Bipolar Disorder ask a question/discussion thread

PIOP

Congrats on quitting nesf, I hope you can keep it up. I know it will be rough in the short term, but in the long term, you'll be glad that you did. When you get stuck on a low for a long time, things can seem pretty awful, but hopefully it won't be too long before you can pull up a little and feel better.

I've had another med change from my doctor, changing from citalopram (celexa, citrol, etc.) to efexor xl. Given all the things I've heard about efexor, I'm a little apprehensive about it, but I'm going to do my best to put those worries aside, and hope that they won't affect me as badly as the citalopram did (epic levels of tiredness, regardless of mood). I'm scaling down on the citalopram now, on a half dose, and then I switch meds over the weekend, so it'll be a super fun time for me!

Anyone else here on efexor? Opinions?

nesf

PIOP wrote: »

Anyone else here on efexor? Opinions?

Have been on it. Didn't find it too bad. Nasty withdrawal effects coming off it alright but fine while I was on it so long as I didn't forget to take a dose (I was on 300mg though).

PIOP

Have been on Effexor for a few days now. Feeling a little less tired, so hopefully that will continue. Still definitely in the acclimatisation phase of things though, and have had headaches every day since I started. Today's headache feels a little migraine-ish, as it's accompanied by nausea and mainly focussed in one side of my head.

Still, I'm hopeful that this change will be good for me.

How's everyone else doing?

Bebs

I've bipolar myself and I'm on lamictol at the moment. I've found it to be great. It's my first time on medication but to me it's an improvement that I just couldn't imagine before I started the medication.

Are there any groups of bipolar people around Dublin?

George Orwell 1982

Aware lecture on bipolar disorder by Prof Patrick McKeon on Wednesday night: http://www.aware.ie/education/lectures/lectures/

nesf

Today was a meh day. That is all.

PIOP

Sometimes, I just hate not being normal, better.

I hate that things I can't control get the better of me, and then result in fights or squabbles.

Sometimes, I end up wishing so hard that I could be different that I just end up feeling like I'm a complete waste of time the way I am. Today is one of those times.

Mostly, I cope, but today, I'm not coping. Today, I hate that I can't control my babbling when I'm manic, and that it makes my friends hate me. I hate that one evening of even hypomania has ruined my plans for the week by making me a social outcast again.

Today, really, I just don't like myself very much at all.

Bebs

What do you define as yourself?

nesf

PIOP wrote: »

Sometimes, I just hate not being normal, better.

I hate that things I can't control get the better of me, and then result in fights or squabbles.

Sometimes, I end up wishing so hard that I could be different that I just end up feeling like I'm a complete waste of time the way I am. Today is one of those times.

Mostly, I cope, but today, I'm not coping. Today, I hate that I can't control my babbling when I'm manic, and that it makes my friends hate me. I hate that one evening of even hypomania has ruined my plans for the week by making me a social outcast again.

Today, really, I just don't like myself very much at all.

Tell me about it. Best thing is just to stop worrying about it and focus on making the best of what you have to work with.

nesf

Am finding this useful at the moment: http://www.findingoptimism.com/

It's mood charting software. Plenty of options and customisablity with the ability to add detailed notes for each day. Excellent for working with your psychiatrist or generally just keeping tabs on your triggers and how your mood has been doing over the past while compared to a few months back etc.

PIOP

@Bebs, I sometimes have trouble answering that question. While I don't want any illness to define me, it's hard to ignore it, especially when it affects my life so much. I've been honest with friends and family about the difficulties that I have, and while that has meant an increase in support, it also means that any stumbles are instantly considered part of the illness too. So, it can be a double edged sword, I think.

Most days, I get on fine. The last few times I've posted here though, I've been feeling pretty rough. I'm in the middle of a med change, and while the effexor are working much better for me in terms of fatigue and tiredness (namely, I'm no longer falling asleep all over the place, and all the time), I don't think the dosage is quite right yet, as emotionally, I've been a bit all over the place lately. Predominantly down, but periods of mixed too, where I've been raging, lashing out, hurting myself, etc.

I can usually keep a handle on it, using techniques from therapy and the like, but sometimes it gets too much. The meds helped a lot, but during this change period, I'm having to rely much more on myself, and that's tough.

Still, I'm determined to get through this. We'll adjust my dosage, and get me settled, and then I'll be back on track. In the mean time, I'll just have to hope that those around me will understand that, at the moment, I feel like half of my support system has suddenly dissolved into nothing.

Novella

Was only recently diagnosed, and was glad to finally have a diagnosis after years of mental health issues. It's funny though, I expected that things would get better, but everything has simply gone downward.

