Mass Effect 3: The Ending(s) [** Spoilers **]

Vadakin

Shiminay wrote: »

Incoming rant - not intended to hate on everyone who didn't enjoy the ending, but it's targeted at the bl33ters:

I refuse to accept that because you lack imagination that story tellers are somehow "wrong."

The whole thing is both highly insulting to anyone with a creative bone in their body and pathetic at the sense of entitlement that people seem to be displaying about this. The writers (and, lets not forget, Bioware, the people who pay them to tell the tale) thought it was the best way to end *THEIR* story. The utter nonsense I'm seeing about this galls me - it's akin to the retards who were OUTRAGED at the fact that Ned Stark was killed at the end of the first Game of Thrones tv show because they're too lazy to read the books and think that you're not allowed tell a story the way you want because people with no imagination who simply expect it to work out the way that every other "by the numbers" story they've been force fed got TV and Film will object ("the main character's not supposed to die waa waa waa". It's fking outrageous that this is even an issue.

You don't go and tell an artist that they've painted that picture wrong, they have to re-do it. You don't tell a musician that their song is wrong, they need to re-write it. Why the sense of entitlement of creative direction in this situation?

Incoming counter-rant from someone who is actually a writer and thus would surely be about defending artistic integrity. Not in this case though as it doesn't apply.

First, the notion that it's Bioware's story. It is...but not entirely. The Mass Effect series wasn't made in isolation. It was made with fan participation. A perfect example is Tali and Garrus. They weren't meant to have a big role in Mass Effect 2 but fans wanted them back, so Bioware put them in. Fans wanted the chance to romance them so Bioware made it possible. Bioware themselves have freely admitted that they made Mass Effect in consultation with fans. Bioware wrote the story but took fan feedback into account, thus the fans do have a right to complain. Especially when they were told one thing and got another.

Second, about rewriting the ending...guess what, they already did it once. This is where Bioware's artistic integrity argument falls flat on its face. Last year, when the beta leaked, so did the script. Fans didn't like the direction the finale was going in. So Bioware changed it completely. The original ending (which was just as bad) was all about the build up of Dark Energy. The whole Organics vs Synthetics ending was put in at the last minute as a replacement. If Bioware were so concerned about artistic integrity, they would have stuck to their guns and not changed the ending 6 months before release.

Third. Video games are collaborative art. Art can be changed. Tolkien changed The Hobbit when it didn't match up with Lord of the Rings. Ridley Scott has had quite a few attempts at re-cutting Blade Runner. When something doesn't work, the artist or artists in this case, can change it. There is a long running precedent for it. It's even more appropriate in video games where the piece of art is constantly being upgraded and added to. If an artist is commissioned to paint a family portrait and does something that the family doesn't like, he is obliged to make necessary changes. In effect, the consumers are the patrons here. Games are made for the express purpose of being bought. More than that, if art should not be changed, what would you say about mods for games created by fans that can change a game in sometimes drastic ways? Are they not taking a dump all over the artist by changing their work?

Fourth. Bioware lied about their product. Even if games are art, they are still a product. Bioware made repeated statements about how the ending of the game would play out with 16 different endings being promised, choices mattering and not coming down to picking A, B or C. That is of course exactly what happened. You were given 3 nonsensical choices and the ending cinematics weren't drastically different. There was a change in colour palette and some minor tweaks. You can't even say that what Bioware said 2 years ago shouldn't be held against them today but I'm not talking about 2 years ago. In the weeks before release, Bioware were saying the same things about choice and multiple endings and how singleplayer wouldn't be negatively affected by not playing multiplayer (it is).

Fifth. This related to what I said above. Bioware didn't sell this game as their story. They sold it as our story. They gave us choices and we made them and our stories would be affected by those choices. That was absolutely the case, right up until it mattered most and then it was taken away. In essence, we didn't get what we were promised. It was always an ambitious project of course, with choices spanning 3 games but after what they did with the rest of Mass Effect 3, there was no reason to think that they couldn't make the ending work for different players with different play throughs.

