The Weird, Wacky and Awesome World of the NFL - General Banter thread

Red Crow · 24-05-2013 10:34am

He'll be in the Hall of Fame but he doesn't deserve it. He's borderline at best and IMO that alone shouldn't make you a HoFer

adrian522 · 24-05-2013 10:39am

Eli Manning wrote: »

He'll be in the Hall of Fame but he doesn't deserve it. He's borderline at best and IMO that alone shouldn't make you a HoFer

He's a sure fire hall of famer and it's not even a close call. If he is not in in his first year of eligibility he will walk in in his second.

I don't know how you could argue that he shouldn't get in.

Because Lewis was better than him? Pretty flimsy reasoning. Are we only to have one player per position that played at the same time?

Who would you have in between Brady and Manning?

BizzyC · 24-05-2013 10:39am

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

I'd possibly grant you Willis but the primes of their careers are different, and urlacher was hit with injuries while still making pro bowls at the time. Briggs is good, but seriously, not as good as urlacher. Btw urlacher had four pro bowl appearances before he was working in the cover 2 scheme, and wasn't working primarily in coverage until lovie.

Being a household name helps a lot with the pro bowl.

Briggs was a push, but there are other players, Junior Seau for instance.

Look at Zach Thomas, close to 400 more tackles from a career of the same duration. (Thomas played a total of 184 games, Urlacher played 182).
He put up 150 tackles 6 times in his career, something Urlacher achieved once.

TaosHum · 24-05-2013 11:02am

Paully D wrote: »

I had a free evening so, after seeing a thread on NFL UK forum, decided to go ahead and predict what I thought each teams record would be over the course of the season, baring in mind that it doesn't account for possible injuries, momentum etc.

It's far too early to put up a prediction thread so this is just to pass a bit of free time. I haven't looked at games in much detail at all, if I looked over it again I'd probably come up with a few different results, which I will do for the proper prediction thread. But anyway, I thought I'd fire the predictions in here to get some opinion and hopefully others will put up theirs too

AFC East:

Patriots 12-4
Dolphins 8-8
Bills 5-11
Jets 4-12

AFC North:

Ravens 10-6
Bengals 9-7
Steelers 9-7
Browns 5-11

AFC South:

Texans 11-5
Colts 8-8
Titans 5-11
Jaguars 3-13

AFC West:

Broncos 12-4
Chiefs 7-9
Chargers 7-9
Raiders 3-13

Playoff teams: Patriots, Broncos, Texans, Ravens
Wildcards: Bengals, Steelers

Last time three teams from the same division made the playoffs was 2007. Unlikely, but you never know! AFC North has sent two teams to the playoffs for the past 5 years, perhaps this is the year they bring three?

NFC East:

Giants 9-7
Redskins 8-8
Cowboys 8-8
Eagles 7-9

NFC North:

Packers 11-5
Bears 8-8
Vikings 7-9
Lions 7-9

NFL South:

Falcons 11-5
Saints 9-7
Panthers 8-8
Buccaneers 6-10

NFL West:

49ers 12-4
Seahawks 11-5
Rams 8-8
Cardinals 4-12

Playoffs: 49ers, Packers, Falcons, Giants
Wildcards: Seahawks, Saints

If the above happens that would leave the Raiders and Jaguars fighting it out for the number 1 pick in the 2014 draft, with the Jets, Cardinals and Browns/Titans all picking in the top five.

That passed an hour anyway :pac:

I'd be downright stunned if three teams come out of the AFC North this season and into the playoffs, especially with two of them having 9-7 records. I don't see much between the three sides and I think they are going to beat up on each other. The Browns will take a few scalps also.

Considering how weak the East is, the Dolphins will never have a better chance to get back into the playoffs. I don't see the Colts dropping back to 8-8 and I can see either the Chargers/Chiefs making a push this year.

Red Crow · 24-05-2013 11:22am

adrian522 wrote: »

He's a sure fire hall of famer and it's not even a close call. If he is not in in his first year of eligibility he will walk in in his second.

I don't know how you could argue that he shouldn't get in.

Because Lewis was better than him? Pretty flimsy reasoning. Are we only to have one player per position that played at the same time?

Who would you have in between Brady and Manning?

