Who thinks Sean Quinn is a great businessman now?

Liam Byrne

Killer Pigeon wrote: »

I agree. I agree with what someone on the first page here said, the amount of begrudgery surrounding the whole debacle is sickening. You'll find a lot of that on After Hours and on boards.ie in general. You and I will probably get a lot of abuse now for saying that but that's the reality.

Probably many of the people complaining are those who were foolish enough to take out hundreds of thousands of euro worth of mortgages on badly build properties and now find themselves in the sorry situation where they can't pay it back. They go out and campaign for concessions on their mortgages/loans and then have the hypocrisy to begin hemming and hawking when someone, like Quinn, goes and declares bankruptcy; someone who did more for the community over the past 30 years and deserves more recognition than most of them clowns. It's fashionable to think that every big businessman is a corrupt crook but it's not always the case.

Go on dear members of boards.ie who are influenced, like most Irish people, by the populist mob bashing, give me your best shot! Sometimes I think that I'm reading a transcript from Liveline.

Absolute apologist drivel!

I didn't borrow too much, don't campaign to have what I agreed reduced (despite being 40% down on my income due to the recession) and don't generalise when it comes to people's actions.

But don't let facts stand in your way of a post that is so insulting and ridiculous that Liveline would probably ring you in order to get the phones hopping in disgust.

You assume incorrectly that we're generalising re "successful businessmen", even though we're accurately viewing Quinn's illegal activities and transferring of assets, and then you have the gall to generalise and make assumptions about all of us in an attempt to discredit our valid points ?

Laughable!

Guy:Incognito

Ronin247 wrote: »

Its funny how the rules for insurance companies get trotted out again and again.Quinn bought BUPA and the government rushed legislation through overnight to change the rules to suit them to the detriment of Quinn.If no one is playing by the rules why do we expect Quinn to be held to them.

They didnt rush through legislation to excuse him from meeting his obligations on runnign a motor insurance company. One of those situations resulted in a company that by right should now be folded and all his staff on the dole.

Killer Pigeon

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Absolute apologist drivel!

I didn't borrow too much, don't campaign to have what I agreed reduced (despite being 40% down on my income due to the recession) and don't generalise when it comes to people's actions.

But don't let facts stand in your way of a post that is so insulting and ridiculous that Liveline would probably ring you in order to get the phones hopping in disgust.

You assume incorrectly that we're generalising re "successful businessmen", even though we're accurately viewing Quinn's illegal activities and transferring of assets, and then you have the gall to generalise and make assumptions about all of us in an attempt to discredit our valid points ?

Laughable!

You're insulted? Oh well...
I'm not for turning.

books4sale

Sean Quinn and successful businessman in the same sentence just don't fly in my world.

cosanostra

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

What has any of that got to do with Quinn having the rules of how to run an insurance company in front of him where it says that he has to keep a certain amount of cash reserves to pay out claims and him deciding "fcuk it, I'll use that money elsewhere instead"? He fraudulently ran his company , theres no ifs and buts there.

Does the state owned VHI insurer hold the required funds?

Captain Limerick

Quinn Direct's policies are a joke,
And its well known to the industry folk.
Its one of the company's aims,
to avoid paying out on claims.
I'm not sad that guy's gone broke.

Ellis Dee

ejmaztec wrote: »

He'll be back in business in a year.

Sad, but true.:( And if anyone is eejit enough to entrust their money to him, they deserve to be ridden frontways, backways, crossways and any other way he can get away with. :rolleyes::rolleyes:

mickdw

Im actually not too upset that he went the uk route with the bankruptcy. Sure he could possibly be back in business in a year or two compared to a longer term here. I do feel though that the uk might actually apply their system to the letter of the law, which in the end could mean that they could hold him bankrupt for a very long time or actually recover some serious funds from him as it will be clear to anyone who takes a proper look at his business that he is hiding assets and is certainly not short of cash.
I feel that the Irish system would just give up on it and let him be bankrupt but keep all his hidden funds.

44leto

Biggins wrote: »

An article from the Indo' that might clear up a few matter concerning his bankruptcy claim:

UK v Ireland: how bankruptcy differs between the two



Source: http://www.independent.ie/national-news/uk-v-ireland-how-bankruptcy-differs-between-the-two-2932952.html

...Long story short: If Quinn is clever enough and bides his time for two/three years - he's in the clear!
(...And I suspect he a very shrude person indeed)

Wouldn't you think there would be some sort of laws in place where a court here would declare someone bankrupt to prevent this. I don't know how that could work.

But I can see a lot of the NAMA debtors doing similar in the near future.

woodoo

Killer Pigeon wrote: »

You're insulted? Oh well...
I'm not for turning.