Sixth. Now I'm going to talk about why the ending itself makes no sense. It's not the Normandy, it's not your squad mates showing up on the Normandy - it's Shepard and the Catalyst. The Catalyst gives his explanation. 14 lines incidentally. That's all Shepard had to go on when making his/her choice. So Catalyst explains that Synthetics will always seek to destroy organics...uh...wait a second, I just united the Quarian and the Geth. I just spent 3 games proving that the Catalyst is wrong. Not a problem, I'll just point that out...wait...

Let me walk you through my male paragon Shepard, the guy I decided to play ME3 with first. My Shepard talked Wrex down on Virmire. My Shepard convinced Saren that he was wrong. My Shepard saved the Council to further galactic unity. My Shepard convinced Garrus not to kill Sidonis. My Shepard rewrote the Geth Heretics. My Shepard urged the Quarian not to go to war. My Shepard brought his team on a suicide mission, destroyed the Collector Base and came back alive. My Shepard helped to cure the Genophage. My Shepard united the Quarian and the Geth and right at the end, my Shepard convinced The Illusive Man that he was wrong. My Shepard has said and done a lot.

So when Catalyst made his case, his logic was severely flawed in my playthrough. The actions my Shepard took proved him wrong. And my Shepard would point that out. I fully expected a Paragon/Renegade dialogue option to pop up. But no. Shepard didn't point out the flaws in Catalyst's logic. He didn't explain that Catalyst was wrong and that the Reaper's were no longer necessary. The guy talking to the Catalyst was NOT my Shepard. And that's what's wrong with the ending to Mass Effect 3. In my playthrough, it makes no sense. Bioware screwed up. It's as simple as that.

The notion that a mistake can't be fixed because it's art is ludicrous. It's happened many times before and ultimately, Mass Effect 3 is a consumer product that was created in part by the consumer. So don't give me this artist crap. They screwed up. Whether they change the ending or not, they should hold their hands up and apologize for that. If they had, much of the animosity towards them wouldn't be there.

The great thing about the modern video game is that games can be fixed. They can be patched for bugs, they can be retconned to provide continued gameplay (as in Fallout 3) and they can be added to with additional story and game play content. Isn't DLC essentially changing and expanding on art?

There is an easy fix for Mass Effect 3. Add a dialogue option where Shepard can point out that Catalyst is wrong and have it available only if the Quarian and Geth made peace. The original endings remain intact for those who want it and the massive plot hole that destroys the whole series, not just the end of one game, is eradicated. A new and logical ending can be added without getting rid of the old ones.

And for the record, those complaining aren't doing so because Shepard dies. I suggest you actually go and look up what people are upset about before you attack them.

hooradiation

Vadakin wrote: »

wrote a lot of stuff

Fans as patrons? Fans as part of the design process? Bioware lied to me? The entire series is destroyed?

What a load of over entitled rubbish.

Vadakin

hooradiation wrote: »

Fans as patrons? Fans as part of the design process? Bioware lied to me? The entire series is destroyed?

What a load of over entitled rubbish.

Except of course that it's all true. Fans were part of the design process. The game was made for the express purpose of being bought and played by consumers, Bioware did lie about how it would all play out and from a story perspective the entire series is destroyed. Games, books, comics, all of it. Why? Because it's all pointless. Because the choices ultimately don't matter. Can I enjoy the games on a pure gameplay level? Sure. But Mass Effect was sold by Bioware on its story. So how can I go through this three-part story again when I know that none of it is going to matter?

You know, if Shepard got to the end, was told it was all a trick and that the Crucible was a Reaper weapon meant to destroy the galaxy (which it actually kind of is...oops) and then Harbinger came down, killed Shepard, activated the Crucible and wiped out all sentient life in the galaxy, giving a final victory to the Reapers....I'd have been fine with that. I'd be fine with a tragic ending where everyone died as long as it made sense.

If Shepard made his case to Catalyst, proved him wrong but Catalyst activated the Crucible himself because his programming couldn't be altered to accept a new scenario, leaving us with the same endings, I'd have been fine with that. I'd be angry but I'd accept it because it would make some sort of sense.

