Gay Marriage/Marriage Equality/End of World?

seamus

They are. So many eyes in the count centre though, you'd want to be Derren Brown to manage to get your rubber out and change a few votes without being spotted.

Not a NSA agent

They use a darker pencil than HB, a bit more difficult to remove.

At least that was the case where I voted.

Stark

If you're going to be that deliberate anyway, it would probably be easier just to dispose of the voting slips rather than trying to alter them

oscarBravo

We really do have quite a well-designed voting system, which - thankfully - we managed not to bugger up by involving computers in it. The votes are cast in secret and counted in public; there's really not that much that can go wrong.

wp_rathead

seamus wrote: »

They are. So many eyes in the count centre though, you'd want to be Derren Brown to manage to get your rubber out and change a few votes without being spotted.

No to artificial contraception

Stark

wp_rathead wrote: »

No to artificial contraception

Too late. Maybe next referendum. "Artificial contraception? Vote No". "But artificial contraception is already legal". " Stop bullying us with facts and logic! "

jooksavage

The odds of a No vote seem to be lengthening. I'm wondering how David Quinn & Iona would respond if Yes swing it (as seems likely). There is something more ugly lurking beneath the disingenuous guff about children's rights etc. (something we obviously can't say out loud, unless we've got RTE's resources). I'm wondering what it would take for Quinn & Co. to drop the facade and in a fit of vein-bulging, eye-swivelling rage, condemn us all for permissive, sin-loving hethens that we are.

Zubeneschamali

jooksavage wrote: »

There is something more ugly lurking beneath the disingenuous guff about children's rights etc.

Well, of course there is!

Check out the chairman of Iona recently:

He said that everyone “is called to chaste self-mastery, according to their state; married or single, heterosexual or homosexual. There is no discrimination in this statement”.
“We shouldn’t even be having this referendum. If we, as an Irish nation, chose to accept the amendment, we turn away from God and his laws. We seriously dissolve any claim we have to expect God’s blessing and protection as a nation.
Mr McCrystal said: “How can we, with integrity, write into our Constitution recognition for homosexual pairings, in a document that invokes the authority of the Blessed Trinity and our obligations to Jesus Christ in its preamble?”

Ireland's Taliban

oscarBravo

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Mr McCrystal said: “How can we, with integrity, write into our Constitution recognition for homosexual pairings, in a document that invokes the authority of the Blessed Trinity and our obligations to Jesus Christ in its preamble?”

He's right: that's a glaring contradiction, right there.

Of course, my solution to it might not be quite the same as his...!

PopePalpatine

jooksavage, Zubeneschamali, if you want to see bitter, check out the Litigious One's Twitter page. :pac:

jooksavage

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Well, of course there is!

Check out the chairman of Iona recently:

He said that everyone “is called to chaste self-mastery, according to their state; married or single, heterosexual or homosexual. There is no discrimination in this statement”.
“We shouldn’t even be having this referendum. If we, as an Irish nation, chose to accept the amendment, we turn away from God and his laws. We seriously dissolve any claim we have to expect God’s blessing and protection as a nation.
Mr McCrystal said: “How can we, with integrity, write into our Constitution recognition for homosexual pairings, in a document that invokes the authority of the Blessed Trinity and our obligations to Jesus Christ in its preamble?”

If that's from the Times article, I think that actual quote was from Patrick McCrystal of Human Life Ireland, another certifiable nut. But I've no doubt that Iona share his sentiments.

Not a NSA agent

oscarBravo wrote: »

He's right: that's a glaring contradiction, right there.

Of course, my solution to it might not be quite the same as his...!

Think there was a group complaining Ireland was no longer a catholic country as well. I failed to see the downside.

seamus

jooksavage wrote: »

There is something more ugly lurking beneath the disingenuous guff about children's rights etc.

Iona have no concern for children's right. None, whatsoever.

They opposed the children's rights referendum.

They have literally hundreds of articles about the evils of same-sex marriage and abortion.

The have no articles about magdalene laundries or child sex abuse by priests. Zero. Nada. Zilch.

The biggest most co-ordinated abuses of children, children's rights and the structure of the family, and Iona don't make a single mention of them, never mind condemning them or otherwise making any negative remark about them.

