The Breast Feeding Support Thread

Soooky

Congrats Baby4 and well done! Same thing here, I had C-section under general anaesthetic and they fed her formula at the start as I was so out of it! I was adamant that I wanted to bf so I persevered I won't lie, I did find the first few days in hospital stressful as I got so much contradicting info from the midwives and baby cried a lot but once I got home we flew it and ended up bfeeding for 13 months

As said previously, lots of skin on skin and try keep baby latched on a much as possible! Also, a nice midwife showed me how to hand express while baby was sleeping to help bring my milk in so maybe see if you can get someone to advise you on this!

Best of luck to you, you'll be grand :):)

spottybananas

Congrats Baby4. I had a section too and didn't get to attempt feeding or seeing baby until he was 30+ hours old, so they gave him formula for his first feed, after I had managed colostrum the night he was born. He was in special care and they were so helpful to me with feeding him, only giving him formula when I couldn't come to feed him (but would always mix it with anything I had expressed) or when he needed jaundice treatment. Stand your ground and look for positive advice/help there and you'll fly it if your baby is already latching well and everything

After a great start with feeding last week gp weighed my baby and said she was concerned he wasn't back to his birth weight after 2 weeks (but as above we had a shaky start with feeding and it wasn't consistent until he was released from scbu at 5 days old). He's to be weighed again this week and she said if he isn't back to his birth weight I have to supplement with formula, which I really don't want to do as this will then reduce my milk production etc. He's been feeding like crazy the last couple of days, and while he has a great latch the constant use/abuse has left my nipples stinging, no cuts or anything just sore from so much sucking.

Any advice on how I can help myself to keep up feeding at the rate he now wants? I have Lanolin cream and use milk on them but they sting like crazy now. And any tips for what to say to gp if she says I have to use formula? I really want to give it just another week even, he's definitely feeding enough for him (he lets me know in puking style if I try to feed him for longer than he wants), but obviously I don't want to come across as not wanting my baby to progress and put on weight.

bovril

spottybananas wrote:

Any advice on how I can help myself to keep up feeding at the rate he now wants? I have Lanolin cream and use milk on them but they sting like crazy now. And any tips for what to say to gp if she says I have to use formula? I really want to give it just another week even, he's definitely feeding enough for him (he lets me know in puking style if I try to feed him for longer than he wants), but obviously I don't want to come across as not wanting my baby to progress and put on weight.

Hi, I found the multimam compresses so much relief. Cut them in half and you can use one on each nipple. Also always check the latch is correct at every feed so no more damage is done.

They say it can take 3 weeks for a bf baby to get up to birth weight. I don't know how you'd go about telling your gp that though. I had to get my baby weighed every couple of days at the start until they could see an increase in the weight and then they left me alone. I went along to the local bf support group run by phns who are training to be lactation consultants. Can you get along to a local group run by one of the bf orgs and tell the gp that you are seeking support and to let you have another week? Keep up the good work. Sounds like you're doing a great job after a hard start.

spottybananas

His latch is definitely perfect every time, they made sure I got used to checking it in special care, but he just has a really strong suck so he sucks it way into his mouth and sucks so hard that eventually it just gets sore especially when he feeds often. Thanks, will try that.

Yeah I know myself that breastfed babies take longer to put on weight which is why it annoyed me that the gp was commenting on it, when just two days earlier the phn had weighed him and said he was fine. There's a local breastfeeding group (a few actually) but all really require driving and I can't drive for another 3 weeks. One might be close enough to walk to I just need to check when they are on if not I might see if my husband could nip out of work to drop me there or collect me, walking one way should be ok for me. I thought that might be the best plan alright if he is still under the gp's ideal weight, thanks again. It would be a shame to have it fall apart now when we did so well to beat the odds with c section, premature birth and not getting to feed him until the next day.

bovril

Be careful with the walking to in the early stages after a section too. Don't overdo it. I had a section myself and I used to have to get a lift with my dad to the local bf group. It is great being around people who know exactly what you're going through and who you can ask questions.