Mass Effect 3's ending makes no sense. It's utterly pointless. For me, that renders the whole series pointless, at least as far as the story goes.

As for being over entitled, you're damn right I'm entitled. Bioware made a mistake and I want them to fix it. If I buy a new Ferrari only to discover that it has the engine from a 1991 Ford Fiesta, I'd have every right to feel angry and want what I paid for.

hooradiation

Vadakin wrote: »

As for being over entitled, you're damn right I'm entitled. Bioware made a mistake and I want them to fix it. If I buy a new Ferrari only to discover that it has the engine from a 1991 Ford Fiesta, I'd have every right to feel angry and want what I paid for.

It's an ending you don't happen to care for, and that's all it is. You have no entitlement to anything.

Deal with it.

Zillah

Gbear wrote: »

And there's a very large gulf in the class of writing between GRR Martin and whoever wrote the story of Mass Effect. For me, a sign of a good writer isn't that they can stick plot twists in all over the place, it's that they can do that while maintaining the overall integrity of the story and while Martin does that, I don't see evidence of that with the ending of Mass Effect.

Not entirely on topic, but I'm just finishing the Song of Ice and Fire books now, and I think GRR Martin is only ok. His characters are fairly bland and shallow, very few of them have any interesting motivations or quirks and just as we're starting to get into one story he flies off to the other side of continent and we don't hear from that person again for another two hundred pages.

Mass Effect has much more interesting characters. The writing suffers from a certain lack of discipline and maturity, but I could pick out far more distinctive and memorable characters from the trilogy than I could from Martin. In the former we have a religious assassin dying of a terminal illness, a lonely robot with a man-crush on the protagonist, a psychotic hedonistic telekinetic witch with a tormented past, an aging warlord turned mercenary destined to save the future of his people....in the latter we get, uhm, "angry noble", "mean bandit", "honourable King", "nasty King", "jealous brother"...

There's a few better examples but they're few and far between and not dealt with in any depth.

Vadakin

hooradiation wrote: »

It's an ending you don't happen to care for, and that's all it is. You have no entitlement to anything.

Deal with it.

Given the time and money I invested in this series based on the promises of Bioware, I'm entitled to ask for what I paid for. If this was something like Heavy Rain, where the game was made in isolation and was being presented as an artistic vision, it would be different. This is not the case with Mass Effect as I've previously explained. If you didn't bother to pay attention, not to me, but to Bioware themselves, well that's your problem. If you happen to like the ending, good for you. I'm glad you got some enjoyment out of it.

Regardless of what happens, I actually think this whole thing is healthy. I've been following the controversy from the beginning and however you feel about the movement to get a better ending for the game specifically, it is serving to expose the dark secrets of the video game industry. Game journalism for example is being called out on its hypocrisy and we're seeing just how far removed from the gamer that many game journalists and publications actually are. It's also showing that publishers can't take gamers for granted. EA's stock is falling, as is the price of Mass Effect 3. It's cheaper to buy it new now than used. At the very least, EA is going to need to have a good look at its PR strategy.

Should gamers always get everything they want? No. But they shouldn't be forced to shut up and take it either. If this controversy forces the industry to have that conversation, then whatever happens with the game ending, it will be a good result.

hooradiation

Vadakin wrote: »

Given the time and money I invested in this series based on the promises of Bioware, I'm entitled to ask for what I paid for.

Did you not receive a copy of mass effect 3 or something? Because unless you didn't after paying your money then you got exactly what you paid for.

The fact that you don't like the ending is does not mean you have not been swindled, hoodwinked or cheated. It just means you didn't like the ending.
Some goddamn perspective would not go amiss.

Vadakin wrote: »

it is serving to expose the dark secrets of the video game industry

Like what? That these 'fans' are over entitled man children with no goddamn sense of perspective and are impossible to please?
We already knew that.

Vadakin wrote: »

Should gamers always get everything they want? No. But they shouldn't be forced to shut up and take it either.

They should shut up, oh god how I wish they'd shut up.

