David Norris - Post-Revelations

My name is URL

Thought I'd start a new poll to see what sort of impact the latest scandal has had on Norris' level of support here.

The letters he sent are available in full here for anyone that hasn't read them yet [pdf] - http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/0730/norrisletter.pdf

So would you still consider him as a credible candidate, or are the latest developments just too serious to overlook?

If you had intended to vote for him and now won't, who do you think you'll support instead?

orourkeda

I wouldn't have voted for him anyway.

goat2

My name is URL wrote: »

Thought I'd start a new poll to see what sort of impact the latest scandal has had on Norris' level of support here.

The letters he sent are available in full here for anyone that hasn't read them yet [pdf] - http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/0730/norrisletter.pdf

So would you still consider him as a credible candidate, or are the latest developments just too serious to overlook?

this is headed with our harp,
and before the trial
so there are people who got to know him here in ireland according to this, who are they, what do they think

Arnold Layne

I wouldn't have voted for him either. I can't understand how people could even before the recent events.

ejmaztec

I hadn't decided who I was going to vote for, because none of the candidates stood out. They're still all a bit meh as far as I'm concerned, Norris included.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Thanks for starting a new poll, I was about to suggest one to the moderators.

I've changed from a definite YES to NO today and I've removed my Sen.David Norris signature too.

I'm truely disappointed.

Lord TSC

Should have been a "I don't plan on voting at all now" option :P

bleg

Appalling thing to do. Michael D all the way for me now!

GLaDOS

I don't know any other candidates Don't think can vote for him now though

goat2

that letter was sent on sinead paper with the sinead address, and at the taxpayers expense i guess, which means it looks like we all had something to do with it, he is speaking of irish law, well israel has its own laws, and it was their business, to do as they wished, also he wanted a non custodial sentence, and there was no remorse for the child or his family in this letter

My name is URL

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Should have been a "I don't plan on voting now" option :P

Probably a good idea to still vote. Otherwise you're tacitly supporting your least favoured candidate. I'll most like vote for Michael D.. The others seem like complete opportunists imo.. The thoughts of that turnip lookalike Gay Mitchell as our president makes me shudder.

UglyBolloxFace

Samir Poor Query wrote: »

Thanks for starting a new poll, I was about to suggest one to the moderators.

I've changed from a definite YES to NO today and I've removed my Sen.David Norris signature too.

I'm truely disappointed.

Why were you supporting him before the recent revelation anyway? Were the previous controversies not enough to dissuade you?

epgc3fyqirnbsx

I think it has been shown beyond doubt that he abused his office and so has lost credibility in my eyes. I prbably wasn't going to vote for him anyway but that is something that I'm sure of now

Lustrum

Can anyone shed some light on where the letter was leaked from? After all, someone has known about this letter for the last 19 years, but said nothing about it - in my mind that's as bad as writing the letter in the first place

kylith

Can someone give me a potted version of what's going on?

goat2

Lustrum wrote: »

Can anyone shed some light on where the letter was leaked from? After all, someone has known about this letter for the last 19 years, but said nothing about it - in my mind that's as bad as writing the letter in the first place

for me i dont care whether it was leaked or not, but i am glad someone brought it back to life, it tells the mindset of the person,

barrackali

David Norris is certainly not getting my vote now. :mad:

Dennis

goat2 wrote: »

this is headed with our harp, .........


There appear to be completely separate three letters.

The main letter written to the court by Norris does NOT have a harp on it and seems to be a personal request for leniency of the sentence based on European and Irish law that Norris himself helped change. He goes to great lengths to outline who he is and has used plain paper in order to do that.

Of the other two, one is a coverpage and the other is a simple reference and is not trying to influence the outcome of anything.

UglyBolloxFace

<snip>

-
potentially legally dodgy post you quoted removed.

UglyBolloxFace

Dennis wrote: »

goat2 wrote: »

this is headed with our harp, .........


There appear to be completely separate three letters.

The main letter written to the court by Norris does NOT have a harp on it and seems to be a personal request for leniency of the sentence based on European and Irish law that Norris himself helped change. He goes to great lengths to outline who he is and has used plain paper in order to do that.

Of the other two, one is a coverpage and the other is a simple reference and is not trying to influence the outcome of anything.

He signed all three letters with "Senator", therefore he is bringing public office into it.

Sir Oxman

I was in the maybe/don't know camp before this weekend - it is a definite no now.

alex73

Hypocrisy Hypocrisy Hypocrisy .... If it were a TD he would be expelled for the party... If it were a bishop on behalf of a priest... well there would be total uproar..

David Norris his former lover was convicted of statutory rape, he should have left well alone.

Interesting he says that the guy was abused by his father. Usually the case as the abused become the abusers.

David Norris will never hold the office of President. He should have had better judgement that to use his office of Senator to write such a letter.

ChunkyLover_53

TL;DR

Vote Norris.

Openly Gay President dealing with the Catholic Church for the lulz!

flyaway.

