Formula 1 2013: General Discussion Thread

Grim.

Jordan 191 wrote: »

2013 French GP ruled out.

A shame. Would have loved to see a race at Paul Ricard.

It would've been terrible scheduling anyway with the 24H of Le Mans the week after.

Myrddin

Ficus wrote: »

He is fast alright but i disagree that he is down on his luck. If you look back through his career starting in karting, he has always been accident prone and gotten himself into all sorts of trouble. I think its too late to be in f1 and still hitting everything that moves through stupidity.

Ah, I knew nothing of his time before F1...so this is normal for him? Shame, as I said, he's genuinely quick.

lolie

Jordan 191 wrote: »

I see Kamui Kobayashi raises nearly £500,000 so far towards getting a race seat next year.

At £1million now:)
http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2012/11/30/kobayashi-raises-1m-fans/
He might just pull it off.
How much bucks would sutil bring with him?

Infoanon

HRT Technical Director,Toni Cuquerella has tweeted this morning "Four years ago I suggested to a freind to start an F1 team,today after three years,the final page of that story is written for HRT"

Stories from Spain say that the employees have been made redundant, phone lines have been disconnected and another story doing the rounds is the drivers were given the option of not racing at interlagos as many parts including brakes were beyond their life cycle.

Sad end but also once again raises many questions about the process used to choose these new comers at the exclusion of better financed and more experienced operations

Jordan 199

Infoanon wrote: »

HRT Technical Director,Toni Cuquerella has tweeted this morning "Four years ago I suggested to a freind to start an F1 team,today after three years,the final page of that story is written for HRT"

Stories from Spain say that the employees have been made redundant, phone lines have been disconnected and another story doing the rounds is the drivers were given the option of not racing at interlagos as many parts including brakes were beyond their life cycle.

Sad end but also once again raises many questions about the process used to choose these new comers at the exclusion of better financed and more experienced operations

Campos Meta/HRT had money problems from day one and changed hands three times during it's three year period in F1.

Of the four teams that were granted entry for the 2010 championship, USF1 didn't make it to the grid, Campos Meta/HRT just closed their doors, so only Caterham and Manor/Virgin/Marussia remain.

Since I started watching F1 in 1994, the following teams closed due to finances:

1994: Lotus and Larrousse.

1995: Simtek* and Pacific.

1996: Forti Corse.*

1997: Lola.*

2001: Prost.

2002: Arrows.*

2008: Super Aguri.*

* denotes teams that closed during the season.

smellslikeshoes

^^^^^


Alain is not amused you forgot Prost Grand Prix

Infoanon wrote: »

Sad end but also once again raises many questions about the process used to choose these new comers at the exclusion of better financed and more experienced operations

Is there any proof of this? As far as I can tell any of the other 14 potential entries would have been just as likely to be in the same position HRT are now.
Fact is when you look into how long the average new F1 team lasts it's a surprise that at least one of them haven't closed shop before now.

kksaints

Jordan 191 wrote: »

Campos Meta/HRT had money problems from day one and changed hands three times during it's three year period in F1.

Of the four teams that were granted entry for the 2010 championship, USF1 didn't make it to the grid, Campos Meta/HRT just closed their doors, so only Caterham and Manor/Virgin/Marussia remain.

Since I started watching F1 in 1994, the following teams closed due to finances:

1994: Lotus and Larrousse.

1995: Simtek* and Pacific.

1996: Forti Corse.*

1997: Lola.*

2002: Arrows.*

2008: Super Aguri.*

* denotes teams that closed during the season.

Did Prost not close down aswell?

Jordan 199

kksaints wrote: »

Did Prost not close down aswell?

Forgot about Prost

frostie500

smellslikeshoes wrote: »

Is there any proof of this? As far as I can tell any of the other 14 potential entries would have been just as likely to be in the same position HRT are now.

This isnt directed at you by the smellslikeshoes, quoting you because I agree with you! but I wanted to reiterate something about these new teams and their struggles. When the teams were announced the FIA changed the goalposts midway through the process. The budget cap of 40million was what enticed a lot of teams to start the application process and when the budget cap was removed suddenly they needed to raise a lot more cash.

Of the teams that could have entered F1 at the time Prodrive was the only one that would likely have been able to do F1 but they werent willing to be their own constructor (they had some sort of agreement with Mclaren IFRC. USF1 never got off the ground and if they hadnt been given their entry Lola would have been the most likely replacement....but they've since gone bust too

It's a very difficult time to try and build a team at the minute unfortunately

Jordan 199

lolie wrote: »

At £1million now:)
http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2012/11/30/kobayashi-raises-1m-fans/
He might just pull it off.
How much bucks would sutil bring with him?

I'm not sure how much money Sutil brings with him. I read that one of the teams that both Sutil and Kobayashi are being linked to (Force India) are saying that speed and not money will be the deciding factor on their driver lineup next year.

Jordan 199

frostie500 wrote: »

It's a very difficult time to try and build a team at the minute unfortunately

F1 has always been a difficult sport to crack and it will continue to be that way IMO.

bbsrs

I think Perez could outshine Button next year and be a title contender , anyone agree?

Daniel S

bbsrs wrote: »

I think Perez could outshine Button next year and be a title contender , anyone agree?

Nah not really, but I do love your username! :pac:

Wouldn't expect it.

hawkwind23

big story for me is how the merc and LH will perform.
i suspect this years car was shelved and they were focusing on developing next years car.
either that or Hamilton has made the dumbest career move ever, cant see him languishing at the back of the top ten all season.

bbsrs

Deleted User wrote: »

Wouldn't expect it.

Paddy Power doesn't think so either ,Perez 18/1 , button 8/1 big odds imo considering the car won 5 out of the last 10 races of 2012 .

