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DART+ (DART Expansion)

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  • Registered Users Posts: 165 ✭✭ richiek83


    Grandeeod wrote: »
    2005. T21. Funds were ringfenced.:rolleyes:

    Apologies, funds weren't earmarked. The plan stated "Key objectives of public transport investment will be to advance public transport projects like Metro North and Dart Underground, as well as rail safety and traffic management programmes and continued planning of future priorities". At this point though, Metro North and DART Underground had received ABP approval.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,539 ✭✭✭✭ Grandeeod


    richiek83 wrote: »
    Apologies, funds weren't earmarked. The plan stated "Key objectives of public transport investment will be to advance public transport projects like Metro North and Dart Underground, as well as rail safety and traffic management programmes and continued planning of future priorities". At this point though, Metro North and DART Underground had received ABP approval.


    The roll eyes to heaven thing wasnt meant in a disingenuous way. I was merely referring to T21 in 2005, which at a time of great wealth was all talk and feck all else.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,235 ✭✭✭ D.L.R.


    richiek83 wrote: »
    Really was. The previous Government's Four Year Plan done at the time of the bailout actually had in it, funds earmarked, to proceed with Metro North if I remember correctly. The new Government reviewed all spending plans including capital plans and this is how the LUAS Cross City got the go ahead.

    They were already half way out the door when the four year plan was published, nobody was thinking about public transport.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,516 ✭✭✭✭ Idbatterim


    Wasn't Luas cross city planned even before the crash? I have witnessed first hand the chaos it is causing to the bus network in particular, when I tried to get down to the quays from ranelagh a while ago, absolute joke... I should have gotten out and walked from dawson street...


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,995 Schadenfreudia


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    Wasn't Luas cross city planned even before the crash? I have witnessed first hand the chaos it is causing to the bus network in particular, when I tried to get down to the quays from ranelagh a while ago, absolute joke... I should have gotten out and walked from dawson street...

    It certainly was; as was the Lucan luas and the Green Line extension to Bray.

    There was a lot of issues with the Harcourt St section when it was being built (though I don't remember too many problems with the Red Line)

    But how can you build a cross-city centre on-street railway line without serious disruption?

    Maybe build critical sections at night?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,854 ✭✭✭ lbj666


    It certainly was; as was the Lucan luas and the Green Line extension to Bray.

    There was a lot of issues with the Harcourt St section when it was being built (though I don't remember too many problems with the Red Line)

    But how can you build a cross-city centre on-street railway line without serious disruption?

    Maybe build critical sections at night?

    Not always a goer because of complaints from people living , staying in the city centre, people forget that.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,516 ✭✭✭✭ Idbatterim


    It certainly was; as was the Lucan luas and the Green Line extension to Bray.

    There was a lot of issues with the Harcourt St section when it was being built (though I don't remember too many problems with the Red Line)

    But how can you build a cross-city centre on-street railway line without serious disruption?

    Maybe build critical sections at night?

    they need to start connecting the lines, it would make a big difference to numbers using the service and viability of lines. Also it would actually give some people the option of ditching the car...

    Dublin needs a serious pile of money thrown at it to sort out decades of neglect...


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,781 ✭✭✭ Carawaystick


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    Wasn't Luas cross city planned even before the crash? I have witnessed first hand the chaos it is causing to the bus network in particular, when I tried to get down to the quays from ranelagh a while ago, absolute joke... I should have gotten out and walked from dawson street...

    But when it's built, you can get a tram for your journey.

    Almost all infrastructure improvements cause disruption during construction.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,453 ✭✭✭✭ salmocab


    could the luas cross city be extended out to blanchardstown from broom bridge to pick up the new children's hospital that will probably end up there when its built in the the very distant future


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,995 Schadenfreudia


    salmocab wrote: »
    could the luas cross city be extended out to blanchardstown from broom bridge to pick up the new children's hospital that will probably end up there when its built in the the very distant future

    ;)

    Very prescient!


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,244 ✭✭✭ mackerski


    salmocab wrote: »
    could the luas cross city be extended out to blanchardstown from broom bridge to pick up the new children's hospital that will probably end up there when its built in the the very distant future

    We already have a real train running on a segregated alignment along the canal. Better to make that a proper frequent service.