How does your analogy stand up to the transferring of assets into other family members names?

woodoo

mickdw wrote: »

Im actually not too upset that he went the uk route with the bankruptcy. Sure he could possibly be back in business in a year or two compared to a longer term here. I do feel though that the uk might actually apply their system to the letter of the law, which in the end could mean that they could hold him bankrupt for a very long time or actually recover some serious funds from him as it will be clear to anyone who takes a proper look at his business that he is hiding assets and is certainly not short of cash.
I feel that the Irish system would just give up on it and let him be bankrupt but keep all his hidden funds.

This should warrant jail when uncovered.

Biggins

44leto wrote: »

Wouldn't you think there would be some sort of laws in place where a court here would declare someone bankrupt to prevent this. I don't know how that could work.

But I can see a lot of the NAMA debtors doing similar in the near future.

So do I - if they think they too can get away with it.
Lord knows some will try!

Liam Byrne

Killer Pigeon wrote: »

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Absolute apologist drivel!

I didn't borrow too much, don't campaign to have what I agreed reduced (despite being 40% down on my income due to the recession) and don't generalise when it comes to people's actions.

But don't let facts stand in your way of a post that is so insulting and ridiculous that Liveline would probably ring you in order to get the phones hopping in disgust.

You assume incorrectly that we're generalising re "successful businessmen", even though we're accurately viewing Quinn's illegal activities and transferring of assets, and then you have the gall to generalise and make assumptions about all of us in an attempt to discredit our valid points ?

Laughable!

You're insulted? Oh well...
I'm not for turning.

Your call. I called you on your prejudice, bias and generalisations, and if you don't want to admit that you were wrong, then that's not my problem.

King of Kings

Most of what I have to say has been said so I won't repeat it but sean quinn is no saint , even leaving aside what he cost us all as taxpayers, read the section of Matt Coopers book "Who really runs Ireland" on Sean Quinn and you'll see the work of a gangster.

He withheld claims for sick and vunerable people dragging them through legal process etc.... used underhand tactics against competitors which COST other (non quinnn employees) jobs.

People only flock to him cos he provided jobs. Sure Hitler would be grand fella if he gave us jobs.
It was all a mask that has finally slipped.

Killer Pigeon

woodoo wrote: »

How does your analogy stand up to the transferring of assets into other family members names?

Isn't it legal? Why no?

Pherekydes

Killer Pigeon wrote: »

Isn't it legal? Why no?

Because they're not his assets to transfer.

Seems bleedin' obvious.

latenia

The man is clearly some kind of sociopath. Even up to just a few years ago he was buying pubs around Dublin, even though he was already a billionaire. His move towards taking over Anglo was the action of someone utterly consumed by greed. Even €100M would have been enough for him, his children and several following generations to live in luxury but he seemed to just want to accumulate money and assets for the sake of it.

Gophur

latenia wrote: »

The man is clearly some kind of sociopath. Even up to just a few years ago he was buying pubs around Dublin, even though he was already a billionaire. His move towards taking over Anglo was the action of someone utterly consumed by greed. Even €100M would have been enough for him, his children and several following generations to live in luxury but he seemed to just want to accumulate money and assets for the sake of it.

I posted previously about the €400m that was taken from the Quinn Group for the Sean Quinn children. They are well looked after. SQ's claim that his house is actually owned by his children is laughable.

As for those bewildered people who claim SQ is/was a good businessman? They seem to be only counting the profits and not the losses.

wtgorilla

An absolute fool. “Never put all your eggs in one basket”.

R P McMurphy

latenia wrote: »

The man is clearly some kind of sociopath. Even up to just a few years ago he was buying pubs around Dublin, even though he was already a billionaire. His move towards taking over Anglo was the action of someone utterly consumed by greed. Even €100M would have been enough for him, his children and several following generations to live in luxury but he seemed to just want to accumulate money and assets for the sake of it.

Look at what happened to the Quinn group in light of the fact that had the economy trundled along and Quinn had a stranglehold on anglo what would this have meant to the group. To be a major supplier of building materials and exercise control over a bank that was bankrolling developers in the country. Would have effectively created a monopoly. Of course things turned out rather differently, he gambled and lost but that does not make someone a sociopath.

latenia

R P McMurphy wrote: »

Of course things turned out rather differently, he gambled and lost but that does not make someone a sociopath.

Pointlessly accumulating more money than you could spend in 100 lifetimes and still wanting more is a sign of mental illness to me. If you had a billion euros, would you embark on a scheme that could see you losing it all?

R P McMurphy

latenia wrote: »

R P McMurphy wrote: »

Of course things turned out rather differently, he gambled and lost but that does not make someone a sociopath.

Pointlessly accumulating more money than you could spend in 100 lifetimes and still wanting more is a sign of mental illness to me. If you had a billion euros, would you embark on a scheme that could see you losing it all?

