Exam Results - Delayed (Mod Warning: Post #383 & #420)

CheesedOff

west101 wrote: »

I Think this would be an effective method with something along the lines of the waterford crystal visitor centre protest some time ago with protestors taking shifts.

I agree, it would definitely make people sit up and listen. Unfortunately I can't do it midweek but would be more than happy to do it weekends should this be something that is considered.

KeelanM90

CheesedOff wrote: »

I think blocking off all exits from the car park is a fantastic idea, I will definitely be out to join in for that (is that beginning tomorrow or wed evening?)
Have we any way of reaching those final year students on placement? So that they can take part. Can a message go up on the facebook site if the picket is going ahead at the carpark exits?

Judging by tonights meeting, do you think this is likely to be dragged out over a long period? There is so much at stake for final year students if this happens.

No dates are given yet but as soon as is known class reps will be notified through text! Chances are nothing but press releases will happen tomorrow as there is so much to organize!

Its impossible to tell how long it will go on for, it really is out of our control, but from tonights meeting one thing that stood out was the officers driving the point that if we do want an improvement we must make ourselves loud and clear!

CommsGirl

Hi Folks.

I was an attende at the Student Union meetings tonight. I wont tell you who I am but what I can tell you is the Student union are working their hardest to make sure that T.U.I. and the Board of Management realise just how difficult the students are finding this whole wage debacle and also how much it is affecting the Students who will be leaving this year. I know that the SU is working hard to put a plan of action into place. We are hoping to have Wed as our day to put the plans we have into action. Please do not hink that the SU are not behind you because they are and as a student myself I do symphatise with you all over this current debacle.I would ask you all to talk to your class Reps and go into the Student union and talk to them about how you can help.

MitchKoobski

CommsGirl wrote: »

Hi Folks.

I was an attende at the Student Union meetings tonight. I wont tell you who I am but what I can tell you is the Student union are working their hardest to make sure that T.U.I. and the Board of Management realise just how difficult the students are finding this whole wage debacle and also how much it is affecting the Students who will be leaving this year. I know that the SU is working hard to put a plan of action into place. We are hoping to have Wed as our day to put the plans we have into action. Please do not hink that the SU are not behind you because they are and as a student myself I do symphatise with you all over this current debacle.I would ask you all to talk to your class Reps and go into the Student union and talk to them about how you can help.

hi carol!

CommsGirl

I am sorry but I dont think I know of any Carol. But if I meet her I will tell her you said Hello.:D

CommsGirl

I am sorry but I dont think I know of any Carol. But if I meet her I will tell her you said Hello.:D

Ah-Watch

KeelanM90 wrote: »

Another was to go and block off the car park at 5 o clock in the evening by creating a picket at each gate and hold it until about 8 o clock every evening causing obvious disturbance to both WIT management and TUI members!

May leave the car at home so, would've thought that would p!ss the students off too though and what would that gain us?

CommsGirl

Blocking the cars from leaving would make the lives of the teachers a little bit inconvient and it would make them see that the students are not going to allow the TUI and WIT treat us like pawns in their dispute. The students need to realise that striking is not an option that would be of any benefit to us at this stage in the game. We the students need to make a stand and if blocking cars for a few hours makes the lives of the people involved in us not getting our exams results a little inconvient then so be it. As I have said many times before (but not on here) we need to have our voices heard and take direct action.

CommsGirl

Can I just say to all the people who are stating that the SU officers are tip toeing around the board of Management of WIT that you are all way off base. They are not doing anything of the sort. As for the trip to Boston, as another poster said the SU officers will be furnishing the college and indeed anyone who asks with a report on what they saw and learnt to make this college ie WIT a better college. The trip was planned and booked for before this whole debacle was even on the radar and cancelling the trip would have wasted money already spent. Everyone is entitled to an opinion but to say that the SU officers are not doing their jobs is so way of base. I am really annoyed by the implications that have been written by some on here tonight. Our and I mean our SU are a good if not great SU who are currently in the SU offices working on plans of action on what to do about this whole debacle that has enveloped are college. So instead of attacking the officers in the SU why not work with them to bring a solution to the table and help with the plan of action that needs to be taken. If you think you can do a better job than the officers currently in office then put your money where your mouth is and come election time nominate yourself for elections and see if you have the support to go all the way.

MitchKoobski

okay so wait...now its Students vs WITSU vs TUI vs WIT apparently.....ive lost all track of this.

KeelanM90

Ah-Watch wrote: »

May leave the car at home so, would've thought that would p!ss the students off too though and what would that gain us?

Ah dude. . .
Don't tell me your drivin from templars??
I suppose it'll only p!ss the students off that aren't interested in their results anyway

CommsGirl

No it's not like that. I am just defending the SU's honour against people who seem to think that the SU officers are somewhat afraid of the WIT Board of Management. They are not and are very much on the side of the students in this whole debacle.