The Iona institute only works for themselves. They have an entirely negative agenda which they will continue to follow so long as the money keeps flowing in.

When they lose a battle, rather than fight for "what they believe is right", they quietly concede and then pretend no battle existed. Exactly like the did with civil partnership and children's rights. They fought against both of these, and then once defeated, decided to claim they always supported them.

They are devoid of any ethics or principles.

Assuming they lose this referendum, they will go dark for a little while and then reappear on the next mention of something they have no qualifications talking about - like abortion - and somehow shoehorn the fact that they love gay marriage into that discussion.

aloyisious

seamus wrote: »

Iona have no concern for children's right. None, whatsoever.

They opposed the children's rights referendum.

They have literally hundreds of articles about the evils of same-sex marriage and abortion.

The have no articles about magdalene laundries or child sex abuse by priests. Zero. Nada. Zilch.

The biggest most co-ordinated abuses of children, children's rights and the structure of the family, and Iona don't make a single mention of them, never mind condemning them or otherwise making any negative remark about them.

The Iona institute only works for themselves. They have an entirely negative agenda which they will continue to follow so long as the money keeps flowing in.

When they lose a battle, rather than fight for "what they believe is right", they quietly concede and then pretend no battle existed. Exactly like the did with civil partnership and children's rights. They fought against both of these, and then once defeated, decided to claim they always supported them.

They are devoid of any ethics or principles.

Assuming they lose this referendum, they will go dark for a little while and then reappear on the next mention of something they have no qualifications talking about - like abortion - and somehow shoehorn the fact that they love gay marriage into that discussion.

It'll probably be contesting any changes to the laws that have to be adjusted to keep in line with the constitution. Anything to filibuster the changes out of time or legality.

Mr. CooL ICE

A friend and colleague of mine, who is gay, was rather upset today. While both her parents and one of her brothers are voting yes, her other brother decided at the last minute to vote no. And his argument is based on this article

/sigh

oscarBravo

Nicolas Cage wrote: »

A friend and colleague of mine, who is gay, was rather upset today. While both her parents and one of her brothers are voting yes, her other brother decided at the last minute to vote no. And his argument is based on this article

/sigh

I can't believe that hypocritical twatmonkey is writing about biological parents.

He is as devoid of shame as he is of empathy.

What a wanker!

Doctor Jimbob

oscarBravo wrote: »

I can't believe that hypocritical twatmonkey is writing about biological parents.

He is as devoid of shame as he is of empathy.

What a wanker!

Not to mention the fact his hypothetical 'catholic week' is every week in plenty of Irish schools.

The Black Oil

seamus wrote: »

Iona have no concern for children's right. None, whatsoever.

I'm no seasoned political analyst, but I think the No side has failed overall to connect with people. Rather than saying, 'OK, you have a different point of view, let's find common ground', it has run around complaining about being bullied, group think, media coverage and so on. Strategically it just didn't work, imo. I mean, do some of these people have anything positive to say about gays, at all?

This has been quite an emotional campaign in the last few days.

Then you read something like this, which is heartbreaking. 90 years, 90 years...

https://twitter.com/shanesweeneyy/status/601747732651474945

aloyisious

Lol at this part of it "Welcome to modern Ireland, a place where 'tolerance' is shoved down people's throats in much the same way Catholicism used to be". Eh Bish,,,, I didn't really write that last bit, and didn't mean it anyway when I wrote it.

joseph brand

All this talk of David 'Iona' Quinn is bringing me down.

I was on the Twittersphere #VoteYes and came across this photo of David O' Doherty who is dressed as Irish as he can, bar wearing a paddy cap, before he votes Yes.

joseph brand

The Black Oil wrote: »

I'm no seasoned political analyst, but I think the No side has failed overall to connect with people. Rather than saying, 'OK, you have a different point of view, let's find common ground', it has run around complaining about being bullied, group think, media coverage and so on. Strategically it just didn't work, imo. I mean, do some of these people have anything positive to say about gays, at all?

This has been quite an emotional campaign in the last few days.

