So I have an Electric car on test..

RobAMerc

Nissan doctor wrote: »

If he is going to write an informative piece on the subject then he has to know all these things.

fair enough - not to me though,I'm not trying to be smart it's just that I'd be more interested in the real world questions such as those Matt Simis posed. I don't have an engineering or physics degree, I like cars

Bodhan

Matt Simis wrote: »

Id be interesting in hearing:

Lack of noise and its effect on pedestrians crossing roads and carparks (genuinely, its the opposite of loud pipes save lives). Plus:

• Overtaking ability on motorway
• Overtaking ability on tight, winding backroads
• General performance outside of maintained urban areas.
• Lack of noise, engine feedback and general "mechanicalness" and its effect on driver fatigue over long commutes

Good questions!

On a motorway it does just fine, easy to overtake because of all the torque BUT the faster you drive the more fuel you use just like a normal car. So the range drops quickly once you get over the 120kph mark.

Same here for the small roads, if anything its better because all the torque comes in one go at all speeds.

It just behaves like a normal car on any road, there's even cruise control.

Lack of noise is a big issue, in two days I've had dogs, kids and adults just walk out in front of me, I nearly hit the dog too as he just ran out in the street. Kids and adults were ok, they just got a shock when they seen the car so close. They need a noise especially when reversing.

stimpson

Bodhan wrote: »

Good questions!

On a motorway it does just fine, easy to overtake because of all the torque BUT the faster you drive the more fuel you use just like a normal car. So the range drops quickly once you get over the 120kph mark.

So what's the range at 120kph on a full charge? What speed did you do Dublin to Portlaoise at?

GavMan

Mellio wrote: »

1. Too Expensive to buy and then pay rental of €82 a month for a battery.
€82 x 12 months x 10 years = €9,840. (Assuming it lasts 10 years)

A little erroneous in that the Fluence ZE is €21,610. Hardless outrageous for a family Saloon. Plus your agreement with Renault is for 3 years, so thats 2952 on top of 21610 = 24562 all in. Again very favourable with the diesel equivalent.

Bodhan

bbam wrote: »

Service costs over 5 years or even longer.
I'd like to understand what maintenance costs there would be? I don't believe there are no serviceable parts in the motors/drivetrain.

I know your test won't cover resale values but what are opinions on this? I'd fear the depreciation on a 5 year old car with 100,000 km's would be horrific.

There are of course normal oily bits in the car, shocks, CV joints and so on. There's no engine and gearbox stuff though (there's only one gear) so other than normal wear and tear stuff that happens to any car the servicing should be much cheaper.

That's unknown at the moment, we've never had used electric cars before. It depends on how many of them are sold to begin with, if there's a market for them then it will do well.

irishgrover

Bodhan wrote: »

...... You need a special cable to fast charge and that isn't supplied in the test car so I can't comment there/
......

hi again. I was seriously considering and electric car a couple of months ago. I test drove both the renault and also the nissan.
I could not handle the nissan purely because if looked a bit odd, but also because of the inital cost.
The renault went out of consideration for the following reasons...

Renault told me that:
a.) The current car will not work with the public fast charge points
b.) A new model that will come out next year will
c.) The current model cannot be retro-fitted to use the fast charge.

This to me was a "show stopper". In effect I could not drive the car from Galway to Dublin without at least one very significant (possible overnight stop)

This, to me, makes the Renault (current model) compeltely unbuyable

Kinikie

How many public chargers are there? And are they all city based?

Bodhan

stimpson wrote: »

So what's the range at 120kph on a full charge? What speed did you do Dublin to Portlaoise at?

All on the N7, so between 100kph and 120kph all the way home, nearly 100kms all told. At the other end I still have 30kms left in the tank, I didn't use cruise control for the drive.
I'm the first test in Ireland so there's a lot more info to come on this millage thing yet. I'm also out on another 100km run tomorrow, that's 100kms there and back with a charge in between!

Wile E. Coyote

GavMan wrote: »

A little erroneous in that the Fluence ZE is €21,610. Hardless outrageous for a family Saloon. Plus your agreement with Renault is for 3 years, so thats 2952 on top of 21610 = 24562 all in. Again very favourable with the diesel equivalent.