Sully

CommsGirl wrote: »

No it's not like that. I am just defending the SU's honour against people who seem to think that the SU officers are somewhat afraid of the WIT Board of Management. They are not and are very much on the side of the students in this whole debacle.

Fantastic but we are trying to avoid creating this topic about the union. So, if you would do us a favour and stick with the main topic at hand? Just to keep things in order.

Thanks.

thejanitor

I was at the meeting also today.

First off I feel it must be said that the comments made by the student union president were highly unprofessional towards lecturers and the general student body. Resorting to name calling seems like a poor attempt of engaging the support of others. This should be apologised for.

I am a student at WIT for some time now in a private capacity and must pay a full fee with no support from the government. My fees can total to €4,500.00 in the year and yes I am very much annoyed at the fact that I will not have my results on Tuesday as planned.

What we all must be aware of is the fact that each and every student is a customer of WIT. The college is paid for an educational service partially by the student and partially by the government. If the service provider, in this case WIT, experiences problems delivering the paid for services, then it is up to them to ensure that the situation is resolved.
To look at this another way it would be the exact same as taking your car to a garage to get new tyres, but the garage has outsourced its tyres to another company which is in despute over unsettled monies, it is up to the garage to provide the service paid for by means of settling the dispute or proceeding with other arrangements.

Under no circumstances is it up to the customer to persue the outsource partners or in WIT's case the lecturers. This is an internal matter and must be left to internal affairs to deal with. What I am saying is that if any pressure needs to be applied, then it should be applied to the College authorities and not the lecturers.

I have spoken to most of my lecturers about the dispute and all of them are frustrated that they are not allowed to issue our results to us because of union obligations. Remember also that a large portion of WIT lecturers are students themselves continuing education and realise how upsetting it is not to have your results. However all of them are being fair and giving us indications of how we done without having to push for it. These people want to see you do well just as much as you do. They are not using you as pawns, they are simply witholding service while there are monies outstanding, just like the phone company cutting you off for 2 overdue bills

I must stress that I am not a lecturer but have enough cop on to absorb the situation and process it instead of shouting my mouth off in the auditorium (no offence to the good points made - guy with the laptop in particular)

I know of at least 3 different situations where lecturers have not issued results to sturggling students, but did tell them that they need to put in a bit more effort this semester. They are really trying and if you treat them with some dignity and respect while the LRC and the college sort this mess out, you will see that they will give you an indication on how your are doing.

Well done to all the good points made tonight.

AdMMM

they are simply witholding service while there are monies outstanding, just like the phone company cutting you off for 2 overdue bills

Horrible, horrible analogy. Our bills aren't overdue..

I have spoken to most of my lecturers about the dispute and all of them are frustrated that they are not allowed to issue our results to us because of union obligations. Remember also that a large portion of WIT lecturers are students themselves continuing education and realise how upsetting it is not to have your results.

I think most of your lecturers are lying to you. It's easy for them to say they're frustrated at union directives when it was a secret ballot...



Things seemed to have developed very fast here tonight. Am I right in thinking that there's going to be no strike but we are going to be protesting publicly? I really hope my class rep went to this meeting so they can fill us all in tomorrow but I don't exactly have high hopes given that we had a two hour break at the end of the day...

thejanitor

AdMMM wrote: »

Horrible, horrible analogy. Our bills aren't overdue..



I think most of your lecturers are lying to you. It's easy for them to say they're frustrated at union directives when it was a secret ballot...

The analogy reflects the lecturers stopping service to the college. Apparently the lecturers have not been paid for summer 09 papers and also the current winter 09 paper.

Be it a secret ballot or not. No
Lecturer will go against their
union ruling. And i do know that the majority of lecturers out there that want to give results but cant.

2Bv¬2B

thejanitor wrote: »

First off I feel it must be said that the comments made by the student union president were highly unprofessional towards lecturers and the general student body. Resorting to name calling seems like a poor attempt of engaging the support of others. This should be apologised for.

Agreed,

Sully

Just to clarify.. They have been paid for summer and autumn exams, just not their full rate. Hence the dispute.

As for Christmas exams, well they would have not been paid by now anyway I do believe.

sashafierce

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jonsey

sashafierce wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Have they not taken two or three big pay cuts already?

Income Levy
Increased Income Levy
Pension Levy
Reduced pay in last budget

dlofnep

I got many issues clarified today.

The heart of the issue is not the pay itself, but the fact that the college did not follow protocol, and cut the pay without informing the lecturers. All the lecturers I've spoken to aren't opposed to a pay cut itself, and understand the economic climate - They are in dispute with the fact that the college did not follow procedure.

