[US/IRL] 6x04 - "The Substitute" [** SPOILERS WITHIN **]

JesseCuster

8

Excellent episode, my favourite since "The Constant"!

Loved the numbers reveal in the cave - I had a feeling something big was about to happen.

Maybe the kid is Jacob reincarnated in Aaron's body (or is that just too confusing?!!)

Interesting that Kate was not one of the numbers, maybe she was always meant for a different role, i.e. Aaron's protector or "guardian angel"

heebusjeebus

8

The numbers is people....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Sp-VFBbjpE

the_monkey

4

just thinking ... Ilana said he can't (MIB/Smoky/Flocke) change his appearance now ....

but he appeared as Alex to Ben in "Dead is Dead" ??

Penn

the_monkey wrote: »

just thinking ... Ilana said he can't (MIB/Smoky/Flocke) change his appearance now ....

but he appeared as Alex to Ben in "Dead is Dead" ??

Unless she meant that he can't change now that Jacob is dead. But yeah I was wondering about this too

mcgooch

8

the_monkey wrote: »

just thinking ... Ilana said he can't (MIB/Smoky/Flocke) change his appearance now ....

but he appeared as Alex to Ben in "Dead is Dead" ??

he appeared as alex before jacob was killed. jacob's death must have changed the rules of whatever game it is they're playing imo.

Dymo

6

We need an Ilana flash back, she knows so much but how?

c0rk3r

For me this is a season too far

I enjoyed the reference to of mice and men, some of hurleys lines and the pilots one liner at the burial but its just not enough. At this point the revealation of what the numbers mean do nothing for me. Each number corresponding to a candidate to replace jacob at this stage i just dont care. I've no investment / interest in any of the characters anymore. Like sawyer i dont care if lock is dead, travelled in time, travelled back in time, is someone else, or the island is under water, in the sky, if jin finds sun etc etc

Like sawyer i just want this to end, get off the island and live a life without the drama or the frustrations that go with it. This whole thing could of been solved in season 3 if they just asked each other questions. For me this has gone on too long

homerun_homer

9

Username-in-use wrote: »

For me this is a season too far

For me this has gone on too long

Goodbye, good luck, Adios, sayonara, smell ya later, see you in the funny pages, yadda yadda

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

7

Username-in-use wrote: »

For me this is a season too far

I enjoyed the reference to of mice and men, some of hurleys lines and the pilots one liner at the burial but its just not enough. At this point the revealation of what the numbers mean do nothing for me. Each number corresponding to a candidate to replace jacob at this stage i just dont care. I've no investment / interest in any of the characters anymore. Like sawyer i dont care if lock is dead, travelled in time, travelled back in time, is someone else, or the island is under water, in the sky, if jin finds sun etc etc

Like sawyer i just want this to end, get off the island and live a life without the drama or the frustrations that go with it. This whole thing could of been solved in season 3 if they just asked each other questions. For me this has gone on too long

pretty much, there's still the chance of some quality tv being thrown in this season but the only reason I watch any more is because of how the show made me feel for the first couple of seasons. I'll be glad when it's over, although I may have to throw things at people who come out with 'best tv show evur' after the finale

uggy

8

I liked this episode. Unlike that droll we saw last week. Finally we are getting to the point where they're giving us some answers.

"Locke" is the smoke monster / man in black. He was being held captive on the island by Jacob and now with him out of the picture he can leave.

Couple of thoughts about the episode:

1. Smokey Locke was all about using the phrase "Don't tell me what I can't do" in front of that kid. But then when real Locke was talking to Rose about the getting a construction job, no matter how many times she set him up to use that line he never did. This concretes my theory that Locke wasn't always Locke but was Smokey Locke alot (if not all) of the time. Would like to see a list of people Locke said "Dont tell me what I can't do" to.

2. Blonde Kid - Arronn? Or little Jacob? Or the same people... I have to say I didnt notice the bleeding hand, wonder what thats about.

3. Sawyer is warming to Smokey Locke, big time. Wonder if he's gonna con him. The only other people you've seen him warm to are people he is trying to con (and Kate and Juliet I guess). Sawyer is most deff the type to only do something if it suits him. And he seemed to go along fairly easy. I know there was the line about Smokey Locke "not looking afraid", but still.

