.12
9.47]
6 41 ms 46 ms 49 ms ge0-1-0.br001.cwt.btireland.net [193.95.129.55]
7 67 ms 65 ms 69 ms google-gw.br001.cwt.esat.net [193.120.250.178]
8 75 ms 37 ms 36 ms 209.85.252.196

Tracerts to google are not normally a good example as traffic is not routed the same way as normal traffic. BT, as most ISPs, have a direct "link" with google (in this case google-gw.br001.cwt), this means that google traffic doesnt go through their international circuits, this link is used for example, to stream google traffic (youtube) freeing these circuits from traffic.

Anyway, the tracert is not really saying much, I am however, surprised to see BT routers handling the traffic and not Sky's. First and last contact points seem to be BTs, the BRAS in ballymount (bas111.bmt) being the first and their Border router in citywest (br001.cwt) as their last. This means that the whole session is managed by BT and not Sky (at least that's how it looks on the surface). Other BT resellers (ie Vodafone) use an interconnects with BT and they handle their own traffic.

Hard to tell from one tracert, as there could be many reasons behind this

So, we are back to square one!

Rte.ie

Traceroute to www.rte.ie (89.207.56.140), 64 hops max.
1 skyrouter.home (192.168.0.1) time=86 ms
2 lo250.bas111.bmt.btireland.net (193.95.137.154) time=64 ms
3 vlan101.rt001.bmt.btireland.net (193.95.141.1) time=46 ms
4 teng0-0-0-0.core002.bmt.btireland.net (193.95.140.5) time=41 ms
5 teng0-0-0-5.core002.cwt.btireland.net (193.95.129.53) time=40 ms
6 ge1-1-0.br002.cwt.btireland.net (193.95.129.63) time=41 ms
7 mat-r-10ge-0-0-3.rte.ie (193.242.111.42) time=41 ms

Bohrio

Solair wrote: »

Or do BT just provide a virtual backbone for them with their own addressing / server names ?

It could be that they are using BT to provide them with the necessary bandwidth but then either BT have limited their usage (Sky will need to buy more) or... well you know

cork_south wrote:

1 skyrouter.home (192.168.0.1) time=86 ms
2 lo250.bas111.bmt.btireland.net (193.95.137.154) time=64 ms
3 vlan101.rt001.bmt.btireland.net (193.95.141.1) time=46 ms
4 teng0-0-0-0.core002.bmt.btireland.net (193.95.140.5) time=41 ms
5 teng0-0-0-5.core002.cwt.btireland.net (193.95.129.53) time=40 ms
6 ge1-1-0.br002.cwt.btireland.net (193.95.129.63) time=41 ms
7 mat-r-10ge-0-0-3.rte.ie (193.242.111.42) time=41 ms

This tracert shows a similar route all inside BT. You again go through BT's bras bas111.bmt but you leave through a different border router (br002.cwt).

So far in both examples you authenticated on bas111.bmt which is interesting (well for me it is) although it could be just a coincidence.

However the above example is not a good one either .

The hop between your computer and the sky router (hop 1) already has 86 ms of latency, this can only indicate a busy router or PC, this is a very common example of what happens when you run a tracert and you are running p2p software (like torrents), ideally you should see a value of around 1 ms.

You might want to make sure there is nothing else running on the background before running another tracert. If you arent then reboot the router.

Anyway, both tracerts are not too bad, I mean, the latency seems okish, definitively nothing outrageous. I was expecting to see latency in the range of half a second or even more but so far its fine.

Sometimes, congestion issues can be detected by looking at the hops between routers/switches. BT routers should increase their latency but they all seem to remain the same. This is similar to a traffic shaping situation.