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,511 ✭✭✭✭ FreudianSlippers


    salmocab wrote: »
    could the luas cross city be extended out to blanchardstown from broom bridge
    Probably not given the site width after Broombridge.
    to pick up the new children's hospital that will probably end up there when its built in the the very distant future

    God I hope not. Connolly is a ****hole of the highest proportion and doesn't fit the criteria for a Children's Hospital in the slightest.

    I also swear anyone advocating building a hospital on the M50 has probably not driven on the M50 in the past 5 years.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,781 ✭✭✭ Carawaystick


    I also swear anyone advocating building a hospital on the M50 has probably not driven on the M50 in the past 5 years.

    Whereas Thomas street is perfect...


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,511 ✭✭✭✭ FreudianSlippers


    Whereas Thomas street is perfect...
    Not saying that (I think the Mater had significant advantages as a site personally); just saying this M50 holy grail is a red herring. Particularly so given it's really nowhere near being a tri-location site (or even a proper hospital in reality).

    As an aside to this conversation but on the topic(-ish) of the thread, who the hell taking the Luas to the hospital? :confused:


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,995 Schadenfreudia


    I also swear anyone advocating building a hospital on the M50 has probably not driven on the M50 in the past 5 years.

    I travel it several times every day - and I think it is an obvious location for the hospital.

    Having said that I hope they just build it at James St - the priority is to just f***ing build it - it's turning into yet another infrastructure-in-Dublin farce.

    But I'd not be surprised if the dysfunctional system, aided by the Irish Times, manages to screw it up.

    If that happens nobody will ever again try and build it in the city centre. It will be Tallaght, Blanch or some greenfield site near the M50.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,830 ✭✭✭ markpb


    As an aside to this conversation but on the topic(-ish) of the thread, who the hell taking the Luas to the hospital? :confused:

    I do it every time we go to Crumlin (Green Line + bus) for my daughters check-up. I'd imagine lots of staff do the same. People seem to have this odd image that people only enter hospitals through A&E.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,539 ✭✭✭✭ Grandeeod


    markpb wrote: »
    I do it every time we go to Crumlin (Green Line + bus) for my daughters check-up. I'd imagine lots of staff do the same. People seem to have this odd image that people only enter hospitals through A&E.

    We did Kildare line + luas and walk to Temple Street for check ups.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,995 Schadenfreudia


    If that happens nobody will ever again try and build it in the city centre. It will be Tallaght, Blanch or some greenfield site near the M50.

    In fact, if they build DU a site near the M50 and a commuter line would be ideal from a national access perspective...which puts Connelly very much in the frame.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,995 Schadenfreudia


    markpb wrote: »
    I do it every time we go to Crumlin (Green Line + bus) for my daughters check-up. I'd imagine lots of staff do the same. People seem to have this odd image that people only enter hospitals through A&E.

    I had an student working in Crumlin all through summer 2014 - I'd drive her there via the M50 every morning and she'd take the Red Line/Green line back.

    Very reliable - both trips.

    With DU and the motorway system - everywhere would be plugged in to an M50 site.


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 17,110 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Sam Russell


    Does the DU not go to Heuston, just a short trip on th red line or a stiff walk up the hill?


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  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,995 Schadenfreudia


    Does the DU not go to Heuston, just a short trip on th red line or a stiff walk up the hill?

    I was about to reply that James doesn't cover the car access angle when I remembered this is a DU thread and not a Children's Hospital one! ;)


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,191 ✭✭✭ cgcsb


    As an aside to this conversation but on the topic(-ish) of the thread, who the hell taking the Luas to the hospital? :confused:

    Thousands of staff and non emergancy patients for follow up appointments, meeting with consultants, surgeries etc. emergency room patients are only a small fraction of people in a hospital that size at any given time.


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,511 ✭✭✭✭ FreudianSlippers


    markpb wrote: »
    I do it every time we go to Crumlin (Green Line + bus) for my daughters check-up. I'd imagine lots of staff do the same. People seem to have this odd image that people only enter hospitals through A&E.
    Grandeeod wrote: »
    We did Kildare line + luas and walk to Temple Street for check ups.
    cgcsb wrote: »
    Thousands of staff and non emergancy patients for follow up appointments, meeting with consultants, surgeries etc. emergency room patients are only a small fraction of people in a hospital that size at any given time.