I stopped going to work and college during a huge low, spending days and days in bed, pretending the real world didn't exist. Then following that, and in a phase of, "Ah, everything will be grand!", let some debts mount. I am now in a bad place financially which is adding huge stress.

I feel I can't really talk to anyone because it's so difficult for people to understand without firsthand experience. I hate myself for being this person because I can't imagine what it must be like to be my family, or my friend. All anyone can say is that everything will be okay, and I love them all so much for their support, but I've no idea if I'll ever make it through this.

Bebs

PIOP wrote: »

@Bebs, I sometimes have trouble answering that question. While I don't want any illness to define me, it's hard to ignore it, especially when it affects my life so much. I've been honest with friends and family about the difficulties that I have, and while that has meant an increase in support, it also means that any stumbles are instantly considered part of the illness too. So, it can be a double edged sword, I think.

Most days, I get on fine. The last few times I've posted here though, I've been feeling pretty rough. I'm in the middle of a med change, and while the effexor are working much better for me in terms of fatigue and tiredness (namely, I'm no longer falling asleep all over the place, and all the time), I don't think the dosage is quite right yet, as emotionally, I've been a bit all over the place lately. Predominantly down, but periods of mixed too, where I've been raging, lashing out, hurting myself, etc.

I can usually keep a handle on it, using techniques from therapy and the like, but sometimes it gets too much. The meds helped a lot, but during this change period, I'm having to rely much more on myself, and that's tough.

Still, I'm determined to get through this. We'll adjust my dosage, and get me settled, and then I'll be back on track. In the mean time, I'll just have to hope that those around me will understand that, at the moment, I feel like half of my support system has suddenly dissolved into nothing.

I've taken the opposite approach myself. I won't discuss the situation with anyone but my siblings. Even my parents are in the dark. I refuse to have people second guess me because I'm bipolar and I refuse to have it available as an excuse for myself. I feel like it's my own cross to bear and perhaps that's an unhealthy attitude but it's just how I feel.

'm on lamictol and I've found it to be working for me. What sort of therapy do you undergo? I'm interested in the different types of therapy as I'd like to give it a try myself.

blue5000

Hi Nesf

Just wanted to say thanks for all the posts here, it seems june and july have been tough times for a lot of ppl to get through, hope things are gettin better for you.

blue

nesf

Insomnia is a bitch. I'd really like to get some sleep soon.

nesf

So possibly developing serotonin syndrome on Lexapro, not good. Dose being cut etc.

Ah, the joys of juggling multiple medications.

PIOP

Oh no, I'm sorry to hear that nesf. Juggling meds really can be a pain, especially when there are just so many side effects (and side effects that you can't tell whether they're drug or disease created!).

Hope you can find the right balance soon with your doc.

I'm doing pretty okay on Effexor. A rough few days at first, very emotional and uncontrolled, but now things have settled a bit. I'm much less tired, and am functioning much better now, so it appears that the crippling tiredness was due to the other meds. We (me & doctor) are just going to keep monitoring things for now on my current dose, and see how it goes for another month or two, and then we'll revisit and look at how things are.

irishbipolar

Hi,

First post to this thread....

I am a 38 year old male with BP. I got diagnosed 10 years ago. Between 1994 and 2005 I have had 5 stays in St Pats - 4 times I was admitted with major disphoric elations and the last time I admitted myself with depression. All-in-all I reckon I have been affected by BP for over 20 years.

I live alone (except for a few dogs). The only stable support I have is my elderly parents (and with their age they have their own problems) and sometimes from my siblings. For the majority of the day I am on my own. I don't work - the last time I had a job was 2004. In fact I can't see myself ever working again. Over the years I have lost all my friends. Basically I have become a recluse. I get panic attacks in public particualarly if I meet someone from my past.

The question I want to ask you is this: I had a session with my doctor last week and he arranged for me take part in the bipolar programme in St Pats. I have an accessment on Monday and potentially could start next Thursday. But I am scared. During my previous times in St Pats I have been on progammes similar to this. It involves group sessions (which I have panic attacks in if I have to speak) and other group meetings. I am not sure I can do this?

Has anyone done this programme in St Pats recently? What is it like?

I have got to the stage where my meds have stablised over the last 3 months and in the last month my mood is alot better (I think but can't say for sure.). But is this as far as I can go? I remember asking my doctor last year about the percentage of his patients that struggled with their BP. He said he didn't know the percentage exactly but he said it was quite high. And a large proportion of his patients struggled. Am I one of those? Sometimes I feel the more I push myself to make something out of my life, i.e. this programme, the more ill I get. Maybe I have to accept this is as far as I can go? Because I have BP the only way I can cope with life is by being a recluse?

