How to Use A Roundabout

Slick50

Leprechaun77 wrote: »

If everyone agrees that the left lane should be taken for the second exit if it is before 12 o'clock, please explain to me what significant difference there is in the exit being at 1 o'clock and thus using the right lane. Why bring in this variable if it makes no difference? Surely the simple principle of exit numbers should be kept instead of trying to gauge what time the exit is at. Maybe we should all just go 24:00 digital to stop this carnage on our roads

+1 If you apply the clock position rule to the roundabout in the given example, you have to change the lane you use depending on which direction you are travelling in. Where as with the exit number rule, the same lane would be used in either direction. Even on boards every one can agree wether it is the second or third exit from their entry point.

Slick50

Divorce Referendum wrote: »

If you use the principle of exit numbers it wouldnt work very well on a roundabout like this example:

Why not?

Leprechaun77

Divorce Referendum wrote: »

If you use the principle of exit numbers it wouldnt work very well on a roundabout like this example:

I would think that a lot of these types of roundabouts would have three lanes, but for any that don't, the basic principle of exit numbers would still work. I do see a slight flaw however in this example from an exit number point of view, in that the left lane would see the majority of traffic and the right lane may become redundant to a certain degree. I think such roundabouts, which would be rare, should be signposted anyway as inevitably they will be at major junctions/intersections

Senna

Vaguely similar roundabout near me (second exit past 12oC), wouldn't dream of taking the Left land at that one. Right is Right

Leprechaun77

Senna wrote: »

Vaguely similar roundabout near me (second exit past 12oC), wouldn't dream of taking the Left land at that one. Right is Right

As a matter of interest, why?

Divorce Referendum

Leprechaun77 wrote: »

I would think that a lot of these types of roundabouts would have three lanes, but for any that don't, the basic principle of exit numbers would still work. I do see a slight flaw however in this example from an exit number point of view, in that the left lane would see the majority of traffic and the right lane may become redundant to a certain degree. I think such roundabouts, which would be rare, should be signposted anyway as inevitably they will be at major junctions/intersections

I think you mean the right lane would see the majority of traffic in the exit no. principle but yeah that was basically what I was getting at.

Slick50

Welease wrote: »

WOW shocked that a motoring forum would be split on this.. but maybe that explains what i see on roundabouts daily...

It's right lane.. it's past 12 o'clock..

Left lane is not fine for a second exit past 12 o'clock.. As already linked to in the testing guildelines..http://www.rsa.ie/Documents/ADI/DrivingFault_Marking_Guides.pdf

"Where an applicant intends to take any exit in the 6 o’clock to 12 o’clock position, subject to road markings, the approach should normally be in the left-hand lane.
The approach should normally be in the right-hand lane for any exit after the 12 o’clock position, or a fault may be recorded for ‘Position at Roundabouts’. *obviously unless road marking indicate otherwise..

Also from your above link... "Applicants should normally follow their entry lane around the
roundabout until they pass the exit before the one which they intend to take, where they should switch to
the left-hand lane and proceed to their intended exit." so because the second exit is beyond the 12 position you keep right untill you pass the first exit, then you can drive in the left lane.? even if the first exit is at the 7:30 position? does that make sense?

The term "normally" is used an awfull lot in these guidelines, I would suggest that the second exit is not "normally" beyond the 12 position.

Voodoomelon

I'm surprised at some of the names giving thanks to both left and right lane suggestions, i thought most regular posters in Motors would be posting the same answer! (right) *cough*

hi5

ULSTER SAYS RIGHT:)

http://www.nidirect.gov.uk/index/information-and-services/motoring/the-highway-code-index-page/appendix.htm

Senna

Leprechaun77 wrote: »

As a matter of interest, why?

Cause its the wrong one.

I'll explain, on the roundabout in question, the traffic sitting at the entrance before my exit will start to move off if they only see a car in the left lane (they assume they are all turning right because the second exit is a very small, hardly used road, so on this particular roundabout 99.999% of traffic in left lane are taking the first exit and 99.999% of people on the right are taking 3rd exit. As i said in my post "Vaguely similar", but the same rule applies, my exit is after 12oC.

Conor_M1990

1st or 2nd exit left lane
3rd exit or any exit after that right lane

Slick50

hi5 wrote: »

ULSTER SAYS RIGHT:)

http://www.nidirect.gov.uk/index/information-and-services/motoring/the-highway-code-index-page/appendix.htm

Ulster says "right" for the fourth and fifth exit, it also says left for the second exit, in their examples, none of which cover when the second exit is beyond the 12 position.