Edit: just thought of compressions. Look up jack Newman website for the video on compressions. This can give a little extra milk at the end of a feed which over the course of the day will help.

spottybananas

I've been walking a lot for my sanity and to lower my bp and I had to get moving fast after I had him to visit him in scbu, but yeah I dont overdo it. The one within walking distance isn't on until Thursday next week so no good really. Will concentrate on sorting the stinging for now.

tinkerbell

Spotty bananas, good work on getting started with the bf! However - what they told you is wrong. Your nipples should not hurt at all if the latch is correct so the latch is not. It's nothing to do with the suck being strong. Unfortunately the staff in hospitals seem to know sweet F all about correct latch, etc, and they advise so many women badly and the women end up feeding in pain for days / weeks on end. It is not supposed to be sore at all so you need to get it seen to by a professional lactation consultant.

Call one tomorrow morning and they'll come out to you probably the same day. I can't recommend calling in the pros more than enough - it's a completely new skill that you and baby are learning and a little bit of guidance goes a long way. I hadn't a clue what the feck I was doing at the start and God bless my LC, she got me sorted after a few visits. If I'd have listened to a certain few midwives in the post-natal ward, I wouldn't have lasted more than a few days bf'ing because they were so useless and pro-formula.

dekey

The most discouraging advice I was given before and at the start of breastfeeding was 'if it hurts, you're doing it wrong'. I had one nipple a different shape to the other, over supply, fast let down, my baby fed every 2 hours for an hour and 45 mins each time, I got a 15 min break before starting again and she had an incredibly strong suck and it hurt. For me it took weeks for my nipples to toughen up and gradually, day by day, they did. I think everyone is different and for some there's a period of adjustment and for others there isn't. Now, 8 months in it's the easiest thing in the world and I love it. I didn't shed one tear during a drug free labour but bf had me in tears regularly during the first few weeks. Pure stubbornness and a fear of blocked ducts and mastitis prevented me from quitting and I'm so glad I stuck it out and now have no intention of giving it up any time soon.

madeinamerica

I have to agree with dekey. It might not hurt for some, but for others the baby can be on right and it still hurts. It's a new thing happening to your nips, it's no wonder it might hurt the soft skin. It took my nips a while to toughen up, like you I'd a drug free birth but Jesus those first few weeks bf were worse. I spent a lot of time in tears and top less! Lovely! One thing that got me through was a couple of friends who had bf too told me that if would be tough but that it does get better. For me that is better to hear than it shouldn't hurt at all. And another friend who is a midwife said that before having her kids she would tell new mothers that it shouldn't hurt, but after bf her two she changed her advice! Where does it come from, the advice that it shouldn't hurt? Just out of interest.

I'm bf 8 months now and haven't looked back.

spottybananas

Thanks, he's definitely latched correctly as I had no pain at all for the last three weeks and its just in the last two days with him wanting feeding every hour or so that they are stinging. I can see to look at them that they are fine, just spending too much time wet so to speak and aren't used to it and it's sore! As he was in special care I was watched for every feed 24/7 for nearly a week by so many nurses and midwives, and while they had different advice every one of them including the breastfeeding guidance one said it was perfect. It's only the last two days of such frequent feeding that this started. Anytime he latches on badly I immediately take him off and start again, theres never "pain" from the beginning, but this sting starts up after he's fed a while (for the millionth time that day).

tinkerbell

Spottybananas, no harm to get the stinging checked out anyway for peace of mind as stinging could also mean thrush, etc.