If I had a fraction of it I would retire and try to get through it as best I could

donegal11

Ronin247 wrote: »

In 2006 my friend who had a very good,cash rich business, got a call from the bank manager with an investment proposal.

E500,000 in AIB shares with a loan from the bank to buy them.The dividend from the shares would cover the interest on the loan and a small profit per annum. He put up some property to guarantee the loan and everything was rosy.
Now that the shares have gone from E18 to about 82cent each he has lost roughly E470,000 and he is up sh*t creek without a paddle.

His was a genuine investment in good faith.If you found out later that the bank had deliberately propped up the share price you would feel fcuked over,as far as I can see that is what went on with Quinn.Greed was his downfall,but greed only made him susceptible to being fleeced.

The difference is Quinn was propping up his own investment and chasing his losses. He knew full well what was going on.

IRISHREDSTAR

Who thinks Sean Quinn is a great businessman now? - The Irish taxpayer don't and I never did, The media for some strange reason are still ass kissing him- what a great man he was creating jobs. He was himself very proud of this fact but also of the fact that the jobs were non-union. Quinn Worker’s should have been out dancing in the street that they were free to join a union- bit late now.

How many non-union jobs did Quinn make and could Mr. Bean not create as many if he was given a few thousand million.

Ronin247

Gophur wrote: »

I posted previously about the €400m that was taken from the Quinn Group for the Sean Quinn children. They are well looked after. SQ's claim that his house is actually owned by his children is laughable.

As for those bewildered people who claim SQ is/was a good businessman? They seem to be only counting the profits and not the losses.

Quinn built an empire.He is and will always be rich.He is an astute business man.He got greedy and lost out big time but that doesnt change his proven business skill.

IRISHREDSTAR wrote: »

Who thinks Sean Quinn is a great businessman now? - The Irish taxpayer don't and I never did, The media for some strange reason are still ass kissing him- what a great man he was creating jobs. He was himself very proud of this fact but also of the fact that the jobs were non-union. Quinn Worker’s should have been out dancing in the street that they were free to join a union- bit late now.

How many non-union jobs did Quinn make and could Mr. Bean not create as many if he was given a few thousand million.

The Irish taxpayer is an ASS.(myself included)
Sean Quinn did not buy shares in Irelands taxpayers,he bought shares in a crookedly run bank.In order for the Bondholders( read German and French banks) to get paid our government stepped in and said we are nationalising the bank and assuming the debts.There is no possible way Quinn could have foresaw that.By doing that, Quinns shares were rendered useless bits of paper,Quinn lost his empire to satisfy the greedy bondholders and our cowardly representatives in the Dail are the ones who are responsible.

Quinns billions were used to pay bondholders and we, the Irish taxpayer, are going to be paying off the same bondholders and we will do sweet F.A. about it.

K-9

44leto wrote: »

Wouldn't you think there would be some sort of laws in place where a court here would declare someone bankrupt to prevent this. I don't know how that could work.

But I can see a lot of the NAMA debtors doing similar in the near future.

Most wouldn't have the connections to the North though.

Biggins wrote: »

So do I - if they think they too can get away with it.
Lord knows some will try!

NAMA are getting judgements against property transferred to partners names or forcing the transfer back. Hopefully Anglo will go after Quinn and any assets he transferred. There are laws against these transfers but NAMA has bigger powers again.

IRISHREDSTAR

K-9 wrote: »

Most wouldn't have the connections to the North though.



NAMA are getting judgements against property transferred to partners names or forcing the transfer back. Hopefully Anglo will go after Quinn and any assets he transferred. There are laws against these transfers but NAMA has bigger powers again.

I think most property kings in ireland are from the North besides nama's books are full of trash property in the North, from Irish taxpayers money.
"The property market in Northern Ireland is in a huge slump. Nama controls more property here than anyone else - by a mile"- BBC News

If Nama dumps all it's property in the north onto the market then maybe they won't go running to the courts in belfast.

K-9

IRISHREDSTAR wrote: »

I think most property kings in ireland are from the North besides nama's books are full of trash property in the North, from Irish taxpayers money.
"The property market in Northern Ireland is in a huge slump. Nama controls more property here than anyone else - by a mile"- BBC News

If Nama dumps all it's property in the north onto the market then maybe they won't go running to the courts in belfast.

They probably do own a lot of property in the North but can you prove most property kings in Ireland are from the North?

Carroll, Dunne etc. I doubt it.

Senna

Will be interesting to see how the NI court view his "family assets". Even thought the NI bankruptcy period is short, i still think they will get more money out of him (and his family) than if he had of declared bankruptcy here.

He was greedy, plain and simple, you can like the man as much as you want, he and he alone destroyed his own business and i just cant see how anyone can justify his enormous level of greed.

ToddyDoody

If he died tomorrow the priest'd say he was a great businessman and no one there would say otherwise.