Wow. No, I would not vote for him.

northkildare

DN so far has 18 votes above, Many of us stand by him, We dont complain about what straight people do so dont see why when a gay man like david has normal point of veiw he gets run over,

Many in our community still support him all the way, nobody can point out what already happens on the scene anyway regardless. try going to our clubs and see for yourself what david means and maybe youl have a better understanding

epgc3fyqirnbsx

northkildare wrote: »

DN so far has 18 votes above, Many of us stand by him, We dont complain about what straight people do so dont see why when a gay man like david has normal point of veiw he gets run over,

Many in our community still support him all the way, nobody can point out what already happens on the scene anyway regardless. try going to our clubs and see for yourself what david means and maybe youl have a better understanding

His sexuality has nothing to do with why I would or wouldn't vote for him

MonaghanPenguin

Was never warm to Norris but after this I think he's not fit to be a senator never mind President.

My name is URL

northkildare wrote: »

DN so far has 18 votes above, Many of us stand by him, We dont complain about what straight people do so dont see why when a gay man like david has normal point of veiw he gets run over,

Many in our community still support him all the way, nobody can point out what already happens on the scene anyway regardless. try going to our clubs and see for yourself what david means and maybe youl have a better understanding

Which club allow 40 year olds to hook up with 15 year olds? You're talking through your hat mate.

UglyBolloxFace

Salvador Most Jaw wrote: »

His sexuality has nothing to do with why I would or wouldn't vote for him

My name is URL wrote: »

Which club allow 40 year olds to hook up with 15 year olds? You're talking through your hat mate.

Can you please cop onto ourselves and stop feeding the troll? He'll get bored soon and fúck off back under the bridge.

Aldebaran

It was always between Norris and Higgins for me, will most likely vote for Higgins now.

northkildare

If more people came to gay pride they would see how it is not the big bad evil people try to make it out to be.

The older guys always look after the new guys to the scene and very helpful, thats the point david is try to make and people think its wrong, Come to the next gay pride before saying things are evil, lots of good older gay guys out there.

Phill Ewinn

Up the bum sex causes big stinker.

David Norris slips on gay poll.

later12

Stop trying to play the victim. This has nothing to do with homosexuality. I happen to know that at least one of the Norris team who has quit (six have now quit by the way) is gay, how can you explain that?

goat2

northkildare wrote: »

DN so far has 18 votes above, Many of us stand by him, We dont complain about what straight people do so dont see why when a gay man like david has normal point of veiw he gets run over,

Many in our community still support him all the way, nobody can point out what already happens on the scene anyway regardless. try going to our clubs and see for yourself what david means and maybe youl have a better understanding

should i have to remind you, that i have alot of friends who are gay, and decent people, who would not dare look at a child, just like me who happen to be straight,
what we are on about is the fact gay or straight or otherwise, would look at a child in a sexual way, never mind carrying out a sex act on a child, it is gross, cruel, disgusting.
david is also worried about the physological and material effect prision will have on his friend, well, if you do the crime, you have do do the time.
and i ask you what effect will the act have on the child,
please do tell, and dont call me anti gay.
i was giving david my vote, that was until i read this letter, i did think alot of him, now i feel he does not take having child sex seriously, i have changed, and it was never about his being gay.

northkildare

i think its wrong that most of us try to hide what goes on, anyone who is on the scene knows what goes on behind the scene, Fair play to DN for bringing the subject to light. He has done so much for us in the past and we should stand by him now rather than running him over,

He is our only hope of getting the rights we need, I remember he came to one of our meetings and the great support he gave us all regarding civil rights and adoption.

grizzly

northkildare wrote: »

If more people came to gay pride they would see how it is not the big bad evil people try to make it out to be.

The older guys always look after the new guys to the scene and very helpful, thats the point david is try to make and people think its wrong, Come to the next gay pride before saying things are evil, lots of good older gay guys out there.

I'd be very pro gay. But for me this isn't a case of gay v straight. If this was a about a 40 year old man and a 15 year old girl I would have the same reaction.

I am very disappointed because before this he would have easily got my vote.

7sr2z3fely84g5

What would happened if it was a woman riding a young lad?.

Min

northkildare wrote: »

DN so far has 18 votes above, Many of us stand by him, We dont complain about what straight people do so dont see why when a gay man like david has normal point of veiw he gets run over,

Many in our community still support him all the way, nobody can point out what already happens on the scene anyway regardless. try going to our clubs and see for yourself what david means and maybe youl have a better understanding

Most people don't care about his sexuality, it's how he dealt with sexual abuse.
Saying he could "guarantee absolutely" that Ezra Nawi would not re-offend is akin to a bishop moving an abusing priest and expecting the problem to go away.
What is worse is his letter is three years after the Fr Brendan Symth affair so he as a legislator should be more than aware than one cannot "guarantee absolutely" the actions of a sex offender.
He claims in the Independent they broke up in 1985 so how was he going to "guarantee absolutely" that his former lover would not re-offend.
The fact is he couldn't. I am sure if any judge in Israel did see those letters they would be appalled at his expertise when it comes to sex. From what I see in his letters, David Norris thinks he is an expert because he was awarded an honoury diploma by the center for sexual minorities.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Alivia Square Alphabet wrote: »

What would happened if it was a woman riding a young lad?.