I am just guessing here though, but whatever the problem is, it does not manifest as clearly as I thought it would

Bohrio

I tried running a tracert from my connection at home but is no use as my latency is excellent


1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms 87-198-47-1.ptr.magnet.ie [87.198.47.1]
2 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms d-xxxxonc-asr15.magnet.ie [87.198.75.66]
3 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms d-xxxxonc-asr16.magnet.ie [87.198.75.70]
4 <1 ms 1 ms <1 ms d-xxxxxonc-dist1b.magnet.ie [87.198.75.73]
5 1 ms <1 ms <1 ms d-rte-core1a.magnet.ie [85.91.2.182]
6 1 ms 1 ms 1 ms d-deg-core1a.magnet.ie [85.91.3.13]
7 1 ms 1 ms 1 ms d-deg-border1.magnet.ie [85.91.2.77]
8 2 ms 2 ms 1 ms vec-r-10ge-0-0-3.rte.ie [194.88.240.17]
9 1 ms 1 ms 1 ms www.rte.ie [89.207.56.140]

I have a few examples of tracerts somewhere but it would be easier if you get someone else to post a tracert from another ISP, like Vodafone (LLU and Bitstream tracert, that would be sweet).

~50 ms is decent enough for copper

airuser

Last December I went to Sky. Speed went up 10% and left it as that. Went away on Holidays and on my return was contacted to say my speed was not what I should be getting. Tested my line, bang went my speed to 3.5M. After a lot of calls Eircom call and found a fault on my Master Socket. This was replaced. Speed 7.01M with speed at Hub 8.142M. Was promised "up to 12".

Eircom Engineer said that they were doing many call like mine and with few staff.

Recently reset my Hub and connection at Hub 10.2M actual 8.65M. That is an improvement.

Now back to the topic of this post.

When BT sold out to Vodafone my speeds dropped(3.5M) and it was nearly 15 months before the went up to the 75% of what I was supposed to get 0n NGB 8.142M actual 6.5M. No matter what one said to VF. It was always do this and that. I replaced all the internal wiring to the Router. Still no improvement.

Then suddenly up goes the speed. 15 months later. Nothing changed in my set up.


Would say Sky have dealt well with me. So I shall wait and see what is going to happen.

Conspiracy theory ?

The only way to sort all this out is if one would take a chance and return to an previous ISP and see what speed then one can get.

Remember that Eircom have the lines and all the others are retailing a service

Also this wonderful phrase "up to", does not mean you will get that speed

endeval

I was considering moving from Vodafone to Sky, but I'm not so sure now. I am in Glanmire, Cork.

http://help.sky.com/broadband/problems-with-your-connection/fix-a-slow-broadband-connection?country=ie

Evenings and weekends

At peak times, you may notice that some popular websites slow down. This is simply because of the number of people trying to access the site or the number of people using the internet on networks outside of Sky’s control (nationally and internationally). Please be reassured that Sky will never slow your service down.

They did say please :-)

airuser

I changed from VF to Sky, because the way one was treated by VF. The CS in my opinion was very poor.

I believe that Sky are not intentionally reducing speeds. But something is happening along the line.

What Speed do you have with VF

Another reason I went to Sky was of the Phone costs.

I now have family in North America and can ring mobiles for free

endeval

6144kb down, 512kb up. Allegedly the best they can offer me.

--- DSL Information ---
DSL Driver Version: AnnexA version - A2pB023k.d21d
DSL VPI/VCI: 8/35
DSL Status: Showtime
DSL Mode: G.DMT
DSL Channel:
DSL Upstream Rate: 512 Kbps
DSL Downstream Rate: 6144 Kbps

Down up
DSL Noise Margin: 6.8 dB 24.0 dB
DSL Attenuation: 38.0 dB 20.0 dB
DSL Transmit Power: 19.8 dBm 0.5 dBm

Nonoperational

That'll be about the size of it alright...

Nonoperational

Mine still perfect. Interesting to see what other exchanges are always perfect.

Sponge Bob

List of likely OK exchanges on page 1 of the thread.

keno-daytrader

Heres a post from the SKY broadband ROI forum, which sums up the ***** service from Sky and their pathetic broadband service in Ireland.

"Barry, I did make a complaint like many others, in the email response I was told that Sky would get back to me within 48 hours, that was 1 week ago!

