Olympic Qualifiers last chance saloon!

slapbangwallop

Billy Walsh on Adam Nolan qualifying for Olympics in London

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rn2HNTZyFzo

slapbangwallop

Wexford Garda Adam Nolan qualifies for London 2012 Olympics at Turkish boxing qualifier

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KFceU4c5cr4

section4

Have to say he has done realy well, been watching him in the seniors this last couple of years and thought he was lucky to win senior title 2 years ago and thought with the class in his weight class this year he would struggle to hold on to it but he did, and now he has qualified for the olympics so fair play to him, one thing you can be sure of is that he will be fit and give it everthing, he will serve Irelnd well in the olympics.
Just a thought but i feel if Joe Ward had the same disciplne and dedication as Adam Nolan he would be qualifed now. Maybe its me but i did not think joe ward looked that fit in the bit of footage i saw of his fight.

walshb

section4 wrote: »

Just a thought but i feel if Joe Ward had the same disciplne and dedication as Adam Nolan he would be qualifed now. Maybe its me but i did not think joe ward looked that fit in the bit of footage i saw of his fight.

Is there talk or rumour that Ward was slacking off and not committed?

megadodge

section4 wrote: »

Just a thought but i feel if Joe Ward had the same disciplne and dedication as Adam Nolan he would be qualifed now. Maybe its me but i did not think joe ward looked that fit in the bit of footage i saw of his fight.

Extremely unfair and unfounded comment.

Have you any actual proof whatsoever?

Conditioning certainly wasn't an issue according to anyone who actually saw the bout. The major talking point was that he dominated the last round yet the scores didn't reflect this. Doesn't sound like a problem to me. Plus he just doesn't have the Adonis bodytype - so what!! Neither did Larry Holmes or Julio Cesar Chavez or Joe Calzaghe and it didn't affect them.

I was at the senior finals and IMO he looked much more 'toned' than last year, his legs looked stronger and he seemed more 'proportioned' than previously.

walshb

megadodge wrote: »

Extremely unfair and unfounded comment.

Have you any actual proof whatsoever?
.

Exactly what I was thinking when I posted my reply.

section4

walshb wrote: »

Exactly what I was thinking when I posted my reply.

No proof whatsoever, I was making an observation based on the clip i saw of him in that particular fight, and his activity since coming on to the scene as a senior, he has a wife and child and so therefore with the best will in the world its hard to be in the best physical and mental shape for this level of competition with these responsibilities. He will obviously be more committed to his family and that could be the difference between him and other fighters who have no other distractions and who ares soley focused on the olympics.

walshb

section4 wrote: »

No proof whatsoever, I was making an observation based on the clip i saw of him in that particular fight, and his activity since coming on to the scene as a senior, he has a wife and child and so therefore with the best will in the world its hard to be in the best physical and mental shape for this level of competition with these responsibilities. He will obviously be more committed to his family and that could be the difference between him and other fighters who have no other distractions and who ares soley focused on the olympics.

Well, for all you know he could be putting in more in the gym than anyone. I don't see how you can make the observation at all from looking at a clip here and there.

Fair enough, if after a rd he was out on his feet and on fumes I could see someone questioning his stamina, preparation etc. The particular fight you speak of, I assume it's the loss to the Turk, yes? And, the clip, was it from the RTE news? Very short snippet.

barney4001

I cannot see the reason or logic that Katie Taylor or Joe Ward and others like them should have to qualify for the Olympics selection their records speak volumes as to their ability

Big Ears

barney4001 wrote: »

I cannot see the reason or logic that Katie Taylor or Joe Ward and others like them should have to qualify for the Olympics selection their records speak volumes as to their ability

How do you propose the qualification system should work so ?

I'm by no means happy that Ward has been denied a place at the Olympics seemingly due to biased or incompetent officiating, but I don't have a problem with the qualification procedure which has been used for either this Olympics or the last.

Dan man

Big Ears wrote: »

How do you propose the qualification system should work so ?