Gbear

Zillah wrote: »

Not entirely on topic, but I'm just finishing the Song of Ice and Fire books now, and I think GRR Martin is only ok. His characters are fairly bland and shallow, very few of them have any interesting motivations or quirks and just as we're starting to get into one story he flies off to the other side of continent and we don't hear from that person again for another two hundred pages.

Mass Effect has much more interesting characters. The writing suffers from a certain lack of discipline and maturity, but I could pick out far more distinctive and memorable characters from the trilogy than I could from Martin. In the former we have a religious assassin dying of a terminal illness, a lonely robot with a man-crush on the protagonist, a psychotic hedonistic telekinetic witch with a tormented past, an aging warlord turned mercenary destined to save the future of his people....in the latter we get, uhm, "angry noble", "mean bandit", "honourable King", "nasty King", "jealous brother"...

There's a few better examples but they're few and far between and not dealt with in any depth.

My point was about plot twists and maintaining the integrity of the plot within that framework. To me it seemed like Bioware went out of their way to seem "artsy" at the expense of the plot making any sense.

And how you can talk of a lack of depth with characters like Tyrion, Cersei and Jaime, is beyond me. Layers up the wazoo.

wyrn

I dragged ME3 out as long as possible, I even avoided this forum since Jan just to hide from spoilers.

I feel.............confused. I'd an inkling early on in ME3 that all the choices that I fretted over in ME and ME2, wouldn't count for anything. Am I missing something or is there only 3 endings? I was under the impression that there'd be quite a few due to all the decisions.

More importantly - WHO or WHAT was that little kid? I was ranting yesterday about how Harbinger never turned up in the end. Bioware had him popping up sprouting his line throughout ME2 and he was nowhere to be seen in ME3. I vaguely remember towards the end being informed that he was on his way. I was convinced he'd turn up in the Illusive Man and that would be the final Boss fight (which was no where to be found). My friend swore that the kid was Harbinger and but I thought it was the catalyst. Otherwise that means that Harbinger worked with the catalyst and...........aghhhhhhhh my brain can't handle this.

I felt a bit cheated that the ending just happened. That was it. No montage of all the crew.

Oh actually I feel really cheated. I can't play multiplayer as I'm the only sucker I know on Origin (don't start me on the Steam vs Origin rant). Can anyone else on Origin play a MP public game? I can't level up my characters as I keep getting overrun and it's really peeving me off now. I spent €70 on the Collectors Edition and I can only play half of the game.

Meesared

hooradiation wrote: »

Some goddamn perspective would not go amiss.

I totally read that in Zaeed's voice XD

Gbear

wyrn wrote: »

I dragged ME3 out as long as possible, I even avoided this forum since Jan just to hide from spoilers.

I feel.............confused. I'd an inkling early on in ME3 that all the choices that I fretted over in ME and ME2, wouldn't count for anything. Am I missing something or is there only 3 endings? I was under the impression that there'd be quite a few due to all the decisions.

More importantly - WHO or WHAT was that little kid? I was ranting yesterday about how Harbinger never turned up in the end. Bioware had him popping up sprouting his line throughout ME2 and he was nowhere to be seen in ME3. I vaguely remember towards the end being informed that he was on his way. I was convinced he'd turn up in the Illusive Man and that would be the final Boss fight (which was no where to be found). My friend swore that the kid was Harbinger and but I thought it was the catalyst. Otherwise that means that Harbinger worked with the catalyst and...........aghhhhhhhh my brain can't handle this.

I felt a bit cheated that the ending just happened. That was it. No montage of all the crew.

Oh actually I feel really cheated. I can't play multiplayer as I'm the only sucker I know on Origin (don't start me on the Steam vs Origin rant). Can anyone else on Origin play a MP public game? I can't level up my characters as I keep getting overrun and it's really peeving me off now. I spent €70 on the Collectors Edition and I can only play half of the game.

You don't need to know people on Origin to play MP. If you pick a quick match you'll join a game with random people.

wyrn

Gbear wrote: »

You don't need to know people on Origin to play MP. If you pick a quick match you'll join a game with random people.

That was the first thing I tried but for some reason there was a picture of a lock on Public (via Quick Match). I had the other options (enemy, location, medal) on any and I tried to connect several times but nothing happened.