The main problem I see with the €82 per month rental is that it's only for 10,000km per year. Thats less that 200km per week. Anything over that you're charged extra for.

Bodhan

Kinikie wrote: »

How many public chargers are there? And are they all city based?

There's charges going in all over the place. There's an app you can get on iTunes from the ESB that shows all of them, good app actually. It's on Android too.
Here's a full map on the web http://www.esb.ie/electric-cars/electric-car-charging/electric-car-charge-point-map.jsp

Bodhan

Wile E. Coyote wrote: »

The main problem I see with the €82 per month rental is that it's only for 10,000km per year. Thats less that 200km per week. Anything over that you're charged extra for.

That's my problem too, at the moment Renault won't say what the charge is when you go over the 10k.
My mates in the UK tell me that they charge 5-10 pounds per month extra for going over. That's a lot if you are going to do 20k per year.

dr.fuzzenstein

Bodhan wrote: »

Lack of noise is a big issue, in two days I've had dogs, kids and adults just walk out in front of me, I nearly hit the dog too as he just ran out in the street. Kids and adults were ok, they just got a shock when they seen the car so close. They need a noise especially when reversing.

Thanks for your previous reply, very useful info.
As for the noise, some vehicles offer artificial noise, this might be standard or even legal requirement in the future.
Some info:
http://www.transport.vic.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0019/60634/EV-fact-sheet-TEACHER-electric-vehicle-basics-w.pdf
http://www.transport.vic.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0019/60634/EV-fact-sheet-TEACHER-electric-vehicle-basics-w.pdf
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_vehicle_warning_sounds

Sesshoumaru

Bodhan wrote: »

Lack of noise is a big issue, in two days I've had dogs, kids and adults just walk out in front of me, I nearly hit the dog too as he just ran out in the street. Kids and adults were ok, they just got a shock when they seen the car so close. They need a noise especially when reversing.

http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/business/8880765.Nissan_Leaf_facing_delay/

NISSAN is delaying delivery of its Leaf electric car which goes on sale in the UK from today after it emerged the vehicle has been fitted with a hazard warning bleeper that must be removed before it can be driven in this country.

The hazard warning beeper came on when put into reverse.

The Leaf does make an artificial whining noise at low speed. TBH I've never had an issue with people not hearing the car coming. I've also driven the Fluence ZE, I thought it also makes a whining noise once put into D mode?

bbam

Would there be much reduction in range if you were loaded.
Say 4 adults over a journey.


In fairness it sounds like they could easily replace lots of town runabouts without much trouble. Leaving more fossil fuels for the rest of us to use up.

Mellio

GavMan wrote: »

A little erroneous in that the Fluence ZE is €21,610. Hardless outrageous for a family Saloon. Plus your agreement with Renault is for 3 years, so thats 2952 on top of 21610 = 24562 all in. Again very favourable with the diesel equivalent.

Fair enough but what happens after 3 years and the battery then becomes your responsiblity.

You have to go to main dealer for maintenance or repairs as there will be very few if any independant garages being abale to service/repair these and we all know what the costs are like for servicing by main dealers.

and as already mentioned whats the additinoal cost for going over 10,000km, I work and drive locally and still do more than 10,000km so another expense.


I have just read that they are also offering different types of packages such as a Maintenance package, breakdown package so again more expense.

I believe its a black hole as to how much the overall costs will be and then again what the resale values will be. Main Dealers will have you over a barrell in terms of what they are willing to offer you.

Big Nasty

And for interior noise:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C4H_PCeVQeM

Nissan doctor

Mellio wrote: »

Fair enough but what happens after 3 years and the battery then becomes your responsiblity.

You have to go to main dealer for maintenance or repairs as there will be very few if any independant garages being abale to service/repair these and we all know what the costs are like for servicing by main dealers.

and as already mentioned whats the additinoal cost for going over 10,000km, I work and drive locally and still do more than 10,000km so another expense.


I have just read that they are also offering different types of packages such as a Maintenance package, breakdown package so again more expense.

I believe its a black hole as to how much the overall costs will be and then again what the resale values will be. Main Dealers will have you over a barrell in terms of what they are willing to offer you.

