New England Patriots thread (MOD WARNING - #4503)

Son Of A Vidic

Mike912 wrote: »

or rugby star turned footballer Nate Ebner cleaning Mr Pollard's clock on a special teams play.

I'd be just happy with Ebner not making a balls of protection on the punt unit. He learned a valuable lesson in the last game, but he's a good lad and I've no doubt it will only make him a better player.

Mike912

Here's a perfect set up highlighting Belichick's disdain for conformance to NFL injury report guidelines (or maybe highlight how much the mafia knows):

On Thursday the Patriots disclosed that Logan Mankins did not fully participate in practice with a hip injury. Logan is listed as "questionable" for Sunday's game by the Patriots.

Vegas has the Patriots a 2 1/2 point underdog on Sunday.
My bookie whose name is "Jumbo" then 8 vowels, has the Patriots 5 1/2 point underdogs.

I say "Gimmee the Patriots plus 5 1/2"
He says "you know Vollmer and Mankins will be at 50% at best, right?"
I say no.
He says Mankins might not even play.

CoachTO

JaMarcus Hustle wrote: »

Didn't Brady appear as Questionable on the injury report every week for a few years up until some stage last year? It seemed to be a long running joke by Belichick, in his own unique way of taking the piss out of the media. I wonder why he stopped - I remember there being a lot of surprise when Brady's name was no longer on it!

Yeah it seemed like Bill turned it into his own little joke in later years. We all know his love for the media anything to annoy them or take the piss out of them.

Mike912

CoachTO wrote: »

Your opponent sets their gameplans around certain players. By putting key players on the list the hope is your opponent plans for the what if or gets a false sense of security about the situation and bam game comes along and your key player is fine. Its nonsense really. I really doubt anyone falls for it anymore.

Better answer than mine. It's all a big effort to get the advantage.

CoachTO

Mike912 wrote: »

Here's a perfect set up highlighting Belichick's disdain for conformance to NFL injury report guidelines (or maybe highlight how much the mafia knows):

On Thursday the Patriots disclosed that Logan Mankins did not fully participate in practice with a hip injury. Logan is listed as "questionable" for Sunday's game by the Patriots.

Vegas has the Patriots a 2 1/2 point underdog on Sunday.
My bookie whose name is "Jumbo" then 8 vowels, has the Patriots 5 1/2 point underdogs.

I say "Gimmee the Patriots plus 5 1/2"
He says "you know Vollmer and Mankins will be at 50% at best, right?"
I say no.
He says Mankins might not even play.

Only thing is these days not even Vegas get sucked in by the injury report especially not on the Pats. In fact betting on the Pats is pointless as the spreads and odds on the line for many years have been better for the bookie rather than the punter.

Mike912

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

I'd be just happy with Ebner not making a balls of protection on the punt unit.

That was pretty bad. Nate's a gamer though, I think he might be pivotal later in the season.

Son Of A Vidic

I'm pretty certain that from 2004 right through to 2009/10 Brady was always listed as - Probable with a shoulder injury.

Masked Man

BB was taking the piss. He's one of the biggest and best trolls in the NFL.

This is what he wore to a press conference a couple of weeks ago.



Technically still wearing the brand of clothes he has to.

edit: read this as well. One of the funniest guys in the game iyam.

Son Of A Vidic

Mike912 wrote: »

That was pretty bad. Nate's a gamer though, I think he might be pivotal later in the season.

I love to see him work his way in like Tavon Wilson did, but Ebner has a lot to learn though. Still, he has done very well so far and is ahead of schedule developmental wise. Of course Wilson was a defensive captain in college and came from a complex system.

I think it was Arrignton (maybe wrong) who missed a bad stop down the sideline against the cardinals in the last game. At the time, I could just imagine Ebner dying to bury the receiver into the stands with a tackle.

CoachTO

Masked Man wrote: »

BB was taking the piss. He's one of the biggest and best trolls in the NFL.

This is what he wore to a press conference a couple of weeks ago.



Technically still wearing the brand of clothes he has to.

edit: read this as well. One of the funniest guys in the game iyam.

Totally agree but I do think there is a method to his madness. And as funny as he is if you read any of the books about him you always get the feeling he does everything for a reason even something as simple as joke. He also was always good at turning a tactical decision and turning it into a troll. He seems to always take the piss with things other NFL coaches see as tactical advantages. His style is why so many like him especially why so many players want to play for him.