What do you think?

Thanks.

PIOP

Hi irishbipolar, welcome to the thread.

I'm only recently diagnosed myself, but have been symptomatic for much longer - probably my whole life, if I'm honest.

I haven't done the St. Pats program, so I can't give specific advice about that, but I do also have many anxiety related issues, so maybe I can advise there. In general, I struggle with anxiety quite a lot (although I'm better these days), and when I'm on an upswing, the anxiety can sometimes become crippling. I've had panic attacks over clothes, shopping, to-do lists, etc. Sometimes I can't even decide on the simplest things because the anxiety literally prevents me from doing so.

I recently finished a year of fairly intensive CBT (weekly sessions, lots of homework, etc) which I found helped me with my anxiety quite a lot by providing me with "ammunition" to combat the anxiety. I learned various calming techniques, and worked with my therapist to test my anxiety levels, to begin to combat my anxiety (starting at the bottom with the little stuff, and working my way up). Have you ever tried or considered something like that? I won't lie and say that it was easy - it was sometimes very difficult - but I do feel it has helped me, and while I'm not totally free of the anxiety yet, I don't suffer from panic attacks so often any more, and I'm better at recovering from them when they do happen.

I can understand feeling a bit hopeless about the diagnosis and your future - I've often felt that way, particularly in low patches when we were still tinkering with my meds. I've wondered if all I'll ever be is what the meds make me, if I'll ever manage without them, etc. I've wondered if the BP will get in the way of things I want to do in life, if all I can hope for is what I have and nothing more. Going to therapy helped me in that respect, although I still do have some fears with relation to my future and the role that my mental health will play in it.

I'm sure that you can find some stability, and progress, and that you just have to find the right mix for you, both in terms of meds, and non-medical support, such as therapy, groups, etc. Finding the right meds will help a lot - I went through some very rough times while trying to find the right meds, but I finally feel like I'm on the right track with this bunch. I wish there was an easier way to find out what meds work and what ones don't, but as you know well yourself, trial and error is the only way really. It's disheartening, I know, to find that the meds aren't working, are making you worse, or are crippling you with side effects, but I'm confident that you will find something that helps, because there are a lot of options out there.

As for the group, if it helps, try your best to get out and go to it. Perhaps it would be worth mentioning your anxiety when you go to talk to them about the group - maybe they can arrange individual counselling or attendance at an anxiety management group concurrent with the BP group to help you get the most out of it. If not, perhaps you could organise something yourself? I know it won't be easy - I sat outside my first CBT appointment for 45 minutes before I could convince myself to go inside, and even then, I told no one I was going and wasn't sure I'd ever go again - but if you can find someone that you can work with, I think it could really help you.

I hope you're doing ok at the moment, and feel free to post back or message me if you want to talk more, and I'll do my best to answer and help if I can.

irishbipolar

Hi PIOP,

Thanks for getting back and for your very helpful advice & support.

Its Monday evening 16/8 and I have only just read your message. Well the good news is I managed to pluck up the courage to go to St Pats today. I thought I was only going for an accessment but it turned out I was enrolled in a foundation course for the week - starting today. There was only one other person on the foundation course which made speaking in the group a bit easier. I was nervous going into the hospital as it brought back alot of bad (and scary) memories.

So as I sit here typing this I feel knackered - I am not use to been out & about (I have become such a recluse) - plus the group sessions today have tired me out. At the same time I have started to feel a bit optimistic. Maybe the tweek in the meds my doc made just might be working? Maybe I can work out my strenghts & weaknesses at last and at the same time recognise my limitations? Maybe I can make a go of my life after all? Maybe I don't have be to a recluse after all? Maybe at last I can manage my moods and my bipolar?

Alot of questions. Hopefully some will come true.

Anyways after the foundation course this week, there will be group meetings one day a week for the next 12 weeks. Hopefully with the help of this therapy I can turn things around.

PIOP, thanks again for your message and for your offer of future support.

EDIT just after re-reading my post, I hope I am not falling into the same trap. I remember a couple of years ago I did some CBT. After the first CBT session I was "full" of myself thinking I had "turned the corner". After 4 sessions I realised there was alot of work ahead, my bubble burst, I told myself I couldn't do it and I stopped going to CBT. I was back to sqaure 1.

I think I need to take a slow-slow approach this time around.

PS Just read some of the previous posts on this thread from various board members. It seems like alot of people are struggling with BP - med changes, etc. I know I am only new to this thread but if I can help in some way or offer some support........

PIOP

Hi again.

I'm really glad that you got up the courage to go ahead to the meeting, and that you were able to cope with it even though it wasn't what you expected. I hope that the therapy will help.