The advice that it shouldn't hurt comes from any advice I've seen in a breastfeeding book or from an LC or from Jack Newman:

http://www.breastfeedinginc.ca/content.php?pagename=doc-MB

He says a few days of nipple discomfort at the start is normal but anything longer than 5-6 days should be checked out as if could be from something else.

dekey

I had the stinging too (like pins and needles times a hundred), I think it was to do with my let down, a minute or so after latching the milk would rush in and the stinging began. It only lasted a few seconds/minutes and then went and feeding was fine after that. Once my milk established (again 'advice' says 6-8 weeks but mine took much longer than that) I could still feel my milk let down but the stinging lessened. God, I remember it was such a strange sensation, it made me feel sick to my stomach. I could sometimes also feel it in the side I wasn't feeding from, those times I just lowered my top and let the milk drip out slowly onto a breastpad

spottybananas

tinkerbell wrote: »

He says a few days of nipple discomfort at the start is normal but anything longer than 5-6 days should be checked out as if could be from something else.

What I'm saying is though that I didn't have any discomfort at all from the start until now, it's only since he went from feeding every 3-4 hours to every 1.5-2 hours that it started. The left one seems to have acclimatised anyway so halfway there

lazygal

I had discomfort both times when establishing breastfeeding. I wouldn't go by the 'if it hurts you're doing it wrong' rule, because after a few days I was fine, and there was no need to adjust latch or any other problems. I had sections both times and feeding lying down and taking to the bed with baby for marathon feeds was a big help. Multimam cream was great, as was rubbing some milk in after a feed and letting the breasts air out!

For anyone reading this thread who has yet to give birth, please, please, please, make sure whoever is with you at the birth knows in advance that formula is not to be given unless there is a sound medical reason to do so. On my first I really hadn't a clue but I knew I wanted to breastfeed so I had my husband well prepped to stave off the offers of formula, which he had to do several times with nurses when I was in recovery. Second time he told them straight away not to mention formula as I would feed as soon as I was out of recovery, and they didn't mention it again. The nurses claimed first time that my baby needed a formula feed because she was getting upset from hunger, but really she wanted me and they are so tiny at birth that a small feed of colustrum does them.

RentDayBlues

lazygal wrote: »

For anyone reading this thread who has yet to give birth, please, please, please, make sure whoever is with you at the birth knows in advance that formula is not to be given unless there is a sound medical reason to do so. On my first I really hadn't a clue but I knew I wanted to breastfeed so I had my husband well prepped to stave off the offers of formula, which he had to do several times with nurses when I was in recovery. Second time he told them straight away not to mention formula as I would feed as soon as I was out of recovery, and they didn't mention it again. The nurses claimed first time that my baby needed a formula feed because she was getting upset from hunger, but really she wanted me and they are so tiny at birth that a small feed of colustrum does them.

Couldn't agree more! You are the mum and only you should say how your baby is fed. Once baby is happy, healthy, with wet/dirty nappys and gaining weight it doesn't matter that the GP/midwives/phns disagree. Growth charts are not exact.

First time around the staff were excellent in hospital and respected my wishes. Second time they were awful and ground me down, those 20mls she took still sit poorly with me which is ridiculous I know!

As lazygal said, be strong on your choice

madeinamerica

Sometimes, when I was sore from the frequency of feeds, I wished I had a spare boob!

madeinamerica

tinkerbell wrote: »

Spottybananas, no harm to get the stinging checked out anyway for peace of mind as stinging could also mean thrush, etc.

The advice that it shouldn't hurt comes from any advice I've seen in a breastfeeding book or from an LC or from Jack Newman:

http://www.breastfeedinginc.ca/content.php?pagename=doc-MB

He says a few days of nipple discomfort at the start is normal but anything longer than 5-6 days should be checked out as if could be from something else.

Thanks for the link. I guess I meant, what is the advice based on? Like, what reasons or evidence are there for it? It seems at odds with a lot of people's experiences.

Based on my own experience I'd agree with your last point except I wouldn't call is 'discomfort'!

Neyite

When you think about it, its no wonder that your nipples get sore with being constantly used and wet after being all nice and dry and behind a padded bra most of the time. Its like when you break out the flip-flops after being in boots the whole winter and your feet have softened up and then blister in sandals.