Goose_Hyypia

CoachTO wrote: »

Totally agree but I do think there is a method to his madness. And as funny as he is if you read any of the books about him you always get the feeling he does everything for a reason even something as simple as joke. He also was always good at turning a tactical decision and turning it into a troll. He seems to always take the piss with things other NFL coaches see as tactical advantages. His style is why so many like him especially why so many players want to play for him.

You'd think he would have appreciated Welkers 'foot' interview before the Jets playoff game in 2010

Mike912

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

I love to see him work his way in like Tavon Wilson did, but Ebner has a lot to learn though. Still, he has done very well so far and is ahead of schedule developmental wise. Of course Wilson was a defensive captain in college and came from a complex system.

I think it was Arrignton (maybe wrong) who missed a bad stop down the sideline against the cardinals in the last game. At the time, I could just imagine Ebner dying to bury the receiver into the stands with a tackle.

Corvus, here's the video of Nate that makes me happy. He has speed that separates him from the pack along with a bit of a nasty streak that should carry over to the NFL.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5P94LZzurYM

(maybe you've already seen that vid)

He's been a US National level rugger since the age of 17. Now at 22 he's being asked (paid handsomely) to play a new sport at the same reckless abandon that he played at for the best rugby level we have here.

You are Belichick for a moment....do you unleash Nate as a missile on defense, or do you give him the ball to run with on offense?

We all know Bill likes to have guys that play both offense and defense. Last request, any vids you can post that shows the skills of a rugger that can play in the NFL?

CoachTO

Mike912 wrote: »

You are Belichick for a moment....do you unleash Nate as a missile on defense, or do you give him the ball to run with on offense?

We all know Bill likes to have guys that play both offense and defense. Last request, any vids you can post that shows the skills of a rugger that can play in the NFL?

I can't see Ebner ever being used as a Runningback and if he ever does it will be short yard downs. He is fast and big and would bowl people over but he is not nearly as agile enough to be a running back. He has great straight line speed but his cutting ability and ability to find lanes wouldn't be there. There will always be so many other guys better than him doing it. He will definitely make it as a safety though as that speed and strength will be key.

Son Of A Vidic

Mike912 wrote: »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5P94LZzurYM

(maybe you've already seen that vid)

Not a big You Tube user myself, but I seen that vid only because of all the chatter about it.

Mike912 wrote: »

You are Belichick for a moment....do you unleash Nate as a missile on defense, or do you give him the ball to run with on offense?

He hasn't the experience to be unleashed anywhere at the moment imo. But I'd be keeping Nate very firmly on the defensive side of the ball and that's hopefully where he will carve out a niche for himself.

Mike912

CoachTO wrote: »

Only thing is these days not even Vegas get sucked in by the injury report especially not on the Pats. In fact betting on the Pats is pointless as the spreads and odds on the line for many years have been better for the bookie rather than the punter.

Good point Coach, with the lines the Patriots have gotten over the years, the gambling man would have done loads better elsewhere. Think the Pats are less than 50% covering their huge odds per game since the epic 2007 year.

Mike912

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

He hasn't the experience to be unleashed anywhere at the moment imo. But I'd be keeping Nate very firmly on the defensive side of the ball and that's hopefully where he will carve out a niche for himself.

Agree since Bill has him firmly placed on the D side of the line, but just for a go, I'd like to see Nate pitched the ball on a sweep just to see what he could do.

My guess is he'd run like his hair was on fire.

Mike912

One time, Bill, give him the ball to run!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIq-MaR5rCM&feature=related

Son Of A Vidic

No Patriot fan will start his or her day without a bowl of.....

JaMarcus Hustle

I refuse to believe the rest of our corners are worse than Devin McCourty. It's not possible.

CoachTO

JaMarcus Hustle wrote: »

I refuse to believe the rest of our corners are worse than Devin McCourty. It's not possible.

They fail us when it matters as usual. Just when things seems to be looking up they forget how to play basic football. Shambles.

JaMarcus Hustle

Remember Tedy Bruschi, Mike Vrabel, Rodney Harrison, Richard Seymour, Ty Law, Willie McGinest....

How can Belichick be even remotely content with the "product" he's putting out on defence.