I like this side to whats going on at the moment. Really dugg on the cave scene at the end and the number, prob my favorite part of Lost and something to theorise on there. Hopefully some boffin can figure them out from here. Prob gonna have to wait 2 or 3 episodes before this story arch continues though

c0rk3r

homerun_homer wrote: »

Goodbye, good luck, Adios, sayonara, smell ya later, see you in the funny pages, yadda yadda

ehh ive watched this show religiously since the beginning im not going to stop watching it now. Im an addict, a hopeless addict that just wants closure.

Sad Professor

9

I thought we got an interesting insight into the Jacob/MIB conflict in this episode. And it seems pretty similar to the Jack/Locke conflict:

For 5 seasons, Locke has said (paraphrase): "This island is special, it is a place where miracles happen, we need to protect it. It was destiny that we came here, there's something we are supposed to do," etc.

While Jack has said: "It's just an island, and I'm sick of it, we need to get off it. There's no such thing as destiny, you're a fool, John, pressing the button is a joke", etc

Now listen to what the MIB has to say in this episode: "I'm trapped here. Jacob manipulated you like a puppet, your choices were never really your own. It's just a damn island, lets get the hell off it," etc.

Sounds just like Jack, doesn't it? Or how Jack used to be. I think Jack is now the new Locke and will fight on the side of Jacob against UnLocke, who ironically represents his old views. Unless that whole business with the bomb has caused Jack return to his old ways.

missingtime

7

Good episode. Interesting to see Ben admit he murdered him.

Liked how they portrayed the names and numbers.

I hope "Lockes'" outburst isn't a an answer the question "What is the island?". He kept saying it was just an island.

Psychedelic

7

Necronomicon wrote: »

It was also interesting to hear him say he wanted off the island - a lot of people (myself included) thought that when he referred to 'home' in last week's episode, he meant the temple.

I thought that fake Locke might have been talking about 'home' as off island alright, but I think he is just trying to trick Sawyer, but who knows.

uggy wrote: »

Would like to see a list of people Locke said "Dont tell me what I can't do" to.

http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Don%27t_Tell_Me_What_I_Can%27t_Do#.22Don.27t_tell_me_what_I_can.27t_do.22

uggy wrote: »

Sawyer is warming to Smokey Locke, big time. Wonder if he's gonna con him. The only other people you've seen him warm to are people he is trying to con (and Kate and Juliet I guess). Sawyer is most deff the type to only do something if it suits him. And he seemed to go along fairly easy. I know there was the line about Smokey Locke "not looking afraid", but still.

I love the idea that Sawyer could be setting up a long con on fake Locke. I think fake Locke is trying to con Sawyer to do whatever, so it would be a nice setup for Sawyer to con him instead.

homerun_homer

9

Username-in-use wrote: »

at this stage i just dont care. I've no investment / interest in any of the characters anymore.

Username-in-use wrote: »

ehh ive watched this show religiously since the beginning im not going to stop watching it now. Im an addict, a hopeless addict that just wants closure.

When I started watching Heroes it was entertaining nonsense but after a while I got sick of it and gave up (don't get me started on how stupid that show is). On the other hand I've a friend who continues to watch it, like you do with Lost because as long as it's on tv he has to see how it pans out, for good or bad because he invested the time in watching it so far.

I didn't tell you to stop watching the show, I'm just saying goodbye to you in this thread or bid you adieu to the "Whine about Lost thread" because we're not here to listen to people who have given up.

Nothing wrong with anyone announcing that they're throwing in the towel & don't care but you clearly have given up on the show and future feedback from this point will be redundant IMO. I come here to listen to fellow fans opinions and theories, those who haven't given up - whether it's a good review or bad, but if you've lost complete interest in the characters, situations and answers then who cares what you add here from now on.

If the show ends up disappointing me in the end then I'll be chatting to you in the Whine About Lost thread in a few months time.

Mr.Nice Guy

7

Meh. Wasn't a classic episode by any means. They answered a lot which I'll give credit for but for an episode centred around Locke I expected better and it was probably the weakest Locke-centric one. Very little drama and this 'ALT timeline' hasn't impressed me I must say.

