Formula 1 2012: General Discussion Thread

Rascasse

Rascasse wrote: »

It wasn't at all as bad as you make it sound. At the end of the '08 season there were a couple of shots of his dad and Massa's family during the races. His Dad was more prominent before the start as Lewis doesn't do media work before the race.

Compared to NASCAR it wasn't bad but aside from title deciders it was the first time they'd bothered showing family members in the wings which is why it was so grating. I think it was in Schumi's 2nd or 3rd race back they showed his wife and Brundle said he wouldn't be happy, she hasn't been shown since. There's a certain decorum about F1 that's different to other sports and it's been wearing away lately and I'm certainly not blaming Hamilton or his family for it but the reason it grated was because what surrounded them was more than what will be mainstream for 10 years from now nevermind 5 years ago.

frostie500

It can be good when they show the celebs in the garage....

aphex™

Mclaren have feck all sponsorship at the moment. Tooned on the back and MaxiMuscle on the front of the rear wing (hardly big money there?).

Bet they can't wait to get TelMex in! Must be tough times for sponsorship.

Rascasse

You'd be surprised. Vodafone is allegedly worth $75m per season (although they are pulling out the end of next year), Santander is another $25m. Maximuscle is part of GlaxoSmithKline and alternates with Lucazade (another GSK brand), probably worth $10m+.

TelMex/TelCel/Claro are not coming to McLaren in 2013 at least. Maybe when Vodafone pull out in 2014.

the culture of deference

Rascasse wrote: »

You'd be surprised. Vodafone is allegedly worth $75m per season (although they are pulling out the end of next year), Santander is another $25m. Maximuscle is part of GlaxoSmithKline and alternates with Lucazade (another GSK brand), probably worth $10m+.

TelMex/TelCel/Claro are not coming to McLaren in 2013 at least. Maybe when Vodafone pull out in 2014.

How can Vodafone spend that much. What will McLaren do to fill that. Anyone know how much Perez is bringing.

Red Bull have sold more than 12 billion cans in the last 3 years, generating nearly 1.2 billion alone in net profit.

_rebelkid

I'm pretty sure Telmex and all them are just regional versions of Vodafone.

_rebelkid

New drawings of RBR's DDRS, via FOM

_rebelkid

Remember when Aerodynamics was simple? One, uninterrupted cascade wing on the Minardi PS04 from 2004. And a two piece end-plate, one upper element, and one lower element.

Rascasse

the culture of deference wrote: »

Rascasse wrote: »

You'd be surprised. Vodafone is allegedly worth $75m per season (although they are pulling out the end of next year), Santander is another $25m. Maximuscle is part of GlaxoSmithKline and alternates with Lucazade (another GSK brand), probably worth $10m+.

TelMex/TelCel/Claro are not coming to McLaren in 2013 at least. Maybe when Vodafone pull out in 2014.

How can Vodafone spend that much. What will McLaren do to fill that. Anyone know how much Perez is bringing.

Red Bull have sold more than 12 billion cans in the last 3 years, generating nearly 1.2 billion alone in net profit.

Vodafone are a huge multinational that, according to wiki, made £7bn profit last year. $75m may seem a lot but the Vodafone brand is present in over 20 country's - 8 of which host grand prixs.

It will be interesting to see who McLaren get to replace them in 2014. Can't imagine TelMex fronting that much when there is no GP's in any of their markets.

Also Perez is bringing no money to McLaren. He's making the move from pay driver to paid driver.

Frank Bullitt

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/19941541

If this had "Eddie Jordan understands..." at the start then It would have some legs to it.

But I'm not sure they would openly let it be know so early, does anyone think it will happen?

Daniel S

Gintonious wrote: »

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/19941541

If this had "Eddie Jordan understands..." at the start then It would have some legs to it.

But I'm not sure they would openly let it be know so early, does anyone think it will happen?

It looks like it will happen, but they will have two number one drivers unless one of them has a massive drop in performance.

Myrddin

Depending on how the new engines go, Vettel would be insane to leave RB, especially while Newey is there anyway. He has a serious potential to break all the records, & overtake Schumacher in terms of titles at RB. That would speak far more to me than driving for Ferrari

vectra

Daniel S wrote: »

It looks like it will happen, but they will have two number one drivers unless one of them has a massive drop in performance.

Isn't there a pitfall of having two top drivers in a team?
ie.
Taking points from each other and allowing the opposition to win?

Myrddin

vectra wrote: »

Isn't there a pitfall of having two top drivers in a team?

Yeah big time, remember the famous Red Bull crash in Hungary Oh how I wept with joy that day :pac:

Daniel S

vectra wrote: »

Isn't there a pitfall of having two top drivers in a team?
ie.
Taking points from each other and allowing the opposition to win?

Yup, but maybe Alonso will take the place of a number two driver as Seb is much younger.

Myrddin

Daniel S wrote: »

Yup, but maybe Alonso will take the place of a number two driver as Seb is much younger.

Maybe eventually, but certainly not in 2014.

Brendan Flowers

Gintonious wrote: »

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/19941541

If this had "Eddie Jordan understands..." at the start then It would have some legs to it.