Son Of A Vidic

JaMarcus Hustle wrote: »

I refuse to believe the rest of our corners are worse than Devin McCourty. It's not possible.

When I play some ball with my mates, my German Shepherds always have the deep routes and the backfield totally covered. Feck, they'll even throw in a pass rush and leave you chewing dirt. Anyone know Belichicks mobile number?

ReacherCreature

"They're not qualified to do this job. That's become pretty obvious."

As slamming as an indictment you'll hear on the replacement referees straight from Collinsworth and Michaels. The fact the commentators (whom, in an unwritten rule have to talk up the good sides of a game) are saying this is a plea for help. The replacement referees are under pressure, I get that, but they're incapable, lack understanding and don't have the balls to stand up and enforce the game under their rules, not the players. It's about time Roger and all them get the 'real' refs on board.

As a direct comparison, the amounts of "bullsh!t" calls that existed when we had Hochulli and co. are relatively few. When you have commentators, coaches, fans and players expressing disbelief it's on breaking point. Good refs remind me of long snappers, you really miss them when they're gone.

ReacherCreature

On the game, I thought the offense was good which far surpassed my expectations. Play calling was terrible at times but we edged away at a good run defense and Brady looked very sharp passing. Nice to see Lloyd have his breakout game although Cary Williams was beat like a drum by Brady. Tom now has the two options at wideout, Welker and Lloyd. Gronk's there too and if Hernandez returns, great. Edelman is also getting reps too which is good to see.

That defense has been shocking though which really should be no news. McCourty's play is awful. His rookie season was great and promising; we'd have a lock down corner for years. But he's sucked in fairness. Hightower missed some tackles last night. Arrington is odd, he's so up and down. Maybe it was a good Ravens attack (Flacco was very sharp with a good line and Rice on form) but I'm worried considering the D was promising vs. Tennessee and somewhat good at times vs. Arizona.

Hazys

ReacherCreature wrote: »

On the game, I thought the offense was good which far surpassed my expectations. Play calling was terrible at times but we edged away at a good run defense and Brady looked very sharp passing. Nice to see Lloyd have his breakout game although Cary Williams was beat like a drum by Brady. Tom now has the two options at wideout, Welker and Lloyd. Gronk's there too and if Hernandez returns, great. Edelman is also getting reps too which is good to see.

That defense has been shocking though which really should be no news. McCourty's play is awful. His rookie season was great and promising; we'd have a lock down corner for years. But he's sucked in fairness. Hightower missed some tackles last night. Arrington is odd, he's so up and down. Maybe it was a good Ravens attack (Flacco was very sharp with a good line and Rice on form) but I'm worried considering the D was promising vs. Tennessee and somewhat good at times vs. Arizona.

I think that was unfair, i thought he had a pretty good game till the last drive PI penalty he gave away. I think that was his only mistake, maybe dropping the int too but thats not his main role.

The PI that was called against him on 2 and 16 was a disgrace, you can only do so much when the officals are granting the offense multiple second tries.

JaMarcus Hustle

McCourty's coverage in general was awful. Lost count of the amount of replays they showed where McCourty was chasing shadows. He looks like one of the easiest corners to shake off.

eagle eye

JaMarcus Hustle wrote: »

McCourty's coverage in general was awful. Lost count of the amount of replays they showed where McCourty was chasing shadows. He looks like one of the easiest corners to shake off.

It wasn't just McCourty that looked bad. Arrington looked awful too.

The big problem last night were the replacement refs. Its that simple.

Our front 7 never got near Flacco all night. When that happens the secondary is going to look real bad. The reason they didn't get near Flacco is because the Ravens OL was getting away with holding the Patriots all night long.

An exposed secondary will always look poor. Don't take too much out of last night. Wait until the real officials return and then judge the players.

Son Of A Vidic

Christ it was bad enough losing to the Cardinals last week, but I have never been as a angry after a game, than the way I was last night. The defence started well and kept the Ravens downless on their first three possessions. Then it all went downhill and became very inconsistent. Wilfork insisted that the flags and constant disruptions affected their aggression and plays. Maybe so, but it can't explain some of the idiotic plays in the secondary.

Ninkovich was outplayed by a rookie, McCourty continues to get interceptions handed to him on a plate and loses them. Arrington certainly wasn’t much better. Gregory goes for a low tackle on the Ravens TE, totally misses and costs us a TD. Tavon Wilson barely gets any snaps and I have no doubt he would have added a lot more security to the secondary than the shower that played most snaps.

