€25k invested in prize bonds

tobdom

scheister wrote: »

think it was about two weeks for the set i recently purchased

mno101 wrote: »

closer to 3 weeks for me

No panic yet so.... thanks!

dxhound2005

Those of us who reinvest our winnings get two letters. One saying we have won, and the new bond in a separate letter. Over the years I have often got both letters on the same day in the post. Happened today for my win on 24 Jan.

I sent an email to Prize Bonds suggesting that one letter is enough. People who opted for cheque got only one letter. With so many more going to be reinvestments now I think it makes sense.

Hibernicis

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Those of us who reinvest our winnings get two letters. One saying we have won, and the new bond in a separate letter. Over the years I have often got both letters on the same day in the post. Happened today for my win on 24 Jan.

I sent an email to Prize Bonds suggesting that one letter is enough. People who opted for cheque got only one letter. With so many more going to be reinvestments now I think it makes sense.

It’s nuts. I wrote to them with the following suggestions

1. change the notification “letter” to electronic notification (e-mail, text etc)
2. allow an opt out
3. put the money saved into the prize fund - I estimate it would add a minimum of 10,000 additional 50 euro prizes per annum, perhaps more.

Calculated thus: 4,500 prizes (letters) per week, 52 weeks in the year, €2.50 per letter, is a Saving of €585,000 per annum, which would fund 11,700 additional €50 prizes.

The €2.50 per item might sound exorbitant, but people have little realisation of the costs associated with raising/printing/enveloping/handling/posting/filing/storing letters even in a bulk correspondence environment when the infrastructure, hardware, software, labour, management and overhead costs etc are included. I have seen and worked with figures of up to €10 for this. In this example I am assuming An Post and Fexco to be super efficient and so allowing a figure of €2.50 per item)

Taylor365

Hibernicis wrote: »

It’s nuts. I wrote to them with the following suggestions

1. change the notification “letter” to electronic notification (e-mail, text etc)
2. allow an opt out
3. put the money saved into the prize fund - I estimate it would add a minimum of 10,000 additional 50 euro prizes per annum, perhaps more.

Calculated thus: 4,500 prizes (letters) per week, 52 weeks in the year, €2.50 per letter, is a Saving of €585,000 per annum, which would fund 11,700 additional €50 prizes.

The €2.50 per item might sound exorbitant, but people have little realisation of the costs associated with raising/printing/enveloping/handling/posting/filing/storing letters even in a bulk correspondence environment when the infrastructure, hardware, software, labour, management and overhead costs etc are included. I have seen and worked with figures of up to €10 for this. In this example I am assuming An Post and Fexco to be super efficient and so allowing a figure of €2.50 per item)

C'mon now, don't want to be efficient and put people out of jobs, do we?! :rolleyes:

Thargor

Do you think there are Prizebond "Whales" out there, people who stuck millions in in 2008 or before and situations like that before the 250k (?) limit was put in and now hoover up most of the prizes? Are there any stats on the average holding?

dxhound2005

The number of holdings from the 2018 Annual Report.

Number of separate Prize Bond holdings 7.13 million.
Fund value €3,415 million.

I make that an average holding of €480. I do a skim through the map most weeks to see any interesting results. But not Dublin and Cork which between them win more than half the prizes in every draw. I see a very small number of holdings with big money. The ones from the same prefix group which win every week in the same county.

Taylor365

Thargor wrote: »

Do you think there are Prizebond "Whales" out there, people who stuck millions in in 2008 or before and situations like that before the 250k (?) limit was put in and now hoover up most of the prizes? Are there any stats on the average holding?

If there was, it would be a gross waste of money to have it kept in pbs at the current rate.

dxhound2005

If you look at the banks this is typically what they offer, i.e. hardly anything on big deposits. They will probably soon go to negative interest rates. Plus Prize Bonds are DIRT free.

0.20% on €3,000 to €100,000
0.01%* on €100,000+
0.01% on €1,500,000.01+ on the entire balance

Taylor365

dxhound2005 wrote: »

If you look at the banks this is typically what they offer, i.e. hardly anything on big deposits. They will probably soon go to negative interest rates. Plus Prize Bonds are DIRT free.

0.20% on €3,000 to €100,000
0.01%* on €100,000+
0.01% on €1,500,000.01+ on the entire balance

Yes, but millions gives you entry into ANY investment. (businesses, rentals, etc.)



Bank accounts would be last on the list.

dxhound2005

Taylor365 wrote: »

Yes, but millions gives you entry into ANY investment. (businesses, rentals, etc.)