Bloody frustrating. After finally getting to the end and no final battle, I though MP would help ease the pain. Nope.

Shryke

We have been cheated. We were given a promise when we bought the game that decisions would matter. They didn't. Forgetting that and looking at the ending just for what it is, it's poor.
It's poorly constructed and nearly incoherent plot wise. It gives no resolution. One of my biggest problems with it is that it felt wrong, Shepards actions are completely out of character and the entire ending jars and contradicts everything we spent 3 games fighting for. It's shoddy as hell and something I'd expect a late teen to come up with. Not ground breaking, and it has no artistic merit. To be to the point, it's insulting. And that they recognise that and are doing something about it is a good sign.

GRRM's characters have plenty of depth. I've been reading his books for years. The big difference is setting. Sci-fi lends itself to big ideas. Martins work is meant to be more of a historical kind of fiction, real and gritty, rather than fanciful and full of magic. Characters are very much tied to their roles, their families and politics. There's a lot more to certain characters as you go on and his character development is brilliant.

pixelburp

hooradiation wrote: »

Like what? That these 'fans' are over entitled man children with no goddamn sense of perspective and are impossible to please?
We already knew that.

They should shut up, oh god how I wish they'd shut up.

Bizarre rant against a harmless group of people who feel a sense of identity and affection for a trilogy that - intentionally or not - has become a cultural item within gaming & (arguably) the wider sci-fi community, being the most prominent piece of space opera in years. An entity may not be created to be art, or beloved, but things take flight & often the creators can find these franchises take a life of their own, where the fans & lovers of the creation keep it going & become part of the process. It's no different to similar franchises such as Star Trek, where for the longest time it was the fans that 'owned' it (for better or for worse).

And it's not a question of entitlement, it's a question of Bioware recognizing that what they served as an ending to a sage didn't do it justice, not by a long shot; they failed their own story, universe & set of characters. Not to mention the core mechanic of the very game itself. Unite the Geth & Quarians? Shut up & pick a colour.

Like everything else on the internet, it's the noisy, ranting few who make the rest of us disappointed fans look like lunatics; but the majority are like myself: genuinely upset that a beloved franchise & set of characters got a pretty shabby send off. It doesn't ruin the previous 99% of the 3 games that I enjoyed and loved, but it left a sour taste in my mouth. So yeah: Bioware, please flesh out the ending, my crew deserves better.

super_furry

hooradiation wrote: »

They should shut up, oh god how I wish they'd shut up.

It's not like they're standing outside your house shouting at you. It's the internet - you don't HAVE to read what they write.

You can, in fact, not read it!

Gbear

wyrn wrote: »

That was the first thing I tried but for some reason there was a picture of a lock on Public (via Quick Match). I had the other options (enemy, location, medal) on any and I tried to connect several times but nothing happened.

Bloody frustrating. After finally getting to the end and no final battle, I though MP would help ease the pain. Nope.

There's always a lock on the public/private setting for quick match. It wouldn't be quick if you had to go inviting people.

Public means anyone can join the game.

I've been having trouble connecting today and it also keeps crashing on me. I think it's possibly to do with the recent patches.

hooradiation

pixelburp wrote: »

And it's not a question of entitlement

That's all it is.
For clarification, because people are very quick to get confused then I have to explain myself and that upsets Retr0 something fierce.
People who simply think that the ending was bad are not the people I have an issue with. That's something a conversation can be built around. That's understandable and not bugfuck insane.

The people who think it's not only bad, but that they've been massively betrayed and lied to and now the whole trilogy is useless and CHANGE IT NOW are the terrible manchildren I have a problem with. The "retake mass effect" people. Retake it from who, exactly? The people who made it?

Their stupid whining is so goddamn objectionable because it's nothing but entitlement. They did not care for the ending, fine - but demanding that bioware change it to suit them?
It's the worst parts of nerdery and it shouldn't be pandered to.

i don't even think the extended cut DLC is a good idea, but seeing as that's already in the works I hope that's as far as this nonsense goes.

seyeM

hooradiation wrote: »

The people who think it's not only bad, but that they've been massively betrayed and lied to and now the whole trilogy is useless and CHANGE IT NOW are the terrible manchildren I have a problem with.