Why was Wilfork substituted out during the Ravens final drive? Surely that’s the time to substitute him in? So much for our pass rush, Flacco had way too much time in the pocket. Most annoying of all, he threw some poor lethargic passes during the game and the secondary still couldn’t pick them off. We have a combined total of 3 sacks so far, which won’t exactly have offenses shaking.

offensive play-calling was weird at times. In the second quarter, a direct snap end-around play went totally wrong and resulted in a 13-yard loss. I thought it was an absolutely ridiculous decision, to call that play at that point in the game and it actually disrupted our own rhythm. I really thought Woodhead was going to be cut during camp but he made it. Why do we even bother letting him run in a game like last night? He has no punch or penetrating power that you need in tight games. I would much prefer to see any potential carries for him go to either Ridley or Bolden.

Another criticism of the offense was their failure to get within field goal range on their last two possessions. The O Line performed well at times, but when it really mattered in the 4th quarter, they let Brady down and gave him no protection from the rush. So both drives ended prematurely when we should have been finishing off the game. I feel Mankins is still nowhere close to being 100% yet and I still have question marks over Gronk and his post injury recovery. Yes he’s getting the snaps, but he’s not quite looking like the Gronk of last year.

Overall, it looks like the defence has reverted back to 2011 form. There are no excuses now, these guys have got the full camp and preseason prep in this year. Yet still we have to watch their basic errors and bad execution. Our defensive rookies offer hope and it’s a pity Dennard is still out injured because his physicality would have been useful last night. Young Ebner got demoted after his mistake on the punt team last week. It’s a pity they don’t apply the same consequences, to some of the idiots who played in the secondary against the Ravens. Once again we know we can’t depended on the defence to pull it’s weigh in the big games.

Looking on the positive side, for me the Ravens game was always going to be the toughest game of our regular season. Ignoring the poor defensive play, we still should have won the game. We can thank the incompetent officials, for making some terrible decisions which cost us the game. Yes we should be masters of our own destiny, but some of the mistakes were just beyond belief and their effect can’t be played down. A lot of pundits suggested we wouldn’t score more than 16 points, well we nearly got double that amount.

So normality is restored, the defence is rubbish again after a false dawn. But the offense can still win without them. Our most versatile weapon Hernandez wasn’t available. Welker was excellent last night, Branch was solid and dependable and Lloyd did very well. Lloyd looks like he’s starting to get a nice groove going with Brady. Ridley is averaging nearly 78 Yards a game, which would be +1200 yards for the season. We nearly won the SB with no defence and a poor run game. So there’s no reason to think, that with more attacking options on the table now and a more balanced attack, we can’t go a step further.

ReacherCreature

Hazys wrote: »

I think that was unfair, i thought he had a pretty good game till the last drive PI penalty he gave away. I think that was his only mistake, maybe dropping the int too but thats not his main role.

The PI that was called against him on 2 and 16 was a disgrace, you can only do so much when the officals are granting the offense multiple second tries.

I was more talking about his play since he was a rookie, he's slammed into the rookie wall and is not playing like he did first time around. He produces flashes but he's a shadow of himself IMO.

eagle eye

Here is Greg Beddard's take on the secondary during the Ravens game.

It’s a shame that Devin McCourty dropped an interception and had the late penalty (the other one was ticky-tack), because this was his best game in some time with four pass breakups, a pass defensed, and another good pass coverage. Great play by McCourty to knock away the pass to Smith on third and 15 late in the third quarter.

On the Ravens’ third-and-13 conversion that went to replay, McCourty has to find a way to stop Anquan Boldin shy of the marker. On the first touchdown to Torrey Smith, Kyle Arrington didn’t lay a hand on Smith. There’s no way he could run with him. The Pitta catch-and-run touchdown is on Gregory. Yes, McCourty was there as well, but McCourty is expecting Gregory to at least force Pitta to him. McCourty wasn’t expecting Gregory to tackle the ground.

On the 38-yarder to Smith in the third quarter, Patrick Chung failed to get back to his proper Cover-2 position in time after cheating up. Four missed tackles in this group. Not good.

http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/2012/09/25/patriot-defense-didn-look-revamped-first-test/XBfDqrQnykRaLYrcs7AjRN/story-1.html