I know an independent mechanic who is going for specific training for electric/hybrid/start stop vehicles in the next few months;)

Mellio

Nissan doctor wrote: »

I know an independent mechanic who is going for specific training for electric/hybrid/start stop vehicles in the next few months;)

Well if I ever decide to go with an Electric Car I will know there is at least one option of an independant mechanic.

Matt Simis

MCMLXXV wrote: »

And for interior noise:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C4H_PCeVQeM

GTFO!

From the Youtube clip text:

Sound Racer V8 in my brothers'
Scion. Delicious, delicious fun.

Sounds absolutely nothing like any internal combustion engine, let alone a V8. Sounds more like a broken electric grass strimmer.

Big Nasty

Matt Simis wrote: »

Sounds absolutely nothing like any internal combustion engine, let alone a V8. Sounds more like a broken electric grass strimmer.

Sounds better than tumbleweed though!

copeyhagen

have been in the nissans with work a few times, i think electric cars will be the future, but not yet.

where do we get the electricity to charge these eco friendly cars, by burning fossil fuels.

and the esb public charge points will be charging from some time in 2012

Bodhan

Sesshoumaru wrote: »

http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/business/8880765.Nissan_Leaf_facing_delay/



The hazard warning beeper came on when put into reverse.

The Leaf does make an artificial whining noise at low speed. TBH I've never had an issue with people not hearing the car coming. I've also driven the Fluence ZE, I thought it also makes a whining noise once put into D mode?

It does make a whine when driving but not a peep at low speeds, in reverse it's quieter than a person who's walking.

Bodhan

bbam wrote: »

Would there be much reduction in range if you were loaded.
Say 4 adults over a journey.


In fairness it sounds like they could easily replace lots of town runabouts without much trouble. Leaving more fossil fuels for the rest of us to use up.

More weight in the car means bad MPG, the same goes for standard cars. I've had two small kids plus car seats and two adults in the front without noticing any reduction in range. All depends on how you drive.

Bodhan

MCMLXXV wrote: »

And for interior noise:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C4H_PCeVQeM

I love that kind of noise too and EV cars are as much about saving the fuel so Trans Am owners can burn it as another way of driving!

Bodhan

copeyhagen wrote: »

have been in the nissans with work a few times, i think electric cars will be the future, but not yet.

where do we get the electricity to charge these eco friendly cars, by burning fossil fuels.

and the esb public charge points will be charging from some time in 2012

We get some of out electricity from fossil fuels but less and less every year. Because coal and oil are running out we need to get new/better ways of doing things.
I'm not saying that EV cars are the only future but they will be part of the future.
Yes, the public charge points will be charged in the future but then you don't get petrol for free either.

challengemaster

RoverJames wrote: »

Here we go again???
You were the one mentioning you say what you like

I don't remember you mentioning in any of the videos on the site about any car being along the lines of the the worst car you've driven

I'd be guessing you won't be revealing what these best sellers are who were some of the worst cars you've driven?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYWylsLdgA4

Try tell me that's not an honestly critical review....

Bodhan

challengemaster wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYWylsLdgA4

Try tell me that's not an honestly critical review....

haha, I'd forgotten about that one. Or maybe I tried to blot it out

RoverJames

RoverJames wrote: »

Here we go again???
You were the one mentioning you say what you like

I don't remember you mentioning in any of the videos on the site about any car being along the lines of the the worst car you've driven

I'd be guessing you won't be revealing what these best sellers are who were some of the worst cars you've driven?

Bodhan wrote: »

Why don't we keep it on topic?

Bodhan wrote: »

haha, I'd forgotten about that one. Or maybe I tried to blot it out

:pac:

"It's a decent car"

Nissan doctor

Bodhan wrote: »

haha, I'd forgotten about that one. Or maybe I tried to blot it out

I haven't watched the video, but if its about the 3rd road seats on the outlander(judging from the screen shot) then they are the most ridiculous things to try to open and put in place I've ever seen.

It would actually be easier if you had to bolt them in and out I recon!:eek:

Eric Cartman

irishgrover wrote: »

This to me was a "show stopper". In effect I could not drive the car from Galway to Dublin without at least one very significant (possible overnight stop)

This, to me, makes the Renault (current model) compeltely unbuyable

but look at it this way, id say little chef are ramping up their plans and puring money into EV's , what better way to make money than have somebody forced to sit around for a few hours while the car charges