When the lecturers lodge an appeal on an issue such as this, the college is supposed to roll back the status quo until the issued is resolved. The college has not done this, so the lecturers will not discuss the issue with the college until they have followed protocol. They feel that the college itself has disrespected them by basically placing something on them without a discussion first.

So with that being said - We should be protesting against WIT management, as they seem to be the one who have broken protocol and caused all this in the first place. If they rolled back the status quo, like they are supposed to until the appeal is resolved - then the lecturers would engaged with them and resolve it ASAP.

If any of the above is wrong - please correct me, but I got this straight from the horses mouth.

sashafierce

This post has been deleted.

shapez

dlofnep wrote: »

I got many issues clarified today.

The heart of the issue is not the pay itself, but the fact that the college did not follow protocol, and cut the pay without informing the lecturers. All the lecturers I've spoken to aren't opposed to a pay cut itself, and understand the economic climate - They are in dispute with the fact that the college did not follow procedure.

When the lecturers lodge an appeal on an issue such as this, the college is supposed to roll back the status quo until the issued is resolved. The college has not done this, so the lecturers will not discuss the issue with the college until they have followed protocol. They feel that the college itself has disrespected them by basically placing something on them without a discussion first.

So with that being said - We should be protesting against WIT management, as they seem to be the one who have broken protocol and caused all this in the first place. If they rolled back the status quo, like they are supposed to until the appeal is resolved - then the lecturers would engaged with them and resolve it ASAP.

If any of the above is wrong - please correct me, but I got this straight from the horses mouth.

Bang on. Imagine it takes over a half dozen pages and the finger has been pointed at the wrong people all the time. Same issue with the Bankers we're having. Ordinary clerical officers in a bank getting spat on because the Executives are spending hard earned money from the public.

thejanitor

Any sign of this "Huge Media Blitz" that everyone spoke of yesterday. No sign of it on any news items so far?

2Bv¬2B

thejanitor wrote: »

Any sign of this "Huge Media Blitz" that everyone spoke of yesterday. No sign of it on any news items so far?

I believe it is supposed to start Wednesday 12-1 or 12-2 I believe,

KeelanM90

thejanitor wrote: »

Any sign of this "Huge Media Blitz" that everyone spoke of yesterday. No sign of it on any news items so far?

You do realize this was decided on about 16 hours ago? It takes time to organize such things and make sure that our views are accurately reflected

Sully

KeelanM90 wrote: »

You do realize this was decided on about 16 hours ago? It takes time to organize such things and make sure that our views are accurately reflected

It doesn't take that long, to be fair. They should be all over local radio by now. But, since they have a load of other work to do - I assume this has not been given the full attention yet.

YFG continues to work on this with local and national media on a daily basis, so its not completely lost thankfully.

Sully

2Bv¬2B wrote: »

I believe it is supposed to start Wednesday 12-1 or 12-2 I believe,

Ill be getting the schedule in the next hour or so. Once I have it, I will publish it here.

jonsey

jonsey wrote: »

Have they not taken two or three big pay cuts already?

Income Levy
Increased Income Levy
Pension Levy
Reduced pay in last budget

We are being punished for one of two reasons (depending on how you look at it):

1. The lecturers don't want another pay cut (or not a 50% one in the exam money anyway) and are not willing to budge or
2. The lecturers wanted to negotiate the size of the pay-cut on a pro rata basis as outlined earlier and the college refused, saying that it was 50% or nothing.

So it's either the lecturers fault for wanting what they think they deserve (after taking pay cuts already that you seem to have forgotten about) or the manegement's fault for not negotiatiing with them, cutting it without informing them, going outside of the grievance procedures, etc.

It's a polarising matter and as with all such matters both sides have their own version and choose to ignore certain "facts" and issue false statements. Take your pick as to who is using us as pawns but my opinion is that it's not as one-sided as most people think and the management seem to have been left off pretty lightly.

thejanitor

KeelanM90 wrote: »

You do realize this was decided on about 16 hours ago? It takes time to organize such things and make sure that our views are accurately reflected

Yes but apparently the student union presidents phone was and I quote "HOPPING" during the meeting yesterday with media editors looking to publish a story - What a load of rubbish!

The reality is that if it gets any media attention at all it will be a few lines that will be short-lived. This was seen on the RTE website on Monday where the story got a few lines somewhere in the back where there should have been an advert that they could not sell. Nobody cares about the situation only local media because it does not effect on a national level.

I know students are still suffering as a result and what I would urge students to do is bombard the college with a letter each and every day until they get the message, if every student was to send one letter by registered post every week, the secretarys hand would not be long about falling off signing the slips for all the letters.

A demonstration will prove nothing tomorrow apart from a short-lived media spell that will consist of only a few lines. Everyone knows that property will be damaged as a result be it cars or the college itself along with the few arrests for anti social behaviour.