I know what you mean about the bubble bursting, and all that. I had periods of time where I was great for a little while, was sure the cbt and meds were working, and then something happened to set me off and I felt like I was back to square one, either down so much that I could do nothing, or manic, raging, screaming and shouting, hurting myself, shopping in the middle of the night, etc. It was hard to come to terms with the ongoing nature of it at first, and the fact that, in order to combat my anxiety in particular, I was going to have to be in situations that made me anxious.

Go at whatever speed you feel is best for yourself, and if you have a set-back, remember that you're not really back at square one. Square one was back when you were unmedicated, and doing nothing to solve your problems, and since you're trying, then you're not really back there at all.

Sorry if that sounds a bit "hallmark card", but it's what I think. I sometimes struggled a lot with talking in therapy, not knowing what to say or trying to hide things. It wasn't always easy, but I'm glad I got through it because things are better now.

If it gets rough, talk to someone. If not to your group, to us, and we can try to help you stick at it, so that you can get as much benefit as you can from it all.

On a personal note, I'm still doing mostly ok. Have been a bit down, but that's partly my own fault for torturing myself by reading books with quirky and wonderful romances that all work out for the best, and then kicking myself because I haven't found that yet and don't know if I ever will. That's probably the part of my psyche that I have to work hardest on - the idea that, despite how I often feel about myself, other people value me and care about me. Whenever I feel even the slightest bit down, it's tough for me to remember that, and so the idea of having some sort of romantic date or long-term partner seems a million miles away, and that makes me feel worse again.

To combat it, I'm trying to stay focussed on the fact that I have friends and family, so I'm not as alone as I think I am, and the fact that I chose not to get into a relationship right now, even though there are people who want to be with me. It's mostly working, but sometimes it's hard to totally drown out that voice inside that's telling me I'm not worth it. Of course, I know I have to be careful now, because I've been down this road before, and it doesn't usually end well - either I fight with, and drive away, my close friends, or I end up getting into a relationship or other sort of encounter with someone who I don't really care for, and then hating myself for it afterwards, and hating myself for making them think that I feel something for them when that's not really the case at all. I need to make sure I don't go down that road, as it's just so damaging, personally, professionally, and in every other way too.

So, no starting up flaky relationships now that I'm feeling mixed up and needy. Now is the time to remember all that work in CBT, to remember that I am worth a damn, and that I don't need to have some sort of ridiculous one night stand or fling to prove that.

PIOP

So, lately, I have mostly been thinking about two things.

1) Checking myself into a&e because

2) I've been planning ingenious ways to kill myself.

Things are not good. In moments of lucidity, I think about checking myself in somewhere, just going to the hospital and telling them that I'm going to kill myself if they don't stop me. But more often, I'm thinking about how I'll do it, and that the resolution to do it is making me strangely calm.

I feel like I'm going to burst out of my head.

I haven't got a life plan, but I have a plan.

Things are odd right now.

LegacyUser

Hi PIOP,
Please talk to someone who can help. Is there a therapist or doctor you can talk to about this? Don't give up and remember that there are people who care about you and unfortunately this is just one of those down sides of bipolar and you can and will get through it.

nesf

Go talk to your GP PIOP. They should be your first point of call if you're feeling this way, they're in a decent position to determine whether you need to check yourself in for a while or not.

PIOP

Sorry to bring this thread onto such a downer, I'm just feeling really unstable at the moment, and it's prompting all sorts of unpleasant thoughts and feelings.

I know I should go to my doctor, or call my therapist, but part of me simply can't handle the idea of being a failure again. I've been doing so well lately, but in the last week, I've just destabilised completely and have been spiralling down ever since, and I'm not even sure I know why.

I just want to succeed at this, and stop being a failure, and every time I can't keep a handle on this, I feel like a total failure. And for me, having to admit that I'm anything less than perfect is like pulling teeth.

I feel really on edge at the moment, and genuinely unstable. I can feel my moods changing and tipping all over the place, and it's no good. I'm not even consistently up or down for a whole day - one minute, I'm convinced I'm going to enter and win a bunch of competitions, the next, I'm planning fool-proof ways to kill myself. I'm just all over the place at the moment, and feeling very desperate, and alone.

I wish, as ever, there wasn't such a stigma about mental illness, and that I could talk to my friends about how I'm feeling, but this time, I don't think I can.

