Irish-born British?

OS119

Duke of Wellington.

later became PM.

ejmaztec

OS119 wrote: »

Duke of Wellington.

later became PM.

Of course it is! I shouldn't have nodded off.

CDfm

Rebelheart wrote: »

Yes, and "Catholic Emancipation" was such an amazing victory for the Irish Catholics, as any of the 40 shilling freeholders could tell you when they were disenfranchised in this "victory".

How selfless and noble, in the circumstances, of Arthur Wesley to support this charade of "emancipation". Mar dhea.

OK -so Daniel O'Connell was able to take his seat in Parliment.The Presbyterians were similarily disadvantaged and the Jews had to wait until 1856 to be allowed enter parliment.

Wellington was known as the Iron Duke because he made unpopular decisions and had to put Iron Railings on his london house to protect from rioters.

I am not saying the guy was a card carrying Irish Nationalist and Democrat but he was not unaware or dismissive of Irish issues either. Lord Edward Fitzgerald he was not but ..........

KeithAFC

ejmaztec wrote: »

Not many hundreds, a mere blip in time.

It goes back to the 1600's with the great King billy.:)

who the fug

KeithAFC wrote: »

It goes back to the 1600's with the great King billy.:)

Backed by the pope

CDfm

who the fug wrote: »

Backed by the pope

His wifes father was Catholic

Overature

If you were born in Ireland, then your Irish, born in Britain then you are British, simple

Judgement Day

Overature wrote: »

If you were born in Ireland, then your Irish, born in Britain then you are British, simple

It must make life very simple seeing everything in black and white.

CDfm

Overature wrote: »

If you were born in Ireland, then your Irish, born in Britain then you are British, simple

You are not automatically an Irish citizen if you were born on the island of Ireland. You may be entitled to Irish citizenship if your parent(s) or grandparents were Irish. You may be entitled to Irish citizenship if you were born outside of Ireland, but you may need to register your birth.

Thats according to the Citizens Information Website

ejmaztec

KeithAFC wrote: »

It goes back to the 1600's with the great King billy.:)

That non-English speaking Dutch bloke?

Judgement Day

Nolanger wrote: »

Right - I started this thread and after 100 replies it's missed the point. All I was querying was why some famous people born in the ROI are never claimed as Irish yet people like The Edge, Phil Lynott, Johnny Logan, Chris De Burgh, Cyril Cusack are all considered to be Irish yet they were born elsewhere?

Fair point but it all depends who you talk to - what self respecting Irish 'nationalist' is going to refer to Lord Kitchener as Irish despite the fact that he was from Listowel; Lord Roberts of Kandahar (popular in Ireland despite being a member of the Anglo-Irish ruling class) was from Waterford; the Duke of Wellington (was from Ireland but did not consider himself Irish) and would not be claimed as an Irishman by many. At the end of the day non-controversial figures such as rock musicians, actors etc who have Irish connections will always be claimed by the media/establishment here.

ejmaztec

Nolanger wrote: »

Right - I started this thread and after 100 replies it's missed the point. All I was querying was why some famous people born in the ROI are never claimed as Irish yet people like The Edge, Phil Lynott, Johnny Logan, Chris De Burgh, Cyril Cusack are all considered to be Irish yet they were born elsewhere?

I think that people make assumptions, especially in the media, where someone gets tagged as a particular nationality at the start, and the label sticks even when the truth is out.

Any Irish-born historical celebrity isn't regarded as Irish if they had any support for the British Empire. Someone on the Kerry forum asked for suggestions on the greatest Kerryman that ever lived, and I suggested Kitchener.:D

This is one of the replies to that mischievous suggestion:

Spud Smith wrote: »

Kitchener,
Another Brit soldier and a gay one at that.

What was it with North Kerry and their GREAT British Soldiers????

Some people refuse to accept that any Irish people willingly went along with the goals of the British Empire, but the British couldn't have twisted all of their arms behind their backs.

That's why those people from history will be waiting a long time for anyone to refer to them as Irish.

In a hundred years, people will be talking about that great Irishman, Jack Charlton.

Judgement Day

Hey - where's Nolanger's post gone?

ejmaztec

Judgement Day wrote: »

Hey - where's Nolanger's post gone?

It's nolanger here for some reason.

Nolanger

Deleted accidentally on purpose

ejmaztec

Nolanger wrote: »

Deleted accidentally on purpose

As it's been quoted above, it's dead but not forgotten:p

CDfm

Rebelheart wrote: »

Yes, and "Catholic Emancipation" was such an amazing victory for the Irish Catholics, as any of the 40 shilling freeholders could tell you when they were disenfranchised in this "victory".
.