The ending was garbage. Fans of the series didn't appreciate that fact. Expanding on it so it at least makes logical sense is an obvious step to correct it and please and retain their fanbase (and potential customers) for their future games.

What are you so buttdevestated about? Did you write the stinker ending or something? :P

hooradiation

seyeM wrote: »

The ending was garbage.

If you think that, fair enough.

seyeM wrote: »

Fans of the series didn't appreciate that fact.

No true scotsman nonsense, but ok lets play along.

seyeM wrote: »

Expanding on it so it at least makes logical sense is an obvious step to correct it and please and retain their fanbase (and potential customers) for their future games.

Yeah, because nobody is ever going to buy another bioware game again because the ending to ME3 was not to everyones taste. They'll be ruined!
You know, just like when they released Sonic Chronicles which was far worse than ME3 in every conceivable way and nobody ever bought another bioware game ever again
Remember when that happened?


The ending is what it is, deal with it.

Unless you're the sort that also petitions films makes, music artists and television show producers to change their products when films, albums and television shows have aspects you don't like, in which case at least your consistently wrong and asking you to stop is a bit unfair.

seyeM wrote: »

What are you so buttdevestated about? Did you write the stinker ending or something? :P

Yeah, that's it.
Good job kid, you saw through my cunning disguise.
You'll go far with that keen insight and 'logic' of yours.

pixelburp

hooradiation wrote: »

That's all it is.
For clarification, because people are very quick to get confused then I have to explain myself and that upsets Retr0 something fierce.
People who simply think that the ending was bad are not the people I have an issue with. That's something a conversation can be built around. That's understandable and not bugfuck insane.

What you're describing is pretty much every other rabid fanboy that exists in gaming, I don't see anything special in the ME3 version that desires particular singling out. Like it has already been pointed out, ignore them if they annoy you that much, but they don't invalidate the general consensus of the disappointed fans who'd like a change to the ending. Ignoring the idiot fanboys is precisely what I do everywhere else, so I'd suggest you do the same

But as far as I can see there has been no one like that in this thread, so I had thought we were having the conversation about how the ending was bad and - yes - if it could be changed that'd be worth doing for the sake of the mythology & franchise as ordinary fans like myself feel letdown by the ending & lack of proper closure.

seyeM

hooradiation wrote: »

Yeah, because nobody is ever going to buy another bioware game again because the ending to ME3 was not to everyones taste. They'll be ruined!
You know, just like when they released Sonic Chronicles which was far worse than ME3 in every conceivable way and nobody ever bought another bioware game ever again
Remember when that happened?


The ending is what it is, deal with it.

Unless you're the sort that also petitions films makes, music artists and television show producers to change their products when films, albums and television shows have aspects you don't like, in which case at least your consistently wrong and asking you to stop is a bit unfair.

Selective quoting and pedantic/exaggerated responses before skirting back to your entitled petitioning crap, what a surprise. The ending was poorly received by some (read: NOT all) followers of the series and they voiced that on the internet which is not uncommon. This generated some bad press for the company and the game. This could, conceivably have some sort of negative effect on their immediate and future sales. Get it? I like how you jumped to LOL YOU THINK THAT BIOWARE WILL NEVER SELL ANOTHER GAME BECAUSE OF THE ME3 ENDING to try to make a point.

Personally, I don't care what they do or don't do with the ending and certainly haven't made any efforts to have the game altered, I completed and uninstalled the game weeks ago. I only replied because you seem so aggressive in replying to people who disliked the original ending and are interested in this expanded version.

hooradiation

pixelburp wrote: »

What you're describing is pretty much every other rabid fanboy that exists in gaming, I don't see anything special in the ME3 version that desires particular singling out. Like it has already been pointed out, ignore them if they annoy you that much, but they don't invalidate the general consensus of the disappointed fans who'd like a change to the ending. Ignoring the idiot fanboys is precisely what I do everywhere else, so I'd suggest you do the same

The internet is usually an echo chamber of terrible opinions and childish behaviour, but this is spectacular even by those standards.