Senna, are you talking about brazil?

timogen

I drive a (40ft+) truck and i would use the left lane unless they're signs on the road to tell me otherwise,I am taking the second exit so left lane.
If the traffic are on the outside of me at this point trying to take the same exit as me they are going to do another lap of the roundabout.
If you didnt know the road,hadn't an overview and knew you had to take the second exit what lane would you be in?

shannon_tek

Roundabouts :mad: . No body knows how the F*** to use them:mad:. absolutely kills me:mad:. I go with the LEFT lane why because im sitting my driving exam . and the rule goes 1st and 2nd exit take the left lane 3 or more take the right lane. put on your left indicator if you are intending to take your first exit(could be to your left) . Or if you are planing to go straight ahead.(known as the 2nd exit can be 3rd) Do not put on your right indicator when using your left hand lane. When Exiting always use your left indicator(which most do not do). If you are planing to take the 3rd exit or more use the Right lane. Indicate Right, from the start. after you have passed the second exit or the exit before your chosen one indicate left and move over. Simples . maybe not for alot

http://www.rotr.ie/ . Theres a video in the corner about the roundabout , not that clear , but should help

rex-x

News tomorrow, man on forurm proves half of Ireland can't drive! its no wonder roundabouts are so scary :eek:

thanks lads for the definitive answer :pac:

Slick50

niamhocxox wrote: »

To be honest this could go on and on.

I think I should just take the right hand lane and you take the left. We'll agree to disagree.

But it is comforting to know that if you hit me you'll be in the wrong

If you hit a car in the left hand lane, crossing over from the right on a roundabout, you're the one who will be in the wrong. Once you are both on the round about. But that's another story.

If the first exit was past the 12 position, would everybody have to go into the righthand lane??

The only reason to go into the righthand lane is to allow the free flow of traffic that won't be interfering with your progress. ie to allow traffic entering the roundabout from the nearest junction to you, to enter the roundabout and exit at the next junction to them.

corktina

the true problem here is the way the rules are written....in a case like this its not the NUMBER of the exit that matters, its the POSITION of the exit. the RotR are not clear enough and have caused major confusion.

Welease

Slick50 wrote: »

Also from your above link... "Applicants should normally follow their entry lane around the
roundabout until they pass the exit before the one which they intend to take, where they should switch to
the left-hand lane and proceed to their intended exit." so because the second exit is beyond the 12 position you keep right untill you pass the first exit, then you can drive in the left lane.? even if the first exit is at the 7:30 position? does that make sense?

The term "normally" is used an awfull lot in these guidelines, I would suggest that the second exit is not "normally" beyond the 12 position.

Yes, it makes perfect sense... because it's the rules, and they work if people follow them..

In the example you mention, if you are goign to the second exit beyond the 12 o clock, you move into the left lane after you have passed the 1st exit at 7:30...

But you still approach the roundabout in the right lane....

What makes it a mess in this country, is when people decide to make up their own rules and join in the left land.. thus forcing 2 lanes of traffic to merge into one to get off at the second exit (past 12 o clock in this case). If they were in the right-hand lane, as per the rules, there would be 0 issues and it makes perfect sense..

stevenmu

So the poll has clearly proven that roughly half the people on this forum are dangerous idiots who should never be allowed drive again. The only question remaining is, which half ?

tobsey

I posted why I think it's the right lane already but another thing struck me since. I can guarantee that if you were approaching that roundabout in your driving test, the instructor would say "At the roundabout ahead turn right, second exit." And that's the crux of it. You are turning right so you should be in the the right lane and signalling right. The guidelines for marking faults in the test say the same thing so I don't know how how anyone can say left lane.

If any of you approached that roundabout in the left lane in you're driving test you would be marked down. End of story. Whether you agree with it or not is irrelevant, it's how it is taught and how it is tested.

P.S. the only real rule on a roundabout is don't hit other cars as far as I'm concerned. Expect everyone to do something stupid and be ready for it.

squod

Four junctions on the roundabout, half the peole believe the 12oclock rule applies? Others see it as the second exit of four, so left hand lane? Is that the story so far?


The road is in the UK anyways so what the big debate for. The Irish ROR doesn't apply.

Tea 1000

jaffa20 wrote: »

http://www.bitingpoint.co.uk/roundabouts

http://www.aandcdrivingschool.ie/roundabouts.html

http://www.rsa.ie/Documents/ADI/DrivingFault_Marking_Guides.pdf (see Page 6 position at roundabouts)

Here's the problem. Three links there all agreeing that the right lane should be taken for roundabouts when the exit you're taking is past the 12 o'clock mark. However, the first one is a UK website, the second one is a driving school that I'm fairly sure not everyone in the country got lessons from, and the third one is a link to an RSA document on how the tester should grade and mark the student.
None of those three sources are likely to enter 98% of the normal people of Ireland learning to drive. Some driving instructors tell the students about the positions of the clock rule, others don't. It doesn't appear in the standard Rules of the Road book.
And going by this thread, only half the people were taught the clock way, which seems to be the correct way.

smokie2008 wrote: »

I've literally just had 6 two hour Lessons AND a driving Test in a Jeep and Trailer and passed no problem going through a roundabout Similar to this one in Naas and I can say 100% its the LEFT lane you should stay in.

This person was clearly taught the opposite. Is his instructor incorrect so? And if so (looks likely), where did his instructor get his information from?