Like BrummyTom for instance?.

partyatmygaff

Probably a troll account but even so...

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056343302

Hello all,

Friends have pointed me in the direction of this discussion.

First of all I would like to take this opportunity to express my sincere sorrow to both my supporters and the people of Ireland - I feel I have let you all down with the current revelations which are being bandies about. I never, ever, meant to cause this.

I was simply helping a dear friend in any way I could. Surely you would have done that same for a trusted companion?

There will be further details released in due course but please allow me time to recover and in time I shall furnish you with further details.

later12

Alivia Square Alphabet wrote: »

What would happened if it was a woman riding a young lad?.

It would be statutory rape.

The only difference (in Ireland) appears to be if both individuals were under age of consent- then I think the male alone would be guilty, or has the law been changed yet?

Thorella

I would still vote for Norris. Anyone else would step down but I admire him for continuing to try regardless of people trying their best to destroy him. Please don't tear into me, this is my first post

northkildare

goat2 wrote: »

should i have to remind you, that i have alot of friends who are gay, and decent people, who would not dare look at a child, just like me who happen to be straight,
what we are on about is the fact gay or straight or otherwise, would look at a child in a sexual way, never mind carrying out a sex act on a child, it is gross, cruel, disgusting.
david is also worried about the physological and material effect prision will have on his friend, well, if you do the crime, you have do do the time.
and i ask you what effect will the act have on the child,
please do tell, and dont call me anti gay.
i was giving david my vote, that was until i read this letter, i did think alot of him, now i feel he does not take having child sex seriously, i have changed, and it was never about his being gay.

Im saying when on the scene its fine with a lot of people and when they come on here its like hush hush dont let people know what really goes on. be it right or wrong we all know this to be the fact and we should face the problems and not try cover it up like the church, least david has the bottle to come out and admit it

DaveSlats

David Norris is a fool.

If he wants to have, say, a silly chatshow nobody would object to that.

But to be a leader of state?

partyatmygaff

Thorella wrote: »

I would still vote for Norris. Anyone else would step down but I admire him for continuing to try regardless of people trying their best to destroy him. Please don't tear into me, this is my first post

That's strange.

If a bishop involved with abuses in the RCC wrote a similar letter and then stood by it would you still "admire him for continuing to try regardless of people trying their best to destroy him"?

I'd hope not anyway.

7sr2z3fely84g5

i didn't mean to post in a question sense,i meant maybe there might not been much uproar if was female doing the deed,the young lad probably be more than happy and not report.

Tigger

later10 wrote: »

It would be statutory rape.

never be prosecuted tho, the issue is that people still think that if a 15 year old gay boy has gay sex it turns him gay (i doubt it tbh) but if a 15 year old straight boy has straight sex well its ok (could be)

Sunnyisland

David norris is now posting in the politics forum.

Tigger

Alivia Square Alphabet wrote: »

i didn't mean to post in a question sense,i meant maybe there might not been much uproar if was female doing the deed,the young lad probably be more than happy and not report.

but if the lad in this case was gay mabey he'd be happy ?

did he report or was it hios parents looking to report the man who gave their son the gay

epgc3fyqirnbsx

Tigger wrote: »

never be prosecuted tho, the issue is that people still think that if a 15 year old gay boy has gay sex it turns him gay (i doubt it tbh) but if a 15 year old straight boy has straight sex well its ok (could be)

The issue, for me anyway, is that he used his office to try to influence judicial proceedings in another jurisdiction for a crime that also exists in this country. Firstly he had no mandate to do anything like that and secondly it is a serious abuse of his office.
That is before you consider the type of crime it was and this countrys history with similar crimes

Einhard

Dennis wrote: »

goat2 wrote: »

this is headed with our harp, .........


There appear to be completely separate three letters.

The main letter written to the court by Norris does NOT have a harp on it and seems to be a personal request for leniency of the sentence based on European and Irish law that Norris himself helped change. He goes to great lengths to outline who he is and has used plain paper in order to do that.

Of the other two, one is a coverpage and the other is a simple reference and is not trying to influence the outcome of anything.

All the correspondence made reference to his position in Ireland. he was obviously seeking to use his office for the benefit of a friend.

However, even if he didn't seek to use his position, his actions would still be acts of appalling judgement. He wrote to the judges after his friend had been found guilty of the statutory rape of a teenager. What on earth was he thinking? There was huge controversy a few years back when a FF TD wrote seeking leniency on behalf of one of his jailed constituents. Discrimination based on sexuality is a terrible thing; but so are double standards based on the same, and that's exactly what Norris' continuing supporters are applying.

Also- can we just ignore northkildare (the person and the place ). Seriously, he's obviously a troll, and one that seems to want to dredge up homophobic sentiment. If we ignore him he'll slink back under his bridge.