I'm by no means happy that Ward has been denied a place at the Olympics seemingly due to biased or incompetent officiating, but I don't have a problem with the qualification procedure which has been used for either this Olympics or the last.

Well I certainly do have a problem with a qualification system whereby if a reigning World champion 3 times over and 5 time European champion was laid off by injury for a couple of weeks in May then too bad they don't go to London, regardless of dominating the sport for the guts of the last decade.
Of course there should be a qualifying procedure for the Olympics regardless of world ranking, world titles etc, but the fact that there is only one qualification tournament for women boxers is disgraceful.
The men's qualification system is far from ideal also, I think for Beijing it was better in that there were 3 qualifying tournaments in the year of the Olympics which meant that the cream really came to the top over the course of the qualification. For one thing it meant that a boxer's entire campaign could not be totally derailed by one dodgy judging decision.

barney4001

Big Ears wrote: »

How do you propose the qualification system should work so ?

I'm by no means happy that Ward has been denied a place at the Olympics seemingly due to biased or incompetent officiating, but I don't have a problem with the qualification procedure which has been used for either this Olympics or the last.

Each country to nominate and send their their own competitors to the Olympics provided they have proven themselves

and as for the judging in the boxing it needs looked into,why not try to change this system as where 2 judges would vote for each corner scoring with a fifth judge scoring it as he sees it, when you look back at some of the decisions given in Amateur boxing especially where Asia is concerned something needs to be done about it

Big Ears

Dan man wrote: »

Well I certainly do have a problem with a qualification system whereby if a reigning World champion 3 times over and 5 time European champion was laid off by injury for a couple of weeks in May then too bad they don't go to London, regardless of dominating the sport for the guts of the last decade.
Of course there should be a qualifying procedure for the Olympics regardless of world ranking, world titles etc, but the fact that there is only one qualification tournament for women boxers is disgraceful.
The men's qualification system is far from ideal also, I think for Beijing it was better in that there were 3 qualifying tournaments in the year of the Olympics which meant that the cream really came to the top over the course of the qualification. For one thing it meant that a boxer's entire campaign could not be totally derailed by one dodgy judging decision.

That would be a very unfortunate scenario indeed, however if the same fighter qualified in May and suffered an injury in mid July and was laid off for a couple of weeks, they would also miss the games. There is only 8 places available per weight for the female competition. Now perhaps they could have shifted the Women's World Championships to March and had 4 participants qualify at Flyweight, Lightweight and Middleweight, and then had another qualification tournament in May, with the remaining 4 places being claimed then.

However the problem with this is due to the short numbers qualification for the final 4 places couldn't be renationalised and they'd have to have all fighters compete at the same event, in essence it would be a 2nd World championship, minus the top 4 from the previous one. That could prove very costly on some smaller countries resources aswell. It's certainly not an ideal situation the way it is, and I'm not saying there isn't a better solution out there, but with only 8 places to give per weight class, it's not a easy thing to get right.

I must admit I did prefer the Beijing qualification slightly over this one, with an increased number of qualification events. However at both Light-Welterweight and Heavyweight a 2nd qualification tournament would not have been possible, as only one qualification place remained for Europe in both weight classes after the World Championships. Perhaps they should have split the qualification procedure between 2 events for the other weight classes.

barney4001 wrote: »

Each country to nominate and send their their own competitors to the Olympics provided they have proven themselves

and as for the judging in the boxing it needs looked into,why not try to change this system as where 2 judges would vote for each corner scoring with a fifth judge scoring it as he sees it, when you look back at some of the decisions given in Amateur boxing especially where Asia is concerned something needs to be done about it

This is not possible as there is a limit to the total amount of athletes an Olympic games can cater for and as such the amount of athletes in each sport is restricted. This is why it took so long to get Women's boxing into the Olympics, and why there was a reduction in places for the Men's event (with the removal of a weight-class plus a few other places), to allow for this, by keeping the overall amount of athletes the same.