Further to what Lazygal said, nobody told me that day 2, baby is insatiable - a nurse gave me formula because 'he sounded hungry', despite constant breast feeding - I assumed she knew what she was talking about so I fed him with it. And he promptly puked back up again at me.

But the reason that they cluster-feed, is to encourage your supply. So, settle back into the pillows, put baby on the breast and allow yourself to be waited on hand and foot from your bed /sofa while your baby does their job, and do skin to skin in-between the cluster feeds.

I suspect its also our clever bodies also telling us to stay put with baby in order to recover from the birth a day or so instead of trying to do stuff we are not physically able for yet.

lazygal

I was wiser the second time-I sat under the baby for hours just letting him feed compared to first time where I kept wondering why she needed another feed. I found a lot of people try to be helpful but aren't familiar with the way breastfed babies feed and tried to give advice based on bottle feeding and schedules and how many ounces a baby should be drinking. Cluster feeding is normal. My now 20 month old still has times where he looks for a feed for comfort and would stay on for ages, depending on how busy I am and where we are this isn't always possible!

bobskii

people who don't understand breastfeeding have an obsession with knowing how many ounces the baby is getting!

tinkerbell

Or my favourite "but you'll never know how much baby is getting / is getting enough" :rolleyes:

By the way, my earlier comment about how it's not supposed to hurt is regarding the whole excruciating pain I hear of so many women enduring thinking that it's normal. There will obviously be some discomfort and soreness / pain at the start as your nipples aren't used to being sucked the bejaysus out of non stop and also at the start the latch is always off for a bit so it will be a bit sore. It's when I hear about women who tried to breastfeed for weeks while crying / squirming from this awful gut-wrenching pain that makes me so sad as they clearly needed help but couldn't get any. Excruciating pain that curls your toes is not normal but unfortunately so many women are told it is. There really is not enough support for breastfeeding in this country.

otwb1

I don't know how many people I've come across who told me that the midwives supplemented with formula in the hospital. Invariably they then went on to say that they had to give up breastfeeding as the baby wasn't getting enough. It's such a pity that there is not more support at the hospital - I was unbelieveably fortunate to have a wonderful midwife in the Coombe who asked me if anyone had warned me about the second night, that it would be hell, and who told me I was wonderful when the baby finally went to sleep for 30 mins after a full nights feeding (cue the Rocky theme tune in my head).

My second amazing experience was when lo was throwing up after feeds at about 10 days - I went to a GP who diagnosed gastroenteritis and who gave me a prescription for antibiotics and anti-emetics. I didn't give them to the baby as I didn't believe the diagnosis, the baby was happy and healthy and had wet nappies - he just projectile vomited after feeds. Sister who had three breastfed children said it was normal and GP #2 agreed. Then a babywearing consultant recommended that I call one of the Cuidiu volunteers. I had no idea that they existed and that you could call them for support.

Long story short - it pays to talk to people who do this day in, day out and be prepared to challenge medical advice if it just doesn't seem right at the time.

spottybananas

Phn weighed baby today, he's 3.54kg, up 350g in 9 days, well past his 3.38kg birthweight She told me to keep up the good work *beams*

Nead21

When I was feeding my now two year old I constantly heard "oh I couldn't feed mine as he/she was just so hungry". Funny that I've never met a baby that wasn't hungry!

I'm due baby number two in July and definitely won't be worrying constantly about weight gain this time. As long as they are feeding well pooping and peeing I'll be happy!

lazygal

Oh the old hungry baby line. Funny how Ireland is one of very few countries which sell "hungry" baby formula. I only recently saw someone advising rice in the baby bottles for a baby a few weeks old. She was a mum around my age, not of a generation that might have been told to do this. Unbelievable.