Usually, we have to contend with terrible posts and the occasional facebook group but people genuinely think they have the right to demand that bioware change the ending because they don't like it.
This is also a fairly unique phenomenon in so far that there's something about the mindset of people who self identify as gamers that lets this kind of ridiculous culture of entitlement gain this much traction.

I mean, i'm certain there were people who were upset by the last harry potter book and it's ending, but I don't recall a concerted campaign to get JK rowling to rewrite it. Getting closer to gamers on the horrible nerd spectrum, I know some people got upset with the JJ Abrams star trek reboot because it somehow meant the original series, movies and all subsequent spinoffs didn't happen. I don't care to understand their reasoning, but I don't recall there being a similar outpuring of demands for change. And given the film went ahead as reported, I think we can assume any calls were met with a well deserved "get fucked"

pixelburp wrote: »

But as far as I can see there has been no one like that in this thread,]

You are more generous to people than I would be.

pixelburp wrote: »

so I had thought we were having the conversation about how the ending was bad and - yes - if it could be changed that'd be worth doing for the sake of the mythology & franchise as ordinary fans like myself feel letdown by the ending & lack of proper closure.

I don't think it ought to be changed, but bioware seem to be holding firm on telling people that's not happening. And hopefully they won't cave on this.

The Extended cut I could do without, but I guess they're doing a fallout 1&2 style "and this is what happened next" which'll put a limited kibosh on the crazy 'Endor genocide' style nonsense. Then maybe this whole mess will just go away.

As far as I'm concerned more multiplayer content would be preferable to the extended cut, but I guess they can do both.

seyeM wrote: »

I only replied because you seem so aggressive in replying to people who disliked the original ending and are interested in this expanded version.

Then kindly learn to read what is being written before feeling compelled to reply in future.
It'll save time and effort.

Ian7

hey guy's just giving my two cent here, sorry if any of this has been said already, there's a high chance that it was.

firstly, before i finished the game i knew from the start that people had issues with it. On my first play-through of the ending I kinda just accepted it but now the more I think about it and read people's interpretations of it I just feel more and more confused about it all. I have come to the conclusion that there is more to this ending than we are being led to believe. What I mean is, none of the outcomes or endings really lend anything to setting up proper sequels to the game.

destroy = seemingly no more space travel - the fundamental pillar of the mass effect series
control = how would we have any enemies to fight if we had the reapers on our side...pointless. and if we can't control the reapers then are we just going to go through another trilogy of trying to prevent destruction at the hands of the reapers?
synthesis = I really don't know where they are going with this one. How can combining artificial life with organic life really prevent new organic life in the future. I don't get it.

Anyway, I really hope that the Indoctrination/hallucination theory is proven correct. I have been looking at comparison pictures and analysis pictures regarding the end sequence and they really do bring up some interesting questions, like....

How the earth side of the beam looks very similar to the citadel beam.
How the weird coloured rubble with familiar looking bodies is all around shep after he stands up from being hit.
How his armor has disappeared.
How his pistol is now super powered.
How the citadel level has human numbers and letters placed on items which look remarkably like the canon from the MAKO.
Why are bodies being brought to the citadel? and what are the keepers doing to them. I know there is some conversation about another human reaper but if so where is it being made?
There is also a mako lying on the groung near the earth beam and there is a set of wheel looking things placed a similar distance away from the control panel on the citadel. Subtle coincidences.
How did Anderson get to the control panel before shepard when there is clearly only one route in and he stated that he "followed" shepard into the beam.
How is the illusive man controlling shepard and anderson when they are not reapers? and whats up with the squiggly black thing around the screen during this scene?
The Starchild could only know about shepard and the dead boy if he/it was in shepard's mind, this also alludes to Indoctrination.

The whole ending sequence after Shep is hit by the beam is literally "out there" and I really hope i'm not clutching at straws but we all deserve something better than the ending we got.