Nobody suggested that. Urlacher was never the best. At times in their careers Brady and Manning completely dominated the game. Urlacher never did that. He was a very good player but the publicity he got for being a tough player is pushing him into the HoF. He'll get in no doubt though.

Son Of A Vidic · 24-05-2013 11:32am

I see the Bears are going to retire Mike Ditka's No. 89 jersey, in a ceremony during the Dec. 9 "Monday Night Football" game against the Cowboys at Soldier Field. A real nice touch, considering he played for and coached both teams.

adrian522 · 24-05-2013 11:37am

Eli Manning wrote: »

Nobody suggested that. Urlacher was never the best. At times in their careers Brady and Manning completely dominated the game. Urlacher never did that. He was a very good player but the publicity he got for being a tough player is pushing him into the HoF. He'll get in no doubt though.

I really don't understand how you can say he doesn't deserve to get in, he's been one of the best linebackers in the game for over 10 years, often struggling on poor teams.

adrian522 · 24-05-2013 11:46am

Apparently Anquan Boldin has been playing in the NFL for about 50 years.

bk-f-zgceae2i6i.0_standard_709.0.jpg

frostie500 · 24-05-2013 12:19pm

There are very few "sure fire" Hall of Fame players. That's why there's a huge list of deserving players still waiting to be enshrined. I think that Urlacher belongs in this list whereas over my time watching the NFL of the guys not yet enshrined I think that it's players like Brett Favre, Ray Lewis, LaDainian Tomlinson, Michael Strahan, Kurt Warner, Derrick Brooks (a great cover OLB and a key for the Bucs dominant defence along with Sapp and John Lynch), Tony Dungy, Robert Craft would rate out above Urlacher for me and that's even before you consider the likes of Brady, Manning, Moss, Tony Gonzalez, Champ Bailey, Charles Woodson etc that will be retiring in the next few years. There's a logjam for a very good reason-there are too many deserving players for the number of spots available. And unless you're a Farve, Lewis etc you have no sure fire Hall of Famers

Justin10 · 24-05-2013 12:47pm

Tomlinson is a first round HOFer, Tong G too. So clearly would seem like it will be difficult to get it, and that is how it should be.

Chucky the tree · 24-05-2013 1:46pm

We could probably do this for lots of players but I'm curious as to the opinions of Terrell Owens? Stats wise he seems nailed on but I wonder if TO the person will hold him back. I'm pretty sure he'll get in put probably take longer then it should maybe.

Danger_dave1 · 24-05-2013 1:52pm

Chucky the tree wrote: »

We could probably do this for lots of players but I'm curious as to the opinions of Terrell Owens? Stats wise he seems nailed on but I wonder if TO the person will hold him back. I'm pretty sure he'll get in put probably take longer then it should maybe.

Look how long it took Cris Carter to get in. He was on his last year of eligibility wasn't he?

Paully D · 24-05-2013 1:56pm

TaosHum wrote: »

I'd be downright stunned if three teams come out of the AFC North this season and into the playoffs, especially with two of them having 9-7 records. I don't see much between the three sides and I think they are going to beat up on each other. The Browns will take a few scalps also.

Considering how weak the East is, the Dolphins will never have a better chance to get back into the playoffs. I don't see the Colts dropping back to 8-8 and I can see either the Chargers/Chiefs making a push this year.

Yep, I'd be surprised too mate. As I said, it was just a very quick run through results which will no doubt be different when I do my proper prediction in early to mid-August.

TaosHum · 24-05-2013 2:07pm

Paully D wrote: »

Yep, I'd be surprised too mate. As I said, it was just a very quick run through results which will no doubt be different when I do my proper prediction in early to mid-August.

Don't get me wrong, its arguably the most evenly poised division in the NFL, its just I can see them dropping games to each other and hurting each other chances of playoffs.

As you said, still early days.

Chucky the tree · 24-05-2013 2:13pm

I can't see the Charger doing very well. They are lacking in too many areas. Impossible to know hows the chiefs will do, I don't think smith is a great and the Chiefs D isn't on the level of the 49ers D. Different style running game as well. The Chiefs for me are the hardest team to try and predict. I wouldn't be surprised if they are picking top 5 or bottom 5.