Then you read something like this, which is heartbreaking. 90 years, 90 years...

https://twitter.com/shanesweeneyy/status/601747732651474945

I read recently that Tipperary is the most Catholic county in Ireland. My mother is from Tipp, so I spent a bit of time down there visiting my (now deceased) grandparents as a child. My granddad had a friend who never married. "Oh he's just a bit queer", everybody would say. I'm almost certain that what they meant was 'odd', but I was younger than fifteen and my reverent parents wouldn't dare mention the 'g' word.


James Randi only came out in a blog post back in 2010 aged 80. (Randi has some great videos, for anyone who isn't familiar with him and his work).

WheatenBriar

Iona are an outsourcing of the dogma section of the Catholic Church
I know nothing about them,I haven't even read the Wikipedia on them,but I know when they first appeared prominently,my first thoughts were someone in the Catholic Church decided that they needed to step aside and let a proxy organisation oppose all they felt needed opposing
Those are still my views on them
I've no doubt they're behind the other disparate no groups that surfaced in recent weeks too

Their tactic is a good one in referenda because the law allows them equal air time no matter how wacky their points with the ability to say they are not Rome (but of course they are,or maynooth anyway)

An interesting tactic used lately is the pretend 'undecided/don't know'
You'll have seen them here on boards,other social media and on radio/TV
Clever
Their purpose of course is to keep sowing the seeds of doubt and promoting bogey men

Michael OBrien

WheatenBriar wrote: »

Iona are an outsourcing of the dogma section of the Catholic Church
I know nothing about them,I haven't even read the Wikipedia on them,but I know when they first appeared prominently,my first thoughts were someone in the Catholic Church decided that they needed to step aside and let a proxy organisation oppose all they felt needed opposing
Those are still my views on them
I've no doubt they're behind the other disparate no groups that surfaced in recent weeks too

Their tactic is a good one in referenda because the law allows them equal air time no matter how wacky their points with the ability to say they are not Rome (but of course they are,or maynooth anyway)

An interesting tactic used lately is the pretend 'undecided/don't know'
You'll have seen them here on boards,other social media and on radio/TV
Clever
Their purpose of course is to keep sowing the seeds of doubt and promoting bogey men

Frankly even as an ex-catholic I still see their religious actions reprehensible even from a compassionate religious stance.
I get a view of Luke 17.2 "It would be better for him if a millstone were hung around his neck and he were cast into the sea than that he should cause one of these little ones to sin."
How many young homosexuals have killed themselves (suicide is a sin) over the actions of the catholic church (and other christians) and their puppet Iona Institute message?

Blowfish

So, I don't know if I'm just living in a bubble or what, but in Dublin City Centre it seems like it'll be a complete whitewash for the Yes side. As an experiment I decided to count the support. In the 15 minutes walking home on my commute, there were 45 people with Yes badges/stickers and none on the No side. That's despite walking directly past a poling station where badges etc. wouldn't be allowed.

I honestly don't think I've seen anything quite like it.

WheatenBriar

Michael OBrien wrote: »

Frankly even as an ex-catholic I still see their religious actions reprehensible even from a compassionate religious stance.
I get a view of Luke 17.2 "It would be better for him if a millstone were hung around his neck and he were cast into the sea than that he should cause one of these little ones to sin."
How many young homosexuals have killed themselves (suicide is a sin) over the actions of the catholic church (and other christians) and their puppet Iona Institute message?

I don't think suicide is a sin with them anymore
That's another thing I don't get with them,they marry adulterers,condom users,non virgins,abolish holy days even though yesterday not going to mass on that day was a sin,make it a sin for not going to mass on paddys day in the Republic but it's not a sin in the rest of the world or if you're French
Etc etc etc
Oh it's not worth talking about

ShooterSF

Can't vote as I'm in Canada but my mam messaged me to tell me my wheelchair bound 85 year old grandma asked her to help take her to vote so her grandson (my cousin) could get married :')

joseph brand

Train loads of voters coming from Blighty.



Also, I found this quality auto-tune in the similar After hours thread.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrPOOkJkXMk

Cabaal

Just back from voting with my wife, seemed to be a really good turn out in the local place. I've never seen q's out the door before for any previous issue I've voted on. Looked to alot more people in their 20's and 30's too then normal.

I'm guessing 70% win for yes come tomorrow,

aloyisious

I took a stroll down for fish and chips and there were car-jams don by the voting centre, along with hundreds of people, families incl, on foot to and from it.