The stuff with the boy Jacob (I'm assuming it was him) was a bit hokey.

What is looking likely is that Lost is in fact a game between two opposing sides.

Basq

8

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

What is looking likely is that Lost is in fact a game between two opposing sides.

Ah to be fair.. that's hardly a revelation!

It's been looking like that since season 1, episode 2 to be honest!

Two players. Two sides. One is light, one is dark.

Mr.Nice Guy

7

basquille wrote: »

Ah to be fair.. that's hardly a revelation!

It's been looking like that since season 1, episode 2 to be honest!

Well yes there were clues in season 1 and 2 but I think most people only copped on to it last season.

blue_steel

7

SIX WORDS: THE SHOW I LOVE IS BACK.
The tone of subtle menace that ran through this episode was spine-chilling... Terry O'Quinn and Josh Holloway with their best scenes together ever in the show... The numbers associated with the names on the roof of the cave... Definately a ten out of ten... Am going to watch again straight away.

ziggyman17

I think sawyer could be setting fake locke up for a long con..

I_am_LOST

Thought it was a great episode. My favourite since The Constant. Have read the whole thread and people have pretty much commented exactly what I was going to say.

The pieces are starting to come together, and there's still a lot of questions, and more questions are created each episode but I have faith they'll be answered.

I wonder, however, will they explain how Jacob and MIB got to the island?

Why does MIB want to leave so bad? He said "It's just an island. It doesn't need protecting" MIB has been on the island so long. Surely he can see it's not just an island but to quote Locke "a place where miracles happen"

That said, if I was a regular Lostie, I would probably be on MIB's side

Sad Professor

9

I love the Sawyer long con idea as well.

Also, does anyone have any thoughts on the idea that the island is basically a prison for MIB? He talked about being trapped. Given the negative view of humanity he espoused to Jacob in front of the statue, him getting loose on the world might uh, bad.

That's not to say he was lying about once being a man, but that's clearly not the case anymore. Whatever he is now he's dangerous.

Maybe Jacob is like the warden. So "protecting" the island may be about keeping MIB on it.

Just a possibility.

ToTheSea:

7

VolvicMinerial wrote: »

Liked they way they answered the question why they were carrying around Locke's body, simple but accurate.

I must have missed this. what was said?

I_am_LOST

Oh, and I know I should know this...but can somebody clarify what year the two timelines are in?

On island - still trying to get my head around this....?

Off island - Bomb goes off. Prevents Oceanic 815 ever crashing = ALT timeline. 2007?

Sad Professor

9

I_am_LOST wrote: »

Oh, and I know I should know this...but can somebody clarify what year the two timelines are in?

On island - still trying to get my head around this....?

Off island - Bomb goes off. Prevents Oceanic 815 ever crashing = ALT timeline. 2007?

On island - 2007

Off island - "alternate" 2004, but this may move around.

the_monkey

4

I watched it again, enjoyed it a lot more this time ... I would retract my original vote if i could !!!


anyway .... wondering, if John Locke does meet up with Jack in the
Alt. timeline, they would want to get a moveon with it ... since i believe
this is gonna dissapear soon.....

Also , I mentioned before regarding smokeys appearence ,
since he is stuck as John Lock now, what about Christian ??
or maybe he never was smokey ????

if not ... then what ????


JAcob ???? --- hmmmm just remembered that line Christian said in the Cabin "I can speak on JAcobs behalf...."


it's the mystery that makes this show great !!!

I_am_LOST

Sad Professor wrote: »

On island - 2007

Off island - "alternate" 2004, but this may move around.

Thanks, but what happened on island to transport them from 1977 to 2007. Did the bomb go off or not?

the_monkey

4

I_am_LOST wrote: »

Thanks, but what happened on island to transport them from 1977 to 2007. Did the bomb go off or not?

Seems it did and it didn't ... in the Alt timeline ... yes, as the island is "destroyed" and under the sea..... plane never crashes etc...

in the 2007 timeline, bomb didn't go off back in 1977 ... but something happened to dump 'em all conviently back to 2007

tok9

8

the_monkey wrote: »

it's the mystery that makes this show great !!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QJ2AHDmSI_g

Mr.Nice Guy

7

I want to know where Eloise and Widmore fit into all this.