HigginsJ · 24-05-2013 11:53pm

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/nfl-rookie-serving-sandwiches-offseason-article-1.1273876

Terrace Ganaway took a part time job during the off-season to keep him occupied and out of trouble. Very level headed from the kid.

Justin10 · 25-05-2013 9:05pm

Chucky the tree wrote: »

I can't see the Charger doing very well. They are lacking in too many areas.

Just from an outsider, just interested to know where you think they are lacking?

Son Of A Vidic · 27-05-2013 10:41am

I see Michael Vick was shooting his mouth off on The Dan Patrick Show, by Claiming he could whip RG3, Colin Kapernick or anyone else in a footrace.

"These guys are young and they're fast and they're quick, the thing I do have is a very quick get-up," Vick said. "I really don't feel like there's a quarterback in the league that can beat me in a 40-yard dash.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000206386/article/michael-vick-im-faster-than-rg3-colin-kaepernick

That's right Michael, they also don't get knocked out, get injured and lose possession as often as you do.

Red Crow · 27-05-2013 10:59am

When plays follow the script Vick is very good but as soon as he has to manoeuvre or use his initiative he becomes a disaster.

eagle eye · 27-05-2013 11:20am

Just on Brian Urlacher. He was a great one and for me is a guaranteed first ballot HOF'amer. You don't get 4 first team all-pro selections unless you are pretty awesome and he was also DROY and DPOY.

frostie500 · 27-05-2013 2:29pm

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

I see Michael Vick was shooting his mouth off on The Dan Patrick Show, by Claiming he could whip RG3, Colin Kapernick or anyone else in a footrace.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000206386/article/michael-vick-im-faster-than-rg3-colin-kaepernick

That's right Michael, they also don't get knocked out, get injured and lose possession as often as you do.

So Griffin didn't miss games last year and isnt currently recovering from a serious leg injury at the minute after a superb rookie season that saw him suffer concussions after refusing to go out of bounds or slide before contact? There's very little body of work from RGIII and Kaepernick but so what if Vick says he's faster than them? He didn't say to Patrick that he was better just that he'd beat them over 40 yards.

Son Of A Vidic · 27-05-2013 2:52pm

frostie500 wrote: »

So Griffin didn't miss games last year and isnt currently recovering from a serious leg injury at the minute after a superb rookie season that saw him suffer concussions after refusing to go out of bounds or slide before contact? There's very little body of work from RGIII and Kaepernick but so what if Vick says he's faster than them? He didn't say to Patrick that he was better just that he'd beat them over 40 yards.

Griffin done the damage playing in a game when he clearly shouldn't have been on the field. Now we can blame him, or we can blame his coach. But personally I can forgive an over enthusiastic rookie for not wanting to sit a game out. That is when experience and wisdom is really needed. The debacle after he exacerbated the injury, between his coach and team doctor tells me where the real blame lay.

Vick on the other hand is a seasoned pro, yet he continues year in, year out to make incredibly stupid decisons when running from the pocket. The guy has no instincts for when to go to ground and just protect himself and the ball. And that's the point I was making earlier, he can brag all he wants about how fast he is. But it means absolutely nothing when he continues to lack some serious cop on when running the ball.

frostie500 · 27-05-2013 3:02pm

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

Griffin done the damage playing in a game when he clearly shouldn't have been on the field. Now we can blame him, or we can blame his coach. But personally I can forgive an over enthusiastic rookie for not wanting to sit a game out. That is when experience and wisdom is really needed. The debacle after he exacerbated the injury, between his coach and team doctor tells me where the real blame lay.

Vick on the other hand is a seasoned pro, yet he continues year in, year out to make incredibly stupid decisons when running from the pocket. The guy has no instincts for when to go to ground and just protect himself and the ball. And that's the point I was making earlier, he can brag all he wants about how fast he is. But it means absolutely nothing when he continues to lack some serious cop on when running the ball.

But again you were commenting about Vick saying "I see Michael Vick was shooting his mouth off on The Dan Patrick Show, by Claiming he could whip RG3, Colin Kapernick or anyone else in a footrace." and that the other guys dont get injured. I dont dispute that Vick makes bad decisions just that Griffin suffered injuries last year too and plays with the same reckless running style of Vick.