LegacyUser

Hi PIOP,
No you are not a failure. You sound like a very decent & honest person who is going through a bad time again. You will get through this. Your friends, family, GP and therapist I'm sure want to be there for you. Please contact them, explain how you are feeling.

irishbipolar

Hi PIOP,

I am really sorry to hear you are going through a rough time. I have been in this position before and like the last post, the best advice I can give is to talk a friend, someone in your family, your GP or your therapist. Don't keep this to yourself. There are people out there who want to help. You were very supportive to me when I posted on this thread for the first time recently. Your advice and suport was very helpful. Likewise there are people out there who want to help you. There is nothing wrong in looking for that help. Please, please, please look for that help - don't keep it to yourself.

PIOP

Hi guys,

Well, I'm still here (just about). I talked to a friend of mine (albeit because I was giddy as heck because I was so pleased with the cleverness of my suicide plan) and we got down into it. Long story short, he drove me to the doctor, and sat with me while I waited, and went in with me and helped me to tell the doctor everything.

I was certified unfit for work for a few days, my med dose has been doubled, and I've been trying to deal with all of the above now for the last few days. I'm feeling a little better now - not 100% yet, but no longer wanting to kill myself, so that's a definite improvement. I'm feeling a little more stable at the moment, although there's definitely fragility still there.

I'll be seeing my doc again in the next few days to review the situation, to make sure things are ok and that I don't take a turn for the worse.

Now that I'm feeling a little better, I'm looking back at the last week or so and seeing my spiral downward, and it's a little creepy and scary. I was literally giggling with excitement as I told my best friend about how I was going to kill myself, and at the time, I saw absolutely nothing wrong with it, or nothing to stop me doing it. As far as I was concerned, it was a perfect solution, and I was so glad I had thought of it. I was so unstable, and so close to doing something very silly.

It feels a bit like I'm looking back at someone else - I don't even remember fully everything that I've done, and it seems so far removed from what I'd consider my "normal" behaviour, and yet, it was me.

It just serves to show me that I can't get too complacent while we're still trying to work out a program of meds and therapy that works for me, or I'll end up in big trouble. I hope that the next time I spiral, someone recognises that it's happening, in case I don't

PBBPD

Hi,

I've recently been diagnosed with bipolar disorder and have started treatment on Valproate. I've only been taking it for a week but don't seem to have any major side effects. I'm pretty depressed at the moment, can't see my way out of this situation etc.

I had a pretty serious manic episode before while working in the US and moved back here because of it - I chalked it up to a breakdown from work though and have been ignoring/hoping against the diagnosis for the past three years.

I was very depressed last year and took Lexapro for a while, which I think may have lead to my recent manic episode. I ended up losing my new job because of it and am a bit all over the place.

I was on to St. Pat's and would really like to use this time to take the Bipolar Programme and was wondering if anyone had experience with it.

Thanks for all the posts by the way - I've found them extremely helpful.

Also, I'd really like to attend a group session for people with BPD in Dublin if anyone knows of any. I've gone to an Aware session which was alright but most of the people there suffered from depression exclusively.

Any thoughts or advice would be most welcome.

rhonda15

PBBPD wrote: »

Hi,

I've recently been diagnosed with bipolar disorder and have started treatment on Valproate. I've only been taking it for a week but don't seem to have any major side effects. I'm pretty depressed at the moment, can't see my way out of this situation etc.

I had a pretty serious manic episode before while working in the US and moved back here because of it - I chalked it up to a breakdown from work though and have been ignoring/hoping against the diagnosis for the past three years.

I was very depressed last year and took Lexapro for a while, which I think may have lead to my recent manic episode. I ended up losing my new job because of it and am a bit all over the place.

I was on to St. Pat's and would really like to use this time to take the Bipolar Programme and was wondering if anyone had experience with it.

Thanks for all the posts by the way - I've found them extremely helpful.

Also, I'd really like to attend a group session for people with BPD in Dublin if anyone knows of any. I've gone to an Aware session which was alright but most of the people there suffered from depression exclusively.

Any thoughts or advice would be most welcome.

I was diagnosed in the States when I worked there as suffering from bipolar disorder 5 years ago. Around the same time I moved home when I lost my job as a result of bipolar and selfmedicating my episodes through alcohol (a very bad idea).
Since then it's been tough to find the right drug combinations - epilim and lustral seem to work for me. Also I take omega 3 oil and vitamin b complex which also helps.

It can be difficult but with the right kind of support and the right medication life for me is quite tolerable mostly and often quite good.

Take heart - you are just beginning to come to grips with this disorder and every case is different. Finding the right doctor/counsellor you feel comfortable with is very important. Take it one day at a time (a cliche I know) but one of my self imposed obstacles is the impatience I feel with myself.

Sorry I don't have experience with the bipolar programme you speak but it sounds promising - I wish there were something like it in my area.