In the meantime, I came across this today. Hilarious, even the comments are genius...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=467pmIX-oZo&feature=related

wyrn

Gbear wrote: »

There's always a lock on the public/private setting for quick match. It wouldn't be quick if you had to go inviting people.

Public means anyone can join the game.

I've been having trouble connecting today and it also keeps crashing on me. I think it's possibly to do with the recent patches.

Thanks for that. It seemed to timeout when I tried last weekend. I just presumed that because of the lock that I couldn't have access. Sounds stupid but I wouldn't be surprised with Origin.

hooradiation

wyrn wrote: »

Thanks for that. It seemed to timeout when I tried last weekend. I just presumed that because of the lock that I couldn't have access. Sounds stupid but I wouldn't be surprised with Origin.

I have had nothing but good service from Origin so far - but it's a peer-to-peer system for ME3 so if you tried to join a group at the same time host migration was happening terrible things would probably happen. Sadly there is no real way to know that you'll be getting into that situation beforehand.

Zillah

hooradiation wrote: »

I have had nothing but good service from Origin so far - but it's a peer-to-peer system for ME3 so if you tried to join a group at the same time host migration was happening terrible things would probably happen. Sadly there is no real way to know that you'll be getting into that situation beforehand.

Origin/ME3 multi is buggy as all hell. I just had my fourth EA disconnect on wave 10/extraction in as many days.

You get no credits if you leave the game before it is over. As though those 25 minutes never happened. **** EA.

hooradiation

Zillah wrote: »

Origin/ME3 multi is buggy as all hell. I just had my fourth EA disconnect on wave 10/extraction in as many days.

4 DC's in 4 days isn't "buggy as all hell" unless you've played only four matches in that time.

So, i guess I'm gonna use my 2,000th post to remind you of a little thing called confirmation bias.

You're welcome.

degrassinoel

The time of the dc is more interesting tbh. Sounds a little bit more like a bug rather than a random dc

Kirby

"Let's sue!" "We were fooled!" etc. is all an overreaction of the highest order.

But the bottom line is that the ending is terrible. Not in a "Oh well different strokes for different folks" kind of way that controversial endings end up being for people. It is universally regarded as just awful.

From nonsensical stuff like the Normandy being in FTL, the "star child" showing up out of nowhere, having none of your actions throughout the previous 3 games dictate the ending, the cutscene being the same whichever one you choose except a different colour, machines killing organics so that.......machines won't kill organics logic, the list goes on and on. It's just terrible on every level and is far inferior to the rest of the trilogy. You can tell they rewrote it last minute. It doesn't gel at all with the rest of the game.

Drew Karpyshn is a mediocre writer. I read the Mass effect novels and his skill is lacking. But he knew how to formulate a story and then tell it. He helped create this universe and had he been around for ME3 we would not have been served up what we were.

Don't let the mad few detract from the main point. The ending doesn't became adequate because some nutty 13 year old's want to sue Bioware.

Zillah

hooradiation wrote: »

4 DC's in 4 days isn't "buggy as all hell" unless you've played only four matches in that time.

So, i guess I'm gonna use my 2,000th post to remind you of a little thing called confirmation bias.

You're welcome.

You're weirdly belligerent.

This is not just me, I have seen people complaining about this in other places. The store steals credits but doesn't produce packs. Sometimes it won't let you buy anything at all. Enemies get stuck in terrain and become immortal, making the game impossible to finish. Powers stop working for no reason. Powers don't work as intended. Missile launchers fire but then don't do anything. Characters fall through terrain or get stuck in it, or fly off into the sky. Enemies stop attacking certain players, who in turn can't hurt them. Enemies die but end up standing there until the end of the round anyway. Physics glitches to do with cover, dodging and camera angles crop up randomly. Boss enemies trigger kill animations through walls, around corners and from absurd distances away. And yes, players get disconnected from the EA central server (not the actual game they are playing, that connection is fine) at the very end of 30 minute Gold rounds and lose everything they have earned, but also lose any expendable items they brought into the game.

None of these are rare, they are horribly horribly common. The game is incredibly buggy. It's still great fun, but it is very rough around the edges.