Leprechaun77 wrote: »

If everyone agrees that the left lane should be taken for the second exit if it is before 12 o'clock, please explain to me what significant difference there is in the exit being at 1 o'clock and thus using the right lane. Why bring in this variable if it makes no difference? Surely the simple principle of exit numbers should be kept instead of trying to gauge what time the exit is at. Maybe we should all just go 24:00 digital to stop this carnage on our roads

Personally, I was taught to go by the number of exits and no mention was ever made about clock positions. That was 12 years or so ago. However since then, I've read the new Rules of the Road book that was sent to most of us in the post a few years ago, still no mention of clock positions, and have listened to the teachings of friends who have gotten more recent lessons who were taught the clock method, so I adjusted my roundabout style according to the new info that everyone seems to be given.
However, I think is a sham that the RSA are focussing on speed only, when they don't even know how to educate people on roundabouts correctly.
I also think the same as Leprechaun77 in that it's madness to introduce a needless variable such as position into an otherwise fairly straight-forward system. I've seen roundabouts where there are 2 lanes in, and both the first and second exit off it are past 12 o'clock... meaning that the left lane is useless.
They need new concrete rules that make sense logically, broadcast them, and have new rules regarding roundabout construction, signage and road markings.

BostonB

Have one rule, not one qualified by, another and another. Changes that occurred over time, which were not communicated to existing drivers. Left lane is for the first exit. No confusion. Not which clock it is, or what the road markings are, or how many lanes are on the exit to the roundabout, or how many roads join the roundabout.

You have some roundabouts here with 3 lanes, and 3 lanes on the exit. They should make whomever designed that pay for all the insurance claims, arising out of that. If you are on a busy roundabout, you should be looking up, not down at road markings, or working out what clock it is. Blanch roundabout used to go from 2 lanes to 3 lanes as you went around it. The markings were changed a few times, so you had a mix of old markings and new ones. You also have some roundabouts, with two lanes entering, no lanes marked on the roundabout, (usually tiny), then two lanes exiting, but immediately one changes to a bus lanes. Causing more merging. What looks like two exit lanes is actually only one. What nut job designs these things.

Of course you could just make it so confusing every slows to snails pace. Thus no accidents.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magic_Roundabout_(Swindon)

Stevie Dakota

I'm for the right lane and to hell with any rulebook. The left lane is a sure way to get T-boned by someone, who hasn't been in that situation?

The right lane you control what happens instead of depending on someone else.

rickyjb

It's a four exit roundabout, looks pretty straightforward to me you're taking the 2nd exit so you approach in the left hand lane unless the road markings say otherwise i.e. there's a straight ahead arrow in the right hand lane.

I have to deal with this every morning where people go straight through roundabouts from the right hand lane and there's only one exit lane, it's pretty dangerous to be honest especially when they think they're in the right.

Things get much messier when there are 3 or 5 exits but for this one it's cut and dry. If you did a driving test tomorrow the tester would say "take the 2nd exit ahead" (no way he'd mention turning right) and if you used the right hand lane you'd be wrong. Do people here really think otherwise?

squod

rickyjb wrote: »

It's a four exit roundabout, looks pretty straightforward to me you're taking the 2nd exit so you approach in the left hand lane unless the road markings say otherwise i.e. there's a straight ahead arrow in the right hand lane.

I have to deal with this every morning where people go straight through roundabouts from the right hand lane and there's only one exit lane, it's pretty dangerous to be honest especially when they think they're in the right.

Things get much messier when there are 3 or 5 exits but for this one it's cut and dry. If you did a driving test tomorrow the tester would say "take the 2nd exit ahead" (no way he'd mention turning right) and if you used the right hand lane you'd be wrong. Do people here really think otherwise?

According to the RSA in the TV advert they published; (from what I can take from it) they're suggesting taking the right hand lane in this circumstance.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pPjIlh9DTZc

Have to add her that I still haven't voted.

rickyjb

squod wrote: »

According to the RSA in the TV advert they published; (from what I can take from it) they're suggesting taking the right hand lane in this circumstance.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pPjIlh9DTZc

Have to add her that I still haven't voted.

I can't watch this at the moment but from what I remember after seeing that ad on tv it said to always use the left lane when taking the 2nd exit unless the road markings say otherwise i.e. unless the arrows say you can go straight ahead from the right lane/there's a left turn only arrow from the left hand lane etc.

I remember thinking at the time thay they had phrased it pretty badly though.
Trust a taxpayer funded agency to spend money on an ad which doesn't do what it's meant to...

Zubeneschamali

Tea 1000 wrote: »

It doesn't appear in the standard Rules of the Road book.

The clock-face rule doesn't, but it says the same as the Rules say: Making a left turn, going straight, any later exit. So any exit that's later than straight ahead, use the right lane.

What does not appear anywhere in the Rules of the Road is the "first exit, second exit, later exits" nonsense.

BlackWizard

The exit kinda looks to be straight ahead even though the road direction gives a different impression. So I would use the left lane. If oncoming traffic in the right lane does not have an indicator on or does not appears to be moving into the left lane, I usually pull out into the left lane. Either they can slow down and pull in behind me or go around again

Similar round-about is in ballyfermot, but the exits are all single-ish lanes so I'm not sure it really applies.

BostonB

Going straight is meaningless on a large very roundabout, where you can't see the exits. Until you get around to them. Straight might be the 3rd or 4th exit.