    I just don't understand I suppose how building a hospital at Blanch relates to the DART or Luas?

    Isn't that how people are currently getting to James/Mater/etc.?


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,995 Schadenfreudia


    Freudia wrote: »
    I just don't understand I suppose how building a hospital at Blanch relates to the DART or Luas?

    Isn't that how people are currently getting to James/Mater/etc.?

    And don't you have another thread somewhere teasing out that whole topic?

    Just build at James's (Irish Times permitting) and get back to DU!


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,511 ✭✭✭✭ FreudianSlippers


    And don't you have another thread somewhere teasing out that whole topic?

    Just build at James's (Irish Times permitting) and get back to DU!
    That's a bit rich considering you're the first person to bring it up in well over a year and probably the first person full stop to bring up the M50 on this thread in relation to same.

    DU is IMO significantly relevant to the NCH and is an extremely valid topic when considering why DU should be prioritised.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,995 Schadenfreudia


    That's a bit rich considering you're the first person to bring it up in well over a year and probably the first person full stop to bring up the M50 on this thread in relation to same.

    DU is IMO significantly relevant to the NCH and is an extremely valid topic when considering why DU should be prioritised.

    I do not disagree with you...except the "a bit rich bit". ;)


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,453 ✭✭✭✭ salmocab


    whilst I was being a bit tongue in cheek mentioning the NCH on the DU thread in the first place, I think there is something to be said for linking transport infrastructure and other types of infrastructure. Yes the m50 can be a mess but Rialto is a mess too with little scope to improve, a hospital is likely to be in place for 50 to 100 years so transport infrastructure can be brought to it and improved as time goes on. The NCH is for the whole country not just Dublin which means that it needs to be accessed from outside the m50 as much as from inside it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,191 ✭✭✭ cgcsb


    The Times recons the Victorian Building on the quays is the site of the new Docklands Station. In previous plans the station had been to the north of the sxisting Spencer Dock luas stop.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/council-to-tender-for-design-of-12m-liffey-bridge-1.2329894

    "The new bridge will connect the old London and North Western Railway Company station on North Wall Quay to Forbes Street on Sir John Rogerson’s Quay on the south of the river and will be funded from levies collected through construction in the Dublin Docklands Strategic Development Zone (SDZ).
    The Victorian train station is the planned location of the proposed Dart Underground station. The Government has a month before planning permission expires on the underground line to decide whether it will go ahead."

    If the planned site for the station has changed, I have to say it's news to me. Does the times know something we don't or is it another case of journos gone rogue.


  • Registered Users Posts: 565 ✭✭✭ noelfirl


    The plans appear to be gone off the net, but I recall that there was to be a quayside front entrance to the underground Spencer Dock station via the old LNWR building. I think think the journalist has incorrectly conflated the two things together.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 426 ✭✭ Jack Noble


    cgcsb wrote: »
    The Times recons the Victorian Building on the quays is the site of the new Docklands Station. In previous plans the station had been to the north of the sxisting Spencer Dock luas stop.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/council-to-tender-for-design-of-12m-liffey-bridge-1.2329894

    "The new bridge will connect the old London and North Western Railway Company station on North Wall Quay to Forbes Street on Sir John Rogerson’s Quay on the south of the river and will be funded from levies collected through construction in the Dublin Docklands Strategic Development Zone (SDZ).
    The Victorian train station is the planned location of the proposed Dart Underground station. The Government has a month before planning permission expires on the underground line to decide whether it will go ahead."

    If the planned site for the station has changed, I have to say it's news to me. Does the times know something we don't or is it another case of journos gone rogue.


    From memory, the building mentioned in this IT report will house the underground station entrance from North Wall Quay. There will be a second overground entrance building beside the Luas stop at Spencer Dock.

    At the time of the application for the Dart Underground Railway Order, the planning notice was posted on the window of the building facing the river. I remember reading it at the time and thinking such an iconic railway building will make a great Dart station entrance on to the quay.

    Here's the archived Dart Underground Railway Order website:

    http://web.archive.org/web/20130130095342/http://www.dartundergroundrailwayorder.ie/

    Maybe someone can have a look and find the details because I'm up to my eyes in my Masters thesis which is due on Monday and I have no time to do anything else before then. I shouldn't even be posting this message.


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