However if Vick think that's he's faster over 40 yards than the other two guys I don't dispute it. He's still like lightening, as shown by beating Shady McCoy. The comment from Vick that you brought up was about him thinking that he is faster not better

Son Of A Vidic · 27-05-2013 3:47pm

frostie500 wrote: »

But again you were commenting about Vick saying "I see Michael Vick was shooting his mouth off on The Dan Patrick Show, by Claiming he could whip RG3, Colin Kapernick or anyone else in a footrace." and that the other guys dont get injured. I dont dispute that Vick makes bad decisions just that Griffin suffered injuries last year too and plays with the same reckless running style of Vick.

However if Vick think that's he's faster over 40 yards than the other two guys I don't dispute it. He's still like lightening, as shown by beating Shady McCoy. The comment from Vick that you brought up was about him thinking that he is faster not better

But I never said he claimed to be better, I just quoted what he said about 'whipping' them in a footrace. And what exactly does that prove to him or anyone else for that matter? Pretty much nothing in my opinion, especially when you look at his track record. Hence the reason why I pointed out his track record in the first place.

He doesn't think there's a QB in the league who can beat him in a 40 yard dash. All well and good, but the reality that Michael seems to miss is, there probably is no greater franchise risking QB in the league than him when he runs the ball.

The issue for me isn't how fast or slow he is. It's the stupid risks he frequently takes while running the ball. So why would he draw attention to himself by coming out with such a pointless statement. Because I just can't seperate what he said, with the evidence of how he plays on the field that's all.

eagle eye · 27-05-2013 3:58pm

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

But I never said he claimed to be better, I just quoted what he said about 'whipping' them in a footrace. And what exactly does that prove to him or anyone else for that matter? Pretty much nothing in my opinion, especially when you look at his track record. Hence the reason why I pointed out his track record in the first place.

He doesn't think there's a QB in the league who can beat him in a 40 yard dash. All well and good, but the reality that Michael seems to miss is, there probably is no greater franchise risking QB in the league than him when he runs the ball.

The issue for me isn't how fast or slow he is. It's the stupid risks he frequently takes while running the ball. So why would he draw attention to himself by coming out with such a pointless statement. Because I just can't seperate what he said, with the evidence of how he plays on the field that's all.

Clearly he takes pride in being the fastest QB in the NFL. I'm sure there are lots of people who want to be the undisputed king of speed in their area.

frostie500 · 27-05-2013 8:18pm

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

But I never said he claimed to be better, I just quoted what he said about 'whipping' them in a footrace. And what exactly does that prove to him or anyone else for that matter? Pretty much nothing in my opinion, especially when you look at his track record. Hence the reason why I pointed out his track record in the first place.

He doesn't think there's a QB in the league who can beat him in a 40 yard dash. All well and good, but the reality that Michael seems to miss is, there probably is no greater franchise risking QB in the league than him when he runs the ball.

The issue for me isn't how fast or slow he is. It's the stupid risks he frequently takes while running the ball. So why would he draw attention to himself by coming out with such a pointless statement. Because I just can't seperate what he said, with the evidence of how he plays on the field that's all.

Yeah I agree with everything that you've said but it was just you're comment of "That's right Michael, they also don't get knocked out, get injured and lose possession as often as you do." that stuck in my craw. It's tough being an eagles fan because it's clear just how much athletic ability that Vick has, both running and his passing, but he makes too many mental errors. Im hoping that a reparied O-Line will help us next season because in 2010 he was one of the top five QBs in the league

Son Of A Vidic · 27-05-2013 8:49pm

frostie500 wrote: »

Yeah I agree with everything that you've said but it was just you're comment of "That's right Michael, they also don't get knocked out, get injured and lose possession as often as you do." that stuck in my craw. It's tough being an eagles fan because it's clear just how much athletic ability that Vick has, both running and his passing, but he makes too many mental errors. Im hoping that a reparied O-Line will help us next season because in 2010 he was one of the top five QBs in the league

Christ, watching Vick frustrates the hell out of me and you know I'm a Pats fan. I frequently find myself shouting, "Slide, Michael, slide ffs!" I can only imagine what it's like for yourself. If he focuses his talent in 2013, on playing like a QB rather than a RB, then he'll have a good season. He just has to keep himself healthy.