Bank accounts would be last on the list.

No doubt the high rollers are well diversified. But the way Prize Bonds have taken off since the crash shows that a lot of people with big money consider it a good option.

Taylor365

dxhound2005 wrote: »

No doubt the high rollers are well diversified. But the way Prize Bonds have taken off since the crash shows that a lot of people with big money consider it a good option.

Possibly, or a place to hold cash while waiting for a crash of some sort, hoarding Buffet style :pac:

abff

I reinvest my winnings and I get a separate holding for each win. I’ve won €1,300 in total - 19 single wins, 2 doubles and 1 treble. I have received a separate certificate in respect of each of those wins, so I now have 23 holdings in total.

I would think it’s likely that the overall stats are distorted by the number of people who reinvest their winnings. I wonder is there any data on the total number of people who hold bonds.

dxhound2005

abff wrote: »

I reinvest my winnings and I get a separate holding for each win. I’ve won €1,300 in total - 19 single wins, 2 doubles and 1 treble. I have received a separate certificate in respect of each of those wins, so I now have 23 holdings in total.

I would think it’s likely that the overall stats are distorted by the number of people who reinvest their winnings. I wonder is there any data on the total number of people who hold bonds.

One of the rules about reinvestments is that they can bring your holding to over the €250K limit, and you can still keep on winning and reinvesting. On that basis I don't think they are counted as separate holdings. Unlike buying new bonds which would be a separate holding, and not allowed if they brought the total holdings over the limit.

I never saw any figure for the number of people with bonds. They have been going since 1957, and there is a lot of churn.

dxhound2005

I got this reply to my email.

Thank you for your email.

I can confirm that it is an automated letter that is sent out to winners regarding their win. If there is no back log of printing prize bond certs (in new purchases/ reinvestments etc.) we will issue out the new cert in that letter.

Therefore we cannot guarantee that you will receive both together.

I apologise for any inconvenience caused.

Kind Regards,

tuisginideach

tuisginideach wrote: »

Same as....:(

And so it continues :(:(

PB2018

Wins on 31st January 2020: €0
Last win - 3rd January 2020: €50
Weeks since last win: 4
€134k invested in prize bonds since July 2017
Win ratio: 15 wins in 135 weeks (11%)
2017 (Jul-Dec): 5 x €50 = €250
2018 (Jan-Dec): 4 x €50 = €200
2019 (Jan-Dec): 5 x €50 = €250
2020 (Jan-date): 1 x €50 = €50

dxhound2005

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Greece features a lot more regularly than other similar population countries in Europe.

04 May €50 ZH812891
11 May €50 ZH781182
25 May €50 ZH800305
01 June €1,000 ZH816762

I you have money you get money.

This is my post from June 2018, in the context of the recent discussion about "whales". This person in Greece is one of them, although they did not need to be a whale to win €150 today.

Prize Value Winning Prize Bond Location

€50 ZH796140 Greece
€50 ZH798408 Greece
€50 ZH798886 Greece

Hibernicis

dxhound2005 wrote: »

If there is no back log of printing prize bond certs (in new purchases/ reinvestments etc.) we will issue out the new cert in that letter.

I've received upwards of 50 reinvestment prizes over the last few years and not once has the cert and the notification letter been in the same envelope.

Hibernicis

abff wrote: »

I reinvest my winnings and I get a separate holding for each win. I’ve won €1,300 in total - 19 single wins, 2 doubles and 1 treble. I have received a separate certificate in respect of each of those wins, so I now have 23 holdings in total.

I would think it’s likely that the overall stats are distorted by the number of people who reinvest their winnings. I wonder is there any data on the total number of people who hold bonds.

Between regular DD purchases, one-off purchases and reinvestments I have well over 100 certs. All of them (except for the oldest few) have an account number and this is identical, so it should be possible to use this to identify the number of holders/holdings with greater accuracy than a count of certs which would be pretty meaningless.

carrickbawn

tuisginideach wrote: »

And so it continues :(:(

Continues here too.

pbwinner

Winnings on 31st January 2020: €0
Last win 23rd August 2019: €50
Total winnings on €25k from Feb 2011 to date: €2900
2011: €75 x 4 €300
2012: €75 x 6 €450
2013: €50 x 12 €600
2014: €50 x 9 €450
2015: €50 x 5 €250
2016: €50 x 5 €250
2017: €50 x 4 €200
2018: €50 x 2 €100
2019: €50 x 6 €300
2020: €0

Cork Lass

Mach Two

pbwinner wrote: »