Nead21

Yeah the hungry baby formula baffles me. It's as if babies should all know to fall in line with a strict feeding schedule and if they dont and want to feed more often they are branded "hungry" and efforts have to be made to get them on track.

The fact that the rice in the bottle advise is still around is actually shocking though.

FurBabyMomma

Oh stop, night 2 was actually the night from hell for me. I'd had a section the previous morning, hadn't slept and baby cluster fed for 10 hours straight while I contracted and bled. All the midwives did was pop their heads in to see if I was alive, I got zero support. I rang my husband at 6.30am hysterical for him to come take the baby off me. My milk was in within 48hrs and the midwives didn't believe me as they thought after the section it would take longer.

In fairness feeding has been fine since then but at the time I felt that I was in a medieval scene where once you've given birth the mother doesn't matter any more. All I could think was it's a disgrace in the 21st century that maternity wards aren't set up so you can have your partner or support overnight. Instead you're just handed your brand new tiny person and expected to get on with it.

madeinamerica

FurBabyMomma wrote: »

Oh stop, night 2 was actually the night from hell for me. I'd had a section the previous morning, hadn't slept and baby cluster fed for 10 hours straight while I contracted and bled. All the midwives did was pop their heads in to see if I was alive, I got zero support. I rang my husband at 6.30am hysterical for him to come take the baby off me. My milk was in within 48hrs and the midwives didn't believe me as they thought after the section it would take longer.

In fairness feeding has been fine since then but at the time I felt that I was in a medieval scene where once you've given birth the mother doesn't matter any more. All I could think was it's a disgrace in the 21st century that maternity wards aren't set up so you can have your partner or support overnight. Instead you're just handed your brand new tiny person and expected to get on with it.

Sorry to hear about your ordeal, fbm. awful. Fair play on feeding your bubs and getting through all that!

FurBabyMomma

madeinamerica wrote: »

Sorry to hear about your ordeal, fbm. awful. Fair play on feeding your bubs and getting through all that!

Well all my plans for a natural birth had gone wrong but I was determined I'd have breastfeeding at all costs! It's just sad that the support isn't there though as that night nearly broke me. But 7 months later we're still going strong and feel very happy that it worked out. I wasn't a maternal person at all before I had her but I think bf has been amazing for bonding. I just love the closeness it brings.

madeinamerica

Have any of ye experienced being told to cover up when bf in public? How did you respond? Did it affect you? Last Saturday I was told for the first time to wear a cover when bf. I was at an expo in the convention centre in town. I had found a seat in a big corridor away from the main hall that was coincidentally behind a pillar (this centre is huge I had to walk a bit to find a seat). Ii used to wear a cover when out but I've got a lot better at bf so can do it quite discreetly without flashing. I had no massive amount of flesh on show with two tops and my son was wearing a floppy sun hat. One of the centre workers came along and was friendly then she said that to feed in the centre I had to use a cover. Fortunately I know that in this state it is the law that a woman can bf anywhere she is legally allowed to be and any incidental exposure of flesh is not deemed inappropriate. I told her this, in a nice way as she was being nice in her manner. She replied that her supervisor had told her this rule and that previously she directed a woman to a bathroom but her supervisor said its ok if women wear q cover. I said that her supervisor was mistakeb and that the rule was illegal. She said she' d google the law. It wasn't that i had anything on show, rather the fact that i was feeding him seemed to be an issue. She also seemed surprised that i was feeding a baby so big (8 months, hardly extended feeding). We actually had quite a friendly conversation about it, she wasn't hostile, but I felt unwelcome and uncomfortable. I stopped feeding him and moved away but by the time I'd got to the exit he wasn't happy as he hadn't fully fed. I found a seat near the exit (2 floors away from the woman) and finished feeding him but I was a bit upset and wary that someone else would kick me out. Later on I got a bit angry thinking about it, especially as she herself was a woman. Anyway, I partially wanted to vent! but also to hear if you've had any experiences? Thanks.