But this wasnt particularily targeted at Irish People. You did not have democracy or suffrage and you had the Peterloo Massacre in the UK too.

You had rotten boroughs- contituencies which were essentially owned by the property owners -essentially Members of the Aristocracy.

So essentially, Wellington was a member of the aristocracy and saw himself in that way and is there any reason to believe that he was ashamed or embaressed about his Irish Birth or not sympathetic to the Irish. In fact, politically - he and the Earl of Mornington (his brother who was sometime Lord Lieutenant of Ireland) saw no reason for discrimination against Catholics. It seemed to be a hobby horse of theirs that they used politically .

So if you take Geldof and Wogan as establisment figures who are ambitiousthey assimilated.

If you look at "English Steve" winning the appentice - he is also likeable and ambitious and gets on with it.

The same with the Irish in America.

Putting down Irish who suceed in Britain is a bit naff.

KeithAFC

ejmaztec wrote: »

That non-English speaking Dutch bloke?

The one who master minded the battle of the boyne victory in 1690 and used a lot of Catholics to do it as well lol.:)

ejmaztec

KeithAFC wrote: »

The one who master minded the battle of the boyne victory in 1690 and used a lot of Catholics to do it as well lol.:)

That comeback took a long time:)

Ireland seems to have a long history of people selling out, and it's pretty much going on even now.:(

CDfm

ejmaztec wrote: »

That comeback took a long time:)

Ireland seems to have a long history of people selling out, and it's pretty much going on even now.:(

So the Catholics actually won

ejmaztec

CDfm wrote: »

So the Catholics actually won

It's not the winning, it's the taking part that counts.:(

KeithAFC

ejmaztec wrote: »

It's not the winning, it's the taking part that counts.:(

McArmalite

In a recent Samuel L. Jackson interview with Kate Thornton on British TV about his new movie SWAT the following conversation took place :

Kate: What's it like working with Colin Farrell, cause he is just so hot in the UK right now

Samuel: He’s pretty hot in the US too

Kate: Yea, but he’s one of our own!

Samuel: Isn’t he from Ireland?

Kate: Yea but we claim him because Ireland is beside us

Samuel: Ya see that’s your problem right there. You British keep claiming people that don’t belong to you. We had that problem in America too – it was called slavery

ejmaztec

McArmalite wrote: »

In a recent Samuel L. Jackson interview with Kate Thornton on British TV about his new movie SWAT the following conversation took place :

Kate: What's it like working with Colin Farrell, cause he is just so hot in the UK right now

Samuel: He’s pretty hot in the US too

Kate: Yea, but he’s one of our own!

Samuel: Isn’t he from Ireland?

Kate: Yea but we claim him because Ireland is beside us

Samuel: Ya see that’s your problem right there. You British keep claiming people that don’t belong to you. We had that problem in America too – it was called slavery

If I had a Euro for each time that I'd seen this on Boards, I'd be able to buy Ireland, all 32 counties.:p

CDfm

ejmaztec wrote: »

If I had a Euro for each time that I'd seen this on Boards, I'd be able to buy Ireland, all 32 counties.:p

a huge exaggeration - you might be able to afford 26 that are greatly overvalued but the other 6

OldJay

McArmalite wrote: »

You are a citizen of the country where you were born, like it or not

Wrong again :rolleyes:
You have the option to be a citizen when of an age to decide. Until then you go by whatever passport your parents decide upon and are noted in the national census accordingly.

OldJay

Overature wrote: »

If you were born in Ireland, then your Irish, born in Britain then you are British, simple

Was Spike Milligan Indian?

getz

Justind wrote: »

Was Spike Milligan Indian?

i believe he was born in india his dad was a irishman in the british army,but he was a british citizen

OldJay

getz wrote: »

i believe he was born in india his dad was a irishman in the british army,but he was a british citizen

It was a rhetorical question.

Hugo Drax

First there was the dream, now there is reality. Here in the untainted cradle of the heavens will be created a new super race, a race of perfect physical specimens. You have been selected as its progenitors. Like gods, your offspring will return to Earth and shape it in their image. You have all served in public capacties in my terrestrial empire. Your seed, like yourselves, will pay deference to the ultimate dynasty which I alone have created. From their first day on Earth they will be able to look up and know that there is law and order in the heavens.