But I'm not sure they would openly let it be know so early, does anyone think it will happen?

This is actually what surprised me most about Hamilton moving to Mercedes. It's been rumored for a good while now that Vettel would go to Ferrari in 2014. Red Bull therefore will possibly have 2 free seats then. They are currently the best team on the grid and are more than likely going to remain one of the top teams.

Mercedes are currently struggling big time. The new rules may benefit them but thats not certain. There was even doubts about their future in the sport. So would it not have made more sense for Lewis to have tried for one of the following options:

Sign maybe a 2 year extension at McLaren with a get out clause for the end of next season if the team still can't deliver the drivers title. This would free him up to move to Red Bull where Im sure he would have got a deal similar (if not better) then the one he signed with Merc.

Push McLaren for a 1 year extension and sign a pre contract with Red Bull for 2014. Similarly McLaren could have pre signed Perez for 2014. I think this would have benefited both parties as McLaren would have Hamilton for another year and Perez would have another season at Sauber to develop. And again it would mean that Lewis would more likely have a race winning car next year.

the culture of deference

This will be interesting.

Ferrari and Alonso saying SV going to Ferrari

Red Bull saying he is not going anywhere


Why would he leave a team like red bull? Unless Newey is off to ferrari in 2014.

Myrddin

the culture of deference wrote: »

Unless Newey is off to ferrari in 2014.

Funnily enough, I can see Newey having an impact on this too. Be it that he's retiring, or moving to another team, I can see it having a big bearing on what Vettel does.

frostie500

Vettel will feel the need to get out of Neweys shadow and prove he can win in someone elses car too which will undoubtedly play a role in his next move. I think that Seb, as lets say a three time champion, might feel that his rep is being short changed by winning in Newey cars and he might want to show just how good he is by moving to another team.

IvySlayer

Ferrari retaining Massa? Why? :S

Myrddin

IvySlayer wrote: »

Ferrari retaining Massa? Why? :S

Given his recent form, he's perfect for the role of number 2 to Alonso.

Jordan 199

EnterNow wrote: »

Yeah big time, remember the famous Red Bull crash in Hungary Oh how I wept with joy that day :pac:

LIGHTNING wrote: »

That was brilliant, boy did I laugh and I like Red Bull!

Was it this one you're referring to:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vx9zIQvrdZU

Myrddin

Sorry yeah, Turkey. Thats the one.

Ferrari retaining Massa? Why? :S

Yeah, its nuts isn't it? He's a terrible number 2. He's not taking points off the other contenders and he's not contributing enough towards the constructors.

He's had a few decent drives recently but you judge a driver over the whole season and this year he has scored less than half of Alonso's points.

Last year it was less than half also.

It's the biggest % points difference between teamates, worse than Grosjean with all his crashes and 1 race ban, worse even than Schumi with all the unreliability.

Myrddin

Deleted User wrote: »

Yeah, its nuts isn't it? He's a terrible number 2. He's not taking points off the other contenders and he's not contributing enough towards the constructors.

He's had a few decent drives recently but you judge a driver over the whole season and this year he has scored less than half of Alonso's points.

Last year it was less than half also.

It's the biggest % points difference between teamates, worse than Grosjean with all his crashes and 1 race ban, worse even than Schumi with all the unreliability.

I think over the last few races, he's been on it fairly well. Don't forget he was a point away from being world champion in 2008, & since his accident, has been a shadow of himself. Something has woken him up though, & with a whiff of the podium now, I think he'll get stronger & stronger

the culture of deference

EnterNow wrote: »

I think over the last few races, he's been on it fairly well. Don't forget he was a point away from being world champion in 2008, & since his accident, has been a shadow of himself. Something has woken him up though, & with a whiff of the podium now, I think he'll get stronger & stronger

Yeah for 18 cruel seconds he and his family thought he had done it.

I dont know why the ferrari guys didnt let him by Alonso to have a shot at hassling MW. I doubt that SV had any tyre problem and the team were just trying to slow him down. Well done MW for nicking fastest lap on the 2nd last. Must have annoyed Seb.

MW pole and FL
SV win and led all laps

Myrddin

the culture of deference wrote: »

SV win and led all laps

Actually another incredible statistic last weekend was that Vettel has led every single lap barring 12 of them, from all three gp's there!! :eek: Crazy stuff

EnterNow

EnterNow wrote: »

I think over the last few races, he's been on it fairly well. Don't forget he was a point away from being world champion in 2008, & since his accident, has been a shadow of himself. Something has woken him up though, & with a whiff of the podium now, I think he'll get stronger & stronger

Its not good enough wake up at the end of the season or when he's threatened with losing his seat. He needs to be there all year round and he hasn't been for the last couple of years. He had a few podiums in 2010 so you can't blame all his woes on the crash. They're throwing points away with him in the seat.

Myrddin

Deleted User wrote: »

Its not good enough wake up at the end of the season or when he's threatened with losing his seat.

I guess we'll find out soon enough if Ferrari deem him good enough Your also forgetting Alonso has a big say in who he's paired with, & with Massa on form, there's nobody better suited to Ferrari than him as a number 2.

Everyone else either lacks experience, or wants to be number 1.