Winnings on 31st January 2020: €0
Last win 23rd August 2019: €50
Total winnings on €25k from Feb 2011 to date: €2900
2011: €75 x 4 €300
2012: €75 x 6 €450
2013: €50 x 12 €600
2014: €50 x 9 €450
2015: €50 x 5 €250
2016: €50 x 5 €250
2017: €50 x 4 €200
2018: €50 x 2 €100
2019: €50 x 6 €300
2020: €0

What is your percentage win on a yearly basis.

abff

pbwinner wrote: »

Winnings on 31st January 2020: €0
Last win 23rd August 2019: €50
Total winnings on €25k from Feb 2011 to date: €2900
2011: €75 x 4 €300
2012: €75 x 6 €450
2013: €50 x 12 €600
2014: €50 x 9 €450
2015: €50 x 5 €250
2016: €50 x 5 €250
2017: €50 x 4 €200
2018: €50 x 2 €100
2019: €50 x 6 €300
2020: €0

Don't know what the interest rate (prize fund) on prize bonds was a few years ago, but those figures (particularly those for 2019) appear to be way in excess of what you might expect on a 25K investment, given the very low rates available over the past couple of years.

dxhound2005

abff wrote: »

Don't know what the interest rate (prize fund) on prize bonds was a few years ago, but those figures (particularly those for 2019) appear to be way in excess of what you might expect on a 25K investment, given the very low rates available over the past couple of years.

It's not an investment, it's a weekly prize draw. And is subject to the vagaries of luck. If you read through the thread you will see that is very possible for someone with much less than €25K to win well above the average return.

abff

dxhound2005 wrote: »

It's not an investment, it's a weekly prize draw. And is subject to the vagaries of luck. If you read through the thread you will see that is very possible for someone with much less than €25K to win well above the average return.

I don’t agree.

If you buy a handful of bonds, it’s just a gamble. If you invest a substantial amount, you are almost certain to get at least some return on your money. You can argue about the merits of prize bonds as an investment and whether the expected return is something that investors should buy into. But Eurozone government bonds are currently near zero or even negative rates of return and can still be classified as an investment, even if they represent very bad value for money at the present time.

Prize bonds offer a guaranteed return of your capital and the prospect of a tax free return that is admittedly variable depending on how ‘lucky’ you are. But faced with close to zero rates on deposits (and having to pay income tax and PRSI) on any interest earned, they represent a reasonable alternative to deposits for someone who wants to hold relatively liquid assets in a low risk asset as part of their overall portfolio.

Do I think they should form the bulk of an investment portfolio? No, in the vast majority of cases. But neither can they be casually dismissed as ‘not an investment’.

Taylor365

abff wrote: »

I don’t agree.

If you buy a handful of bonds, it’s just a gamble. If you invest a substantial amount, you are almost certain to get at least some return on your money. You can argue about the merits of prize bonds as an investment and whether the expected return is something that investors should buy into. But Eurozone government bonds are currently near zero or even negative rates of return and can still be classified as an investment, even if they represent very bad value for money at the present time.

Prize bonds offer a guaranteed return of your capital and the prospect of a tax free return that is admittedly variable depending on how ‘lucky’ you are. But faced with close to zero rates on deposits (and having to pay income tax and PRSI) on any interest earned, they represent a reasonable alternative to deposits for someone who wants to hold relatively liquid assets in a low risk asset as part of their overall portfolio.

Do I think they should form the bulk of an investment portfolio? No, in the vast majority of cases. But neither can they be casually dismissed as ‘not an investment’.

Ah they can.


:pac:

abff

Taylor365 wrote: »

Ah they can.


:pac:

That’s true. Idiots can say anything they like. In general, the less someone knows about a subject, the more certain they are in expressing their opinion.

Taylor365

abff wrote: »

That’s true. Idiots can say anything they like. In general, the less someone knows about a subject, the more certain they are in expressing their opinion.

The ironing is delicious.


Currently @ 35k without a sausage since July.


I've had 2 wins since Jan 2018, both of which are on a 14k batch.


Rub the lamp for this year! :P

PB2018

Wins on 7th February 2020: €0
Last win - 3rd January 2020: €50
Weeks since last win: 5
€134k invested in prize bonds since July 2017
Win ratio: 15 wins in 136 weeks (11%)
2017 (Jul-Dec): 5 x €50 = €250
2018 (Jan-Dec): 4 x €50 = €200
2019 (Jan-Dec): 5 x €50 = €250
2020 (Jan-date): 1 x €50 = €50