Anything about congestion in the evenings in Ireland is met with 15 steps to trouble shoot, then when all steps are taken by the customer, the next step is to be totally ignored, by all Sky reps on here and your complaints dept.

From 14mb to 1mb in the evenings on my line for the last 3 weeks, and many other users are reporting the same thing, so if Sky is not aware of the problem by now, I dont hold out for much hope with the service from Sky here in Ireland.

Perhaps you will be the first Sky rep to address the evening slowdowns???"

Bohrio

It wont really make much different and I believe this is something Sky should be doing (or BT in there behalf) but the only way to trace this problem is to gather data, the more the better, then filter this data and try to find a pattern.

We will need to filter this data, this is important as corrupted data can ruin everything. For example, filter any line issues.

Things we should be looking for are: is this a problem related to one area/DSLAM? is this a problem related to one BRAS? a particular network Switch/Router? maybe a specific line profile? Does it affect Line Sharing customers or Bitstream, or both? etc

Once you have all this information we should be able to see a clear picture.

It could be a waste of time although I see no harm in trying.

mbyrnes1978

I ordered SKY broadband on 19th march.

i received an e-mail and text on teh 20th stating my experiance had begun and that my modem would be delivered and everything would be working once i plugged in my modem/router.

not the case, its now the 9th april i've no broadband. i've had an eircom tech out last week who told me that SKY had issued me with the wrong number and the number they issues was for a neighbour who had that number for years.

so back on the phone again to sky, which i can say is quiet time consuming in the evenings, during the day when i ring on lunch i'm through in no time but night time is a joke last night i was 18minutes waiting.

so basically i dont have a clue of whats happening because each time i ring i get customer care and the guy say that my issue is over his head and that he'll get team above him to review it.

Ordered on 19th march STILL NO BROADBAND!!!!!

aindriu80

Sky do nothing but walk you through a series of steps to take on your side. After you complete the checks they refuse to answer any further questions.

Here is my speed test results since I moved to Sky. Before Sky I was with Eircom getting a regular 6Mb (8Mb advertised), now I get from .50Mb to 17.5Mb but the former prevailing in the evenings & weekends.

http://www.speedtest.net/results.php?sh=4b143edb23ade63aaca1781ce382bc67&ria=0

As you can see its farcical. Up and down every single day

Trampas

Shocking stuff.

When I got sky bb in it was running at 14MB now it is crazy slow.

rebellad

Trampas wrote: »

Shocking stuff.

When I got sky bb in it was running at 14MB now it is crazy slow.

Same as me - was getting between 12 -14mb up to last week but am getting between .5 - 3Mb in the evenings now...

aindriu80

Sky Broadband. Was told that the line would take 24Mb to expect 20Mb. Best ever speed was 17.5Mb during day time. Tonight things are going faster than usual.

keno-daytrader

http://speedtest.net/result/2634604977.png

aindriu80

keno-daytrader wrote: »

http://speedtest.net/result/2634604977.png

I thought I had it bad : P

keno-daytrader

aindriu80 wrote: »

I thought I had it bad : P

Yeah, from 14mbps all day to 0.53mbps in the evenings.

I emailed the CEO of Sky, and got a response today, so if nothing comes of it, will go back to Eircom asap very reluctantly.

aindriu80

keno-daytrader wrote: »

Yeah, from 14mbps all day to 0.53mbps in the evenings.

I emailed the CEO of Sky, and got a response today, so if nothing comes of it, will go back to Eircom asap very reluctantly.

Don't think he will do much. I have the same plan but will wait till the fibre comes out in May and see if Sky can get their act together before jumping ship.

Sponge Bob

aindriu80 wrote: »

Sky do nothing but walk you through a series of steps to take on your side. After you complete the checks they refuse to answer any further questions.

It is called the 3 Mobile Broadband model. Make you wade through sh1te and then tell you it your problem if you stick through the script.

Next time you call, same script.

On a loosely related note I see the SKY Broadband advertising on RTE TV has gone into screaming overdrive this week, probably to counteract them oul bastids on the Interwoogies.