I'd also like to hear you quantify what 'proven themselves' means.
Bad decisions in both professional and amateur boxing are commonplace, this doesn't mean that we should merely accept that and get on with things, and ways to improve scoring should always be looked at. However I would expect rather large discrepancies in scoring if 4 of the judges were only focusing their scoring on an individual fighter and only one was looking at both of them. I'd expect even greater robberies to occur if such a system was in place, and that's without any bias from the judges, merely due to the fact that some are more trigger happy than others when it comes to what they see as a scoring shot.
You could get two judges who are extremely conservative judging one fighter, and another two who think they're in a thumb war with the scoring button judging the other.

Dodge

No issue with the qualification for the men. Does seem particularly harsh on the women though. If that draw isn't seeded, you could easily have the 2nd best boxer in a weight division not make it if she draws the favourite. I realise this can happen at the games, but for many women boxers simply getting to the games would be a huge step for them.

lets just hope Katie makes it.

tflanagan5

video analysis of the fight showed ward landed 33 clean punches to the turks 18 so its was undeniably a blatent robbery

barney4001

Dodge wrote: »

No issue with the qualification for the men. Does seem particularly harsh on the women though. If that draw isn't seeded, you could easily have the 2nd best boxer in a weight division not make it if she draws the favourite. I realise this can happen at the games, but for many women boxers simply getting to the games would be a huge step for them.

lets just hope Katie makes it.

It would be a great injustice if katie fails due to a dubious decision and thats the only way she would fail to qualify

walshb

barney4001 wrote: »

It would be a great injustice if katie fails due to a dubious decision and thats the only way she would fail to qualify

You will find no bigger fan and supporter ot KT here, but that's just a wee bit complacent/arrogant, isn't it? KT has been consistently the best, but it's not like she has had it easy. She had many fights that were ultra close, so why would it be odd if she failed to progress? Is it not possible that a girl could unseat her, beat her or deny her a place, without it being a dubious decision?

Dodge

walshb wrote: »

You will find no bigger fan and supporter ot KT here, but that's just a wee bit complacent/arrogant, isn't it? KT has been consistently the best, but it's not like she has had it easy. She had had many fights that were ultra close, so why would it be odd if she failed to progress? Is it not possible that a girl could unseat her, beat her or deny her a place?

Spot on. Its boxing. We've all seen heavy favourites lose. Katie's been world class for years, but ANYTHING can happen.

Lets just hope she gets average luck and gets the medal she deserves

barney4001

i got it on very good authority that Joe Ward gets the wild card nomination

barney4001

ps and im backing him to win gold

looking a price now

gene_tunney

barney4001 wrote: »

i got it on very good authority that Joe Ward gets the wild card nomination

barney4001

put your shirt on it

Jayob10

barney4001 wrote: »

i got it on very good authority that Joe Ward gets the wild card nomination

If you heard what I heard last night then its still not confirmed, nothing will be confirmed until May.
The news is that he is under consideration, thats all really.

He has a definite chance, he has by no means been awarded the wildcard. Yet.

barney4001

Jayob10 wrote: »

If you heard what I heard last night then its still not confirmed, nothing will be confirmed until May.
The news is that he is under consideration, thats all really.

He has a definite chance, he has by no means been awarded the wildcard. Yet.

As good as from what i heard

walshb

barney4001 wrote: »

ps and im backing him to win gold

looking a price now

Don't waste your money.

Jayob10

barney4001 wrote: »

As good as from what i heard

thats just not true im afraid, its no closer than it was.

All thats known is that the lines of communication are open between the IABA and the AIBA. theres a good relationship there, but thats all.

Nothing is guaranteed. We are not the only ones talking to the AIBA either.

Dan man

barney4001 wrote: »

put your shirt on it

Keep your shirt on lad, there's no way it's anywhere near to being finalised yet. Fingers crossed it'll work out in his favour.

Dodge

barney4001 wrote: »

As good as from what i heard

the continental qualifiers aren't even over yet. Still have Africa and the Americas to go.

Calm down