GarIT

bbsrs wrote: »

I think Perez could outshine Button next year and be a title contender , anyone agree?

I think they will struggle to compete with Renault next year. They may even have to fight until the end with Mercedes over fourth.

frostie500

Id be very surprised if Perez was able to match Jenson over the course of the season. Sergio has a lot of talent, obviously, but it's one thing to be able to have strong races every now and then compared to doing it when the pressure to perform week in and week out is on with the top teams. Heikki couldn't do it at McLaren and we all know how talented he is. Getting the move to a big team means that you have to achieve big results.

We saw over the last three years that Button doesnt have the same speed as Hamilton over a single lap but over a race and over the course of three seasons there was little to choose between them. There'll be races where Perez is faster but I'd be surprised that over the balance of the season Button will be the man to beat

bbsrs

frostie500 wrote: »

Id be very surprised if Perez was able to match Jenson over the course of the season. Sergio has a lot of talent, obviously, but it's one thing to be able to have strong races every now and then compared to doing it when the pressure to perform week in and week out is on with the top teams. Heikki couldn't do it at McLaren and we all know how talented he is. Getting the move to a big team means that you have to achieve big results.

We saw over the last three years that Button doesnt have the same speed as Hamilton over a single lap but over a race and over the course of three seasons there was little to choose between them. There'll be races where Perez is faster but I'd be surprised that over the balance of the season Button will be the man to beat

Between the top 4 there is little to choose in outright race pace but in terms of innovation and rule interpretation RB's Adrian Newey is the difference over a season.
I think if Perez gets a good confidence boosting start to the season he is in with a shout as long as Newey's magic takes a while to get going.

Myrddin

bbsrs wrote: »

I think Perez could outshine Button next year and be a title contender , anyone agree?

Nope, he hasn't been great towards the end of this season, & I suspect if his performance at the start/middle of this season was the same as it was near the end, he wouldn't have got near a McLaren. He wold do well to get his head down & learn how the team works & stay outta trouble for the first season.

hawkwind23 wrote: »

either that or Hamilton has made the dumbest career move ever, cant see him languishing at the back of the top ten all season.

Time will tell, there's many factors at play that you or I have no idea about.

recyclebin

Red Bull won't be able to use DRS all the time in qualifying and will have stiffer front wings next season. I'm hoping this will level out the field again at the start of next season.

We will probably see more clever use of exhaust gases. I don't know why the FIA didn't make the rules in such a way that the exhaust exit comes right out past the rear wing.

Alter-Ego

recyclebin wrote: »

Red Bull won't be able to use DRS all the time in qualifying and will have stiffer front wings next season. I'm hoping this will level out the field again at the start of next season.

We will probably see more clever use of exhaust gases. I don't know why the FIA didn't make the rules in such a way that the exhaust exit comes right out past the rear wing.

I believe the FIA is mandating rear exhausts, similar to the ones of GP2/3 cars, for 2014.

The "coanda effect" exhausts are getting banned for 2013 as well.

Grim.

I believe the FIA is mandating rear exhausts, similar to the ones of GP2/3 cars, for 2014.

The "coanda effect" exhausts are getting banned for 2013 as well.

Great! moving F1 even closer to a spec series, well done FIA :rolleyes:

Cookie_Monster

Official calendar released. No GP of the Americas, but an unnamed European GP, likely to be Turkey for 21st July

01 Australia (Melbourne) 15 - 17 Mar
02 Malaysia (Kuala Lumpur) 22 - 24 Mar
03 China (Shanghai) 12 - 14 Apr
04 Bahrain (Sakhir) 19 - 21 Apr
05 Spain (Catalunya) 10 - 12 May
06 Monaco (Monte Carlo) 24 - 26 May
07 Canada (Montréal) 07 - 09 Jun
08 Great Britain (Silverstone) 28 - 30 Jun
09 Germany (TBA) 12 - 14 Jul
10 Additional European event (TBA) * 19 - 21 Jul
11 Hungary (Budapest) 26 - 28 Jul
12 Belgium (Spa-Francorchamps) 23 - 25 Aug
13 Italy (Monza) 06 - 08 Sep
14 Singapore (Singapore) 20 - 22 Sep
15 Korea (Yeongam) 04 - 06 Oct
16 Japan (Suzuka) 11 - 13 Oct
17 India (New Delhi) 25 - 27 Oct
18 Abu Dhabi (Yas Marina) 01 - 03 Nov
19 United States (Austin) 15 - 17 Nov
20 Brazil (São Paulo) 22 - 24 Nov

lee_baby_simms

Circuit of the Americas is Austin though right?

Rascasse

Rumours that calendar may change. The local college football team are playing that weekend which is a big deal - the Longhorns regularly get 100,000 people at their games. It's also the final weekend of NASCAR. So the locals will be watching football and the US motorsport fans will be watching NASCAR. Obvious answer is to switch with Sao Paolo and give Austin the season finale.

Also rounds 9-10-11 are 3 weekends in a row, don't think they've ever done that before have they? I hate the 3 week gaps between early season races, no need for it at all.

brian_m

Folks,

From what I can find online the German Grand Prix has not yet been confirmed for Nurburgring... The last two years I have traveled to Spa with a few friends which was really enjoyable. For 2013 we are thinking on switching to Nurburgring for a change, does anyone have any experience/opinions on it?
I have visited Nurburgring in the past but not on F1 weekend.

Thanks

Yeah I wouldn't be too sure about a German Grand Prix next season at all. Bernie's letting things slide to not have a calendar done yet!

SilverScreen

lee_baby_simms wrote: »

Circuit of the Americas is Austin though right?

Correct. Grand Prix of America is what he meant, which was to take place in New Jersey.